Dozer stopped dead in it's tracks yesterday while backing up. The left joy stick is completely dead, save the horn button and travel speed buttons. No forward, no reverse, no turns. Brake pedal is up all the way up. Parking brake is off. Please help. Work waiting, conditions dry, but rain in forecast. I would hate to call in a rental machine.
At a wild guess look at the coupling. Hey NIGE care to weigh in here
My very inexperienced mechanical $.02 would point to the parking brake switch itself. Now I'm not one to throw parts at a problem but the switch is only $13.04 through my dealer. Part # 190-8478 for a D5G which I assume would be the same for a D4G.
Serial number would be helpful, does the parking brake light go out once you try to go into forward or reverse?
Usual question - Serial Number..? On the smaller machines there are a million & one different S/N prefixes so it's nice to know you're working with the right version of the machine. OK, next question. Look in the centre of the instrument panel and you have 6 small indicator lights (well 5 actually because the lower RH one is blank. When you turn the key on and after the instruments have done their self-test is the top RH one (the one with an exclamation point inside a gear wheel) flashing..? If the answer is yest then you have an Active Diagnostic Code. Solving that Code(s) will most likely fix your problem. Send me your e-mail address by PM along with the machine S/N and I'll fire you off the document that tells you how to get Diagnostic Codes using nothing more than a short piece of electrical cable.
Apologies for the delay in responding, folks. A letter in 2007 from CAT regarding a software issue gave the serial number of this machine as: SERIAL/PIN # CATOOD4GAHYDOO836 I will be able to confirm that number is on the machine in the morning and determine if the exclamation point on the dash is flashing. This is in addition to the above description of what happened, although it may be unrelated to the tracks being immobilized: The machine was backing up slowly with the decelerator pedal engaged when the tracks locked up. At that time there appeared a warning light on the dash about water in the fuel supply. Recovered a very, very small amount of water from the tank. Removed and drained the fuel filter. No water present. Reinstalled same filter, which is a NAPA brand without the electrical wire hookup that comes on a CAT filter. Started engine, which appeared to come on full throttle. I've had this water in fuel warning appear once before and went through the same procedure with immediate success. I can't recall if the tracks locked up then or not. but I am thinking that they did not. Back with more info later.
Just to eliminate the possibility that something's going screwy with the water detection for the fuel filter sending some sort of signal that is affecting the drive system I would try either a genuine Cat filter or a will-fit filter that contains the water detection connector.
Well, that serial number I posted is incorrect. That is the Product ID number. CAT clerical error, I reckon. The correct serial number is MHK04990. Nige, that upper right hand dash light goes out after the initial come-on. Just like some women I have known. Anyway, perhaps there is no diagnostic code problem. As you suggest, probably the next step is to obtain CAT fuel filter. That may not happen until Monday, so you all have a good weekend, and I will be back here next week. One additional symptom that concerns me: the fuel prime pump works, but will not shut off after the system is bled. Dozer cranks and runs wide open, but there is no movement action with the left joy stick. Much obliged for all the help.
Just curious how you made out because I'm experiencing a similar issue with my d4g XM sn# hyd01475. It starts fine but idles really rough and when you try to increase the throttle it stumbles and just low idle. It won't move either checked the fluids and everything looked good. I have to see if there is a diagnostic code tomorrow.
does the parking brake light go out or stay on? If it goes out when you turn the brake off then your pump coupling is still intact, if not.... when you throttle up does the decelerator pedal come up? The decelerator pedal has a position sensor that affects pump and motor solenoid currents.
Nige, a new CAT fuel filter comes without the electrical hookup for water detection, same at aftermarket. We'll see what happens this weekend. justingiffi, your symptoms sound like water in the fuel, regardless of a warning light message to that affect on no, except for the sudden immobility. Drain the fuel filter and tank petcock behind the the removable metal plate on the rear of the machine. newguy2k3, yes the parking brake light goes off when the brake switch is toggled from ON to OFF. I will have to see about the decelerator pedal this weekend. That sounds like a good lead.
Thanks bluetop man that was exactly what it was. I pulled the fuel filter off and drained it and couldn't believe how much water was in the filter. I was surprised the warning light didn't come on or anything. Let the pump prime the filter and fired right up and runs like a top.
Well, we are finally back online here still having the same trouble with D5G tracks locked up. First, the official serial no. is the first one given: SERIAL/PIN # CATOOD4GAHYDOO836 We have installed a new CAT fuel filter and the pump primed the system OK. Incidentally, this new CAT filter came without the electrical hookup for the water-in-fuel warning system. Also a new CAT brake toggle switch was installed. Symptoms: Engine starts and runs, accelerates to higher RPM's and the decelerator pedal comes up on throttle up. The dashboard light for active diagnostic code turns off after stabilization. However, the tracks remain locked in place. All suggestions much appreciated again. Worst case scenario is to call the CAT house and get a mechanic to pay a friendly visit. But at this point, something has to give. We don't use this dozer very often, but right now is one of those times when it is sorely needed before winter rains start, as it is predicted to be wet this year on account of El Nino in the Pacific, that little swirling S.O.B.
See if a local independent has access to ET. You are going to have to get the code to be able to fix it.
Sorry for my ignorance, but does the filter not have a plastic screw knob on bottom with a short nipple? Loosen it to drain the water?
It certainly should have one.
To the guy that's replacing the filter, unplug the electrical connection from the old filter and screw it in the new one. Goes in the same hole.
Unfortunately, the original CAT fuel filter with the electronic drain has been tossed, and apparently now is available only without the electronic drain. Also unfortunate is the fact that there is no independent mechanic immediately available nearby. But it begs the question, since the H20 in FUEL light was on immediately after the tracks locked up, could that sensor be the culprit? Nige, would that DOC you mentioned earlier for codes analysis be beneficial at this point?
No, the water I fuel light only ties into that sensor. Has nothing to do with powertrain.
The reason I mentioned that is because I recently swapped filters on a JD 700K. The original filter had the sensor, the aftermarket did not. I guess I was having a blonde moment because I was thinking I was going to have to bypass the sensor. Turns out that it simply unscrewed from the original filter and screwed into the aftermarket in place of the drain.
The problem is resolved: The steering module went inoperable, locking up all machine track movement. At the same time, the ECM calibrations were apparently erased. Installed new steering module, flashed data to the ECM and re-calibrated. So far, so good. The CAT man had to work on this one, apparently this was an odd failure. Lucky for me, the CAT man discovered the factory installed ECM could reprogram in lieu of a new one, saving $1875 dollars US up front. On the back end, this one took a little longer. Don't know the total damages yet. Thanks to all for their contributions to this thread.
Nice to know that it appears to be fixed. None of us here likes suggesting calling the CAT man because we know what it costs simply to get him into his service truck. However sometimes there is no other way.
Blue top or Nige, I have a D5C lgp and it seems like the parking brake stays on. the light goes off after the dead man switch is pressed. it will try to go forward but locks up and if you try to steer either direction it wont even act like it's trying to engage. Do you guys have any ideas of whats going on?
A good start would be a Serial Number.
Sorry, I'll get the hang of this sometime. 6CS1142 is the serial I have.
5XK29878, is the serial on this one, model 3046. Sorry, it was wrong on the list I looked at.
First one 6CS1142 is the machine, 5XK29878 is the engine. When you say "it will try to go forward but locks up", just exactly how far does the tractor move in either the forward or reverse direction before it "locks up"..? Does it make any nasty noises when it's doing that..?
The pump engages but is dead headed in forward and reverse. Left or right though the pump doesn’t engage.
Do the tracks move at all, even if it’s only just a jerk..?
They don't move at all.
Is the low brake pressure indicator lit..? It almost sounds as though the parking brake is not releasing even though the indicator light on the panel indicates that it is. Have you checked the 20A fuse for the brake solenoid and if the fuse is OK, checked the solenoid itself..? The resistance of the solenoid coil is supposed to be 8.15±0.6 ohms.
The light is not on and I checked the resistance of the solenoid, it's steady at 7.6. That's .7 so I'll start by finding the part number for that. Thank you for your time and help.
.9 I good math
Just because the resistance of the solenoid coil is correct doesn't necessarily mean that the valve it controls is working correctly. That's possibly your next point to check. Another question. Did the problem start suddenly or has it been slowly getting worse over time until the point at which the tractor won'tr move..?
I think you meant to type 0.55?? Which is close, but not out of spec. How fussy are these coils Nige?
The operator said for the last two months it has been doing this. He called on monday and explained it to me. how do I go about checking the valve it controls?
Sorry, no idea. But anything that was outside the permitted spec range of 7-55-8.75 ohms would have me changing it. Considering the spec is only around 8 ohms, ±0.6 ohms is almost ±10% so it's a fairly broad range. A lot would depend on the accuracy of the multimeter measuring the resistance I'd guess.
Okay, Thanks again for the help on this.
Hey guys, Thanks again for all the help. I bought a handy little DC voltage tester and then put power to the solenoid. The shuttle was only just budging when power was put to it. I swapped the solenoid and the valve because that's how they shipped/sold it to me. for my 2000 d5c-LPG dozer The part number was "160-7203" and the name was "Valve GP brake solenoid". Thank you and merry Christmas.
Good to hear you got it fixed. That 160-7203 Valve is the one that controls the parking brake, if that won't release the tractor's going nowhere fast ..........
Yes sir, I heard the solenoid kick over but the shuttle hanging up was my hang up. After awhile the solenoid burnt up from trying to pull it. (much like I would've) Take care and thanks!