I’ve noticed a few posters complain about the service and and exorbitant pricing they receive from their dealers but I’ld like to tell you about a recent experience with ours. Hastings Deering covers two states here, plus Papua New Guinea and a few other island nations, so a large dealership, even by world standards. We are an hour and a half from our nearest town, where HD have a mobile mechanic based, and which is another two hours away from the actual dealership branch. Their callout fee incudes a generous amount of travel with the balance charged at a reasonable rate with no labour charge. Despite this, when our 140H developed a park brake issue, (blowing air from the transmission) I floated the grader to town to get things happening quicker, because we urgently needed the machine. Within 24 hours of the breakdown they had parts sent out and the repair mostly completed. As the mechanic was reinstalling the driveshaft, one uni joint literally fell apart in his hands. The company immediately sent someone from the dealership to meet the him half way with parts. When you live in the bush, you always assume that unexpected breakdowns are going to take a lot longer to deal with, so when a big company goes out of their way to help a small customer, it makes a big impression.
I don't have any big stories to tell but our Cat dealer here (Holt of Ca.) has been the most responsive by far of all the dealers I have to deal with. I seem to talk with ONE GUY at the parts counter, he answers my calls or emails immediately, and they have been able to get strange and esoteric parts quickly. It is too bad they do not make much product that I can use (very small power generation) The other big C used to be my favorite but it has gotten so bad, I literally was having a dream last night about going into their parts department and finding it abandoned. (I feel like having to have that dream was like working most of a day and not getting paid)
Local dealer has been really good on some things. Having service guys stop by, getting parts and helping with our repairs. Thing I don't like is how much gets jobbed out. I go to Cat and pay Cat prices for Cat work not some jobber up the road. I don't think they are what they were 30 years ago but that seems to be everywhere, if they can't plug a computer in and fix it they are lost.
Sadly, that is the case with all brands of machinery. Computers have there place, but at times a mechanic is still needed instead of a technician.
There are several factors that are causing poor experiences with service any where you go. First mechanics and I mean real mechanics (not a parts changer) are a dying breed. Dealerships won’t pay for experience anymore. They rather hire kids right out of tech school for a much lower wage. Because after all they have all the resources why pay for experience when we have computers with all the information. Then these kids then leave and go to private companies because they will pay a little bit more. But they haven’t learned anything. So now private companies start paying less because there are so many techs out there costing everyone money and longer down times. Which makes it hard on the experienced guys. It’s hard for them to get a decent wage and they are getting burned out because everyone gives them all the work because they know what they are doing. It’s a viscous cycle.
So when did mechanics become “techs”? Is there a difference in pay? I cringe when someone tells me they are sending a tech to fix a machine.
Got a local truck dealer with 7 "techs", 2 years back a GMC Brigadier with a slobbering 6V92 came in the door, It was spewing oil from the airbox drains... Not a single one of the kids had ever seen a 2-stroke Detroit and it had no diagnostic plug. It ended up on my doorstep 40 miles away. At least the service manager knew where to send it. Turned out the owner was running 15/40 engine oil and had a leaking fuel tube under the rocker cover on the right hand side. I didn't need a laptop to find that. It also amazes me these kids cant find air problems or even troubleshoot a 7 wire trailer.
I had one yesterday. Fault codes for SCR Operator Inducement and Turbo Pressure Sensor. Didn't even need to throw the laptop on it to hear I had a boost leak. Fixed the leak and checked the SCR codes. Found they were related to the boost sensor fault, cleared faults and put it back to work. Less than an hour.
Techs or mechanics I really don’t think there is a difference. I think it’s a play on words. Like custodian vs janitor. Somewhere the world decided to jazz things up to make things seem more important than it really is. I’m not knocking anyone’s profession. Just making a point. But personally I like bad techs or mechanics whichever you prefer. It gets me lots of business and makes people really appreciate what I can do.
About the same time 'secretaries became executive assistants'! HR departments over spec requirements for employee hires, college education to make coffee, sharpen pencils and do businesses' housework. Mechanics, understanding of the field of mechanics! Technicians; understanding the field of integrated electronics to control mechanical devises. If you need a computer to read and trouble shoot fault codes, that is IMO...mechanic-technician. Same pay; part of the job.
If there is a difference between "mechanic" and "tech" it shouldn't matter because you have to be both to be effective these days. I just got in from a call with a unit "throwing codes and shutting down." It had come from a very experienced mechanic whom I very much respect. But he doesn't know much computer stuff. This was a unit I have never seen before. I got the service manual (free if you know where to look) and found the code was engine mechanical fault, i.e. stopping when the computer didn't want it to. A little troubleshooting, eventually found the fuel line was pinched. The old guy should have been able to fix that in 10 minutes but the computer code threw him off his game.
You shouldn’t ever get to old to learn something new. I cringe when I hear an old mechanic cursing these computer controlled machines. When I started pulling wrenches that stuff was in its infancy, but I chose to learn because that’s the direction things were going. 99% of the time I can find the problem with out a laptop. The basics are still the same. Engines still need air fuel and fire or compression, electrical hasn’t changed and hydraulics haven’t changed. I use a laptop mainly to change settings, turn on functions and upload fuel trim codes. The rest of the time I troubleshoot from the knowledge and experience that I have. Stop learning and growing and you will find yourself being needed less and less.
The 'computer' and codes threw him off. Instead of even just listening to the engine's exhaust under load; miss firing from fuel starvation he was psyched out. Younger tech-mechs jump out their service trucks with laptop in hand, some want (and instructed to) hook up the laptop for the $100.00 or more invoice charge.
I didn’t mean to disparage the guy I was just making a general statement. But I know what you mean about the techs/mechanics these days. I once worked with a guy who couldn’t even put air in a tire without using his laptop. Drove me nuts. I once asked the guy if he pulled that thing out to make Love to his old lady. The same guy that once had me replacing a hydraulic pump because the computer said it was bad. Luckily for me I tested the sensor that caused the code and alarm first. I believe out of laziness it is the reason I became a great mechanic and troubleshooter. Because I don’t like doing work that I didn’t have to and I only want to do the work once.
Totally TRUE. I hear 'new junk' all the time from older mechanics with none-to-limited experience ( like 'I don't do email or texts) with computer diagnostic software. Simple, learn or retire. Electronics are 'guaranteed income'!
It is my experience that a tech has high skills but in a certain specialty. A mechanic is well rounded in all components. Our local dealer has transmission guys, generator guys, engine folks, driveline experts, but hardly any mechanics. If you need certain things you wait until the expert in that discipline frees up or you get a guesser. Then its a crap shoot on how your repair turns out. Its getting that way in all trades. Car dealers have been this way for years. Complication of machines certainly have a lot to do with it. My old knob certainly does not have the capacity to know all about these new machines.
If its a warranty job they wanted us to take a Product Status Report before clearing codes and one after repairing the problem and testing the unit. No PSRs or Media Numbers cited on the work order and (they said) CAT won't pay out the warranty claim. A laptop is definitely a must-have tool when dealing with modern machines. They get you pointed in the right direction but critical thinking and troubleshoot skills get the machine fixed properly.
I have no problem with computer backed diagnostics if somebody will pay the bill for my limited use. Not going to pay a grand for this or $850 for that if I don't use it up before the next subscription is due.
Well, YA! For a independents' LIMITED USE on CAT equipment you'd be ahead of the game purchasing a laptop loaded with SIS_ET_CBT with a bootlegged forever license. Upgrade SIS once per year or every couple of years for $100.00. No logging onto Cat, no passcode issues. You can't use Service Adviser, but that info is available from friendly Cat dealer service techs.
I have a problem with people changing the name of something in order classify something that isn't true. A mechanic is a repair and maintenance person. End of story. The connotation of a technician seems to me to designate someone who is less which actually is starting to be the case as described above in many responses. I don't know how many times I have been on sites where a tech has showed up and would do nothing because the computer didn't indicate what the problem was or designate the proper repair procedure. The job I did in Hawaii was a perfect example of this phenomena. A tech went out to replace a shotgunned travel motor, tore the machine apart, tweeked all the adjustment screws and then walked away from the job. Left the machine dead with a huge repair bill and then quit the dealership. It would appear at that point that "The Tech" was less than a repair person and shouldn't be paid the same as he couldn't perform the work required. If that is what a "Tech" is defined as, then I'll stay being a "mechanic".
Blew a hydraulic hose on the 140H the other day. Looked on parts store, and dealer will make one up for $122.47 but it would have meant waiting nearly 24 hours to get it up overnight by courier. Decided to rip into town and get one made up by Enzed. (national hose doctor franchise) The price of convenience?... $263.32 plus $2.00 for the o rings.
I prefer Serviceman, which is what Cat used to call us. I introduce myself as a mechanic. They call me a Technician on my pay stub and in the company directory and that’s about the only two places I hear the term I try my hardest to be well rounded on both electronic and hard skills.
Not true, A mechanic can be a technician. A technician can almost never be a true "mechanic". Pet peeve of mine. Refer to 6V92 post LOL
THIS over and over^^^^^^^^^
I am a Cat guy, that's pretty well know on the forums. The reason I prefer Cat is 70% dealer and 30% Cat. The construction/excavation business is basically the same wherever you are located and for the most part modern equipment is all on the same playing field minus a few shady manufacturers. What makes the end user like myself - the ones that depend on their iron to put food on the table - is the support that backs up the sale. A great piece of iron at a great initial purchase price is very expensive when you can't get parts or service when it breaks down and they all break down. My Cat salesman, Rental store salesman and PSR have went to the bat for us many, many times with Cat corporate and within their own organization. Most parts are available when I walk in the door or next day from Atlanta. Sometimes we have to wait a couple of days for some odd ball parts on some of our older equipment but I'm OK with that. Just my local $.02, your milage may vary.
And there, in a nutshell, is the difference. Customer support rather than "The Brand" itself..... Even different branches of the same dealer can have different levels of support because at the end of the days Customer Support is based on people rather than "systems" or "process". Many times I can recall customers bursting our salesmens' bubbles by telling them it was neither price nor the availability of a suitable machine that just got their business, it was the "Guys who'll look after it after we've bought it"............
Seems like Hastings Deering provides fair and professional service. I am wondering if you could recommend any firm with same level of service in the UK.
I walked into a customers shop a few days ago and 2 guys were attempting to put a tune up kit on their forklift engine. Its a super old Yale/Eaton with a 4 cyl Ford industrial engine. I started to head back to my truck and one of them yelled at me to come over. He said "Neither of us has ever seen these before." Then he held his hand out...…………..he was holding the points and condenser. LOL...…….WOW! He then asked me about the plug wires because they had just yanked them off. I told him that they have to go in a specific order, to be timed on #1, and you needed to know the firing order and direction of rotation of the distributor. The look on their faces was priceless. It was like I was talking gibberish to them.
At the quarry we had an old Yale fork truck, believe it was a retired Navy machine going by a tag on it, it had a flat head Chrysler six engine. Last time I was at the shop about a year ago I see it was parked out in the dead equipment yard. Have a feeling it is there for some simple little thing like the guys working on that Ford industrial. Once or twice a year the starter would stick on due to the mud and crap around the quarry. As long as you realized it and shut it off fast no harm was done and a quick shot of penetrating oil and a few taps on the external lever for the solenoid it was good for several months. Either that or there was some simple problem in the distributor, like carbon tracking in the cap causing miss-fire. If I had room and a real use for it I'd be trying to talk the boss into letting me have it for scrap iron price 95% chance I could have it running in a day for the price of a hamburger and fries!
Gess they would be stuffed fixing a Chevy V8 then.
AH, Ken, Maybe you just pointed out my problem? I have never let "room and a real use for it" get in the way of me bringing a piece of old iron home if I liked it. I can't afford a shrink. I spent all my money on old iron.
It's a great hobby. I am starting to liking it.
My Cat dealer, Fabick, at least at the tech and tech supervisor level, had been great. We’ve had to call out management a couple of times, but when confronted with computer data, they’ve always taken the truthful side. Their parts guys, save one, are friendly, and more than willing to take even 3+ hours to help a noob figure out the vague parts manuals when some obscure part is needed.
Finding some of the more obscure stuff in Cat Parts Manuals is an acquired (and marketable) skill IMHO. I like to think I managed to make a career out of it.
The thing is the hard to find item in the parts book can sometimes be what at least I would think to be a common part. Like a brake light switch for an 87A 988 Front end loader! I actually had a branch parts guy of our local dealer call me and ask for the part number and where it was shown in parts book! Maybe that's why when I retired in 2015 the local branch gave me a nice winter coat, set of beer glasses and a wall clock for my garage!