Ok so my 74 case 580c had the injection pump all gummed up, i pulled it and got a kit a went through it. it runs and starts good but has a miss in number one cyl., i tried two of the china junk injector nozzles but no change, i checked valve clearance and it was good, i bought a Stanadyne new injector nozzle and still missing and a bunch of white/fuel smoke out the stack. after ir gets warmed up it is a bit less but still too much. Is there any way for the Roosa Master pump to over fuel on only one cyl. ? Before the fuel went bad and gummed it up the engine ran great, no smoke ,no missing. Maybe im an idiot but i did not test the new Stanadyne nozzle to check calibration, i did test the china ones and they were 3300 psi pop off, book calls for 2800 if i remember right, where did i go wrong?
Kinda spit balling a bit, but are the fuel lines good? Not clogged? Did you bleed all the air out?
IF all else fails----- swap #1 injector for one of the other three that are firing.
You really need to perform a compression test as part of your diagnosis, just to be sure you have enough heat there to burn the fuel.
Yes Sir, had cleared all lines, bleeds out on all cyls. Even makes a bit of a difference on number one but not like the others.
I think it has compression as it is firing partially ,when i crack the line it really misses. i will have to try to find the tool or fitting to be able to test, my test set is for automotive.
I may try to swa p them but just thought getting three new that all did the same thing was odd, of course the china ones are junk but the Stanadyne one i assume was properly set at the factory but maybe they dont come pre-set?
If the pump and injector lines aren't super clean, that new injector could be plugged with crap. Yes they are pre-set.
Before install of pump, i cleaned all four lines , new fuel tank, new filters, new hose.
I don’t know of any way 1 cyl could over fuel..
Thats what i thought after seeing the way the pump distributes fuel, im thinking i need to take the new Stanadyne nozzle out and verify it is set to 2800 as per my manual, correct me if im wrong but wouldnt a higher pop off setting act like late ignition timing on that cylinder hence all the unburnt fuel smoke?
U r correct.. Just plug your injector # in Google.. Spencer diesel usually has the o. p. on theirs site..
How far did you go with your “over- haul”.?? Gaskets and seals.?? or hard parts, mv, dv, dv spring, return connector, pilot tube, did u set the roller to roller..?? How about the vent wire.. did u take it out and seal the threads.??
i did replace the pilot tube and the vane pump, other than that just cleaned and replaced seals, oh i did put a new check ball assy on the return. tried to put it back like i found it as it was running great until fuel turned to molasses .
where did you get the number for the injectors.?? It’s actually stamped on your old ones.. it’s just above where the pipe meets the body.. you’ll probably need a wire wheel to get the paint off.. Send me THAT NUMBER and compare it to what YOU BOUGHT..
The guy that suggested a compression check should not be ignored. These engines don't have sparkplugs, they do fire on compression.
the china nozzles were marked 20671 and of course they could not be adjusted to anything lower than 3300, the original that came out of the machine is marked 20673, the new Stanadyne one i got in it now is also marked 20673. the Roosa Master pump is a dbgfcc 431-58aj,
The originals (20673) pop at 2800 new Service ((used) at 2600 psi & r for a 207 engine.. The China injector 20671 say they’re for either a 207 or a 188..on their website.. If u go to a fuel shop website they say for a 188 engine.. So I would make the decision on what engine I had.. There is a Stanadyne service bulletin that states if your going to use the 20671 in sets only, u need to turn the inj. pump up 10%..to accommodate for the higher pressure.. I hope this helps..
Thanks , i will verify the engine size, i will pull the new nozzle and test it just to be sure and try to figure out how i can test compression , im guessing via the hole for nozzle?
Harbor Freight sells a master compression test kit that has a pencil injector adapter.. Don’t get the small kit, that’s only for testing thru the glow plug hole, which u don’t have..
Awesome, Thanks for the tip ,i was wondering where to get such a thing. Probly wont get to mess with the 580 till the weekend if all goes well with work.
I think HF has changed the master diesel kit? im looking at it on line and dont see anything that looks like a pencil type adaptor like i have seen for sale on the web?.
WOW.. your right.!!! They did change it.. Idk what to tell u.. I’m not 100% sure but I would “guess” there’s something that works for pencil injectors..
I went ahead and got the 50 dollar set and i will fire up the old south bend and machine my own, i can get dimensions off the old nozzle and rob a coupler out of the kit.
I was thinking, u could have made a tester out of 1 of the old injectors that u replaced.. Take all the guts out, plug the inlet stem, grind off the tip portion of the injector until u get to an open hole and adapt the other end to your 500 psi gauge.. That way u can use the factory hold down.. Good luck.. Idk if the manual gives a normal compression reading.?? But.. anything over 300 psi is acceptable.
Was thinking the same thing, i tried to take one of the china nozzles apart and tapped on it to try to get the pin to come out and ended up bending it. Moved on to the lathe and enjoying getting to run the ol girl [1934 16"x8' Southbend], almost therapeutic to use it haha!
UPDATE!!!!! Ok after much horsing around and other things getting in the way of working on the backhoe, I finally got it straightened out! I bought a compression test kit from harbor freight for 60. Bux and machined my own nozzle adapter. Compression cold was 325 and running was 400. So I pulled the brand new Stanadyne nozzle and put it on the tester. It popped off at 2800 psi perfectly. My manual list two different readings of 2800 and 3200, now as I was taking my compression tester off I noticed a decal on the valve cover, covered with dirt. Cleaned it off and it said pop off should be 2600. So adjusted the new nozzle to pop at 2600 and reassembled everything, after a rough start and bleeding the line she straightened out and runs like before! So lesson learned as the guys on here said,check compression first then move on from there. Thanks to all for your input and help. I will post a pic of the kit I bought as well as the adapter I made.
Here is the adapter I machined with a coupler I robbed from one in the kit.
i know this is a old thread.....can you point me in the right direction on how to turn the pump up 10%? thanks
Are you referring to increaseing the fuel delivery to increase the engine horsepower ?
No to compensate for higher injector pop pressure
Is this your own idea or a factory procedure? I believe you are supposed to adjust the injector pop pressure like was previously done in this thread.
Not my idea...if you look up thread you will see what I mean
U don’t lower the pressure..
i want to try turning it up 10%
U need to get a parts breakdown.. it’ll be self explanatory.. U turn the screw IN 1/8 turn.
ok thank you i have a parts manual
Contact me directly with questions..