I fabricobbled a borewelder .Just finished and tried a run on 95 mill id heavy pipe .It sucks going up hill. The first 2 rounds had frive failure when my slip ring welded up. The next 2 went ok except for up hill . It takes for ever to upload pics so l will put the welder up later on if it escapes the trash he trash
Nice! Looks like it’s doing the job. Looking forward to your other pictures.
Try running a smaller bead?
Has anyone used a dual shield wire for bore welds. Every bore welder i have seen has been using hard wire . I have hand welded many larger id bores as well as OD buildups with flux core /Co2 very succcesfully. Maybe the tubular wire dosent lend itself to the rotation as well as hard wire?
I am just using ER70 S-6 1.2mm and argoshield . My voltage and current meters were dead before I got the welder . I can weld , but I aint no welder and rarely weld vertical , and would always go up in a U shaped weave .
Are you on Facebook by any chance.? There is a line boring and welding group on there that many knowedgeable people contribute to. I know RayF of this parish is one of them. You could try sending him a PM to get the details of where to find it. I don't use Facebook to it's no good asking me.
Dual shield would be too hot and the slag would be a big problem on an automatic system. You're using too big of wire(.045"), way too hot and trying to put too big of a bead. Gravity is taking over before the puddle has time to solidify. Use a .8mm(.030") or .9mm(.035") wire and turn the heat down. Even manually, vertical up is difficult without a weave. 1.2mm wire could be used for some applications but would also cause more frustration because it has to run hotter to get proper fusion. Would be easier to preheat the metal and have your heat turned down than trying to speed the job up. The pics. I've seen of bore welding are usually lots of narrow beads. Less heat and faster travel speed lets the puddle solidify before it gets too big. Will need to do some experimenting with heat and travel speed.
Seconded. The ones I've seen look a bit like an extremely fine screw thread.
Thanks guys . I am not on facebook (yet) . I was going to use 1 mm but i thought the bigger wire would be less likely to twist . I didnt get near it today . Hopefully tomorrow for more messing .
Use .030 wire, Set your voltage between 17 and 18 volts. Find the sweet spot in that range for your wire feed speed and your rotational speed. It will lay in there to were it looks the same all around.
i do line boring and id welding. What voltage you running /wire speed looks like may be a bit much try about 17.9 volts and depending on dia of bore play with rotation speed. Other factors that play a big part is the welder its self inverter migs are the way forward as they are able to change from down hill to up hill nicely.
Has anyone experienced any underbead cracking or delamination of the finished bore done with hard wire? Im assuming doing a cut prior to buildup to keep the finish out of the heat affected zone.In my world of welding and fabricating hard wire has always been for 1/4" and under ,gauge metal,tanks and cab type stuff. Always used flux core with co2 for anything structural or repairs. So welding on heavy sections that require line boring seems a contradictory practice. I know its now done all the time, im just curious as to the long term end result.I think bore welders are an awsome invention after years of 7018 buildup . I plan to buy one or create one if i get ambitious, but i h dont do that much line boring these days.
I think prep is really important and also why I think preheat is a good idea to ensure complete fusion.
I always take a cut first before welding the bore. It cleans the crud from the bores and trues them up so they weld better. If you are getting undercut you are running way to hot. You can watch the weld bead nice knit into the parent metal when things are going well. Pretty narrow sweet spot there but it is variable jut a wee bit.
I always thought that was SOP for the exact reasons you said, better fusion and a more even thickness of bead. Having said that not long ago I had a "bore welding expert" tell me not that it was uneccessary. I canvassed opinions from various HEF members who are into bore welding including RayF and as a result the "bore welding expert" was shown the door and told never to come back.
Welding is all about proper fusion and the better the prep the better the chances for success. Good welds can be made on poorly prepped and even dirty base metal and bad welds can be made on perfectly prepped clean base metal. That's why they do X-rays and ultrasound on critical welds. I think with bore welding the least you'd want to do is run a flap disc or sanding drum in the bore to get it perfectly clean and free of any dirt or rust. Noticeable high spots could be taken down as well so the arc length/wire stick out would be consistent around the entire bore. I can imagine there are situations where it would be a PIA to cut the bore prior to welding and then having to remove the boring set up to do the welding and then setting up again to do the final boring. In most cases there have to be brackets and fixtures tacked in place to do the necessary repairs. You can't run real hot so preheat can compensate for that. As a rule thick sections (3/4"+) should be preheated for any welding to prevent a quenching effect that could/would lead to a failure. I think this would be paramount for bore welding.
Dave, most bore welders use the same bearing mounts to run the bar and the welder, so basically there is one setup then after the initial cut you simply slide the bar out and slide the bore welder head in, then do the reverse and reinstall the bar to make the final cut.
My welder uses the same feed and bearings as the boring bar ,so I did pre bore 1.5 mm . I welded my 2 bores . I cant see much as my torch is not cantilevered from one side . It is a bit rough . I need to attack 1 side with a grinder before I start cutting . I did preheat and covered after to slow cooling .
If they use the same setup would make it easier.
Not to go off topic but, does anyone know why Rayf hasn't posted since last April ?
As Nige said there is no setup to run the bore welder. Just slide the bar out and slide the bore welder in. Only takes 5 minutes.
Much easier to take a quick cut than wear away at it with the die grinder
Here's one for ya This was done horizontal. There is a bit of a learning curve.
I don't drop in as much as I used to. I run a Line Boring group on FB which is more focused than what you can do here. If anyone is interested I can reply to a PM. Answering the topic,its a big risk welding bores before a prep cut and I can't think of a reason not to. As far as penetration and laminations go its not an issue if you have the welder set right and are using the correct gas. You can get a perfect weld.
Right there is that fine screw thread appearance I was talking about previously. I’ll admit straight up that I’m not a welding expert but I do know what a good bore weld is supposed to look like.....
So do I, but it can be an episode sometimes to achieve it.
Almost like a phonograph finish when machining. Pretty fast travel speed to get the narrow bead. First pass would be the trickiest.
As my old grandad always used to say - "99% preparation, 1% perspiration."
Prior preparation prevents pi55 poor perfomance
Curious if when doing a horizontal weld, a back up strip is tacked/clamped in place to be able to weld right to the bottom edge of the bore?
I have never used any type of backup ring. You can get the full width of the boss and even gain a little bit of width.
Is one reason behind that because each ring of weld is depositing such a small quantity of metal per rotation.?
Do you have to change the angle of the nozzle for the first pass or if it droops doesn't really matter?
If you look at the bore that RayF posted a picture of you can see where the weld is just a bit above the face. If you start with the tip of the wire right on the bottom edge of the bore it will droop about the same. Nige is correct in that it is such a small deposit of metal and also the automation from the bore welder is so steady that it helps also. Once you set things up and turn everything on you are pretty much committed to were the nozzle is set. Because you tighten every thing in place. You can tamper with voltage,wire feed speed and travel speed but that is about it.
I usually do a turn at the bottom with the wire turned down and let the bead bleed down a bit.Then another with the wire up a bit and then engage the feed.
Fabricobble or codswallop. Ye decide
It appears as though you are gaining on the bore welding. There is a learning curve so don't give up. Not sure if that is your bore welder or the line bore. Does look a bit fabricobbled what ever it is. But refinements will come with time as you will want to make the operation more efficient. At any rate it does the job and that is what matters.
That makes sense. Once you have a "shelf" you can turn your heat up a bit.
The photos arent great . That is in boring mode . A bidirectional vari speed motor driving the lead screw and a fixed 65 rpm driving the bar . It is only for in house use on 60 to 100mm bores.
A few more pics
Not a pretty looking thing by any means ( just picking on you ) LOL But it does seem to work well. Your getting the hang of it.
I go for function before sleek lines .if i was going again it would be a little different. Apart from the bearings bar and cutting tips every thing was accumulated scrap . It was very interesting and the welder settings have a small window. Thanks for all the help . I am done with it for a while.
Something I forgot to add before. If you get a smaller bore don't be afraid to cut the contact tip shorter along with the gas shield. It would give you more clearance for the small stuff. Don't worry about the sleek lines. It works for what you need and that is what is important. You will refine it more as time goes on I am sure. I have thrown stuff together for different jobs also.
I used a standard murex tip and tip holder and shortened both from both ends .My shroud /shield can slide a bit . I am not sure if the tip was a bit to close to the work or my tip was too short (i took a little more off it) ,but a small glob formed on the tip a few times welding the smaller bore welding the wire to the tip . How best should I setup the boring bar for parallelism to other bores ? I got cones made ,but differences in wear and ovality between pairs of bores and when the pair are close together are a problem. I know I said I am done a while ,but I am still boring and welding away in my noggin .
Your tip could have been a bit close if you got that much build up. I use quite a bit of nozzle gel also. It will still build up but it will also fall off occasionally. If it is that hard to align with the cones. I will use straight edges and steel machonists rules. Bit of a learning curve and sometimes you will need to average things out from one side to the other. Hope this helps a bit.
It all helps . Must get me some nozzle gel .
Back at it again. Nozzle gel is a great job. Use it whin ever i mig. Made a new torch end so can change my torch angle a bit more and tings look better now.
Those results look well tidy fella. Let's see what the surface looks like once it's machined.
Other job on tomorrow so hope to bore it out tuesday and will stick up a pic if it doesnt look terrible (my camera may be bust)
Don't be shy. The only way you will get better is by practice and taking advice/suggestions from people who have been there before.
Hand miged the boom bores as my bore welder needs room both sides and this i s the end result. I hope i can bate the pin in .
Finding it hard to get a smooth surface finish . One problem is my bar speed is fixed at 65 rpm which seems fine for pulling out heavy or intermittent cuts but i think a nit slow for a light finishing cut. 2 i have no machining expierence other than a pillar drill. I gave the bores above a hone after .
I welded a bush in a spun hole the other day snd it was a little fussy and then realized i should have sanded it a little first just a bit. Had some crap worked in the surface a little, I flame cleaned it a bit but there was something ground in the surface a fuzz and a machine with a finer adjustment and little more current practice make a little difference. But some of it some minor stuff in it really didn't show till really hanging with it uphill about 10 o'clock.
If your finish isn't as good as you would like. You should try some 40 grit flap wheels for a die grinder. You won't need to spend but a minute or two at it as the 40 grit will clean them up pretty fast. I have also used a carbide tool for the last pass with good results, but you have to remove them as they will chip if you try to bring them back threw the bore. Always keep in mind "Practice makes perfect".
Ya, I was gonna run something in it and forgot and had it tacked in. I agree the ideal pre prep is 40 or so, I use 36 sanding too and its my go too smoother. Managing the dross seems different than hard wheel, its a little finer and can finish a little smoother. I was sitting right downin front of it and well positioned, not quite as fluid as I was but it was all position and I was well braced and could see it well and could see little "hairs" so to speak raise. It was a fussy little thing and had considered getting the Maxstar for the fussy adjustment. 3/32 7018 can have a window of a couple amps and the taps on the red unit are a stretch with the small electrodes.
This is the finish . There are some weld lines visable . I left the bearings on as i have not got the pin and i want to measure it before i dismantle. Did give it a very quick blast of 80 grit wheel on a diegrinder. Must get a 40 grit to make better progress. Ment to add that this place is a great resorce and i have learned a lot and got a lot of help to date. Thanks to all who contribute.
40 grit will make a lot quicker work of it. Get yourself a piece of carbide tooling and take the last cut at .005 or so and see how nice that comes out.