Hello, My wife and I moved out to the country and I'm surrounded by projects I'd like to work on this summer. I'm torn between just hiring these projects out or purchasing a machine so I can do the projects myself and have it available to me whenever I need it. Basically I need to create a swale in my yard for drainage, create a walkway, remove a number of trees and stumps and possibly create a small pond in a low area of the property. I found a JD 1010 backhoe in my area for what I thought was a decent price. I know it is old (vintage 1960's ) but the seller claims it all works except for the brakes. It looks to me like it would fulfill my needs since I don't need modern or huge equipment and for me the simpler things are the easier they are to fix. If anyone is familiar with this type of machinery I was wondering if parts, new or used can still be found and about how many hours on a machine this old would make most buyers walk away from checking it out if it had too many hours already..... It has a gas motor, some small leaks, no brakes but everything else works..... Thanks in advance for any information you can give me since I am very new at construction equipment.......SH
Welcome to the HEF, Project-man. Good to have you. Thanks for the great introduction. Most new guys just ask a bunch or questions and then ditch. We have the skill, we have the tools and we know how to chat. If you are looking for a Forum, the HEF is where it’s at ! The HEF is where topics never end. Giant hoes to emission deletes, theres always a new trend. Let me to take you on a trip. To a place very unique. Where heavy equipment Autists come together and conversations peak. Hang out on the HEF, where opinions are the norm. From SkyKing1 to Nige, they’ve got it going on.l!
Welcome to the Forums PM glad to have you! What is your level of heavy equipment experience? Don't know much about JD but there may be some issues sourcing parts for a 60 year old machine. Not having brakes is kind of a problem out of the gate... What's your budget and time frame?
Going out on a limb here for what I can imagine that 1010 will need in the way of repair you probably can find something 30 years newer that needs much less repair
If you prefer working on the dirt and trees, I would heartily recommend something more in the 80's to 90's for model years and diesel. If you prefer spending your time and money working on the equipment, then older isn't all bad. You imply that you haven't had a background in heavy equipment repair and tools to perform such, so really working on old iron isn't going to be your strong suit. As just a example, what your looking at is probably a $5-10,000 backhoe? Going to probably need tires, some hoses replaced. Cylinders repacked. Some welding on the loader or stick. Could have engine and transmission issues, but hopefully not catastrophic ones. Or you could spend $20-$30k. And get something vastly newer with better capabilities. . With better parts availability. And sell it 5 years from now, for what you gave for it. If your budget is $10,000 max, you would be better off renting the equipment you need, and be done with it. Unless you enjoy the use and care of old equipment. The 1010 isn't a very big backhoe, I don't think most had any roll over protection, and it would likely burn fuel like no tomorrow. Really the hours on the machine don't really matter at that age, any statement of hours is just a guess. Post up pictures of the machine, or preferably a link to the sales ad/ facebook/ craiglist listing so everyone can get a peek at it and give you some advice.
It all works today, tomorrow is the question. To head potential problems off before they start, you need to figure out where ALL fluid levels are at, how the oil looks, and if the filters have been changed in this decade. Also, get some fuel filters and a new battery right away. At least we'll have addressed the usual starting problems early.
If you have no experience with heavy equipment at all, it has a gas motor. Diesel engines are a whole different thing and if you have fuel problems or injection problems you're dealing with the mystery of the universe if you have no experience. Gas motor needs spark and gas, it's pretty simple stuff. So it it runs and goes and can dig a hole go for it if the price is right. What's the price? Somebody here can walk you through just about anything that dies, it's just nasty dirty work. Joe H
maybe a picture would help. Is this 1010 a smaller farm tractor with an add on backhoe, or a crawler with a backhoe? and what is the model number on the backhoe? There was a 110 JD backhoe that was a lighter model in the 310 line, but I've never seen a 1010.
Appears they are based on a 1010 industrial tractor. Fun fact the 1010 had the strangest cylinder sleeves ever all 4 could be replaced as one unit
Thanks so much for the feedback. I don't have much experience with heavy equipment but I'm definitely willing to learn and since I'm retiring from teaching it would be a good way to stay active and out of the house. The machine is $5000 and before I make an appointment to check out the machine, I was looking for some feedback from experienced people who are knowledgeable in this field. I like the fact it has a gas motor and not a diesel so tinkering with it would be easier for me. A backhoe seems more practical for the work I'd like to perform on my property but I'm also wondering if a skid steer would be effective due to the number of attachments available. The sad thing is where I live, I see similar machines like this one I'm interested in all over the place, parked next to barns and garages and they never seem to be used or moved. I wonder if they are operational or just sitting there parked until they get transported to the scrap yard.
An old machine like that would probably be a hobby all by itself. There is probably more wrong than right with it. You will easily spend another $5000 in just parts to get her usable. Take this from a guy who bought a 30 year old machine and has been working on it for 4 years on and off. I have yet to dig a hole with it. Granted I go months without getting time to work on it and I am doing more that patching it together. Not a restoration but not a patch job either, somewhere in the middle.
I'd buy that, but no more than $3000. $1,500 would be better but not likely he'd take that. I had a Case very similar, first year they made a backhoe. Gas motor, 4+2 speeds, pretty well clapped out but dug a lot of holes and was still clapped out and running when I sold it for what I paid for it. Don't be afraid of it just because it's old, I'm old too. Joe H
I'd look for something newer like a Case 580 of some sort that's much more common. Unlikely JD will have many parts if any for an old 1010. Would be nice if you could up your budget a bit. Making swales and walkways, a skid steer would be superior. A backhoe isn't very good for finish grading or even grading in general unless you can tell exactly what the bucket is doing.
A old diesel is easier to repair then a old gas. No point or plugs to worry about no carb to gunk up. Just a old roost master pump that may need a rebuild. And if it does it will only need it once. Not like points plug and carbs!
You’re probably going to have to double your budget to find anything that won’t just be a project in itself. If you could possibly stretch your budget to $15-20k that opens up a lot more available equipment and different types of equipment too. Also don’t be afraid of the diesels, if a diesel is running good when you buy it (and you keep the fuel system clean) chances are it will stay running good. A gas motor of that age will be constant tinkering, poor running, etc. Unfortunately the service parts for older gas stuff like that is just crap quality these days. It’s really hard to find a set of points, condenser, carb kit etc that are not junk and it makes keeping these older gas rigs running harder and harder. What percentage of your work is digging related (removing stumps, trenching, digging holes) vs grading (making swales/berms, building/fixing roads and paths, leveling ground), vs loading (loading material on/off trucks, carrying/piling dirt, compost, logs etc)? What is your terrain like and how many acres do you have? A little more details on your projects/situation will help us direct you towards the right machine.
Hi Project Man. Welcome to HEF. I'm relatively new to this stuff as well having purchased my Bhoe in April of last year. The gentlemen here are extremely knowledgeable and helpful. They've guided me through some tough repairs. You'll get a lot of great feedback so take your time on your purchase decision as you gain more knowledge. Good luck.
This is a picture of your pond before it fills with water. If you look close enough there is a beautiful piece of heavy equipment in there somewhere . . .
Thanks for the introduction and glad to have you on board. This is really an outstanding group of individuals that give an unbelievable amount of help, guidance, and support to those that genuinely want to learn. The only thing to add to what others have already said that hasn't been mentioned much is safety. You have made it to retirement (CONGRATULATIONS!), it would be a real shame for you to get seriously hurt on a piece of equipment. A machine like you pictured, doesn't have any kind of protective structure over the operator, isn't balanced like a modern backhoe, mechanical condition very unknown, etc. etc. For not a whole lot more money, you could get something like an earlier Case 580D or E, or even a K and have a much better chance of having something dependable AND safer. It's a lot of fun working on your own place, but it is no joke knocking over big trees or working on a pond dam or steep road. For what you described that you want to do, I'd seriously consider a skid steer over a backhoe and then rent a mini ex when you needed to dig. Let us know what you decide!
Great points Jbrady. Based off all of that, I suggest you consider renting a machine first. Get several of the projects all lined up and organized, all the fences and brush cleared away, etc. Then rent something nice and fresh. Get it delivered on a Friday and picked up Monday for a single day rental, if that is possible. That way you have two working days plus Friday evening to use up the 8 hours on the meter. 1) the brakes will work 2) it will have an ROPS 3) it will be unbelievably faster than that old hoe. Just a thought. Most guys who buy hoes to do projects, they end up exactly like you see them all over the country, parked and no longer needed. I built our 1.25 acre place from raw land, logs and stumps in 1995. It has not needed a machine on it for 15 years now. First rental was a 200EC cat. 1 day Cat 312 1 day brought home a 580 case from work, 1 day here and there. 350 rental dozer and a little roller for a weekend, and seeded it. Since then the company excavator has been off the trailer a few times, but really not for any need, just because I had it with me.
Welcome to HEF! I wouldn't pay more than $3000 for a tractor that old and that would be if everything works like it should. If it's not all beat to crap it could be a fun project in itself. You can get by without brakes if you are keeping it on your property. My NH doesn't have brakes and they are too complex and expensive to repair so I just use caution. Found a few videos on this model. https://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=jd+1010+backhoe
JBrady makes really good points in regards to safety, personally I wouldn’t even consider any machine without a ROPS. Clearing trees in particular can be very dangerous work. Bigger is better. Full caging is best, and it takes experience to do safely. Every species reacts differently to being pushed over…. Is your ground hilly or steep? If so tracks will be a lot more stable than tires. As skyking1 noted, once the main work is completed an excavator will sit most of the time. When our excavators have been at home during the off season they just sit….the skid steer however sees year round use.
I think that all trees want to kill you, just some of them are better equipped to do so.
Yep!.. Twice had tops come off large over mature spruce…very brittle wood, not a lot of strength. Both times in a fully caged Hitachi 270. Managed to catch and toss aside falling top once, second time a glancing blow. Need to ‘ease’ into tree very gently to get initial lean….even then trouble happens fast….
It wouldn't be a bad idea at all for the original poster to look at your posts about your backhoe. At least the time and money you've invested, is going to pay off. You bought a lot newer backhoe, with 4x4 and the cat parts support system. Which is money well spent in my opinion. There is a world of difference between what he is looking at buying, and your backhoe.
I would not own a machine without a Cab in my area. ROPS is a must. I decided that my machine was going to live with me for a long time so I took the extra time to make things right and do all the usual maintenance items like hoses and cylinder repacks. When I do start using it I do not want to be fixing problems every time I go to do something. My home project got put off by COVID and some other life twists so there is no urgency to getting her done. Soon I will need to finish what is left. You mention the CAT parts support. That is huge, I am amazed at how most anything I want is available with the exception of body parts. I am not sure about Case but I personally would not buy a John Deere because I had a bad experience with a piece of their equipment and getting repair parts and the two dealers near me treat people like crap. The CAT dealer is amazing. The counterman dropped parts off to my house which is 35 miles away, all because they did not get the parts the day they promised they would have them.
I'd listen to crane operator. Spend the extra money now for a better machine. My father bought an old Case 580c for our cabin in the mountains over the summer and it's hasn't moved since it was delivered to the house. Thankfully I found this forum. The folks on here are incredibly knowledgeable and willing to help. At this point I'm already in it and enjoy the challenge but Imagine I'll be spending dozens of hours working on this 580. Hopefully as I learn I can share my knowledge with the next poor sucker that gets himself into the same situation as me.
If you can swing it and shipping would be a concern but ford made a good hoe . A lot are municipal machines so good care but old and parts are a problem when it breaks and they all break . Old cats like a 416 for some reason keep ticking and you can get parts . Lots of farmers around here have them but they are long in the tooth . I learned on an International backhoe but wouldn't entertain the thought of owning one . Old Deere was good solid but I don't know about getting parts .
I'm pretty much a know-nothing around here but I agree with the others. Rent something or a couple somethings to get your big jobs done. For tree work I'd likely get an excavator and have everything ready to go over. Either cut them as high as possible or push them over. With a decent excavator you can push over a lot of trees in a few hours, with a thumb on there you can also grab them and move them out of the way. As the other guys have said falling trees are no joke and can literally kill you, knock you and your machine around, and destroy things. It's nice to be as far away from falling tree chunks, with a sturdy cab around you. If you still want a project after that then you could consider a backhoe like you've mentioned, but if stumping I want to warn you that it likely won't have the guts to to pull stumps over a foot or so in diameter. Stumps can be surprisingly stubborn. I've got a New Holland lb75b (or maybe lb85, hard telling) that is a reasonably beefy full size backhoe and and the hole you need to dig to rip out roots is usually pretty big and even then you can pretty easily flip your machine over by wrapping around a big root. A decent sized excavator will make easy work of any of that, again, if you have good weather and your ducks in a row. Good luck with your new adventure! I was in a similar boat with new (to me) land and after renting a backhoe to get some immediate projects taken care of I was almost happy to spend about 25k on a mostly contemporary backhoe (no DEF or computer issues on my 2004 model!).
For what it's worth I bought a Case 580C a few years ago for $5000, in the full knowledge that it needed some not insignificant work on the pins and bushings in the swing tower (that's British understatement for you ), a shuttle rebuild, some work on the engine, and it had no working brakes. I've got a fair amount of use out of it so far, and am (very) slowly working through the list of things that need to be fixed, but it'll take a while and have cost a fair amount by the time it's done. And of course there have been numerous hose replacements and cylinder repacks on top of that. And an unexpected starter failure. And so on. (Parts are reasonably available for it, at generally reasonable prices, which helps.) I'd be wary of something significantly older and less common, to be honest... Unless the price was really really good, and you're happy to put a significant amount of cash and time (and sweat) into it.
As a "just for example". Here's two backhoes local to me. Ones a ford 555, the other a Jd 310D. The JD has extendahoe. I think the ford was for sale for $13,900, the JD for $15,000. If you spend another $3-5,000, you can find ones with 4x4 in similar age and shape. This is the kind of stuff you need to be looking for. JD, Case, Cat, Ford. In no particular order. I'd prefer 4x4 if I was buying.
Exactly what I was thinking too. Those old gassers can have everything new, and still not run.
Wow!! Thanks so much for the feedback everyone..... A wealth of information and many things to think about. I contacted a rental company yesterday about renting a machine and I'm thinking that would be a good way to go before I invest in a machine that I will need to service, store and keep operational for as long as I have it. My main project is to create a berm and swale to redirect very heavy rainfall from entering the basement area of our home. On the side of the home there is a downgraded area leading to a basement garage area. The side yard both grades to a steep down hill and sadly gradually grades towards the basement area. 99 times out of a 100 rainstorms there is capable drainage both down the hill and drains in front of the basement garage door can handle the water. But if it rains for hours and hours and the soil gets saturated the basement drains can't handle the water and we have had 2 basement floods in the last 3 years since we have been in the home. The original earth material that was excavated to create this "basement garage" set up is available for me to move and redistribute and attempt to create a berm to prevent excessive rainwater from flooding our basement anymore. The soil composition is basically sand and tons of small to medium sedimentary rocks. The soil only good for growing grapes. I'm thinking of going in 3 directions: 1) hire a guy to do the whole job @ $3500 2) hire a guy to dump 5-6 dump truck loads of clean fill and rent a skid steer to do the finish grading $$?? 3) rent a backhoe or skid steer for a week, relocate the original earth material and redistribute it into a berm and attempt to use the front bucket for grading @ $1000. So that's where I'm at, it's Feb and the ground is pretty hard so I will be planning to do this in March or April. I'm trying to plan ahead and your feedback and information is very helpful to me. Especially about upping my budget for a decent machine, diesels are great if they are in good running condition, and the safety aspect of tipping over an older machine (the day after I retire) and suffering catastrophic physical damage. I'm sorry this post is too long but hopefully it describes the project I'd like to complete before too long and I definitely do not want to experience a flooded basement for as long as I live here in the country..... :/
if there is anywhere on your property that is lower than the basement door threshold, you can fix it.
Backhoe or skid steer rental, for a week, with fuel, will likely run you in the $1.5k+ range. Fill material is likely another grand (but I'm guessing on that one) and the likelihood of not doing it well enough may be costly as well (I speak from experience!). There would be the nice part of having that equipment around to take care of other stuff while you had it, but you'll be angry at yourself if you didn't build the swales properly. Granted, I don't really know the layout of what you are trying to accomplish but if the $3500 is from a guy that knows what he's doing that doesn't sound like a bad price at all to me. Maybe try to see some examples of his work before committing. I don't know how much education is available to learn how to create berms or swales out there. It's not terribly difficult but done well isn't as easy as it seems it should be, again, I know from experience. I've done several jobs several times because I didn't really understand what I was doing, luckily I had a backhoe sitting there waiting to do the hard work. You won't have that luxury if you rent.
WOW! That was deep! You could write for a magazine!
As the former owner of two John Deere backhoes, I'll tell a bit about my woes: In 1999 I bought a 1974 JD 410. It was low hour, joints tight, no welds on it at all. Factory rear bucket had a crack in the cutting edge. Front bucket had a crude job of adding to the weld on cutting edge. Overall, even the original paint looked good. It had just sold at a farm auction. I was considering buying it from the new buyer. I vaguely knew the farmer who had sold it. I asked him if there was a reason I wouldn't want it. He went on about how good the brakes were. I tried to drive it home, 10 miles. I ran low on hydraulic/transmission oil. Had to get oil to refill it to get home. Resolving the leak, it ran fine first hour, then didn't have enough power to lift an empty bucket. Loader took 2 minutes to raise to full height. I went to my nearest John Deere dealer, found they were closed. John Deere now has one dealer in my state, 65 miles away from me. They offered to send a mechanic, He would not have hydraulic diagnostic tools, only a good mechanic. He MIGHT be able to diagnose the problem. His trip would cost between $1200. and $1500. Most wanted me to try a new hydraulic pump $1400. The pump on it was a different color, I figured someone had already done that. I made some calls, tried to figure what the problem was. Somebody several states away said I had an oil flow problem. Oil was flowing somewhere it shouldn't. Get an infra red camera, start it up cold. As oil starts to warm, it'll show heat where oil shouldn't flow. Tried that, found oil was slipping past in two sections of the backhoe valve. New Hampshire Hydraulics confirmed the diagnosis. They believed it was defective when new. John Deere said the part was No Longer Available. New Hampshire Hydraulics said they couldn't get the two sections I needed, but a whole different valve could be assembled from parts. It took 6 months for them to provide the valve. It cost $1400. New valve was 1.5" narrower than the old, so joystick controls wouldn't mate up. I fabricated a new joystick mechanism. 20 years later I bought a JD410C from a friend. Backhoe boom wouldn't lift when warm. When it was up, it sagged in seconds to the ground. John Deere Parts & Service offered no help. The port relief valve size of a 1/2" hex socket was unavailable. After weeks of trying every lead possible including the dealer several calls, I asked to speak to the service manager. I posed to him: "So your telling me your best customer had my problem, there is nothing you could do for him?" No he said, "We can rebuild it." $48. I had a rebuild kit, after hours spent trying to find this thing. Turns out an identical port relief valve different part number is available, just have to readjust relief pressure. I have found John Deere is unconcerned about older machines, and their owners.
The best advice I got for removing stumps was to DIG them out. Don't try to pull them. I have dug out some monsters. Backhoes were built for digging. That said the smaller stumps can sometimes be pulled but don't overwork the machine trying. Also it is easier to get some of them out with the tree attached. Dig around the base of the tree a little and you can often push the tree over and it will pull the stump as it falls. Pulling on stuff with too much force tears things up and blows hoses.
This is something you can completely do yourself, skid steer, very easy to run, not as dangerous as backhoe and safer, just keep everyone away from you. What you described could be done in one weekend, with using the on site fill. Probably call for a 10 wheeler of loam after you’re done and would sub that out to the young guys, or do yourself.
How is a skid loader safer than a backhoe?
Personally, I think it’s way easier for a non operator to learn how to run a skid steer than a backhoe and can do way less damage to his house in 5 minutes than backing into one with a backhoe but maybe that’s just me. lol
I would agree because it's so much shorter. You don't have that back bucket sticking that out there looking to ruin all sorts of things like the house, the trees, the brush, your car, anybody stupid enough not to get out of the way etc etc. At the dam job, an operator drove a 988 or maybe a 66 or maybe the 80? Into the parking lot where people park their cars maybe he was getting his lunch. I don't know. I do know that he counterweighted Chris the crane operators Subaru right at the a pillar. He also parked the loader and left before he got two checked!
It depends a lot on the person in the seat. Skid steers can be intimidating to someone who has never operated equipment before, especially with joystick control. You certainly don't want to go near buildings or other hazardous area's until you're fully familiar with the controls. Skid steers can also tip backwards or forwards. Any machine is dangerous when you aren't used to it.
Thanks again for the tips..... the only reservation about renting a skid steer instead of a backhoe is that I'm not sure how well a skid steer can remove this old settled material that is essentially become a medium sized grassy hill with 2 mature trees on the side of it. From some of the videos I have seen regarding how to operate skid steers, they shouldn't be operated on the side of hills or slopes because they can tip over. I would need to scalp the top of the hill to remove material and I'm not sure how much material I can remove from each pass. It's probably the same for a backhoe but I would imaging the force a backhoe bucket would have would be more efficient at removing material than the scraping of the skid steer. But I don't really know and that's why I really appreciate the tips and ideas you fellas have offered me. Just this afternoon I've been cutting firewood from some big ass rotten fallen trees that made a mess of our property a month ago. I've been using my 3/4 ton plow truck to drag the 20' logs around and keep thinking how easy a machine could be to do this property "management" stuff. After several posts, I believe a machine is in my not to distant future and I need to realize it's almost like getting married..... God only knows whether it will happy or frustrating..... :/
you can always get an annulment.
Backhoe is the most versatile excavation machine. An excavator as heavy will dig faster. A skidsteer is a fine machine to distribute soils on a flat dry surface. A big articulated loader is great for loading thousands of yards. A tracked dumper is fine for rough terrain transporting. A bulldozer is nice for finish work, or lowering a grade. None of these can do all the jobs a backhoe can do. In my case, I have land 3 miles from home. Hooking up the trailer to the dump truck takes time. Loading the machine takes time. Chaining the machine, driving, unchaining, unloading, stowing the chains & binders where thieves won't steal them takes time. In less time than it takes to air up a tire on the trailer I drive the backhoe to "the land". At "the land" the driveway is steep. A not loaded truck, towing a heavily loaded trailer won't make the hill. I have to unload out at the highway. In my world a backhoe is pretty versatile!
Interesting question. That could be quantified and measured fairly easy. A quick search identified at least six different gov, safety, manufacture, trade orgs & agencies that track that data, more if you include Canada. More if you look at agriculture. If I had more time, It would be fun to go down that rabbit hole. Looks like most skid steer accidents are mechanical crushing injuries and rollovers.
Rent a compact track loader (skid steer with tracks), with a tooth bucket, and it should have no problem digging anything but the hardest ground. Sod, clay, light shale, etc it will dig up with ease. It will also be more stable than a wheeled skid steer. It will not dig out stumps or take down large trees effectively, that's generally work for a backhoe or excavator. What you are proposing should be an easy weekend project.
yes, I don't even consider wheeled skid steers. One of those would make for a nice weekend rental.
Backhoes are the Swiss Army Knife of excavation. There are machines that do specific operations better but none that perform all the functions a backhoe can.
The thing about ssl Ctl . I was late for work one day and flustered tired . Boss man mad for be late yells at me to jump in the Bobcat and start shading pipe . Grab a bucket of sand and start hauling *** and a dude walks out from behind a dump truck and first thing I do is hit the breaks . Well its not the breaks and sand goes all over . Someone just getting used to those machines make that mistake a bunch . I can't stand bobcat for that reason .
Need some pics. of what you want to do and the terrain. Without seeing the actual "job site" it's impossible to say what machine would be best. I wouldn't automatically discount a skid steer with tires.
That's a perfect example of why you should get used to a machine (any machine) in a big open area instead of just jumping in green. It greatly helps to elimate panic moments. Sometimes you have to tell the boss no. What if you would have hit the guy and he was badly injured?
Well, I don't know anything about government data, but it would seem skid loaders are inherently more dangerous than a backhoe. You can't see out of a skid loader, and when the boom is up, especially on some models (Bobcat) they can be real tippy.
All machines are dangerous if people don't read the manual or have proper instruction on how to operate them. There also needs to be a lot of common sense which unfortunately isn't that common.
I think I didn't get the point across . Wasn't green Ran the bobcat for months . Most people in a panic hit the breaks and that means feet not hands . Most I think will react that way if new and I wasn't just natural reaction . Would also hit breaks in a scraper even when they don't work before I would drop the bowl . Make sense ?
Not really in a skid steer if you've got some hours in it. You could let go of the drive levers.
Reading the manual and receiving "proper instruction" is a great blanket solution for internet Airchair Quarterbacks. You don't get good instinct and reflex from a book.
I can see how it could be to a newer operator. Lower to the ground. Smaller. Less hangy-down things (technical term). etc.
One of the most common pieces of advice on this forum is to get a manual. It doesn't just tell you basic maintenance. My Cat track loader has a plate on the dash that basically says to not operate this machine until you have read the manual and familiarized yourself with the controls. Having someone experienced with a machine show/teach you is the best way to get familiarized. It doesn't matter if it's a skid steer or a D11. You don't just hop in a machine you're not familiar with. If your boss tells you to, do you think he's going to take responsibility if something bad happens? Nothing wrong with saying you've never ran that machine before. And yes, I've got thousands of hours in a skid steer. They aren't a simple jump in the seat and you're an instant operator machine. You need to know how to react in an emergency situation. Knowing the controls and getting some competent instruction is the best way to learn.
You know, honestly; I don't think I have ever actually read an operators manual for any machine I have ever run. I really don't know of anybody else who ever has either. Aside from explaining the controls, all the manual really winds up being is a liability cover for the manufacturer. Pages and pages of the manufacturer informing me that the machine can kill me. The first time I ran a skid steer was on a farm I worked at as a teenager. The place was pretty much staffed from the local high school. Besides a couple brief instructions on what not to do, the training was basically "Go get the skid loader and start moving trees, two sticks, two pedals, you will figure it out". That's the way it is on every farm and small job in this country. So maybe you can go to a big union shop and they will give you all sorts of "proper training", but in the real word it often doesn't work that way.
On a job site if something bad happened, I don't think "I didn't read the manual" would help your defence. More the opposite. Many accidents could have been avoided if someone had just read the manual. If it was a crane you'd sure want to read the manual and it's no different with a skid steer. Some people might pick it up quick, some won't.
Exactly what sort of "bad thing" or accident on a jobsite is going to be prevented by reading a operators manual? I have never given "not reading the manual" as a defence when something has gone wrong. The guys I have worked for would have laughed pretty hard at that one. The last bad thing that happened to me on a jobsite in a skid loader was blowing the front door out. I was tired, it was an unfamiliar area with different tree species, and I generally just was careless and screwed up. What was the manual going to do about that? Most of the bad stuff that has been done to my machines by employees was caused by carelessness or general stupidity.
I actually do read the manual of almost every machine I own, new or used. I'll buy a manual for a used machine if it doesn't come with it. Not so much for the safety aspect, but there are a lot of little features, settings, etc that I would have never found or used if I hadn't read the manual. Also for service related things, like that hidden grease fitting that no one would know about. Do I need to read the manual to safely and effectively run a piece of equipment, no. But for the small amount of time it takes I often learn things that help me be more productive or take better care of the machine.
Reading the manual let's you get familiar with the controls and features of a machine. It will also have warnings about what not to do. Nothing bad comes from reading the manual but could from not reading it. A little while ago there was a thread about mini-ex's. and a certain model could put the bucket in contact with the cab if the boom is in a certain position. Reading the manual could warn you about things like that so you don't find out the hard way.
I am the same way, call me crazy; but I actually enjoy the read.
I've read the manual for my machine. Maybe not all the way through but to understand location and function of everything as well as capacities and fluid types.
I remember when I rented the backhoe before I bought mine. My street, as mentioned elsewhere, isn't conducive to long truck/trailers so the rental guy stopped at a church parking lot down the road. I had no idea how to operate the machine. I think he gave me a very quick "Here's how you go forward and backward" and sent me off. As soon as I was parked in my driveway I sat and read through the operators manual for probably an hour or two. I made it through the rental with no major issues, but it was nice, as a know-nothing, to have a bit of understanding of where stuff was and some of the hazards. That being said, I don't think the manual mentioned any of the things that I've been in trouble with in my backhoe. Trees above you, getting stuck in mud, etc.
Safety is similar with all makes & models. A refresher is never a bad thing. Between machines there will be differences. One machine recommended leaving the bucket bottom perpendicular to the dipper, let the teeth do the penetrating, take much of the wear. My current hoe wants me to use the bucket curl to loosen the soil. This manual points out this hydraulic circuit has the most power. All backhoe manuals warn against pushing the dirt back into the hole with the swing. Come to think, I never have figured out the differential lock.
Thanks again for the information.... the swale I want to construct will mostly be in an open area of our yard and I will take down the two mature trees on the side of the small hill before I start removing that material from that hill for the swale. Figuring out the logistics and strategy for this project is challenging for me. I can just pay someone to do it for me but since I would someday like to have a machine of my own. I really would like to familiarize myself with slid steers or backhoes and see how productive they can be for me a week at a time. If most of your think a skid steer (with an aggressive bucket) can break up the old material on the hill that initially was dug out to create the "garage" basement then I would rent one for a week and see how much damage I can do with it. I'm thinking a couple of days on the skid steer will give me a good indication whether or not I would need additional material for an effective swale and allow enough time to grade the material properly and be done with it. I'm thinking in the fall when I have to cut down some large trees in a wooded area of our property, I can rent a backhoe to dig out the stumps and rough grade the area I want to clear for a better view. Using both of these machines would help me understand the potential either machine has to offer and if either machine would be worth the time, investment and space necessary to keep them operational.
Pick dry weather to work the job.
Any machine will take a couple of days or more to get somewhat familiar with. If there were mature tree's where you want to make the swale could be a problem. If there's a lot of roots near the surface and you start digging it up could turn it into a much bigger project. I've told potential customers I couldn't do it when they wanted landscaping done where large tree's were still standing or been removed. If you can add material and still get the proper slope and drainage makes it much more feasible.
Mature trees where you are getting material for the swale? As Dave mentions above that may be troublesome, I've never really messed with a skid steer but if you are trying to pick up dirt full of roots it could be tricky. Also, how productive can you be? Extremely! Every time I used my hoe I'm amazed at how much work can be done quickly.
Roots can be extremely difficult to deal with if they're near the surface. You can't just shear them off nor can you dig them out easily (with a skid steer when landscaping). You can hook a root and when you try to lift it up you instantly have a 10' long trench/rut where the root came out of the ground. One root can also lift other roots out of the ground so now you have 5 or 6 of these trenches or ruts. It literally is opening a can of worms. Your 1 hour landscaping job can become an all day affair because you have to dig out or cut all the roots and then bring in more material to make up for volume lost by the roots. Spruce tree's are especially bad but any mature tree's can have a bunch of roots near the surface. That's why it's easy to turn jobs down. Better to walk away than open a can of worms the customer won't want to pay to close.
If you rent something buy the extra insurance that absolves you of any damages to the equipment.
I seldom dig out a stump. The process depends on the tree. I do NOT push dead trees! A healthy tree with no dead branches I push over. A healthy tree trunk is a big lever. In the mid 1980s I bought a Power Wagon with two winches. I would climb high as I could get with a ladder, hitch a heavy chain & a winch cable. I've taken 24" hardwoods easily this way. Lately I push them over. Set the backhoe, sink the bucket teeth deep as I can into the bark 15' above the ground & push. It the tree is too big to simply push, I dig some roots out on the near side. Up to 36" diameter this method takes out stump & all.
Thanks again for the responses......the 2 mature (@ 20" diam) trees do pose a problem because they would need to be taken down and stumps dugout to effectively remove material from this hill...... basically I need to move @ 8-10 cubic yds. of material next to the hill and as far as @ 50' to create this swale. I can remove material from the top of the hill/berm and go down to above the trees but as stated before, I would need to be very careful not to back into these trees and damage the rental......I'm going to attempt to send some pics of the project because a picture is worth a 1000 words. I'm terrible at technology so if I'm unsuccessful, please don't kick me off of the forum......
If it were me, I think I'd reshape the whole backyard to get the proper slope away from the house. A small swale is just a band aid fix IMO, and could be easily overwhelmed in a heavy rain. You've got plenty of area to work with, you need the entire grade sloping away from the house, pool, etc for at least 10-20', then you can reshape the backyard to suit. Still an easy job with a large tracked skid steer, but you're going to be moving a lot more than 8-10cy.
That's another option I was thinking about and I'm assuming it would require a mid sized bulldozer to rework the backyard and create the best drainage for the whole backyard. That would mean I would completely obliterate the fine "field grass" lawn I've manicured over the last year but I guess a summer w/o a decent lawn is better than a flooded basement any day..... I'll take a few more pics to see if I can better present the scope of work..... you guys are the best!!
Looking at those pictures, I'd be thinking just a Catch Basin (CB) and pipe installation. The opposite of tearing up the whole thing.
In the hands of a good operator a dozer is far better at grading. The roots won't bother it either. You won't need a mid size dozer, the smallest dozer available will be just fine, 65hp/17,000lb or so. A dozer will cost about three times as much as a skid loader, and will be harder to find at rental. Also, if you don't have experience it may not make much of a difference. A good operator in a tracked skid loader (CTL) will do a fine job as well. I would just get a big CTL, myself.
Do you really need a garage door for entry to the basement ? A stairwell and a standard 36" wide door would be my preferred solution. If it were mine, I would eliminate it and fill the pit in with decent fill material. Your water problems would gone forever I have a stairwell and entry door in my basement and I wouldn't want it any other way. Most building codes do not require escape windows in basements that have a entry/ exit door. (It doesn't apply to you, but, it may to other people reading this thread)
Pictures are hard to interperet. The depth of the soil and distance will give a better idea of the scope of work needed, or what the options are. I'd do just about anything to make it drain over the surface, but the swale with a bigger catch basin and pipe would work also. The garage door should go unless you need it and use it. Huge energy waste. French doors that both open are nice for big projects if that's what the basement is for.
Looks like a real nice spot with a great view that we can't see much of! I will reiterate that I don't know anything but I think I'd go with an oversized french drain at the top of the garage door hill that runs the water off elsewhere. Maybe that's what skyking and Delmer are suggesting too? A catch basin is just a hole somewhere else, where the water can seep into the ground, right?
There is already some type of drain in front of the garage door. A lot of material needs to be removed to get drainage. Find where it is lower than your basement floor and take a picture from there to your house. Will need to know where your septic is. Where does that drain go?
Stand with your back at the retaining wall by the pool, and take a picture showing the direction of the yellow arrow. That looks like the direction you are going to have to get the water to flow. i.e. get the dirt to slope that way. Whoever originally set the house up, with the garage door and walk door being a water pit, needs their *** kicked.
I don't think you've said where you live. If it doesn't freeze there underground, dig a trench around the high side of the basement, a bit lower than the footing. The trench needs a gentle slope to daylight. Buy landscape fabric 3 times as wide as the ditch is deep. Lay fabric in the ditch & add six inches of crushed 1-3/4" stone. Put perforated drain pipe in. Fill the trench with 1-3/4" crushed to a few inches below grade. Fold fabric to keep dirt out & fill with more crushed. Swail is very nice, but only controls water on the surface, You likely want ground water controlled also.
They have lot grading inspectors for city lots now and they have to approve the grade for proper drainage. I don't think they did a few decades ago as I've seen quite a few yards that slope towards the house instead of away from it. On acreage's I don't know if the grading has to pass inspection. It's like drainage is a 2nd thought on a lot of properties. The same thing with planting tree's. People forget or don't realize that tree's grow bigger and the roots can cause extensive damage to pipes and even foundations. It's another area where there's alot of people who lack common sense. People building house's surrounded by tree's in close proximity is another lack of common sense. It's just asking for trouble if there's ever a wild fire.
Thanks again for all of the feedback and ideas.....one of the senior suggested we put in a catch basin and pipeline to the hillside. I was quoted by an excavation guy @ $10,000 for that job due to the depth they would need to dig for a proper pipeline slope and though that was a little excessive..... but non-the-less a very good solution to the water overflow problem. I'm sending a few more pics that were taken at a longer distance to hopefully better represent this annoying problem. I really appreciate the knowledge and experience I'm receiving from the members of this forum. It's helped me a lot trying to figure out this grading problem. I like being independent and buying this property in the country gives me the excuse to work on different projects I would never need to do in the burbs......
without completely redoing your entire property you need to do the catch basin suggestion. Do you need the garage door? If not, you could close off the door opening and put in an external staircase down to the regular door opening and backfill all around then either use a bulkhead door or building a small entryway with a normal exterior door.
NO, that is a bad idea. You are buying that all the waterproofing on either side of it is up to the task. Right now, that waterproofing is relieved by the open end. Close it off and you will find out the very hard way if it is done right.
Is the level of the pavement in the 2nd to last pic lower than the floor of the basement/walkout? If so I'd still stand by my suggestion of completely reworking the whole back yard. Bring the grade above the pool down and slope it away, and bring the grade from the walkout basement down enough that water flows towards the pavement and away from the house. I know this all sounds drastic, but IMO it's the only surefire way to fix a drainage problem like that. It's not as big of a job as you'd think, I could probably do it in a day or so with my CTL, with my small dozer it'd be done by lunch time. Spend another day to tidy everything up, seed and straw, and you'd be good to go for decades to come.
He's got the existing drain and apron that would have to stay. The swale is a good idea and would work most of the time to keep excess water away from that drain so it doesn't get overwhelmed. The basement stairs would keep even more water away. Digging the whole yard out to get the surface to drain will be even better, but I still have no idea how much dirt that would be, if there's bedrock in the way, or what. You can find how deep and for how far you need to dig with a water level and tape measure, but those pictures don't show any elevations, and pictures are hard to judge for slope.
A swale to drain excess surface water is the best idea. You can't really change the level of the water table but if you can prevent water pooling by having water run off towards a swale(s) will help a lot. May have to reshape the high area's to slope away from buildings as well preferably redirecting it to a swale. It doesn't have to drain directly to a swale. If it has to take an odd path that's 100' or longer to get to the swale or low spot is OK.
At this point I really just want to see that expansive view, facing that same direction, in the last photo you posted, but from the pool deck! It looks like it's incredible!
Well, now we know where that drain grate from in front of the garage door goes. Either put in a swale with some big rock and grow grass over it, or put in real catch basin and 8” corrugated out to driveway as long as it drains good there.
Hello again and sorry for my absence.... my wife and I were out of town taking care of our 6th grandchild and our 7th was born while we were out of town..... 7 grandkids under 4 years old.... we are so blessed and now I have 4 grandsons who I'll need to put to work in my twilight years..... Back to business.... the previous homeowner had a 50' perforated coiled draining pipe under the floor of the basement (which made no sense to me) which does a good job removing water except when there is a deluge of rainwater.....so it seems like most parties agree here that a properly graded swale would do a good job of relocating excessive rainwater away from the basement area and not cost a fortune to do it. At the rental we're staying in, I noticed a old Kubota B7 100 Diesel backhoe. It's 4 X 4 and has 1349 hours on the motor. The unit looks in decent shape and I want to see what the owner has planned for this little backhoe. If she's interested in selling it, what procedures would I need to do to get it started and running since it looks to me like it has not been run for at least a year. I'm not sure what the owner did with this mini backhoe except for preparing a small garden she has in her yard. The backhoe has been stored in a shelter out of the elements. Any thoughts about this particular machine and whether or not they would be useful and practical or should I experiment with rentals to understand the best machine for my needs today and in the future...... This equipment stuff gets addicting since there are so many choices and consequences for not getting the right piece of equipment. You guys are the best!!
I'd probably pass on the B7100 Kubota for the work you have planned. I have a B3200 Kubota with a backhoe (newer and larger) and even as such it would take a long time to do what you are planning. The only thing I use the hoe for are small digging jobs on finished lawns or where the mini excavator wont fit, otherwise it's just a counterweight. If you do want to go the route of a small TLB, the only ones you should consider are the commercial grade models: Kubota B21, B26, L35, L39, L48, or JD 110. They are faster, stronger and more rugged than the standard compact tractor with a backhoe attachment.
Yeah, unfortunately I don't think that machine would do much big work for you. You could scratch at tree roots for hours without the ass on the machine to do much, except maybe flip you over. If you were moving clean dirt for your swale it'd be better than nothing but it'd be a lot of scooping smaller buckets of dirt than you want with the hoe side, then loading and moving it. If you have material with little roots and rocks it may be ok, if you have time.
"I noticed a old Kubota B7 100 Diesel backhoe." These machines are built for people who retire too early. Best suited for planting shrubs & posies. My son's friend bought a Kubota Compact Utility Tractor with permanent loader & hoe. We used it a few times. Project 1: I was installing invisible dog fence, requires a six inch ditch. I was using my Case 580K I had at the time. My son & his buddy showed up, wanted to switch machines. They had a bigger project they needed a bigger machine. I continued reasonably well with my project with the little machine until I got to the driveway. Hard packed gravel driveway, took about two hours to dig a shallow trench across. Project 2: I had major flood damage to a storage building. Half a 24 x 40 building was undermined. A 24 x 12 concrete slab had to be broken up & removed, then new gravel was hauled in from outside & some was brought inside. I could reach with the full sized backhoe only until the windshield hit. The Kubota was perfect for indoor excavating, mostly pushing gravel into the hole. Project 3: We had to correct someone's mistake where they installed their own underground service to a new home. Job involved digging 4' deep trench 8' long. Took all day! Not enough reach to dump spoils, had to stop several times to move the pile away from the hole. Project 4: A steep sidehill with 4' of less steep at the top, sloping away from a house. Job involved trenching for electrical & gas, placing an underground gas tank. It was too steep side hill for the big backhoe. After wasting much of two days with the Kubota, I was frustrated! I dug a trench at top of the hill for uphill tires of the big backhoe & placed the spoils for the downhill tires to ride on. Took more grass seed, but got the job done. I would not consider the CUT backhoe for your project. It is just too small. Rent an excavator, or full sized hoe if you aren't interested in having a full sized machine.
Thanks again for the input....I kinda thought it was a little small for my needs and the home owner said they do use the machine a few times every summer for their gardens. I have to get an insurance wavier from my homeowners company before I can rent equipment from a local rental company. I will identify what is available for me to rent and get your feedback. When I'm home I will also take a picture Crane Operator requested to show the depth of the garage area in relation to the side yard. The more I'm contemplating this swale project, I'm thinking some loads of clean fill will reduce the amount of material I will need to dig up in order to create a decent swale and just need a skid steer to finish grading the material.
Before you go too far consider this. The drain you mentioned is actually the code for around here. there needs to be drainage around the high side of every house so it doesn’t flood the basement. You need to address the waterproofing of your foundation. You can swale and swallow and whatever you want but if you’re getting water intrusion, you should check the sealer. whomever did the retaining wall and site drainages on that job sucked ass. You may consider hiring someone that knows what to do at least in the civil engineering side of it. You may do the work yourself but when I look at your pics I would cut the **** out that place. There looks to be too much rolly poley all around your house and no good slopes.
Thanks for all of the points to consider....the basement is as dry as a bone all of the time. We have very sandy/rocky soil that does not hold water thankfully. My problem happens when we have 1-3 inches of rain per hour which will saturate the ground and send rainwater down into the basement/garage area where the 50' of perforated drainage pipe cannot handle the deluge of steady heavy rainwater. If I can prevent 30% of the side yard water runoff from reaching my basement area I will be in good shape. And you are right, the side yard is rolly polly with 50-60% of it gradually draining to a very steep hillside but the other parts are inconsistently graded. Today I was standing by my red barn and looked at the whole side yard mess and summarized it would probably be best done with a bulldozer and more fill to build up the lowest area near the basement and properly grade the whole area so all of the rain runoff heads to the hill side. I'm wondering how much damage can I do on a bulldozer or after playing around with it for a couple of days, would I be able to crudely grade it properly enough to solve my once a year basement flood problem?? I'm enclosing some pics Crane Operator asked me to send from different angles.... Again thanks for all of the input and ideas......this is the best time to figure this out before spring....
My choice would be replace the existing drain tile with a larger one with a lot of fall to it. The one you have now may have been laid too flat (not enough slope). and is too small. Maybe both.
might be silted in and a simple jetting could clear it. Wish you had led with the picture of that drain grate.
^^^^^^ For this you can use a smallish backhoe and is a much better sol than cutting the hell out of the place. You just scared me a lot when you asked what kind of damage you could do with a dozer. The answer, is a lot. Dozers are one of the hardest pieces of equipment to run well. With a grader being the hardest, in my opinion. You could also do the larger pipe with a mini ex on a weekend and finish up with a skid steer and a load of loam.
Yes to both recommendations....the drain by the garage door is a small catch basin and leads into another drain inside the basement where the 50' of perforated coiled drain line is buried. I have thought about getting it roto rooted but would much rather build a berm / swale to prevent the deluge of rainwater from reaching the drains in the 1st place. Last year the town @ 15 miles from our home had 5" of rainwater in @ 3 hours and completely flooded a number of homes and businesses. I can only imagine the damage this kind or rainfall would do to my basement in a matter of hours. We have already been canceled by one of our homeowners ins for the damage we sustained from our 1st flood so I'm really over worrying about flooding and want to eliminate the chances for it ever happening again. I'm sure I could do alot of damage with a bulldozer considering I don't know what I'm doing. I'm open to learning how to operate different types of equipment in my yard working on this particular project. I'm sure an expert can do it faster and more efficiently than I ever would but this project presents an opportunity to plan, execute and hopefully finish before summer hit. So again, I really appreciate all of the feedback and different strategies that have been shared from the members of this forum.
Ok that is totally bass -awkwards! Why on earth would you bring outside water into the basement envelope to drain pipe? All you need to do is take the water from that outside drain AWAY towards the parking area.
I still can't tell the elevations very well. It looks like three blocks so 24" but does the soil surface keep rising from that point? and how much or how far? If it's 20', I'd sharpen a shovel and air up the wheelbarrow tire, and do some exercise every morning and you'll be done before you know it. Even if the drain goes to daylight now, which I bet it does, I'd still want the ground surface to drain away. It doesn't look that far.
You want to shape everything to get ALL of the water away from the house naturally, without relying on drains, if at all possible. A large CTL will do all the dirt moving you need, and be easier for a novice to get 'decent' results with than a dozer. In the grand scheme of things even reshaping the whole back yard is not that big of a project. I think you are way underestimating the ability of a lot of this equipment, an experienced operator could do what you need done in a day or two. Even for a complete novice, a week rental should be sufficient.
You could (maybe) consider putting a check valve in the line draining the basement to prevent the outside water from going into it. I did in my own basement drain. I have two down spout drains that have check valves in the end of the buried 4" PVC they drain into. Those pipes drain out to the backyard and dump on the surface. Not for water backup, but to keep critters from going into them and dieing. I have also put them in farm tiles that dump into creeks for the same reason.
Are you sure that the outside grate drains to the inside sump/pit? I'm guessing the interior pit may be a collection sump for your footing tiles, and it drains or sump pumps to the outside pit, which then runs through that pipe to the driveway. You need to do a little investigating to see what's really going on there. I would want a exterior grate to run the width of the "driveway" / entrance, instead of the small inlet it currently has, and it should drain off to the blacktop driveway- that's 60' away from the house. Much better would be if you could shape the yard so it will natural fall away from the house, all the way toward that blacktop driveway. Don't try to hold it with a berm. Slope it all away. You're going to have to establish the slope/ grade yourself, if you want to do this with a rental machine. Determining what you have for slope, and the elevations you are going to need, is where the "experience" factor is going to come into play. Some guys can naturally see the slope from the seat, other guys need some reference stakes and elevations set with a transit/ laser to be where they need to be. I'm guessing you don't have either of those skill sets. You can rent a compact track loader for a couple days, and if you get it all screwed up, then you can hire the expert to fix it right.
Might be good to have someone experienced come and give an estimate. By the time you rent a machine and figure out what you're doing, an experienced operator could be finished. It might not cost any more than if you had to rent a machine for a longer time period. An experienced operator could do the job at least twice as fast and do a better job for the cost of renting a machine for a week. Sometimes it's better to let someone experienced do jobs that have to be done right. You can learn a lot watching how they do things so that you may want to tackle a less critical job in the future.
Yes I'm sure the outside drain goes right into the basement garage area drain which in turn drains into a 50' perforated coiled piping under the basement floor as described by the pervious home owner. Believe me when I tell everyone the soil composition on my property drains fast and the basement is dry as a bone all of the time.....except of course when we have extended downpours that saturate the soil allowing runoff to collect in the garage/basement area. I like the idea of creating a slope/grade away from the house and at the same time, I'm thinking of constructing a wide pathway from our double pool gate and curving to the front yard area. This pool gate pathway would be level with the elevation of the front yard and would prevent rainwater runoff from collecting in the garage/basement area. With that constructed, I believe it would be easier to reshape the remainder of the side yard and create the proper slope to drain heavy downpours to the hillside that's perpendicular to the red barn you see in the pictures. Creating this pathway would require some dump truck loads of clean fill, I'm estimating about 8 cubic yards more or less. This week I can stake out the length and width of the pathway and how much material it would take to make this pathway level with the front yard area. This would make more sense than a berm because it will have a utilitarian purpose. Thanks again for the ideas and recommendations....I'm already excited to plan it all out.....with your help!!
A dump truck carries 10 to 12 yards depending how heavy it is. You might get enough fill after other parts are reshaped.
Thanks Welder Dave for the information.....I had a local experienced guy over last summer and he quoted @ $3500 for the pathway and the regrading job but could not start the project until spring. That's why I'm considering doing the job myself and learning how to operate some rental machinery and decide if owning a piece of equipment for some other jobs I'd like to tackle would be worth it in the long run.......and as always I really appreciate all of the help and knowledge shared by people who know what they are doing.......
Just curious, have you considered a pond? Wall off the doors, block the drain and voila...pond.
Yes, I have considered a pond on my property but not in that side yard area...... Thinking about constructing a pond, (which I know little about) I have a spot in mind in a low area near my driveway in a wooded area. I would need to remove @ 10 mature trees and stumps to clear an area of @ 1/10 of an acre for a small shallow pond. My biggest reservation is that it would be only filled by rainwater and whether or not the water would become brackish over the summer without any way of naturally circulating the water. I know I can make the pond as deep as I want but have not searched for any information regarding it because it is a "back burner" project.....I like the idea of a pond in my golden years....
Okay...I guess that wasn't as funny as I originally thought. I get the reference though... "pond...golden years" Henry and Jane... Touche.
Maybe an auxiliary pool with the blocked off garage, instead of the pond!
Sure....I'll take all ideas into consideration...:/ I'm going to stake out the pathway dimensions and see what I come up with for fill material requirements.....Looking at the basement/garage area from the highest point and if I had an unlimited money supply, I should raise the retaining wall facing the front yard and build another retaining wall to meet the retaining wall next to the pool gate.....basically squaring off the ramp leading to the garage/basement area and building stairs to access the walkout basement area....but that's definitely a job for a professional and probably very expensive too..... I'll stake out my pathway plan and see what I can come up with. This project is really making me consider whether or not it's worth doing myself.....
Filling and and tearing up the whole yard is really pointless. You have a low point with a catchbasin and grate. Just pipe out of it downhill towards the parking area, put in fabric and drain rock along the way. Grade it nearly flat. Storm water does not care about keeping a certain slope. Keep digging until that pipe comes out of the ground. That is called daylighting. if the soils are as you say, no water will come out of that pipe. It will all soak in. If it did not all soak in, then anything left will run out of the daylighted pipe and the basement would never flood. If you are not sure that it will daylight, assemble all your garden hoses and fill them until you can reach where you think it might be the same level or lower. Use the water level in the hose to determine the elevation between the two points. This is a simple water level and is accurate as anything. For a quick check, use a long level and sight down the top of it and take some measurements to the ground. This method is easier with help. This solution requires a trench, some pipe, some gravel dumped on your parking area, and a wheelbarrow. The trench will heal back up after one season and you will not know it is there.
Late to the party but as others have said if you can cut and re-grade where the water naturally drains away from the basement door that is the best solution. I make my living installing storm drains and they will all clog over time. By re-grading the area to drain away from the garage it will also make the garage door more accessible. More work, more time and more mess during but it's the best solution.
I think you're all nuts for suggesting that because by the time you got to a point below that basement, you'd tear up the whole world up there. But that's me. I just don't like making work including landscaping the entire lot and reseeding the entire place
I still can't tell how much dirt it would take, but it doesn't matter, having the grade slope away from the house is the best, no question.
I would love to have a company come in and put a direct rainwater drain line to the hill side where most of the water goes but to do that, a trench would have to be dug more than 20' deep to create the right drainage pitch and that's way beyond what I can afford. When we moved into this house, I discovered the driveway drain that originally ended at the hillside was collapsed and was not working properly. I had a excavator guy dig it up, replace it with solid 6" PVC all the way to the hillside. From the driveway drain to where his pipe ended, his trench was about 10' down from the edge of the hillside. So in other words, the digging depth it would take to properly pitch water from my garage/basement area which is probably at least 12' lower than the driveway drain would be a considerable project. So back to the drawing board.....today we had a front come in and experienced 50+ MPH wind gusts so I was not able to stake out my planned pathway and attempt to calculate the amount of material necessary to complete the job ....Yesterday, my neighbor was burning some junk near his utility building and the fire got away from him. The one town firetruck came to the rescue and I had the opportunity to help putting out the fires with my neighbor while the driver worked the water pressure panel on his truck.... living in the country is fun and educational.....
I find that hard to believe.
I don't see it either.
Any house I've been involved with has about 7' of concrete below the highest point of grade. Depending on the strategy, you either have a catch basin where the grade is lower than anything nearby. Might be 6 feet higher than the cellar floor. A narrow trench is dug somewhat lower than the cellar floor. Pipe is laid with a bit of slope to drain it away. It won't work if you don't have enough slope to your land you can drain to daylight. I suggest 1/8" per foot slope. In some cases the pipe is buried in the soil already there, some would make it a french drain with landscape cloth & crushed stone using perforated pipe. If you also have a high water table where underground water is a concern, the job gets bigger.
I would like to see a survey with elevations. That would make quick work of what to do. Do you have access to a laser level or any other survey equipment?
Agree. I think Sunbelt rents lasers but for what they charge one can almost buy a cheap laser/tripod/grade rod combo. Either way a laser would be handy over time. About 4-5 shots from the garage to the lowest point will tell the tale.
Garden hose makes a workable level. $20 of vinyl tubing works even better, cut one end at a slant and pull it through a hole in the lower side of a 5 gallon bucket for the deluxe version. Don't need a laser level to tell the difference between 20' and 4' or 16".
So again....thanks so much for the input.....I'm sending some pics of the basement and apron drain location and the hill area leading down to the garage/basement area.....In taking these pictures I've realized the apron drain and the basement drain is a mouse highway.....I thought my house was sealed pretty well against rodents but did not account for the 3" PVC leading from the outside drain to the floor drain...... almost a mouse a week in my basement traps and couldn't figure out where the hell they were coming from.....:/
Good grief ! What a nuisance and tripping hazard that pipe is. You need a either a check valve or a trap in the line going to the pit and grate outside. You could then remove the sump pump permanently. Not a mouse trap but a plumbing trap. Either one will stop mice and odors from entering the basement. The plumbing trap is useless tho if all the water evaporates out of it.
I add a glass of water to any unused trap a month for that reason. We have a bathtub that does not get used and hoo boy that septic stench only had to come in once for me to get right on that.
Sooo, looking out through the door there is the end of a fence on the right. See how that grade runs perfect to your door? That needs a swale about 10 feet from your door with a positive drain all the way to the corner of your driveway. Easy peasy. If it were me, I would possibly redo that drain from the catch basin in front of your door and maybe upsize it. Not completely sure that’s warranted though. You have a lot of square footage of drain all the way to your door. If that hill outside your door was burden from the door and retaining wall, great. Use that creating the swale, put fabric and some rock, loam and seed. You should be able to create a nice flat area for a volleyball set up. lol No offense but this has gotten way too complicated and while this has been fun, get a plan together and get it done AFTER the wet season. You may be able to get this done soon as you probably have little to no frost. Good luck.
So we can see the rainwater first collects into the apron drain in front of the garage door then empties into the drain in the basement via a 4" PVC pipe then another buried irrigation perforated coil piping (50') dissipates the rainwater under the basement floor and sadly not directly to another hillside @ 100' away from the back of the home. The home had been unoccupied for @ 5 years before we bought it and the basement had sustained a number of floods before our purchase. The basement area was semi finished off with wall paneling and insulation on the outside walls of the basement..... Needless to say my first job was to remove the water damaged paneling, rugs and insulation......It was a nasty job but someone needed to do it.... The basement dried out within a month and has been bone dry ever since except for the excessive downpours we have here @ 2-3 times a year. I installed that sump pump in anticipation of another possible flood but we all know that pump can only handle so much water and if we get a deluge of 3-5 inches in a matter of hours my goose is cooked..... The basement is divided into 2 halves and I installed 2x8 PT boards in front of the 2 doorways that connect the 2 haves of the basement to prevent flood waters from reaching the utility / living space section of the basement. So coming up with a permanent solution to a anticipatory flood has been on my checklist ever since we had our last minor flood last summer. Thanks again for the comments and recommendations.....I'll be out soon laying out a potential pool pathway to the front yard and after some measuring and calculations, I will be able to determine the best course of action....with the Forum's help.....
Man, 7 pages! I am pretty sure the horse was dead by page 2 . . .
Honestly I don't know that he'll ever get a good answer over the internet, despite the knowledge base here. In person most of us could probably go walk the site, shoot some grade elevations and know what to do in a few minutes. That's just nigh on impossible going off some pictures and descriptions while sitting hundreds of miles away. I'm afraid the OP needs to take the suggestions he's been given and figure it out for himself or hire a local professional to do it.
If he was nearby I would go shoot it myself and write down some elevations in THE BOOK OF ELEVATIONS!
Thanks again for the information and I will rely on the recommendation the last excavation guy gave me last summer and go from there..... Did not mean to be a P I T A here.
I'm enjoying reading the thread, I don't think you are being a pita at all, every time someone posts I'm likely learning something. Also, I'm not trying to call out your spot but you mention South Bristol, NY as your location on your profile page. And you mentioned 20' depth for adjustments. Looking at the terrain map of your area I buy it, the terrain in a lot of NY is huge elevation changes in not much distance, similar to West Virginia. Just the first terrain spot I paid attention to was 400 feet up in a thousand out.
You're not a PITA, and I too have enjoyed reading this thread. I hope my post didn't come across as harsh, it wasn't meant to be, just that there is only so much we can help via the internet. This is a boots on the ground type of problem, hopefully you've gained enough knowledge to tackle the problem yourself or at least be better informed when talking to contractors. If you want to take the time to shoot some elevations and draw out a map it would help both you and those trying to help.
Here's what is supposed to be happening in your basement. The house has footing tile. It also has the outdoor grate. Both those water sources, drain to this pit. When the water gets high enough in the pit, the "sump pump" in the pit, is supposed to come on, and eject the water to wherever this upper PVC goes to, from the pump. The outside water is not supposed to be ejected into the tile under your basement floor. The idea is to get the water out of the house.... So when the water comes into the basement, is it coming from the grate and the sump pump can't keep up? Or is the grate not handling or catching all the inflow, and its running under the garage door?
If people didn't come to HEF looking for help the forum would die a quick death. There are no PITAs. Except for two that I remember. Earlier in the thread I thought the water from the basement drain pit was flowing out to the pit that is outside. Nope. You said the water in the outside catch drain, drains into the basement. It took a special kind of halfwit to install that set-up. Today I looked closer at your photos and I see it is quite amazing that all the water from that slope alone is being directed into the basement. I would have installed two separate drain pipes to the hillside. One (a big one ) for the outside water and a 4" for the basement footing
Thanks again for some patience, I'm not writing these posts to bore or offend anyone, I'm just looking for an economical solution to a problem that's been bothering me for the last couple of years and I really appreciate everyone's 2 cents.... I'm sure when the original house was constructed there were the proper footing tile and drainage away from the home.....10 year later, the previous owner added an addition to the home basically doubling the sq. footage and creating this garage/basement area so he could work on his snow mobiles and ATV's and such..... so basically this addition and basement area was never drained properly and I have no idea how many minor floods the previous owner had before we bought the home. Our S. Bristol home is on a plateau overlooking Canandaigua Lake and around 1/2 of our property there is @ a 300' ravine with a creek flowing at the bottom of the ravine. I believe the previous homeowner did not want to spend the money digging a trench deep enough to the ravine with the proper pitch for proper rainwater drainage and probably thought the 50' of coiled perforated flexible drainage pipe would do the trick. It's supposed to hit 50 degrees today so I'm going to stake out the pool gate pathway and with some crude calculations try to figure out the amount of material it will take to create a curving wide pathway which at the same time, isolate the downslope leading into the garage/basement area....I think that's probably the best economical solution to this problem at this point of analysis.....:/
Thanks for posting that last picture that gives some dimension to the depth of cut. Looks like a 6' cut to get through the ridge at the far left. That would be a bit of trenching and shoring to get to that drain. Agreed that a little swale is easier, now that I can see it from that angle. Me for myself I would put in the pipe for any and everything that I wanted to drain out. Downspouts, area drains, all out to the ravine. But it is what I do.
I for one am enjoying this forum and all the threads. I am just starting the process to build a house on 15 acres I bought just before the world changed and covid was unleashed on us. Keep posting pictures. If it was me and I could scrape together the money I would have a pro re-grade the yard and put in proper drainage. To save money I would probably rake and seed the lawn myself.
You're just fine PMan and not boring or offending anyone as far as I'm concerned. As Tinkerer said this is a discussion forum where we, well discuss stuff.
I don't know where to buy one. Neighbor had a sight level. Quickest way ever to figure approximate heights. Measure your height to eye. Sight to a point uphill, that's 63", repeat. Gives a quick way to estimate grades & ditch depth. I also have a few cheap laser levels, not as useful in bright sunlight. Best I have is a Berger I paid $850 about 20 years ago. It is manual levelling, so takes time to set up. I use a Porter Cable auto levelling near daily, but again not as good in bright sunlight.
This johnson at Amazon is OK. https://www.amazon.com/Johnson-Level-Tool-80-5556-Contractor/dp/B000KKWQ9S?th=1 I prefer my David White 2.5x magnification unit. https://www.whitecap.com/product/25x-hand-held-sight-level-352NHL25X
A transit is great as long as you have a second person. Using one by yourself takes ingenuity. I just bought a Spectra LL300N-2 rotary laser level. Picked it up used off eBay. It is a complete kit in a carrying case. Level, tripod, grade stick and receiver. I have about 40% from new. Once my house project is complete I will probably sell it. Being able to stake grades by myself is the main reason I sprung for this over a transit. Asking my wife is fine, she will help. The issue is keeping her from wandering off.
I used a transit many times by myself. I would stick a spade in the ground at an angle and I would set the rod in the handle. Only for shooting elevations. Never for setting lines, that requires two people.
I feel your pain.
Like I said, ingenuity.
My guys used to get bored, and I couldn't get their attention . Shouting wouldn't do it with equipment running around. I had to chuck a stone at them to bring them around.
Clod of dirt doesn’t hurt as bad. Lol
Throw a rock or dirt at my wife?......I do not have a death wish.
I would cut the concrete around the outside drain and plug the line running into the house and trench a new drain running away from the house that never should have been drained back to the house even if you just have to run it away from the house and dig a deep hole and fill it with rock for it to dissipate just make sure it’s lower than your basement. Just my amateur opinion.
Again thanks for the understanding and patience. Last evening I pulled out some 50 lb fishing line, a string level, some stakes and a 100' tape measure. Since I wanted to create a pathway from the pool area to the front yard I secured the line @ 1' from the bottom to the gate post and set up some stakes to visualize what a path would look like and approximately how much material it would take to create a raised and curved path. The most alarming feature of this project stared me in the face when I hade my line level from the pool gate post to the outside corner of the house. By creating the curved level line from the gatepost, it would be necessary to raise the height of this wonderful retaining wall that channels rainwater under "any" rain condition onto drain in front of the garage door. I took some pictures to show the height and approximate location of the pathway I'd like to construct and this is what I came up with.... Gate post line height 1', 1st stake 2'4", 2nd stake 3'3", 3rd stake 3'5", last stake (by the house) 1' 6". I would like the inside (steepest) curve of the path to be @ 45-50' and judging by how much material that will be needed to create this pathway, I'm thinking the outside curvature (orange stakes) will need to go well beyond what I laid out with the average width of the pathway to be 12-15'..... Thanks again for the knowledge and encouragement.....If it's possible for me to complete this project on my own, I would value the experience far more than watching someone else do it and not learn nearly as much......
Now you may be seeing why I would trench a pipe out of the existing low spot and be done with it.
Maybe the problem is he's talking about building a dam, and the rest of us are talking about how best to drain it?
That "pathway" you show would require a retaining wall on the house side of it. Otherwise you will have to create as slope to the basement door that even a goat would have problems going up and down. I would remove the basement door, repair the wall where it was and fill the entire void with fill dirt. Then you have easy access from the front yard to the pool and your water problems are gone forever. It would also eliminate easy and unseen entry for any home invaders (burglers).
Thanks again for the ideas and suggestions......after staking out the potential pool pathway, the amount of material needed to create the pathway would be substantial, the retaining wall would need to be raised and access into the basement would be extremely restrictive due to the steep bank created by the new elevated pathway. Maybe my best and least disruptive drainage solution is to save my money and have an excavation outfit install a very large catch basin in the concrete apron in front of the garage/ basement door, bring in a very large excavator, trench and lay a 6"or 8" solid drain pipe to the hill side. Tomorrow I will measure the distance from the drain to the side of the hill and try to rough figure how deep this trench will need to be dug for the proper drain pipe pitch.....I'm already anticipating the trench will need to be very deep by the time the excavator makes it to the hill side.....
you are overthinking all that "large" stuff in your post. Do you have a stringline, a level, and some posts? If you had a string level that would be awesome, but not necessary. Pound a post in where you think the pipe is heading. It does not need to be all the way there, just along the way in the right direction. Get it good and firm, then tape another post to it to make it taller. ( this part is just a wild arse guess on my part.) Pound a post in next to the existing catch basin. Put it on the side away from the house. Tie the stringline to the posts, and then adjust it until it measures level with your level held next to it. Now you can measure down to the catchbasin. Add 1 foot for the pipe. Let's say it is 5' for that stringline to clear the bump. Once again, a wild guess on my part. Add the foot. Now you can measure down anywhere along that string, take that number and subtract it from 6 and that is your cut. You can paint those cut numbers under the string and have a good idea of how much work there is. Of course you'd need to add a little slope. 1% is plenty for a storm pipe. That is 1' per 100'. If you want to see actual cuts including that slope, adjust the string accordingly. Measure the distance between the posts, do the math, and lower the string at the downhill end the appropriate amount. A 6" pipe will carry away a Isht-ton of water @1%. IMO a 4" would be plenty. It is a whole lot more than no pipe at all
I'm looking at this photo and I see a really simple and small grading job to get the water to run to the driveway. Not onto the driveway drain, but to run the water past it. To minimize yard damage, install a 6 inch pipe with a catch basin and grate on the outfall end of it. Can you post a photo of the swale from the driveway to the ravine or whatever it is ? It doesn't make any sense to me to dig a trench straight away from the basement door through the elevation the the pool shed is on.
Thanks a ton Captain for the information on how to accurately measure the cut and depth necessary to tie in a direct drain line from the basement catch basin to the hill side. I wish I had more time to tinker with your survey directions but since we're heading to Canada to see 2 of our 7 grandchildren, I don't want to start the measuring process and then stop in the middle of it for travel. But before I leave, I do want to ball park the distance from the catchbasin to the hill side and an approximate depth the catchbasin is in relation to the average height of the side yard above it. Because I'm not good at this, I estimate the excavator cut would be deep because the catchbasin is already @ 10' or more below the side yard elevation and to make the 100' - 1' slope ratio it would be deeper still ending at the hill side.... All of the posts have been extremely helpful and I think by the time I get back from our Canada trip, I should be able to come up with a good rough estimate of what it would take to complete this drainage problem even if it costs more than building a berm, swale or completely tearing up the yard for a total regrading project.......
Since my wife's flight was delayed for several hours, I was able to do some rough measurements in my back yard....first I discovered the catch basin is 6'6" below the highest area of the existing grade in front of the retaining wall. Taking the path of least resistance and a relatively straight cut would have a run of @ 180' to the hill side for discharge. So if I'm figuring this out roughly, an excavator would start at the present catch basin spot, start digging 1-2' below the catch basin depth removing more material as it moves up the hill into the side yard. Then the operator needs to know how deep to dig the cut so that the stub of the drain pipe will pop out 9-10' below the ridge of the side hill when the trenching is finished. Does that sound reasonable? I would get some quotes and opt for a much larger rectangular catch basin to handle more water. I would probably opt out to solid 6" piping and never have to worry about floods or mice again. Could this trenching work be done with a backhoe that has an extension on it's bucket or would a small/medium excavator need to be used to dig at these depth? Thanks again.....you all are helping me make progress and I'm learning a lot from this forum.....
In my experience a full size backhoe digs deeper than a mini excavator. I have a headfull of stories when my backhoe (22 feet reach from the swing tower pivot), outreached & outlifted a mini excavator. Most compelling was last fall when a customer wanted to borow his neighbor's mini to install a generator. He was nearby, I could easily dig with my backhoe, but he preferred to borrow the mini. He was going to operate the mini ex. , but he developed back problems & said he'd hire his friend to run it. His friend & I have a lot of history, we don't like each other. When the friend declined, I admit I was releived. I ran the digger. First day was uneventful, digging 30 feet of 30" deep from the house winding through shrubbery to the generator stand wasn't worse than with my backhoe. Digging 24" deep 150 feet up a steep lawn to the propane tank wasn't worse. The hole for the tank 12' long, 5' wide, 6' deep was a stretch! I found I couldn't see the bottom of the hole. With my backhoe I could set the tractor in one place, dig the whole hole, with nearly all of the bottom visible. Mini excavator, I dug almost all of it blind. The tracks were on solid ground, the blade offering support, it was necessary to dig straight below me, lack of reach. Mini works best sitting firmly on level ground. Digging on a sidehill, I felt like a rubber duck in a bathtub bobbing around. Digging a large hole, the spoils need a big footprint. The pile was too big to place one side of the hole. I had to move several times to move the pile away, it wanted to fall into the hole. Next day I had a premonition, brought the backhoe even though the customer said it wasn't needed. Gas company truck delivered the tank. They had a crain on their truck. They couldn't handle the steep lawn. Without effort, the backhoe toted the tank up to the hole. The mini Excavator would fall flat on its face reaching past the center of the hole with the propane tank. Backhoe didn't mind at all. Tank had to be backfilled with sand, ditches needed 6" of sand in bottom, 6" on top of pipe. Moving sand would have been a VERY slow process with a mini excavator. Backhoe with 1.3 cubic yard loader bucket, no big deal. I have 2' digging bucket & a 3' toothless clean up bucket. Loading sand surrounding an empty propane tank was efficient. Bedding gas pipe & conduit also. The mini was sweet at cleaning spoils off the lawn. that one has a 4 way blade. With care one can scrape spoils leaving the grass perfect! We spent time picking the stone off the top. That was hand work. all hands on deck. I, Seth, customer's wife, & even he with a broken vertibrae picked stone. We tossed them into backhoes loader & backhoe bucket, excavator bucket & his compact utility tractor bucket, dumping each into the backhoe's loader bucket to be hauled away. Each toolbox may have the needed tools to do a job. Mini excavator can do it, Mini & compact track loader is a good choice, big excavator is also a good choice. I happen to own a backhoe, & find it infinately versatile. Most jobs I can drive to, saving time trailering.
This makes so much sense and is obvious to me. Looks like a swale already that just needs minimal work. Are we missing something? why dig though a hill?
It’s why I haven’t responded in a while. This is one of the easiest jobs in the world, just cut down on sq ft of lawn directly draining into garage door area on downpour. Look at line from corner of driveway to base of gate above door. Cut a swale, fabric, some stone and loam and seed, call it a day. Maybe while doing swale, revisit catch basin drain. It’s all about the run off. He may have to pull a little of the burden down to create swale and I would run it straight down to corner.
I would take a different approach. First, remove the catch basin in front of the basement door. It looks Way tooo close to the same elevation as the door opening. There should have been a slotted drain pipe that is designed for that situation instead of the catch basin with the grate. 6 inch minimum diameter. It wouldn't surprise me it the entire apron around it isn't pitched to it. I would not tear up the yard. A good operator on a trenching machine could and would lay a new pipe all the way to the ravine. Here is an image of the slotted pipe that I would put in the entire width of the 2 basement doors, or even further it the length of the toe of slope is wider than the doors.
Remember, it's hard to judge grade from photos. He said it's 6'6" at the deepest and 180' to the outlet, I'll take that at face value. Better than 20' for sure, but still might be more than he wants to mess with? either trench or daylight drain. So there's three options I see. 1. trench to daylight and refill. to the driveway or past. 2. regrade to drain away from the house, to the driveway or past. 3. build a swale, dam, berm to reduce surface area of lawn draining into the basement. I'm assuming it's way too deep to do anything the direction of the pool.
Thanks again for the input..... pictures are not the best representation for the amount of elevation difference in this side yard, retaining wall, driveway drain and garage/basement catch basin. The elevation at the pool gatepost is the highest point in these pictures. The retaining wall material is graded away from the house until you get to the last few blocks that were omitted and that's one of the places where the runoff pours down around the wall and onto the catch basin apron. The driveway drain is @ 2 1/2' lower in elevation from the visible corner of the home at the start of the retaining wall. The driveway drain runs straight to the hillside with a 6" solid pipe. There is no way to connect to the driveway drain pipe from the catch basin because the catch basin drain is considerably lower than the driveway drain. So either trench out to the hillside deeper that the driveway drain, increase catch basin capacity and run a solid 6" line to the hill side popping out @ 5-6' lower than the driveway drain and keeping the accessibility to the garage/basement area in tact or build a berm / pool pathway to isolate the garage/basement area from excessive runoff and regrade the area of the side yard (@ 50% of it) so the excessive runoff migrates the hillside. Sadly this option would reduce the accessibility to the garage/basement area to a minimum and that would be unfortunate. I'm reluctantly traveling with some family members down south for a few weeks. We will be renting out our home to 3 different parties while we are gone. So far with all of our rentals we only had one flood in our absence and the party never knew the basement flooded because we keep it locked. I'm sure by now the poor members here that have been responding are probably cringing every time I post but please remember I appreciate everyone's feedback and this spring / summer I will have something done about this ridiculous drainage situation because I'm tired of having it hang over my head.....
Just so we're clear, referring to Tinkerer's post #165, the grade at the closest corner of the house is 2.5' higher than the surface of the round manhole cover next to the driveway? How deep is the basin under that round manhole cover? that could be close to the correct elevation if it's a couple feet deep. Also, is that a solid cover, or a grate? and are you sure there's only one pipe going away from that basin? would sure make more sense to have that be an access point for the basement drain. If you don't want to dig out an above ground drain to that basement, and want to preserve access, then you need the swale that we've been trying to talk you out of.
Thanks Delmer for the information....yes, the closest corner of the house is @ 2 1/2 higher than the driveway drain. Basically the drain has a round cover with holes in it. I did not take into account the depth of the catch basin for the driveway drain but I imagine it goes down @ 2' from what I remember. That drain line originally had a perforated black flexible pipe that after 40-50 years drained slowly and I was pretty sure it was clogged and collapsed and hoped that replacing this driveway drain would solve my flooding problem. It has a 6' solid pipe that goes directly to the hillside. When it rains hard it moves a lot of water. It's too bad the garage/basement drain is lower in elevation to the driveway drain or there could have been a drain line intersection at some point. To straight shoot a drain line from the basement/garage area would require a trench deeper than the driveway drain and pulling the trigger to complete this project is making me apprehensive. I'm going away for a few weeks and keeping my fingers crossed we don't get any 3-4 hour downpours that will overwhelm the basement drain.....But I will say, ever since I installed the high rate sump pump in the basement catch basin, it has not turned on once so far so that's a little reassuring.....
There is perforated drain tile with a fiberglass sock around it to prevent fine material from plugging the pipe. I have installed many miles of it on interstate highways. I ran a Vermeer trencher with a laser mounted on it. Any a mount of slope the project required could be set in it. I noticed you said a lot of water originates at the top of slope by the pool area. Is it feasible to install slotted drain pipe there and drain it in the direction of that drop-off I saw behind the pool shed ?