cat 299d xhp vs terex pt110 forestry . I'm trying to decide between these two machines for mostly land clearing jobs. I'm brand new to this Industry and I'm assuming that's most of what I'll be doing in my area. Please give opinions, facts and your experience with these machines. All advice is appreciated.
Hi chain. We are proud owners of a 289D, and less proud owners of a New Holland C238. First I'll talk about the cat. This is our third Cat skid loader. All we've ever done to them is check the fluids, grease them, and go to work. They have spent most of their lives in the dirt, are put in the shop during the winter when not in use, and have made us a nice bit of $$$. We baby them, and they in turn hold their value. We had a hydraulic hose on our 279C get a hole rubbed in it towards the thousand-hour mark, but other than that no issues. All in all they have been great machines for what we use them for. I really really like the backup camera. Highly recommend if you go caterpillar. Not sure if it is an option on terex/NH Our New Holland is a "ranch machine" - by that I mean it stays out at our ranch and gets all of the **** jobs, such as literally anything to do with trees. It is our second New Holland. The first one was a bit of a melon, front idler went out on it fairly early in its life. I attributed this to the heavy tree shear it often had mounted to it. In my opinion counter-weights would have helped. Not too long ago we traded it for the New Holland we have now. I have not ran it much but I haven't heard of them having any issues with it, no news is good news. I know a guy who runs a Terex forestry unit. Looks like it is a mean machine set up for really ****ing **** up. I personally don't buy into all that extra protection crap, I like to think I would be careful enough with my machine to not need that protection, but it takes all kinds. I think he has pretty good luck with it. He has a big rotary grinder kind of a deal that pulverizes trees to nothing. It sounds like you're going to buy a brand new machine, so I don't know what to tell you. I've never priced the terex, the Cat will be at least $75k, and the new holland was cheaper than the Cat. Go sit in them all. See what the visibility is like out of them, climb in and out, switch attachments, etc. I will say the multi terrain loaders do have a smoother ride than the compact track models such as your 299D. Considering how much you will be traveling around after trees, definitely something to consider. Also, on side slopes, the multi terrains (277,287,297 series) have less of a tendency to slip a track. While simply keeping them tight eliminates the problem for the most part, again - something to consider. Putting a skid in the trees is a catch 22 in a lot of ways. It's going to be hard on it. You're probably going to **** some **** up. I put those tree attachments on the same level as a concrete hammer on an excavator. If you need to do it for awhile, fine, but don't tell the guy you sell it to you had one on it. Since you're buying new and not trying to buy an undersized machine for the attachment you are wanting to put on, you shouldn't have any problems with whatever direction you want to go. Run it until it hits 1000 hours and trade that son of a bitch. :my2c
Yes. I am going to buy new. I'm not worried about the price. Looking at production vs down time. I would like to be able to take very good care of it and make it last long as possible but if that isn't possible I'd lean more towards the terex simply because of the extra 5 gpm. AM I wrong? I'd like Thanks for the response. I'm trying to do as much research as possible. to have the most productive machine so I can be competitive with prices and still make money in the long run.
I don't know. That forestry machine is obviously going to be king **** for what it is made to do, which is be in the trees and beat the **** out of them. The way I see it, if you're playing the long game here, is that you buy the Cat for the resale. I can think of a lot of guys that would want a well taken care of used *normal* skid loader. When you start looking at the "forestry special" and stuff like that...its just something a lot of guys would try to shy away from. I know I would anyway. I don't know a lot about that Terex machine unfortunately so sorry I can't be more help.
You are not going to notice 5 gpm. I would pick the Cat simply to stay away from the ASV undercarriage and I think the CAT is built better. However all OEMs make compromises. The CAT, even one that has mulched, will likely resale better than an ASV. I agree though mulching is really hard equipment and I personally would never buy a used machine that previously had a steady diet of mulching. No matter what brand you chose, you will spend money on repairs when your mulching. Since you are brand new to the industry, I would spend some time (if you have not yet) really defining your business model which includes pricing for your services, cliental you plan on catering to and host of other things. By the time you pick a mulching head (another very important purchase decision,) you will be $110K plus not including all the other things you need to run this type of business. I would consider an extended service contract regardless of color. Just read the fine print yourself, and make sure that mulching is included, I have seen it excluded on extended service contracts. Fixing your costs (minus your screw ups) can be a life saver in these high demand applications.
As much as I hate to say it I would go with the Cat. I own an older model ASV RC50, but Terex has done nothing for ASV since acquiring them. They've not modernized their machines, jacked their machine and parts prices up to a point of craziness, and weakened the dealer network. As KSSS said, you really won't notice much of a difference of 5gpm with the hp that both machines have. I have been in and crawled around both machines and Cat is clearly the better built and designed machine regarding operator comfort, visibility and serviceability. You should also seriously consider dealer service and parts support since brush cutting is very hard on equipment. Above all, demo both machines and ask the dealer questions on how many service trucks they have, do they have a loaner policy, what is their parts fill percentage and so on. I also think the Cat machines come standard with a 3yr powertrain and hydraulic warranty. It used to cost extra on Terex machines, but I'm not sure if they've now made it standard or not.
Do you think you will be mulching full time in your area? For what you are going to spend on a CTL with a forestry head (and yes, some of that protective gear is necessary even if you are careful), you might want to look into a purpose-built carrier. I've been mulching since 1999 and have worked my way up from machines that put out barely anything and overheated quickly to running CAT and now I'm back with a Bobcat. For all around versatility, you can't beat a skid steer or ctl but the more I think about it, if I was going to mulch more than 50% of the time, I'd get a purpose built machine. I recently came across a very good deal, I think, for a purpose built Rayco C100. Brand new and around $129k with a head. That's not too much more than some of the prices I got for a brand new CTL with a head. I'm not in the market for a machine right now but in your area, you are going to be competing with machines much stronger than a CTL. There's a lot of out of work oil field guys, seismic clearing crews, etc. that have machines sitting idle and they are working for rates much lower than they should to keep their machine's busy. There is work out there but you are probably going to be bidding against purpose built carriers that are higher-production. When you have a good set of skills and a good CTL and good head, you can do some amazing things but you might have more maintenance and less production than a similar sized purpose built machine. Just my .02 but worth looking into if you are going to mulch full time. You can always get a used CTL and set it up as a backup but please get some of the guarding if you go with a CTL. You need lexan, muffler protection, etc., and you need to seal up the compartments. If you are mulching trees taller than your machine or working in areas where larger trees can fall on your cab, you need FOPS. The standard ROPS cabs won't hold up well to a mature pine tree crashing down on them. I've seen and heard about some being sliced open by heavy objects and I've dented a cab or two myself. Good luck!
First. Thanks for the replies, info and opinions I've do e a little more research and if I go the skid steer route I'm leaning towards the 299d xhp. If I go for the dedicated mulcher I haven't done much research on them but I like the fecon 128 because you can also use skid steer attachments. I don't think you can on the rayco. What worries me about a dedicated machine is that you are limited to mulching. What if everyone starts getting these things or bigger ones and I can't make any money? If I can't make much money with a skid steer at least I have a nice tractor lol. Also I work 28 day on and 28 off so I have time and this isn't my only source of income. I'm not rich. Either way i go I'd like to have 50k in the bank for a cushion if the market isn't good and I will be able to pay the note. Please send more info and knowledge my way.
hey guys I own a PT 110 with a Denis Cimaf mulching head I have to say that the terex while not being super luxury provides everything you need a forestry machine . the 20" tracks offer amazing flotation in swampy lands and the ground clearance is Superrior also if you are working in residential areas the terex track system will not destroy the lawn or land. if you are primarily running the machine as a mulching unit you will see that the tracks will last as long as any other machine . as for part prices catipillar offered ASV tracks on their machines so they can't be that bad , also parts will be easy to obtain the terex machines run rexroth controls , motors and pumps . Rexroth is proven A Perkins motor is also very reliable in whole if your planning on running on gravel and doing construction all day long get a Cat they will outlast on the job site just due to the track system . wanna run in the forest get a terex no need for aftermarket coolers on the top of the cab , or adding protection on the cab I have had a 10 " maple fall on the cab and the only thing I lost was a window wiper everything else was a okay and you do notice those 5gpm when you try to advance with a torquing down mulching head it shows in a forestry application also the Perkins motor offered a few more horse powers I agree with the other post here saying to get a dedicated Mulcher but only if you get something else other then a Denis Cimaf head , or a gyro trac or the new fecon ninja heads . no carbite teeth those slow the head down too much a CTL CANT handle those heads with effectiveness what a CTL can offer is a mulching head , stump grinder , grapple bucket , tree shears , forks etc . sorry I'm all over the place guys I vote terex but I have also heard that cat is good from a few buddies of mine you can't go wrong with either just know that the cat is a little more in $$$ and requires aftermarket protection but they also offer 60month 0% interest and 3 year 3000h warranty also an outstanding dealer service make sure your terex dealer is close by and see what offeres they have for warrenty and service call me if anything 514 913 3414 Nico Broyage forestier Nico
Also when it comes to GPM, this determines the cutter RPM but the PSI effects the power you will have to get the drum spun back up and how well it powers through wood. I believe the CAT has higher pressure than the Terex and all the XHP models run variable displacement piston pumps which run cooler and are more efficient than a gear pump. Final Hydraulic HP is a factor of GPM and PSI.
I've decided to go with a 299d xhp. Now I'm considering mulchers. Denis cimaf or fecon with depth control rotor. Possibly an afe eco as a second mulcher.
I was in a similar situation and went with the PT110 forestry unit. I put the Fecon 74SS-V-HDT head on it. So far, very happy. The variable displacement motor on the Fecon is a really nice thing and worth the money. Look at what you will be mulching in soil/CWD to decide which rotor head/tools you want to have. The DCR is fine but if you have any rocks in the area you are mulching, not so much
Just curious Chain Rated if you have tried out the AFE eco mulcher. I'm very interested in any info on these units! They look quite effective...
Hi chain, I have a 2015 299D2 XHP. With a cat/fae hm418c head. I like it but I'm having issues with the motor running hot. Around 225. I have the debris kit and the reversible fan on the radiator. Programmed to reverse and clean out for every seven minutes. Have you had any issues with yours?
We run a fleet of 299XHP mulchers. Some run drums, some run disks. The unit itself is an animal and easy to operate long hours in total comfort...Mulching is hard on these machines but they perform very well in my opinion. Go with the full land management package. Steel undercarriage ....we have added the AFE disk mulchers to our arsenal and have been having very good luck with their products to date. Far less maintenance on the disk mulchers vs the drum. If large scale mulching is what you are wanting to do , consider a dedicated , purpose built machine vs a CTL equipped. Mulcher. We have both and each serves their respective purpose..
Thought I'd send this to yall. long story short... demoed a 289Cat with Cat HM315 mulcher. worked great!!! Bought used FAE UML SSL 150 (same as HM315 just older) It was setup for a 299Cat xhp and had 1" hoses and quick connects.. replaced 1" quick connects with standard 3/4" but left 1" hoses. I also did nothing to the electrical connector for trap door. ... My question, Will a mulcher that's setup for a Cat 299 work to capacity on a 289? Something is wrong. I am bogging down in very light material. The 289 with HM315 that I demoed seemed to turn much faster with more torque. Any thoughts? thanks!
Short answer not likely. Not familiar with the setup on the FAE UML SSL 150 head but the Fecon heads and others are set specifically to work with the specific unit and the flow/capabilities that the main unit has. Since the 289 and the 299 don't have the same specs that could be a big of part of your issue. I know the 299 can have a high flow option. Did the one that the FAE was set up to work on have high flow and does your 289 have the high flow option? The other big issue is you necked down a 1" line to a 3/4 inch connector and thus you lost a lot right there. even if you have the same specs on both the original 299 as on your 289 (I doubt that very much but don't know it) then the loss you suffer by using the 3/4 inch connector will be significant. From the details that you posted I am not surprised at the results you have described.
Just saw your other thread. Seems like you got some good information on that thread.
Yeah but nobody on that thread was cat savy... Yall were talking cat..
How about you stop bouncing all over, you already had 1 thread locked.
Best I can tell you've asked this exact same question about the exact same unit at three different threads on the forum. This makes things very confusing to keep up with and makes it difficult for us to get things back in order when members respond to these duplicate posts as is the case here. Please do not post this question again in a different thread on the forum, all members can respond to the question at this thread. > HeavyEquipmentForums
I think I remember something about the D series Cat machines needing some sort of electrical jumper that tells the machine that the attachment is a high flow attachment. They only run a 2 line system (and a case drain) and the machine will only give standard flow without the jumper. Check with your local Cat dealer.
This is the last time I will say this, let's direct all comments about this question posted by Pair of Hounds to this thread > HeavyEquipmentForums This same question is posted on HEF at three different threads, and this question has hijacked a thread that inquired about comparing a Cat 299D to a Terex PT110, way off topic. Help us get this mess straightened up and get the train back on track!
did not mean to continue thread MR SUPER MODERATOR. question was meant for several members. Please forgive me
No worries here, it's just my job to make sure the train keeps rolling down the tracks and your post did, in fact, highjack (internet speak) this thread, I'm just doing my task of keeping things on course. Likewise, it's really not necessary for you to address me in all caps "MR SUPER MODERATOR", which is [again] "yelling" in internet speak, I'm just doing my job.
With tact like that, I feel like Mr. should be added to your official title!
We had a 299D XHP for 11 months and it burnt to the ground. Had a rental 299D2 XHP and it caught fire while we were operating. We are in between machines now. Also have a Gyro 25XP and bobcat 770. Have a cimaf and gyro head for the CTL's. We are running in SC and it can be 100+ outside. We have issues with machines overheating or not having enough power as far as CTL's go. We are looking at a Gyro 140. Anyone have similar issues or suggestions on the heat issues in CTL's? All of my operators loved the Cat and nothing else we have tried has kept up with the production. Our standard procedure is to blow machines off twice daily or as needed by overheating and then a thorough cleaning weekly. Are will just not spending enough time cleaning?
sabinc, have you considered buying a mechinical drive carrier and mulcher like the RT200. It won't have the heat issues of hydraulic driven mulchers but the engine heat would be the same. I to own and operate a mulcher in a hot climate and the reliablity goes clean out the window in hot weather. If I was a bit younger the RT200 would be on my look at list at #1.
You need to be cleaning much more in these very arid and high heat conditions. No half ass jobs either. They need to be cleaned well. Did any of these units have the forestry package ! I'm thinking they did not...the RT200 is a great machine and certainly something to consider depending on what type of clearing you folks are doing.