Ok as promised I woudl make a seperate post here for the buggies I ran into this weekend. I'll start off with the 627's and move onto the bigger babies. Also the Spring Tour Part Deux has been updated over in Showtime.
Ok.... so I didn't take too many 627's.... but realistically who wants to see a baby buggy?
See here's what people wanna see......big babies
Here are the last of the new pics, I have a couple more but haven't downloaded them off the camera yet.
opcorn :canada
You Are The Man>>>>>>>
Great pics there Burnout! Keep it up.
nice pics Burnout!Is it me or the 657e looks to have dirt on his bowl while he`s parked?
Yep, the bowl is about 3/4 full still. I can't figure why though. I know our company policy is when the machine is parked bowl is empty and eject cylinders are all the way forward!
Fantastic! :notworthy - Chris
great pics thanx for sharin, someday i wish i could run a 57, ive run pretty much every kind of cat scraper except a 57 and 666.
I tried out a 57 this week for a few minutes...... I think I'll stick with track loaders.
Nice pics.
Nice pics, Burnout, nice to see 627B's that aren't all beat to hell. alan627b
Great Pics!
starving memories... no more big dirt spreads in cali.
Sweet pics of the MAP iron!
nice 57s that G must be a blast.
Which 657G? Sureway has between 30-40 657G's as far as I know. Ha ha the MAP equipment.... yeah their weaseling their way into Sureway's backyard. But with adding 14 more 657's to their fleet this year Sureway still has a big lead.
i have been with local 12 for 6 years i got in when they were pulling people off the C list that had no I mean none at all experience on running a 57 or any other cat.
MAP won't be catching Sureway anytime soon that's for sure!
Nice Pics Burnout !!! I have driven both 57,s and 27,s here in Oz Pete
The last two 657E's that came off the line "5YR655 and 656 before switching to the G series.
thats a set of manly earth movers for sure:drinkup i think with the changes they made on the looks of the g the e looks alot tougher, good pics. did they come from the factory with those sideboards?
i got thinking about my lasst post, there was a time when i thought b & c model scrapers looked toughest, the e when it came out looked tinny and breakable, ide be buzzin around on my 37c and see a new e come through the job, and think what a waist, cab,stereo climate control who would want that, how could you ever see anything from inside a cab, how could you breathe? now ide have a hard time goin back:beatsme and that was just in the early 90s
I am almost positive they come from the factory with those side boards, I belive it is an option. I still like the looks of the E versus the G. Also like the 3412 and 3408 engines in the 57E versus the C18 and C15 in the 57G. Would like to know how the power is of the 57G versus the 57E? Anyone who has run both and has a story or two to tell, would love to hear about it.
657E w/ factory installed sideboards I have never seen factory installed sideboards. All have been dealer or contractor built. If Gavin 84W can help he may know as he works for a cat dealer. Dug
Dug, I knew something just did not click about the sideboards, glad I did not bet on it. Just looked at Peterson's web site, and it shows that these are dealer installed. Along with many other modifications to the bowl.
at least when they come from the factory they are usually modified to handle the bigger loads, built up necks and stuff
Good old STICE's machines... Here's some pics of the last time they were working...
cool pic.s
another pic.
Random Pictures!
Holy crap Hiballer.... you mean MAP actually uses some of their equipment? :drinkup
When dirt bosses allow things like picture #3 (from post #33) and operators are so "skilled" as to do things like what's shown in picture #2 (from post #33), I guess you have the right combination to break the bail on a machine as new as a 657G.
Ahhh don't worry about it Mass-X....MAP is just a Sureway wanna be. Within a year or two they will be just another division of The Sureway Group of companies.
heck we hook 3 up all the time, operators just have to be smart about it. :drinkup
That pic of the buggy with the broken bail.....something just doesn't look right to me. It looks to small to be a 57. Looks more like a 27 with a 57 sticker on it. I could be wrong though.....getting old and need glasses.
I agree. Years ago I ran 637Ds, often we hooked up 3 at a time. I've seen 4 hooked up as well without apparent problems.
Look, at the end of the day you can hook as many as you want up but what is the use of having 3-4 fully loaded scrapers hooked when they could be roaring to the fill and making money, bails and hooks are not designed for it and the extra coordination required just fries brains even more than they are for scraper drivers!! I have seen 6 637G hooked and you could literally see the guys lower the bowl into the shale and fill it in a tractor length or less, makes for good pics but 2 together is plenty. Can't understand why people exceed design limits like this and with them stupid sideboards they run in California and then wonder why hitches, draft arms, tyres, chassis and operators all get beat up.
Would anyone have pictures of tire failures on any Scraper? Thank you
Sureway was right beside us on that job in Acheson. They should know there wont be much to buy out in a couple of years if Map keeps up what they're doing. We're losing motors left right and centre on the Henday, but thats what happens when you only have 2 mechanics to try and keep up equipment that was junk to start with. Personally, I dont like hooking up more than 2 scrapers, and if I have to I definitely dont take the middle! I learned that lesson real quick!! Usually we only train up in sand or soft material. I think Gavin84W nailed it though. Its just wasted time for the front guys. 2 is all you need most of the time. But what do I know? Im just a scraper operator!
Man would I love to operate one of those scrapers, you guys are lucky:notworthy
Great Pics, thanks for sharing.
Not exactly scrapers but almost. Pic 1 Molten slag pot carrier with 631G front end Pic 2 Molten slag pot carrier with 621G front end Pic 3 Molten steel ladle carrier with 651E front end Pic 4 Finished steel slab carrier with 657G front end
that is one industry that you dont see to many pics of. killer pics.
They aren't worried about the Iron, they will just abuse it for the first reason to see what its made of and then liquidate it. Look what we're doing to the IGL Fleet.
those are killer pics for real
i got my 1st close look at a g model yesterday it looks funny with the 1 lever in the cab instead of the normal 3 got also looks to be easier on the operator no more reachin and grabbin
NICE PICS!!! and your right, if your gonna post pics of iron post the biggest pics of iron you got...and 657s are some big beasts!
A few pics of what I did today. Trying to dig a drainage swale with 2 627G's. The only other iron besides scrapers was a gutless,beat down old D5. The engineer said it was good dirt! They even dug test holes!!! ointhead
At least your empty
haha this is very true... at least you are empty
I'll bet the boss had some interesting comments that afternoon....
Are you over in Brintnell or somewhere off 167th ave? I remember seeing some MAP iron on 167th the other day. And how about a shameless plug for a 627G video. YouTube - Cat 627E/G Spreading Wet Fill
the Hamptons on 199th st. is where all that fun stuff is. They want to go down 2.20m at the deepest cut stake, but somehow I don't think we're going to get there with the scrapers, unless we wait until it's good and frozen.
Ahhh ok I remember the Hamptons. I was in there 2 yrs ago doing water and sewer, buddy of mine buried a 977L track loader in there. You guys got much work left to do? We have the only big site still runnin over on 137th.
The machines in post #45 are made in Brimfield IL http://www.kresscarrier.com I see them transporting machines all the time from their factory.
You must be retarded if you dont think you can hook 3 scrapers up!!!
I've been in the string when we had 4 627B's hooked together a few times, but you really had to be on the ball, especially if you were last in the string. Things really happen in a hurry, that's for sure. Alan
Ha HA I think it would be in Italian though, hey Luigi it's Mario I got ah stuck, do we just bury it? Like all our sewer and water screw ups?
You know your ass is buried when you dont need to step down to get out of the cab =) (boarderline spam post, getting my post count up)
Hey Mario, give me a hand UP out of this thing.... Hey Boss, the inspector was wrong...their is a bottom to this muck! Guess how far down it was?!
Good pics. See one 657G scraper there. Our 657G is a lemon. The other 2 657E's we have run circles around the 657G. CAT seem to cheapen up everything about the 657G. Rides rough, low power, tinware is sad. etc.. We have been disappointed with the 657G along with our 2 16M Motor Graders!
Sounds like you've worked for the dirt mafia before 245dlc! Or are we getting a reputation? hahaha!
Got some more pictures from my phone.
More!
Lol no I knew better or did I as I worked for Raywalt? lol The rep was spread pretty far when I first moved to Edmonton in 2001.
Nice Pics. Hopefully the 657G runs better then ours. What a disappointment. The 2 657E run circle around the 657G. The operators hate to run it. Low power, rough riding compared to the 657E's. Lots of CAT product improvements. CAT replaced the majority of the tinware, grill hood, A/C condenser in front of the cab. CAT really cheapened up the tinware, wiring harness. Nice to notice the guards above the push block, sure save the front radiator. Need to add turbo precleaner to the rear engine. Saves on outer air filters. Also adding auto lube systems helped out a lot too!
You can hook as many twin scrapers together as there are on a given site. But the dirt boss who allows more than two to hook together at a time is the real retard. The machines are designed and built to work in pairs. The machines’ components are not designed for the stresses imposed by hooking more than two together. The risk of the center units getting smashed aside, you wouldn’t wantonly abuse a machine as expensive as a twin engine scraper that will last for decades if properly taken care of. There are a lot of dirt foremen out there who aren’t actually qualified for the position. Get around guys who know what they’re doing and you won’t see more than two scrapers push-pulling together. All the dirt bosses who I’ve worked for and worked with make it clear to the operators that push-pulling is a two-machine affair. If more than two machines hook up, there are three scraper hands walking from the cut to their rigs to drive home, permanently.
Great Pics, Burnout. I have a question for you, I heard that Sureway has like 50 Plus of the 657 Scrapers ?? Just wonder if that was true ??
Mass-X, I generally agree with you, but we did an entire job in wet sand where 3 was the magic number. 1 couldn't load itself, 2 would load but both units would jump and buck like crazy. Hooking 3 together made loading smooth a silk, much less stress for all involved. Mine had no tail hook, so I was tail end Charlie all the time, and man could I get a load on. In most circumstances, though, I'd totally agree with you. And put a few guys who aren't very good or don't work well with each other together, and it's a recipe for disaster. Alan
Ok they are also designed to carry a specific load, why add sideboards? Every contractor pushes a machine to it's limits to make money. Being a Foreman you have to do that as well. Why do contractors put sidewalls on a 740 and turn them into a 50ton truck when they weren't designed for it? Do it all the time and some of the biggest companies do it. Doesn't matter they are blowing out the shocks or eating up pumps they keep doing it. Sometimes we have trucks hit the fill and can't dump unless they are pointed uphill. If your a foreman and you have one scraper go down and now have 3 scrapers running around your gonna tell me that your gonna let that scraper run as a single. Burning up time cuz it takes longer to get loaded and not near as big loads, tires because they will spin more as well as fuel. Or do you have the operator go park it and go home. Then your last option is to tell him to go hook them up triple. If you don't choose option number 3 then seriously doubt most companies are gonna keep you around as a foreman or ever let you be one. I will say you do need qualified operators to run triples expecially the middle man. Typically running triples you run and get the first 2 loaded and then the front one un hooks and takes off since you can rip the bail off the back one easily with 2 in front. So tell me what is that hurting?
Forgot to mention we run tripples for about 6 months straight and never had a problem. Went through cutting edges a little faster thats about it.
A few more 57s
Nice to see you busy hiballer627 , apparently Burnout isn't hogging all the work! How many scrapers are you guys running now?
I'm told the scraper fleet is around 40 right now plus a few parts machines. The bosses are buying more every week it seems like. Our estimators are keeping everything good and busy this year though, which is a nice change from last year. Sureway is a big outfit, but we'll give them a run for their money one day!! hahaha
They have a few more than that!
I’ll probably regret debating the oracle of earthmoving, but here goes. The decision to install sideboards on a scraper is made in an office. The decision to push-pull in trios is made in the cut. We can discuss sideboards, but that doesn’t relate to push-pulling. Make a separate post and we’ll talk sideboards. This is about push-pulling, and I’m talking about taking care of the machines you’re working with in the cut. Sideboards or not, there is no financial justification to push-pulling in threes. I agree. But there is a huge difference between pushing equipment to maximize return via production, and putting equipment in a situation that will lead to extensive damage. Push the machines as hard as conditions safely allow but that’s not an excuse for risking damage and decreasing component life. Watch a big scraper spread next time you see one. When one twin goes down, in the time it takes for the operator to get shuttled to the spare and get back out to the spread the machine running solo gets pushed by the utility cat. I can’t remember the last time that change in operations needed anything more than the solo scraper hand to get on the radio and tell the utility-cat hand he was going to need a push for the next few rounds. No hooking up in trios. No self-loading. Dive into the cut and let the utility dozer catch you and run push-cat until your partner’s back. The hitch, gooseneck, bail, frog and floor. If you try to have the first machine pull the second while the third pushes, the least of your worries is a broken bail. It’s the damage caused to the center machine when some type of unknown condition causes the three machines to get out of sync and the rear shoves the middle machine into the front scraper off center. Do it long enough and you will cause extensive damage to the center machine. If you push-pull in threes it’s not a matter of if, it’s a matter of when. The decreased life of hitches/goosenecks/bails/floors, etc. causing increased maintenance intervals and abbreviated component life far outweighs whatever temporary gains in production you would get by having 3 scrapers push-pull together. So for 6 consecutive months the project only had 3 scrapers on it or the 4th was down that long?
Yup the other scraper was on another job doing something and didn't need two there. As for big scraper spreads when don't see much of 627's around here any more. Even the company i worked for sold theirs. As for a push cat being around didn't have one of those either. Worked on alot of jobs were the biggest dozer was a D6N. If there was a D8 around to push the other scraper go for it but even if there was the foreman wasn't gonna have him stop what he was doing to go push one scraper around. most the time he would say go hoom up with the other guys. Also seen instance where instead of having 3 scrapers hooked up it was 2 dozers and a scraper. One dozer with a bail on back pulling, one dozer behind pushing. I can't see where it's harder on the hitches and pans? I mean a D10 behind a 627 is gonna cause way more force and power then 3 scrapers hooked together. Not to mention some companys that run a D11 or 2 D10's behind a 651?
Nice pictures mate that is a good looking workforce. Do they keep busy?...How from home do you work with them?
Not to harp on the subject buddy, but I have had many a conversation with Mass-X, met him in person a couple years ago. IMO.. which in fact counts for nothing in the world of scrapers he is the man to learn from. There are some very knowledgeable people in this forum, Mass-X, Alan627b even that Vantage_TeS guy knows his stuff. I know I am forgetting others. I am the same age as you are and I have learned a wealth of information from the gentlemen here. As for the triples debate, I have never seen more than 2 hooked together at Sureway and that is a company that's got the game figured out pretty good. As usual take my comments with a grain of salt, or dirt whichever you like.
Well I was just saying from personal experience that I've never seen a scaper tore up from running tripples but like you said I am sure it is harder on it. Peronsally I love running twin engine scapers but they are deiantly getting to be a thing of the past for the companies I have worked for but thats only been 2 in the past 8 years.
Think of it this way, a 627 is what? 600 and change horsepower? 2 of them is 1200. What are you going to accomplish with 1800hp that you can't with 1200? There may be times when 3 will work nicely, but at a cool million for a new scraper why tear it up? If your movin dirt at 8 bucks a cube and 10% of that is profit and it takes you less than a year to tear the guts out of a scraper did you make any money?
Screw you and your Edmonton prices Alex Try making money off of $1.50 a cube :Banghead
When I talk big scraper spreads, I’m referencing 18-50+ 650 series machines on site. That’s different from 2-6 627’s which are not meant for large scale earthmoving. I can tell from your posts that all the “big” earthwork you’re talking about is relative based on the geographic area you’ve worked in the few years you’ve been in construction. That’s part of the reason who you don’t understand the issues with push-pulling in trios. Because the cost was too high? Due to improper utilization causing higher maintenance costs and increased service intervals on wear components? Try reading and comprehending what I wrote: I can tell you’ve never been around a big spread of scrapers, which have a utility cat working support for the spread. That machine boards the slope, rips the cut, pioneers, knocks down edges, sorts out rocks, finishes the cut to grade, and does all the other duties of a utility cat. Those duties include pushing a single twin scraper during the time it takes for a partner machine to get back in circuit. You’re making my point. Those dirt jobs with D6N's is why this concept is so hard for you to understand. On little dirt jobs you’re more likely to have guys making decisions who lack scraper experience, which is why you get the misinformed opinions that push-pulling in trios is acceptable. If you’re so impressed by the big earthmoving companies you’re touting with their 627’s and ag tractors, try your ideas while working for one of the large earthmoving companies that owns a few 657’s and moves 10x the dirt and see how long the acceptable trio concept lasts. You’ll learn a lot while you drive back to the hall to get on the out-of-work list thinking about the ass-chewing you just received. Because you’re talking about a small earthmoving operation where the D8 you’re referencing isn’t working support for the scrapers because there’s only a couple scrapers and a foreman who’s only seen a couple million cubic yards of material moved with twin engine scrapers. On a large earthmoving project, there’s a utility cat supporting the scrapers, which includes pushing a single machine when the need arises. And a foreman who will make damn sure that the scraper hands understand push-pulling is for two machines, not three. His opinion formed from having seen more than a couple million yards of dirt moved with twin engine scrapers. I’m surprised someone with your breadth of experience isn’t more well-versed on equipment statistics. The machines are designed to work within certain operating parameters. Due to changing ground conditions that cause shock-loading on GET’s it’s easiest to rate the machines by horsepower per GET . The combined horsepower of a 627 and a D10 is 1211hp/GET. The combined horsepower of two 627’s is 1262hp/GET. The combined horsepower of three 627’s is 1893hp/GET. D11’s are poor push-cat’s for all but rock. A D11 coupled to a 651 puts 1450hp on the GET. A pair of D10’s pushing a 651 (the real way to push 651’s) puts 1760hp on the GET. A pair of 657’s generates 2100hp/GET. Give that some thought, and consider the ramifications of a push-pull trio and you’ll understand why it’s something you see allowed when you’re dealing with guys who lack a lot of time around push-pulling, and not something you see on a spread run by guys who’ve been around twins for a while.
http://www.tjlambrecht.com/equipment.htm I would say they are pretty small. Over 600 pieces of Equipment, and have the biggest highway job in the United States at the moment. I have worked for smaller companys though that you can't just throw a dozer at everything. We had trimble GPS on our 627's and we did our slopes. Wasn't any dozers around. If there was he was busy doing something else. If you have to have 2 dozers on a job where you just have a maybe 4 627's running your not gonna make it. 8 dollars a yard:notworthy haven't seen a job in about 5 years where we have gotten more then 4 dollars a yard. Most the subdivision jobs were closer to 2 dollars a yard. Rock was lucky to get 8 bucks. Did alot of our jobs we would have any where from 2-4 627's running, a few Challengers and or Quads, 815, and a D6N. Every now and then we might have a D8R to come in but it was a rare site. That is the old company I worked for. TJL is a little different, even on their jobs though we have 2 dozers and both are 6T's.
Just wondering what company you work for? You seem real knowledgable guessing your a suerpintendent or higher?
Oh I'm waiting for Mass-X's response. Trust me he knows road jobs. As for his position... yeah its pretty high up.
This is worth reading now lol
Mass-X, just so I know, what does the abbreviation GET stand for, exactly? I doubt seriously you'll ever come across a D11 or even a D10 pushing a 627except for somebody who did it to get a photograph of it.......it's just a waste of horsepower. The biggest pushcat I've ever swung in front of in Nebraska was a well tuned D9H, and even that feels like the hand of God shoving back there. An 11 would get a 627 so overloaded I doubt they ejector would push it out. And if you hit something the scraper couldn't move...the 11 would move you right along with it. Try explaining to the mechanic why the bowl floor needs replacing... Mass-X might be more used to the type of scraper spreads in the western states, but around here in the Midwest 627's are pretty common , even on "big" spreads, as the soils and moisture conditions aren't too friendly to machines bigger/heavier than these. I've only been out west a few times, and even the "small" job I visited (5 million yards or so) seemed pretty big to me. But even around here, the points he made are still true. Even being pushed by a lowly D8H or D9G can tear up machinery in short order if the wrong machinery and methods are applied. I bow to his knowledge about the "big leagues"! Alan
im just lettin him in on how we have moved dirt before and will still continue to move dirt, 3 operators that know how to run push pull, could easily push pull for many years hookin 3 up and not have a single problem. Like i said different parts of the country do things different. Me and my brother came down to LA from MO and down here they had only moved dirt with trucks and hoes, well we came down here and seen where we were going to be working at, all bottom ground, flat as a pancake and everything that could hold water was holding water, and they said they were going to move all the dirt with 631's, abd if any of you have been around 627's 0r 37's or 31's know what they will do to this type of ground. so we suggested they bring in john deeres with pans, they fought and fought and fought till finally they said we could have 2, just so we could get everything stripped then they would bring in the 31's well here we are 2 months later have 12 john deeres and not a single 31, even the head superintendant said we made a believer out of him with those deere's. Just goes to show u can teach in old dog new tricks. I will say me and my brother are quite posiibly 2 of the best push pull operators, we have done it all, and still love to do it, not many ppl can say they have got 438 loads push pulling in a 10hr day, and i would give up my brand new D6t to be able to run push pull again but i dont think thats going to happen, not around here, around here they are a thing of the past, and its sad, and stupid, cause 2 guys that know what they are doin will out perform and ag tractor and pan setup, i think that on a 1500ft or shorter haul a pair of 37's with the right operators will bury 4 john deeres with pans! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=427R_p9nFs Now this right here is a good way to tear the bail of the 3rd scraper
Link is broken.
YouTube - TRN scrapers in action
Kman.... so your the best huh? Well in that case I'll just shut up now. Didn't know I was talkin to the best. 438 loads in one shift? So thats 219 loads each... short haul, very very short haul. Alan... GET stands for Ground Engaging Tools, buckets, cutting edges, teeth etc etc etc.
No I am sure there are better. Yes it was a short haul, probably would of been more for push dirt. Our sompany was real big on loud champs and for 20 years it was held.
GET=Ground Engaging Tool (cutting edge, teeth, etc.)
Thanks for clarifying that abbreviation, Burnout and Cat Wrench. I checked out a Kiewit job around here a few years ago, stripping a quarry, where they had a fleet of 651E's being pushloaded by both a D11 and a D10 together...it sure looked impressive, seeing the massive load they got in the scraper's own length, until you went down to the fill and watched that poor scraper try to shed the load it got. Often it took 5 minutes of banging the pan on the ground, chooping with the apron, and backing up only to get hung up on the cube that fell out. They had a D9N working the fill and it spent most of it's time pushing hung up 651's around. Didn't seem like a real bright way to move dirt to me. it might work in California soil, but not in clay, in Nebraska, in the winter. Alan
Kman, what sort of situation allowed 1 scraper to get 400+ plus loads in a 10 hour shift? Short hauling, and cutting both sides of a hill and dumping into a common fill, or a fill on either side of 1 hill? I've seen that done a few times, and it sure racks up the score in a hurry, but the most I've ever had was 200 or so in a 10 hour shift. I'll give you the benefit of the doubt, since I wasn't there. It must have been something to see..... Unless .... you mean 438 loads per PAIR... 219 loads for each scraper. 21.9 loads per hour. 2.739 minutes per load cycle. I can believe that on a short haul situation, in good dirt. Alan
yes 219 a piece 438 together, there is no way a single scraper could het 438 in a single day its not possible. The first 3 foot was good dirt, the next 10ft was all chirt, but we rock and rolled that day, if it wouldnt of been for the soils guy flippin out we could of proably got 230 a piece, but as soon as we got the dirt off the top and got into that rock we hauled some dirt. There was also one other job they took us to awhile back, it was right around 23,000 yard or something, they gave us 2 weeks to complete it with a pair of 27's and a 963, at the end of day 3 we called and said that we were done and needed the floats to come pick us up by noon the next day, there is no way a pair of ag tractors could do that
Yeah Alan we hardly ever took a break! I mean I take so much pride in my work and that day was defiatly one of my funnest days at work. Being with someone who has the same goals as you makes a good scraper team. Alos helps are bladders are about the same size as well haha. Every thing he didnt think of I was and vice versa. It was also 219 loads a piece and it was a big hill with 2 fills on either side with some pretty deep cuts and fill. No really fine grading just hog dirt. By the time the back scraper got done loading the front scraper was dumpng. So more than likely a good push dirt for D11 or D10 but there wasn't one there so we took advantage of the situation.
I've only driven 613's here in NZ but I would love to have a crack at a push pull setup. Nothing better than changing the face of the earth forever! haha
Nothing like watching 57,000 cubic yards dissapear over a period of a day, and that's only the 10 657s we ran long hauling in the pit. Not sure if I have any pictures let me go dig around... Edit: sorry no pictures but I managed to grab a video when I jumped on a truck for a bit YouTube - Quick Tour In A Cat 773B Haul Truck
I reckon if California is the scraper capital of the world you cannucks up there VT must be a close 2nd, does anyone else have big scraper (657) fleets other than Sureway, MAP, Kidco?
Gav, can you tell us what you would consider a big fleet?
657E's taking a time out the wrong way Opps
At least he just took a sit down, and did not lay down for an extended nap.
Gotta love them high sand edges! I've had a lead scraper do that to me a few times. "Just seein if you're on the ball" he'd say....
Definately a "Puckered Sphincter" moment....wooo! No thanks!
I know this thread is pretty old but it's been an interesting read, that's for sure. It is possible to hook up 3 or 50 machines together if they have hooks and bails but it is not wise to do it, and for the exact reasons MassX described. Stress on the machine will show up eventually and then all the sudden those heaping loads you did 2 months ago don't seem that cool now that the gooseneck has a big crack in it. I have been in some circumstances where we had 3 627's working together to assist in the loading but never did the first two pull the 3rd scraper through the cut. 1st scraper in, 2nd scraper pushes him. 3rd is coming in and hooks up to the middle scraper, but doesn't shove with any more force than to keep his pushblock tight against the stinger. The moment the first scraper is loaded, he is gone. Leaves the other two to push pull. That way one scraper is always assisting another, but never using all 3 at the same time. I've seen that done successfully. The cut has to be straight as well because the middle scraper hand must pull his bail off the stinger of the lead scraper as he's finishing off his load, just before he shifts out of second.
we have ran 3 27's before and you can use all 6 engines and all 12 tires to load the front 2 scrapers but the middle scraper has got to let the lead scraper go before the 3rd scraper sets in because if the front 2 scrapers are pullin the 3rd one and he catches something hard, like a stump or rock your goin to yank that bail right off of there!
I would suggest not trying to load the middle scraper by pushing and pulling on it. Stress will show up.
I spent four years with a team of four 637's working together and very often hooked all four together. We loaded all four machines with all four wide open in second gear. BUT, only in the rite material. We did it when working in sand or soft ground. Never in hard or rocky ground.
Same here, we never did do 4 thou and we never did load the 3rd one with all 3 scrapers, and we did it in sand and gumbo clay. I dont see there being any wear on anything besides the cutting edges. All 3 machineshad 20,000 hrs on them and all had been push pulled like that for many many years.
There was a dozer operator that used to work for the company I work for. Had stories from his days at Kiewit running a D10 push cat with their big 651/657 spreads. One of which was what happens when you do hook up more than two pushpulls and the one catches a rock... sardine can anyone?
I had a scary situation one time when that happened. The lead scraper started his cut, I tagged him and three others tagged onto me About half way through the first scrapers cut he hooked a huge rock and stopped dead. The rest of the train never even flinched. It jack-knifed my scraper to the right in a heart beat and snapped my bail as easy as if it were a spaghetti noodle. I thought I was done, going to be crushed. I screamed into the radio STOP and everyone backed off in time. Lucky the only damage was my broken bail. It was welded back together and rolling again in no time.
Now that i think is just a lil stupid, there is no need for 5 at anytime, as long as you have 2 scrapers there they should have no problem push pulling. The only reason you should hook 3 up is if you are running 4 scrapers and one goes down, the amount of production you gain my running trips instead of letting him load by himself will pay for itself in the long run. And like i said earlier if there is rock on the job you shouldnt let your scrpers hands run triples either unless they are talented scraper hands
In the conditions we were working in at that time, no those guys should not have hooked onto me. But running more than two together is not stupid. It is serious production when conditions will allow for it.
No i said hookin 3 together is fine, but anymore then that its kinda pointless. The only reason you hook 3 together is when you have an un-even number of scrapers. If your hookin 5 together you are proably loosing money. I dont think you can tear anything up when running 3 except for maybe a bail, but 5 your just asking for trouble
You sure can do a lot of damage with three together. If you hook a big enough rock you can rip the floor right out of the bowl. We ran four together like in this video for several years without a problem. And I really don't think it was pointless. We could move an awful lot of dirt in a very short time. I should note that I took that video with my phone. It is four short clips I stitched together to make one.
I'll say this you have some good scrapers hand if you can hook 4 together frequently with no problems. Sometimes thats the biggest problem. I ran with vapor and we had trouble with our 3rd guy. he was always slow to the cut and late to tag up sometimnes he probably hurt production. Or someone wants to do something different or change things up. but 2400hp on one bail is alot of torque to rip it right off there. Good skills with the 3rd and 4th guy.
For sure Kman. If the team isn't compatible and all on the same page it can be very frustrating and even counter-productive. That team was some of the best Operators I ever worked with. Three of the four of us were very experienced, worked together for several years and got along really well. The fourth guy came and went but for the most we were lucky, he usually did well with us. If not he didn't stay long.