So, Im finally breaking down and replacing the chains on my excavator. The pads are in good shape so those are going onto the new chains, so i need to remove ~400 bolts. So far just for giggles i tried a 1/2" impact wrench. Yeah that did nothing. I also tried a 1/2" breaker bar going with the snap the head procedure, yeah that didnt work. I was worried the breaker bar was going to turn into a boomerang. I have an old IR electric 1" impact wrench coming from my brother. Its old! From what i can find, its 750 ftlbs of torque. Not sure if that will be enough to break the pad bolts. I hope it will free up the sprocket bolts at the least. I think the best option for the pads is to cut off the bolts. However, i dont have any cutting equipment. Ive been putting off too long so i need to buy something. Torch set would certainly do it, but what about a plasma cutter? I have a lot of projects that a plasma would be great, instead of using a cut off wheel. This is a farm machine and i dont need to get the pads cut off all at once. I was thinking of maybe doing a couple each day over the winter.
Buy the plasma cutter, as you said "I have a lot of projects that a plasma would be great".
Plasma for the win. You’ll be happy long after you forget what you paid for it.
You don't mention the size of the excavator nor the size of the bolts you are working with. By far the fastest method is a great big impact and heavy sockets to take them loose. On medium to large size excavator the bolts are installed by the torque turn method. You generally turn them to a certain torque, say 250 foot pounds, and then turn them an additional two flats of the bolt head. The problem most people run into with this method is the nuts drop out of the landings on the inside of the chain links and start turning with the bolt. We have made wedges to pound in under the nuts to hole them in the landings and prevent them from turning. Many people burn off the bolt heads and remove the pads. The problem with that is they also put cut paths in the pad which many times cause the bolts to come loose when installed on another chain. When I use the cutting torch, I burn the nuts off making two cuts. I burn off one side and then the other a break the pieces off. The bolt can then be knocked out without damaging the pad. I've never used a plasma cutter for this, basically because those require electricity and an electric machine out in the weather. My questions about the machine would be is it any faster and any cheaper in consumable costs. I can do a couple of sets of tracks with standard bottles on a cutting torch.
Thanks all, i like the plasma approach. Machine is a Hyundai R130LC3. Bolts are 14mm (22mm socket head size). The nut is square and not captured. From what i understand, putting a crowbar between the nut and chain holds the nut from turning. Again, no rush to do it so if its raining Ill sit and watch TV.
I use old school torch the nuts off method
As the others said. Torch the bolt heads off. Like John said careful not to cut the pad. Hit the bottom of the pads with a hammer. If your replacing bottom rollers also it’s a good idea to run a tap in the bolt holes. Very least cut a notch in threads on a spare bolt to chase the threads. Not any fun to have a bolt broke in the bottom of a roller frame
That’s why I cut the nuts off ,won’t hurt the pads.
Fastest way I found is get a decent 1" gun. My 1/2" makes more torque than the 1" you're borrowing. Get something in the neighbourhood of 1,500 - 2,000 lb-ft. On the bolts that it won't break free, torch the nuts off. When I do tracks solo, I stick a prybar between the chain and nut and hold the nut in place while I zip it up with a small impact. I come back after all the pads are zipped up and torque them down.
My usual weapon of choice is the impact (Big), when that fails I prefer a scarfing tip or the old school rivet washing tip on the torch for the bolt head. With a bit of practice you will never gouge a pad. I hate cutting the nut end because of the spray back.
I just learned what a scarfing tip is last week. Seems like the right application for one.
Best way - get someone else to do it......!! Can you get hold of a pneumatic HyTorc or something similar..? Those things are the mutt's nuts when it comes to getting track pad bolts off.
Holy crap, $1200 for a used eBay one, looks like over $5000 new?! How big a of compressor do you need to run one of these guys?
Air requirement is really low. Best comparison I can make is that they’re like an air-driven torque multiplier.
I was just using a 3/4" drive one the other day to torque up D8 master pads. Don't really use a ton of air from how it sounded. There are a bunch of planetary reduction gearsets inside the tool that give it that high torque output.
Can you change the preset torque limit on them? Like if you change from one job to another that has a different torque spec, or do they come with a single preset torque limit? Update: I looked it up on youtube. I've never seen one of these before, interesting setup.
You just adjust the air pressure at the regulator. I don't know exactly how accurate the gauge is though. We have a digital torque measuring thing set up in our shop that we use to verify the torque output. Personally I like the pneumatic gun better than the hydraulic one. Hydraulic one is more compact but its slower and you need a power source, which isn't always easy to find out in the boonies. I'm not too fond of being near hydraulic hoses that have up to 10,000 PSI in them either.
Like 92U said, all done with the air pressure regulator. Each tool comes with a chart relating air pressure to applied torque. Set the regulator to the pressure corresponding the torque you want to achieve and have at it. If I had to I'd say the tool maybe uses less than 20cfm when the trigger is pressed. EDIT: I checked the data sheet and the required supply is a minimum of 30cfm @ 90psi.
2 cents worth. a plasma cutter for beheading bolts imho is not the way to go` tip is usually to big around to get a square cut
If your careful and skilled with a cutting torch, you can cut the bolt heads with very little to zero pad damage.
i`ve got 148 to practice on very soon. double that if i decide to do both sides. still lookin for the rail
Leather is your friend!
The problem as I see it with the gas axe is that if you carefully cut the heads off the bolts without touching the pads you're still left with the bolt shank and nut as an assembly which likely will not come out in a downwards direction (too long) so you have to cut again. If you go the other way and cut the huts off, one wrong move and you've nicked a track link and you're in big **** - bindair dundat... Hence my preference for mechanical methods to remove the hardware. But that's purely my preference and for sure is not the only way to do the job. BTW when I mentioned a Hytorc I wasn't suggesting to buy one (new or used), simply "acquire one" temporarily to do the job.
On junk chains I usually don't care about damaging the links. They go the scrap pile anyway. Reusing the pads demands a clean seating surface for the new bolt to seat against. Scarf some material away and a bolt will come loose a few hundred hours of operation after it was installed. The fastest way is the big impact but the problem with that is the size of the bolt head has been reduced and the socket tends to explode or the corners of the head just round off. I've heard that someone makes some half size sockets for that. I've also seen metric sockets used at times for that.
This table might come in handy. Not only does it give Part Numbers but also the sizes for sockets used to remove worn bolts. The other thing you didn't mention John is that a large amount of the energy from the impact is lost in "rattle" on a worn bolt head.
If you use a hot wrench, try a #2 or 3 scarfing tip. That way you blow the metal flush with the pad without eating into it.
I will have to be doing this sometime on my JD 450e so I'm following along and appreciate all the great information. Just out of curiosity, I would think that if you were replacing the chains and saving the pads, wouldn't you have broken the link, dragged out the entire assembly and had it laying on the ground with all the pads facing down? Seems like burning the nuts off is the only way to go at that point.
I agree, but all you have to do is make one slip with the torch while cutting a nut and just nick a link and your are in it up to your neck.
I bought one of these to break lug nuts on my military 5-ton truck- 3,750ftlbs of torque. Haven't used it yet as standing on a four foot cheater worked when I had to change a tire. The guys on the messageboard SteelSoldiers.com (all about military vehicles) swear by it. Just use it to break the nuts free...then your impact wrench to spin them off. https://www.northerntool.com/shop/tools/product_200732635_200732635
Flip the track over if you have another machine kicking around. If possible when I do chains I just set a pallet near the track and knock pads off the chain 3 or 4 at a time with the chains still on the machine. When done, I pull the chains off and toss them in the scrap pile. Install the new chain and put the pads back on. Actually works pretty good with smaller pads and easy on the back because you aren't all hunched over working on the ground.
Torque concerns are only for tightening. IIRC, for cat grousers, on new bolts, 125lb/ft torque, plus 2 flats (120°).
Lot of good info here. I was looking at (dont laugh) harbor freight 1" impact gun, but my compressor is just a little undersized. Chains are junk so if i go to the torch method, i like the idea of pulling the chain and cutting the nut side...didnt even think of that.
3/8 air hose, 1/4 coupling, compressor @150psi, IR QI2145MAX 3/4 gun, and I can remove all the pad bolts on a Cat 324D and smaller, with little to no trouble. For install, I play with the setting on my 1/2" gun to get 125ish torque on all the bolts. Tighten the all to 125ish, then I paint mark two lines on my socket 2 flats apart, grab the QI2145MAX, and tighten each one until the 2nd mark reaches where the first one started. Been doing them that way for years with no issue. The dealer here lays the chain on a roller bench and had a positionable hydraulic wrench. For removal, they just over tighten the pad bolts until they pop.
The OP is replacing the chains, reusing the pads... nick away eh? @Nige
If you're not in a hurry, it could work. Do you have a 3/4" air line? If not, rig up a small tank with a straight 3/4 hose to the gun, like 4', no valves or angles, a quick coupler to hook up your regular air hose. You get one shot, then let the pressure build back up.
I find it much better when I sit back and have a beer while my 33 year old daughter runs the impact gun.
My thought as well. Any size compressor will do the job. Just one bolt at a time.
Here's a thread I bookmarked some time back; HeavyEquipmentForums This is copy and paste of the post by member KY Jim that seemed to be of some value (not my words); "O.K., Bandit, you're in Luck. I work on 650's, same as your 550, just a little bigger. You will need: blocks to support rear of dozer, and two blocks to put under the blade. Come-along or chain hoist, a section of 2-3-inch Bar Stock, and a block to hold the track against the idler for reassembly, plus assorted sockets and impact or ratchets. A torch(Depending,) a lot of Anti-seize, and a big Torque Wrench. Block up rear of dozer, and put a block under each side of blade. Jack her up, and find the Master links. Remove the grease fittings for the track tensioners. Take your short section of Bar Stock and stick it into the teeth of the sprockets so it will support both sides of rail(track chain). Spin track either way, bar stock will ride around, catch the rail, and as it passes around it will suck the tensioner in. Now you're ready to break the track. Spin the Master link to the rear of the tractor and break the track. With the dozer in Neutral and brakes Off, hook your pickup or Farmall to the track on the top side, and Head Out The Door with it. That done, time for the Sprocket. NOTICE; There are occasionally some thin shim rings on the back side of the sprockets, DO NOT DAMAGE/LOSE THESE! They are critical to aligning your sprockets, don't mix them up, either, they go right back on the axle they came off of. All Cases have these, JD not so much. No idea why Deere won't use segmented sprockets, probably to make more money off you. Get your screwdriver/scraper and knock all the dirt off your roller frames, and check the 8 big bolts that hold them on the crossbraces CAREFULLY, the bolts break REGULARLY, and many times will only have a shred of steel holding their heads on. Put a socket on ALL of them and put a little torque on them in reverse. IOW, back them out if they will and LOOK at them. NEVER put these bolts back in without Anti-seize, if you do, you WILL be Sorry. You will probably need to change out a few rollers, if you're not doing a Full Track Rebuild. Check ALL your roller bolts, and if you have Rock Guards, check the bolts on those, as well as the crossbars that connect the guards. These will get loose and wear in the holes, and eventually decapitate themselves. Now, if you ARE going to replace all the rollers, a NOTE: Go ahead and pull the roller frames, MUCH easier to work on, Worth The Time. Turn the roller frames upside down, and pull all the roller and rockguard bolts. You WILL break the heads off MANY, if not ALL of them. Don't Panic, it's NORMAL, we'll FIX that while we got her apart. Check your roller frames for straight, make sure they're not spread or Forked at the idler end. This happens due to Operators being @$$hats and hitting stumps Dead Center in High. After you get all the roller bolts drilled out or get your New frames in, whichever you decide, buy a Tap the same size/pitch as your roller bolts, and chase out ALL the roller bolt and rockguard bolt holes. It seems John Deere does not cut threads all the way through the roller frame, just 3/4 of the way. THIS is why you break the heads off the roller bolts and have to drill them out. I don't care HOW MANY times you've changed out rollers, unless you do this you WILL break the heads off a BUNCH of them. Fastest way to get out snapped-off bolts is drill it for an Easy_out, then heat the side of the roller frame alongside the broken bolt til it's Cherry Red. Take a few draws off your stogie or a couple sips of coffee while it cools to normal color, THEN tap in the Easy-Out and wrassle with it. Sometimes you may have to go ahead and blow the bolt out with the torch. Needless to say, you need to be GOOD with a torch to do this. Usually bolts will come out First Try with method described. If it is still stuck after Third Try, Blow it Out with the torch. This will be a good time to Build Up the wear-places on the idler ends of the frames, and replace the wear bars, as well. As you put it all back together, MAKE SURE to Antiseize ALL bolts that screw into the roller frames. That way the NEXT time you have to do this it will only take ONE day, instead of three. Also, re-pack your track tensioners and check the rods for pits or cracks. Now, the Tracks. If your new rails come seperate from the pads, Unassembled, that's O.K. Lay the rails out on the shop floor, pad side Up. Take a grinder/wire wheel and knock ALL the paint off the pad side of the rails. They must be BARE METAL. Next, put 'em on, MUCH easier to do with no pads attached. Now, have your assistant lay out all the new pads with the grousers down. Then have him/her take the wire wheel and knock off ALL the paint in line with the bolts holes where the rails will meet the pads. They must be Bare Metal also. The reason for this is that paint on these will prevent your pad-bolts from EVER tightening up and STAYING tight. You will ALWAYS have loose bolts and pads, and they'll drive you NUTS. Do It Right The FIRST Time, and Forget about it. You must cut the paint off the inside of your new sprockets for the same reason. The axle flange mating surfaces MUST be CLEAN and BARE, or you'll go broke replacing broken bolts. Any paint, dirt, or rust on these mating surfaces will prevent proper bolt torque. And DO torque all bolts To Spec, and go over the pad-bolts TWICE. Re-torque your sprocket-bolts in two or three days and they should be good until they DO back out. As you replace the shields on the roller frames, some of them will have stripped nuts/bolts. Just get Grade 8 replacements, and Mig the nuts in position. The factory bolts are too soft, the dirt wears the heads down. Grade 8 will LAST. If I forgot anything, feel free to ask. KY Jim"
If I am scrapping the chains ,I gas the nuts with an biggish nozzle . I start at the away side cutting down one side of the nut and when I get down to the chain there is usually enough heat to cut across the nut and bolt together . All done in one continous L shaped cut . All this with the chain hanging vertical safely off pallet forks . Do 4 or 5 pads ,a crack of the sledge and move on
This is one of those threads that has a million ways it can be done differently with the same 3 basic methods, if your not wanting to spend a fortune on a big air gun harbor freight ones seem to work pretty decent i have borrowed one from time to time and was surprised by its function , no clue how long they will last though. Find best most efficient and cost effective way for you to do your project and let it rip , i think about every known way of doing pads has been posted.
Very true! If you are going to be doing this on several machines a year one method would be great, if you only plan on needing to do it once in your life then a different method would be the best. Also helps to know if you want to save pads, save chains or both!
Impact didnt work. Now what. 1" impact or torch/plasma. Gonna try my neighbors torches I think.
If it’s going to be a one time thing ,what’s cheapest?
1" impact, plenty of air, and a socket the right size for worn track bolts. If you have to beat the socket on to the bolts heads so much the better.
After a comedy of errors, it all ends in an almost 100% failure. The only positive is that the sprocket bolts are loose (well the 3 i tried). track bolts with 1" impact wouldn't budge. Guess i have to find some gas. At least my new impact wrench can put the new bolts on. I guess theres always next year. Happy new year everyone.
Out of interest what diameter of hose were you feeding the impact with.?
Interested in this thread, as I will be putting new chains on my excavator (ex60) in the coming weeks. Has anyone tried out the Milwaukee 1 inch cordless impact gun? Looks a serious bit of kit, just wondering would it be tough enough to open track pad bolts.. Thanks
Hopefully at least a 1/2" hose. I've never found ANYTHING my 1" impact won't take off. It took 2 1/4" nuts off a disk shaft on a 23 ft cultivating disk that had been sitting in a field for 20 - 25 years. If you give it enough air volume it will do it. Track bolts shouldn't take more than a few seconds to come off or break. They 'will move' unless they round off.
I think we're in a different tool zone than a cordless impact wrench. IMHO a 1" impact wrench that you can hold in one hand will not be very effective. My 1" air impact weighs about 30 + lbs. It takes TWO HANDS to hold it. When it 'impacts' the bolt IT IMPACTS the bolt . I won't get into the dynamics of mass/torque/force but I will explain with an actual event. While trying to remove a track master pin with a sledge hammer -backed up- with another hammer, it would not budge. Moved the BUCKET to back it up and it came out. In the same way, the force/torque on an impact wrench is applied against a mass. If you have a 'light weight' 1" wrench with 'whatever torque' it will not remove or have the IMPACT' of a 'heavy weight' wrench with the same 'torque'. Torque applied to mass
I’m like you. There ought to be almost nothing that a 1” impact won’t take off. I’d go one bigger and say that I’d use a 3/4” hose for a 1” impact. I think I mentioned it before but the socket has to fit tight on the bolt head. More energy is usually lost from “socket rattle” than any lack of air.
3/4" air line, 50' long. I do have 1 quick connect at the tool. The hose is threaded into the compressor. After much "hydration" over the new year, i went and investigated a little. Looks like the 2 bolt heads are rounded over so the socket isnt a tight fit anymore. The one that did break, the shaft of the bolt looks fused to the pad. Not sure if a large hammer and punch would break it free.
Im with the torch guys. Impact is by far the quickest when things are not worn out and rounded. Ive cut lots of pads with the torch ,thru the link and cut the bolt head . Plasmas are great but the tip or head is too big and you cant wash a bolt off like a torch the plasma just burns anything metal in its way including your pad or rail. A big dirty tip on a torch ,get things nice and warm ,start your burn and pull the torch back a bit and keep burning . with practice you wont touch your base metal at all. Dont run too much oxygen pressure 40 psi is good, go easy on the oxy trigger on your torch just feather it and start on an edge that will heat quick, you can hold the tip back 3/4" or so and keep a nice wash going . with lots of practice you can wash the nuts off bolts that you really need to save with out hurting the threads, this is an important skill when your out in the bush in the middle of the night trying to make something run for the morning. By the time you get done with your pads you will be good at it. One final thing use oxy acetylene ,it works better than propane on this kind of burning than propane.
1500 ft lbs or torque is what my Milwaukee does so far nothing has not loosened under its "delicate" touch
I've used the 3/4" drive Milwaukee impact before. I was quite impressed with it but I'm still not sold on battery powered impacts for big jobs like tracks and undercarriage work.
We're in the process of putting new rails on the 321DLCR, well when it quits raining. Using a 1" impact from the cheap store and it's handled the first sprocket ring and a half a dozen pads. No issues what so ever and cheap - $200. We don't use that big of a gun that often so I figured I'd give the cheap one a go. So far one set of new sprocket rings and 1 new chain is on. Laying the used track on the gooseneck to take the pads off the old rails without bending over.
There's no way the bolt could fuse to the pad unless the whole thing was submerged in salt water and left for decades. Hit the pad with a hammer and it will come loose. If the rails are shot, torch the nuts off.
Apparently you haven't spent much time pulling pad bolts!
Guess it depends on your definition of fused but fused would imply they were melted together and welded. Stuck or seized might be a more appropriate term.
I think at least 50%of the bolts here on the coast are seized solid.
could quite possibly have some salt water intrusion. i bought the machine from a demo company on the coast. Yeah, seized may be a little more correct. Like i said, i hydrated heavily and i may not have been seeing straight. Ill be honest, i need to "whack" the broken bolt a little harder to see if it will come out. Rails are shot, so i dont care what happens to them. i an also comment, that the nut on all three bolts i tried never moved. They are not captured so the bolt is "seized" fairly well to the pad.
Just wait until you do an EX1200 with cast pads. Probably 1/4 of the bolt heads will just twist off. Then out comes the lance to burn the bolt out.
What sort of stuff have you used it on?
Small success. The one I thought was seized just took a bigger hammer. Right bolt was burned off with plasma. Took way longer than I thought. Pretty much had do melt the whole thing away. Only like 366 more to go. Think I'm going with Oxy-ac torch.
I've had good success with heating up the nuts and hitting the bolt with the impact. Might be quicker and less messy.
My mulching head has thirty 24 mm bolts (roughly 15/16 in) that are wet (lubricated) torqued to 590 ft lbs. ( yes, I have a very large torque wrench.) When the bolts have to be removed they are a real bear. I used to use a cheater bar with a five foot section of pipe to loosen them but this electric impact wrench is amazing. I got it after a recommendation from another guy that got it for the same purpose. Never would have thought an electric impact would be this good. You can even program it with four different settings for what you want. It is not precise enough for fine settings of torque but it is very repeatable and comes close. What it excels at is removal of old tight bolts with lots of torque.
I must be missing something. If he is installing new rails does it matter if he nicks a link. I understand the concern if the rails are to be reused.
When you install your new rails be sure you get all the paint off the rails where the pads touch them. Clean the pads good also. They will not stay tight if you don't. Two years ago when our National ACMOC show was at Holt Cat in San Antonio I watch them use a skidsteer with a fork attachment that had a pin sticking out the side of the fork. They stuck the pin into the end track pin boss and drug that track up and down the concrete apron until all the paint was worn off. There was a recall on excavator rails and they were changing a few a day in that track shop.
We've been getting sets of tracks complete, and what I've noticed is that whoever's done the installation of the new grousers has used an oxy-torch to burn the paint, it makes it easier to get the paint off.
Used to do that all the time. Our yard was sandy and about 3-4 laps of the yard they'd be down to bare metal. Saved an easy 2 or 3 hours of grinding with a wire wheel.
Finally got an Oxy-Acetylene setup, and its looking like thats the best way to go for me. Now i just need to figure out my process. I tried one bolt by burning off the head of the bolt. put a decent gouge in my pad. It was getting dark and cold and it was the first one. I may be able to do better this weekend. Still, the bolt is going to take a good amount of beating to get it out of the pad. This weekend, im going to try cutting the nut off. Then hit the bolt head with an impact to loosen it and hopefully pull it out. That way and dont have to be careful with the torch.
Maybe try and heat 1 flat of the nut cherry red and hit the bolt with the impact? Usually once the nut expands from heat they come right off.
if you want to continue with the oxy-acetylene route, try getting hold of an angled scarfing nozzle........that way you can blow the liquid metal up away from the shoe.
The rails are shot so cutting the nuts off is the best option to save the pads. The tip above is a rivet cutting tip that is flat for cutting rivets and bolts off flush. A scarfing/gouging tip is a little different and has a lot bigger cutting jet that has more potential to cause unwanted damage. A rivet cutting tip still allows for precision cutting but hard to find depending on the brand of torch. Cutting the nuts off allows you use a larger size tip and the nut could be cut off faster than to heat it red hot.
When burning the nuts off, I used to just slap the bottom of the pad with a big hammer which usually took care of the loosening part. Once on each side and if you couldn't get the bolt out, you could just raise it up and cut it off. The short piece would then be able to be pounded down and out.
These things need a good 8-10 whacks per side to break free. Took another shot with the impact. I was able to snap the heads on about 50 bolts. I got luck with another 20 or so and the nuts actually backed off. There were a lot of bolts that the impact would just bounce off so i guess those will get cut. Second good news, is the machine started right up. Ive had problems in the past in cold weather. Id knock on wood, I think i have my fuel issues solved.
well, i thought things were going to easy. got all the pads off, got the new parts ordered and delivered with all the business shutdowns. Got the sprockets and chains on with very little problem. Even with the machine parked in the only mud hole around. Start to put my pads on and the bolts are no go! They setup i bought was for 5/8 bolts. My pads are 9/16. I now got to find a way to drill close to 400 holes in hardened steel plates. Oh on the plus side, my machine still starts right up. i think my fuel issues are finally solved.
Before I drilled 400 holes I would order the right bolts.
Chains and sprockets already installed. Chains have 5/8 holes. Would they be loose?
Yes.
Soooooo, I took 4 old bolts and the pad seems pretty tight. I thought it would move in the holes. Well, that's what I told the wife. Now how do I break the news she was right.
HA! You're on your own on that one!
The topic has been discussed before. I think a reamer may be better than a drill bit but might have to do a little from each side. If you knew a shop that had an ironworker they could punch them. HeavyEquipmentForums
I would never put something like that in my Ironworker way too hard ,and very difficult to keep centered. A reamer running slow with cutting fluid maybe. We have drilled them before with good success. Slow speed ,steady pressure on the bit and cutting oil. A bit of a flat ground on the cutting edge of the bit to reduce the hook will keep the bit from grabbing as it breaks thru.I can put you in touch with the machinist that works in my shop if you want to carry on with this ,hes good at drilling stuff like this.
I got a bridge reamer coming later this week, as well as a cobalt drill bit. Is it safe to say, the smaller bolts wont work. It's a farm machine, but I dont want shaky pads in 3 years.
Make sure to sand all paint and crud off both the pads and the rails. They have to be perfectly flat. Don't just tighten the bolts with an impact. Use the torque turn method. 5/8" track bolts are 130 ft./lbs. +- 30 ft./lbs. initial torque with an additional 1/3 turn. https://www.barloworld-equipment.com/media/3946114/pegp5027-06.pdf
My manual shows 282 ft lbs +/- 10%
Oh yes, paint will be ground off. I had a whole assembly line setup with my kids and then it all ended on the first pad. Ugghhh, I've been waiting to get these fixed for 5 years. Finally get to it and I'm stuck again.
You'll get more consistent bolt tension by torquing them to a lower initial figure then turning 120 degrees. The problem with track shoe bolts is that often the surface that they are pulling down to is nowhere near 100% flat and that will affect the torque required to turn the bolt and thus crack off the torque wrench. 5/8" diameter track shoe bolts on a Cat machine would be tightened to the specs quoted above by Welder Dave. Also SAE30 oil would be applied under the bolt head and on the threads. Does your manual recommend putting a dab of anti-seize or some type of oil under the head of the bolts and on the threads before assembling..? Use (or not) of lubricant can also majorly affect the final tighness of the bolted joint.
Is this a final torque number specific for track bolts or just 5/8" bolts in general? The torque turn method is the best for track bolts. If the bolts come loose they will never stay tight again.
It's the actual spec for the pad. Oh and it's only a 9/16 bolt. Which I apparently never realized until I went to reinstall.
282 ft./lbs. seems really high for 9/16" bolts.
Sorry I understood it that you were going to open up the holes on the track shoes and use 5/8” bolts, so that’s what I quoted specs for. If you use 9/16” hardware the initial torque would be 90 ft. lbs, again plus 120 degrees.
His rails are 5/8" but the pads only have 9/16" holes he has to enlarge. Cat standard specs. for 9/16" bolts looks to be 190 to 210 ft./lbs. This is on a Hyundai so wondering if the OP is converting everything from metric to standard? Could see where you could run into problems mixing and matching hardware.
Sorry for the confusion. Old bolts were 9/16 and shown as 9/16 in the manual. It's weird, everything else is metric, but the pad bolts. New chains are 5/8. I didnt notice the difference until trying to install the pads. Probably could have ordered the correct stuff, but didnt realize.
Your original post mentioned metric sizes.
Yeah. I even bought a special 22mm socket to try to break the bolts off originally. Thinking its gotta be metric. I mean why not. Everything else is.
It seems kind of funny but all the undercarriage components I've worked with in the 40 years were all Imperial measurements. Chain pitches are 7", 7.5", 8", 9" and so on. Pad widths have changed to metric. There are plenty of 800 MM and 850 MM three bar track pads on excavators. As far as pad bolt torque methods go, both ways were used. Cat was the only manufacturer to use torque turn for years. The rest of the dozers that I had to do track work on just used torque. I had a welding instructor years ago that told us about working on bridges and how all the bolts were torqued into the yield point of the bolt. It was his position that pad bolts are the same. That is the point that the bolt has the maximum amount of holding power. It is also the reason you are not supposed to re-use pad bolts. As far as what is right goes, do what the manufacturer of the bolt specifies.
Good spot. 14mm was the bolt size originally mentioned. I wonder if the holes in the new links are actually designed for 16mm bolts and the hardware has been metric all long..? Either way 16mm is only a few thousandths larger than 5/8". At that sort of diameter the only major difference is the pitch. 5/8" is 2.3mm pitch (11 TPI), 16mm is 1.5mm pitch. So M16 could be classed as a signficantly finer thread than 5/8" UNC and that could make a big difference in the tightening specification.
A 9/16" bolt, 0.56" is actually a little thicker and a 14MM bolt, .55". As I recall a 16MM bolt is the same as a 5/8" bolt both at .66". As far as thread pitch goes, again as I recall, you can spec any of four different thread pitches for any metric bolt.
5/8" is .625" and 16mm is .629" but should be close enough for the hole they go through. I don't think anyone has more experience with undercarriage than Cat so would use the torque turn method myself. I paid a couple hundred extra to have the track shop put the pads on in the track press using the torque turn method. Then cleaned everything up and it was just easier and saved me a lot of time for not too much more $$.
Never removed bolts from excavator tracks. Dozer tracks in my experience wear the flats of bolt heads. No socket I own turns them. A scarfing tip on an acetylene torch cuts the heads off pretty well. I now have a Hypertherm XP45 with flush cut hardware I haven't tried yet.
I think I need to rent a mag drill. The bridge reamer worked awesome...on 1 hole. I tried it in my power drill so it could go slow. It dulled pretty quick though.
Here's another thought, and dont laugh, this is a farm machine not for business. I use 9/16 bolts that match the pad and cut some .032" shim stock to put in the chain. It would act like a bushing. Not the most elegant option but I dont see why it wouldn't work.
I think the bolts would hammer it out and come loose.
before I did that, I think I'd put the bolts through the track pad, and weld four short beads axially on each bolt to make them fit the chain tight, a little crush isn't going to hurt anything. Have you tried your cobalt drill bit in a drill press? If you can't find a cobalt or other high quality drill bit that will cut them, you could do it with a masonry bit, sharpen the angle a little, and experiment with speed and pressure a little to see what works. it will be slow, but it will do the job eventually.
Welding the bolts would likely cause them to break. Just need to get the proper type of drill bit and enlarge the pad holes.
Cobalt drill is due friday. I did get my 5/8 bridge reamer and tried that in a hand drill so i could control the speed. It cut really well but i think i damaged it. My drill press only goes as slow as 380rpm. I think i need a mag drill so i can slow way down and cut. Hopefully, we have one a work i can borrow, if not, i can rent one to try.
A mag drill might be too fast too. It was suggested on here to heat up cutting edges to make them easier to drill. It seemed to help when I drilled a cutting edge. Maybe try heating the edges of the holes red hot, let them cool and see if it helps. The other thing to consider is the holes need to be slightly bigger than the bolts but that could fixed with a die grinder and carbide burr if necessary.
You might try to call the supplier and let them know of your situation. Most I've worked with in the past have been real good at taking back the wrong pads and getting the right ones. Drilling all those holes is going to take forever.
Im reusing my old pads, and ill admit i didnt check the bolt size before ordering. I did have a bit of a panic and placed a pad on the chain before pulling them off the pallet to make sure the holes lined up. Never thought of checking the bolt size until i got everything installed. Mag Drill should go from 0-400 RPM. Ill try the heating option tonight.
Get the right tool for the job! Got my bit and mag drill. Set the drill speed slow and use cutting fluid. Took about 4 minutes per pad including aligning the drill to the hole. Finally some good news. However, it wasnt easy. At first i was a little worried. Got about 20 holes and the bit chipped. Figuring i had nothing to loose, I lined up for the next hole and it plowed right through. Got another 40 holes like that until it just stopped cutting. Again, nothing to loose its time to figure out how to sharpen a drill bit. Off to HD to finally pick up a bench grinder. Ive needed one for so long and always put it off. Since I couldnt find a bit sharpener that would take larger than a 1/2" bit, bench grinder it is. Little bit of youtube and bit is sharpened. Drilled a bunch more holes until the bit broke. Off to the chop saw to square off the bit and ready it for sharpening. Since i was only enlargeing the hole, i only had to put a small angle on it. Cut like a dream and finish my holes for 1 side of the machine.
Good job.
all done, both sides. No more clanking. forward and backward. its amazing. i dont cringe when i hit the travel peddles. Ended up going through 4 drill bits. Some pads drilled easy, some where real PITA's. On to the next project at some point...replacing the bucket pins and bushings.
preperation,persperation,tormentation,consternation,determination,constapat-enough