I'm sure many people will have come across this at toolbox/tailgate meetings before a shift starts. You have the guys who always speak up about safety (or anything else for that matter) - some have suggestions worth hearing, others appear to simply like the sound of their own voices........ however the vast majority of the crew stand there apparently like dummies and listen, chant the mantra at the end of the meeting and go off to work. How to involve them..? Well one of our guys came up with the "Don't drop the Ball" idea. We have an old basketball that after the toolbox meeting introduction the supervisor/foreman launches it across the circle. Whoever catches the ball a) mustn't drop it and b) has to come up with a safety share on the spot. The way we put it to the guys is that nobody's expecting the ball to come their way but if it does come, just like being hit with a curve ball from left field while working, you have to be ready with a safety share just like you would have to be if something unexpected comes up while you were out working on the job. We found that it brings out the quiet ones in the team who more often than not have something to say worth hearing, and it doesn't permit anyone to stand at the back hoping they won't be noticed. Their own workmates see to that. A good idea that I thought was worth sharing.
Very good idea Nige! Just knowing you may be "put on the spot" at a moments notice should get people to be thinking about safety! If I can find the email address for the head of safety for the company I retired from I will pass this idea on to him.
Great idea. I used to randomly take a craftsman or three, subs included with me on my daily safety walks. It never failed to amaze me what these guys would see above and beyond my own observations. They see it every day and usually speak freely when in a very small group and don't have to speak in front of a crowd of 150 or more like when we had our jobsite wide weekly meetings..
I'm one of those who tends not to speak up too much anymore when it comes to safety. The company I work for preaches safety like its gospel. Yet whenever something gets brought up, it falls on deaf ears or it puts a target on your back. A guy can only try so hard before he just says **** it.
I forgot to put in the OP that after the first guy fields the ball and gives his safety share he gets the opporunity to launch it across the circle at one of his co-workers. We'll regularly do it 3 or 4 times before the supervisor calls for the ball back. So anyone who might be "backward at coming forward" gets picked on by his own team mates. I think maybe you are confusing safety concerns & safety shares. A safety share is something that someone thinks should be highlighted to keep folks working safely. Like reminding everyone to put the lock pin or other safety device in an articulated machine to prevent sudden any unexpected movement if you're working in the hitch area, or if there has been a lot of recent rain to remind everyone to be careful getting on & off machines because access ladders are full of mud & slippery. Maybe reminding people about stored energy and keeping out of the line of fire when disassembling a machine component. Simply things that people need reminding of from time to time. A safety concern is when something isn't right, a lockout that doesn't work, or a machine with defective lights. We had one the other day when the fuel truck operator asked about the possibility of a louder horn for his Cat 740 because when you're round the back of the truck most of the noise of the horn is blocked by the service truck body and if there is a lot of equipment working around the area you don't necessarily hear it. If your company is like you say it is regarding safety I sympathize. Damned if you do and damned if you don't. Fortunately the outfit I work for not only talks the talk but walks the walk as well. Some of the rules might seem OTT to someone from outside the mining industry but at the end of the day they are designed to ensure that everyone goes home safe every day. Nobody who has supervisory responsibility wants to have to be the one to tell a widow her husband isn't coming home any more.
One of the reasons I chose mechanic work as an occupation is I have zero tolerance for public speaking. I don't have the gift of gab and would rather cut off my hand. If I as forced to do that I would have found another job. If you forced a salesman to rebuild an injector pump I think the results would be no better.
I also do not like speaking to a group, but I believe what is being talked about here is not a long drawn out speech with charts and diagrams. Just mentioning something you saw that could be a problem for someone else like: "Yesterday while I was washing the pit loader I noticed that the wash hose was getting a bit worn or cracked next to the shut off valve, would not want to see it fail while someone was walking up to turn hose off." Just little things one might notice everyday but forget to mention due to getting involved in some other aspect of their job.
You're right. I did get them mixed up. I still think the don't drop the ball is a good idea though. Same here. I used to have extreme social anxiety. I've forced myself to interact with others and I have a handle on it now. Still not interested in public speaking though.
I like that idea. Thanks for sharing
I find safety meeting are a bunch of insurance B S .If anything happens they can say you should know better. Must sign attendance sheet for proof you were there . Go to work and they tell you to do what they told you not to do in the safety meetings.
If something is talked about as a safety issue and you do it anyway why is it a bunch of insurance BS. Are you saying they expect you to do what they just said not to, or does the crew just do it anyway. If my crews did it anyway we would have a "talk". I often told people when they continued to do something the unsafe way, "Isn't it sad that I care more about your life and family than you do."
It's not about safety at all, it's about CYA. When I was working offshore, I was about the only one who would climb a crane boom to work out on the tip, which was not accessible because the boom was always longer than the platform. The other mechanics were heavier than me and not up to the task. First they demanded we wear hard hats, steel toe boots, safety glasses and a safety belt. I skipped 3 out of four to get the job done because I had to be unencumbered to climb. I got by with it a couple years. I explained that the safety belt can only be used when reaching point B, not while traveling from point A to point B. The traveling was the most dangerous part and being encumbered made it more dangerous. Then they came out with the full body harness with leg and shoulder parts. No way in hell could we maintain our balance with those stupid things while the wind was blowing and the waves were rocking the platform. You can't reason with people who live in a world of policies. Then they demanded we wear safety glasses all the time and dust masks while grinding. I explained to them that the minute you put on both, the glasses will fog, thereby making the task more dangerous. I asked for face shields but they never arrived. Then we had a big safety meeting, hundreds of us and most of the bosses. The safety man said "If you have any questions or concerns just call me". I asked him in front of everyone "What's your phone number?". You never seen so much stammering and lying about "Um well I just got a new office and I don't know my number yet" None of the other bosses offered it either. Not ever. They just want to cover their rasses.
Worked at a place where the boss was (apparently) all about safety and every little thing should be brought up. He knew that I (the welding supervisor) would bring up concerns if I thought they were warranted. Well the boss did something incredibly stupid and literally almost killed himself but wanted to keep it hush hush. I should mention he is also a politician (mayor of a smaller city) and tells you what you want to hear. Anyway the incident should have shut the whole place down and an investigation been done. It would have cost them thousands. There was a big opening in the roof for a huge crane to lift components of a new roller coaster in. It would take about a week and a half to move all the components in. A few days later the weather turned and they were calling for rain. It was a windy day and the boss was up on the roof with several employee's trying to tarp the roof. The boss is a former ironworker and don't know what he was thinking but attempted to walk across a roof beam dragging the tarp across. The roof is about 38' high. Well the wind caught the tarp and he fell about 10' onto the scaffolding inside a couple feet away from the edge and almost got punctured by one the scaffolding pins on the corner. Pretty major incident to say the least. I wasn't there at the time but had heard about it and that's why the boss came and asked me not to bring it up at the toolbox meeting the next day. Of course his version was a little different. It was only a 7' foot drop (not high enough to require railing) and not a big deal, he wasn't injured. I found out quite a bit later from a longer term employee, that the boss confided in, the boss had indeed broke a bone in his arm and that's why he was holding it. He never went to the Dr. After the toolbox meeting I questioned the boss why it wasn't brought up when if it had been anyone else there would have been an incident report etc., etc. The boss pretty much admitted that he scared the ***** out of himself! I think he knew it would have likely shut the amusement park down for a quite awhile. This incident was almost as stupid as an assistant superintendent at a golf course climbing on an 88" tree spade to hold branches out of the way while the tree was being planted. Got his steel toed boot crushed and had to have 3 toes amputated. I think the operator of the tree spade is partly to blame too but he can't see everywhere.
This is the bosses telling you to do something they said not to do in safety meeting. Had one boss tell me not to slope trench because would have to take sidewalk out . I told him to call safety man to look hole .If he though it was ok give me a letter stating that he the safety man and company would be totally responsible for any injuries or death. The boss walked away and we took out the sidewalk.
I guess I was pretty fortunate that the two companies I worked for for the last 30 years of my career really did care about safety. The owners home phone numbers were also in the company phone book and they did answer. Admittedly they were very family oriented, most unusual for a 2,000 employee company. Not much employee turnover either. Ordering safety equipment was never questioned. If we had a crane that could not be serviced with out 100% tie off it would have been modified to allow it even if it had to be torn down to do so. It might be faster and more unencumbered to more without having to jockey two tie off ropes but you sure are not going to get a second chance when you slip.
I tend to agree check . What few safety BS meetings I've been in they all want you to sign your name at the end ................... Oh well ...... Whatever . Pretty crazy times today when a company hires an adult worker after the job interview and then has to treat them like children . I tell ya what .... When your time comes there aint nothin anyone can do about it ........ It will come out of no where ....... Won't go down like you might think , will not see or hear it coming . Just try to get as much work done as you can before it happens
I talked to a relative over the weekend who is a supervisor/manager. We got talking about safety and such and he really opened my eyes up to how management sees is it. He also pointed out many shortfalls of my employer's safety program. Needless to say I think I will be speaking up a bit more about safety issues from now on.
A company that does not have a better than splendid safety record can not even bid on many larger projects. We had a .45 score where 1.0 is the acceptable(smaller is better) industry standard, earned the states safest contractor award twice in 5 years, and we still did not meet the safety criteria for all jobs. A non lost time injury, that is a OSHA recordable, takes the profit out of $100,000.00 of work by the time you are done. Beside the human element these two reasons are why all successful companies are so anal about safety. There success does depend on it. I go to bed every night very grateful that I was fortunate enough that no one ever died on any of my projects. I still wear my company sweatshirt that shows 2,000,000, yes, 2 million, construction man hours company wide without a lost time injury. Unfortunately they have never made close to a million hours since. The 2,000,000 safe man hours was achieved when work was slower and we only had 1,500 of the best, long time employed, seasoned hands working. The over whelming amount of all construction injuries happen with employees with under 6 months experience. Incidentally, eyes and hand injuries are the most common.
That's an impressive record of safe man hours Old - iron ! Something to be proud of for sure . I'm just a small time owner operator doing various jobs for customers . Get my share of cuts , scrapes and never could get around some sort of debris in the eye even with the safety glasses . The job sites are pretty easy to deal with ........... If we get to a stage where it starts to look a little funky just stop & regroup . Might have to run back to the shop & get the proper tool or grab another piece of equipment to get the job done . Hands down our most dangerous place to work is on the road moving equipment from job to job . Don't have the control I would on a jobsite . it's about like loading cattle , most will go up chute but there is always one that will bail over the fence on ya Only way to deal with it is good driver & blocker car to keep the aggressive drivers away from the truck . Plus the " Blocker Driver " can also be a witness in court in the event of an accident . I need to keep some basketballs in the cab of the truck to toss at certain drivers .
Safety is what you make of it. If you think it’s BS and just CYA that’s your problem. If you truly care about the well being of your crew then that will show through. If your boss doesn’t care that’s his problem you can still do the right thing and watch your buddies back. This is coming from a guy that did think it was BS. Now I’ve seen to many guys get hurt over the years to thinks it’s BS. It would kill me to have to make a call to one of my guys family that he won’t be coming home.
Safety is one thing, corporate safety programs and safety men are another. If one is cynical about corporate safety programs, safety meetings, safety rules and the lackeys who administer them, it doesn't mean that one is careless about safety.
Spot on check ! Sat though a BS safety meeting this morning . There went 25 minutes of my life I will never get back . It was all " cover your ass " for the company and everyone knows it . Sign & date your signature at the end .......... I damn near got a paper cut when my buddy passed me the sign up sheet .
I worked for the biggest and baddest in the Energy field and Railroad. It’s easy to blame the safety guy and call him names when your not in his shoes. You get a crew of guys that have TD25c attitude your safety meetings are going to be a little dry and unproductive to say the least. So ya safety is what YOU make of it. There is a thin line between being careless and having a bad attitude about safety. It doesn’t take much to find yourself on the wrong side of that line and somebody you care about get hurt because of it . I’m only talking about attitudes here I’m not talking about rules. I won’t disagree with anyone that their rules can be over-the-top. But think about it like this. I can guarantee you those rules exist because someone or hundreds of somebodys have been hurt because they chose not to follow those rules Or they didn’t exist.
I agree. It's up to the employee to work safely according to his ability. There is an important distinction between having a bad attitude about safety and having a bad attitude about safety policies and those who administer them because safety policies are usually written by lawyers and the objective is a winning posture in court rather than safety. The courts don't do a perfect job of administering justice yet they seem to be the ones who initiate the policies companies adopt. How much time have Judges and Lawyers spent wrenching, operating, climbing booms, grinding and welding?
I worked at AMEREN MO, Callaway Nuclear for over twenty years. Can actually state flatly our safety manager was a twit. He quoted contexts that did not/COULD not apply to what was being performed such as "Fall Protection, Full Tie Off Above Six Feet", he applied that to our removing and resetting fuel shipping casks on flatbeds, If we got on the trailer had to be wearing a harness, if reached to the top of a three set of casks(log loaded) we had to use double lanyard tie offs on the harness to get up to set lift rigging. Was more a danger to hook/unhook the protection that to set the rigging. I chose to run the damn crane and ***K the harness crap. Tried showing him where the rule did not apply under DOT regs, he would not EVEN attempt to understand. He was far more unsafe as to forced crap than realistic. To enter a three foot deep access manhole to open or close a valve we had to test air, have a air monitor ON person, had to have full harness on, required a safety man AND call the control room for each entry/exit, five minute job took an hour. Monitor was all we needed in the early days, sample the hole, get an elephant trunk fan and go in. Rules is rules and stupid is still stupid.
I was in a corn processing plant in Iowa with a 175 ton crane. Had a similar situation to yours dmiller. Saftey man shows up as we were preparing to take counterweights off the support trailers, and set them on the deck of the crane to install. Installation rules were anything over 3' up had to be tied off. Where in the world do you tie off on a flatbed trailer? So there I was, all 6'6" of me, wearing a harness, with a 8' lanyard, tied off to the rub/chain rail on the side of the trailer. And the rub rail on the single drop flatbed was all of 3' off the ground. So if I stumbled and fell, the lanyard would have gotten tight, 3' after I hit the ground. But the safety man was happy, he'd done his job and we were tied off. I'm all for safety, its just that job struck me as particularly funny.
I used to wrench on vac trucks and hydrovac trucks. We were about 11' to the top of the catwalk on the side of the tank. I did not like being tied off up there. For one, they only provided us with 6 foot shock absorbing lanyards and a 2 foot dog leash to tie off to the top of the tank. If I fell, I'd not only hit the floor, but I'd end up getting my head smashed into the deck of the truck as well. When I brought it up they simply said "well use a 4 foot lanyard." Great idea if only the anchor point on top of the tank wasn't 5 feet away from the area we needed to repair 95% of the time. A self retracting lanyard would have been optimal if they weren't too cheap to buy them. I eventually refused to go up there because I didn't feel it was safe with the equipment they provided.
Yeah Dozerboy . Got it , that's pretty cool . Most of my attitude is genetic ........ I can't help it My Old Man got it form his Old man & I got it as well & will pass it down to the boy ....... Hard headed bunch The Old Mans first " safety meeting " was in 1969 . Grab a flack jacket & M-16 .... Then an all expense paid trip off to Viet Nam & Cambodia . Old man gets back to the states after the tour & the funny part is everyone was worried about " safety " LOL ! Sorry guy's ..... The Old Man would say stop acting like Pu$$ys & do your job !
Like mashing a finger with a hammer, walk it off get back to work were the first words from my Dad!! Seems all these safety managers want their names in headlines in the safety letter papers or tabloids, they strive not so much for being safe as to enforcing rules they have no clue how were adopted or by whom and to the why they were adopted. Iron workers now have to be cabled off to the structures they used to bound around on free climbing, there are really certain inescapable conditions that are hazardous but no worse then pruning trees at home or driving old iron with no cab guards/home made cab guards. I worked in a power station, we lived by company inspired rules at first, SUGGESTED long sleeve shirts inside the plant around the hot piping, heavy jeans and working boots. Then came OSHA and the others, steel toed shoes then NFPA came in with Fire Retarded (retardant) clothing for electrical flashes. We ended up having to wear long sleeved heavy cotton fire retardant treated shirts OVER t-shirts and extremely heavy denim (I believe 14 or 16oz duck) which equates to canvas heavy inside a building that on a good winters day was 105 degrees. Got to working out OSHA limited stay times and according to the 'Rules' we showed safety we could only work 10-12 minutes at a time needing more men per shift to do the job. Safe was actually killing us, he blew that off and suggested we add cool vests to the layering, he was suggested he wear what we had to IN PLANT for a day to which he stated: I am a manager, I do not wear working clothing on a whim to prove a fallacy. Too bad for him as he said it in front of plant manager, he was fired. Next one up was twice as bad.
Crane operator Not being able to climb on top of a flat bed truck in standard in a lot of places. And the fact that the safety man had you improperly use a harness and lanyard is ridiculous. Awls you have to do is Google flatbed trucks and hundred percent tie off’s and you come up with all kinds of solutions to that problem. TD25c “Quit being a pussy and get back to work “ Your old man probably would’ve said that common sense isn’t so common anymore too. The fact of the matter is that’s what most safety stuff is. Someone lack common sense and made a poor decision while doing a semi risky behavior got them selves hurt and now we all have rules we have to follow because of that
I'm lucky I only have 3 employees and that's all I want, that way I can have employees that are bright enough to protect themselves, anytime I have a new hire they don't get off the ground for 6 months or run any equipment unless I know the their work history. Then they go for their working at hights training and what ever else they require. My employees have all the safety equipment and time and my support to do the job safely , but if they aren't bright enough that they can't keep themselves and their fellow workers safe without someone leading them around by the hand , they'll be kicking their lunch box down the road. So I guess if your a large enough company that you need to hire, shall I say intellectually challenged workers, then I guess you better hire them a babysitter as well.
I'll sure try my best Dozerboy ...... Helping the Old Man on a remodel of the home he grew up in " old farm house " . Mostly dry wall work & painting . Two evenings in to the project and He's only accidently busted out one window . So far so good ! LOL
I cant repeat most of what the Old Man has to say on this forum .
And here in lies the problem... Stupid people doing things that stupid people should not be doing. Do we need a 30 minute safety meeting to tell people not to put their hand in moving machinery? Not to stand under suspended loads? not to stand in the middle of the haul road? It's getting old, hearing the amount of crap "safety guys" can preach in their meetings anymore. A... They have to justify their pay, B... Maybe there are enough dumbasses out there to justify their job... Kinda like a dog chasing his tail. I been out there for 40 years and have a strong self preservation instinct. Now, getting the crew lined out for a crane pick, or keeping the grading crew from running over each other should be the Supervisor's realm, not some guy with a degree that's never seen the field and gets paid to waste my time. I had to work with one 25 years ago that had to ask me where to start with his first meeting. Big DUH.
Here's the BS that gives safety a bad name. A number of years ago when doing a project at Oscar Mayer Weiner in Madison I got wrote up by their safety official when we were assembling a crane in the parking lot. There plant rules were that a critical lift sheet had to be filled out for any lift over 3,000 lbs even if you had a 100 ton crane with a tight in 3,000 lb load. I did the paperwork for the first track lift. We moved to the other side, still on asphalt hoisting with a 100 ton crawler crane with only base boom and tip installed, and close in. I got wrote up for not doing another critical lift sheet. That weekend a barrier rental company, that the plant hired to install hi-way barriers around my construction trailer, delivered and set them with the boom on the delivery truck. On Monday I got wrote up 14 times as they set the barriers without any critical lift paperwork. I had to appear before a safety committee that laughed when I told them it was their sub, not mine. A few weeks later one of my labors, and of course me also, got wrote up for not having his extension cord hung form the ceiling as was required. He was the only person in a finished, completely empty 40 ft. square freezer, vacuuming grout flakes where we repaired the tile floor. It was written that he could pull the vacuum over his own cord causing a potentially serious hazard. This was a project that I did not finish. After toughing it out for 6 months, spending more time on Bull Sh*t than on construction, it was get me out of here or see you later. The plants hired construction safety inspector could dream up anything. Just heard the other day that the plant is closed down or about to be. Wonder why?
That's ridiculous OIH. Since the Pike River mine explosion that killed 29 men 9 years ago, there's been changes to the health & safety Act here and the CYA across the board has skyrocketed. For us in the crane industry, it means that every lift now has to be accompanied by a written lift plan, every commercial or industrial site we go to requires documentation of our training and qualifications, every task needs a written safety and risk assessment and we are subject to government inspections at any time. Most of this we've adjusted to now but there are still site safety managers who will throw us something out of left field to make our job harder. Usually it's something that the safety man has dreamed up with no consultation, justification or industry backing, but we have no choice but to comply. These are the people who have no business in safety, IMO. Safety is a culture, first and foremost. It doesn't just happen on somebody's say so, especially if those of us experienced in the job think the policy is ridiculous
We now interrupt this broadcast with a " Public Safety Message " from the Caped Crusader ........ Rest in peace Adam West .
Your kinda a smart *** Td. You have my admiration forever.
Adam West always cracks me up laughing , I don't see how they kept a strait face while filming .. LOL ! Remember him in an interview talking about the old Batman TV show ... Adam summed it up as " The Theatre Of The Absurd " . That's pretty close to what the safety culture has turned in to today
Theater, I have also heard that word used to describe security practices. TSA at airports is the most obvious example of "security theater". Make people do a bunch of stuff to feel like they are "safe". Also things like making you change your password every 6 months which does nothing for security and can inconvenience people badly. "Safety theater" is very close to security theater.
That's a great point Berkin ! I don't fly unless I'm in my own plane but have heard all the crazy stories about air port security . Dumb a society down & that's what happens . I aint gonna participate in it .... Just keep it " Old School " all the way . Life is to short to put up with that BS .
I can relate to the 'Theatrical' productions of safety. Too busy being safe to be smart. Our one year safety manager of years ago mowed his grass with safety toe shoes, safety glasses, a hard hat, and ear muffs on so as to 'Present' a safety aspect to all in his community. Middle of August he passes out from all the garb on, fell back into the street in front of a passing car, narrowly missed. Hit the back of his head NOT the top as he fell, concussion, damage to one eye from the hat rolling into his safety glasses(was wearing a chin strap) as he hit scratched one cornea then he had to be hauled to hospital with Heat Prostration/Heat Exhaustion, all that while push mowing a 100' by 120' lot with a 1400sf home sitting on it. Stupid is as stupid does. He was PROMOTED to Safety Management at our Corporate Office and as far as I am aware is still there but is divorced, lives in a condo and does little outside work anymore. This is the same dumba-- that ran screaming into our parking lot as a drywall delivery truck was unloaded. The truck had the standard tractor seat rear of cab fork boom, operator was sitting in the seat wearing a seat belt while unloading. Safety man screamed he had to come down, had to be wearing a harness, had to have safety glasses, long trousers(was wearing shorts, again summertime), hearing protection and a Hard Hat. Truck was removed from lot, driver called his boss, company told him return with what product was still on truck. The plant had to send personnel TO the drywall company to receive sheets after that. NOBODY that sold bulk sheetrock would deliver from that day on. The sheetrock company explained to the safety man that DOT rules applied to the trucks, they want to apply extra rules that do not apply they can haul their own. Safety Dumba-- had no concept were different rules for different industry and he had GRADYATED from a college with a degree in safety, REALLY!
Worked in a vessel shop where the new safety officer wanted the welders to take their welding helmets off and put on a hardhat to walk 50-100' to the rod oven to get more rods. After discussing it, they decided the welders didn't have to wear a hardhat when they went for more rods. Was watching a show on the building of a P&H mining shovel. They said they don't require the workers to wear hardhats because if anything fell on them a hardhat wasn't going to make a difference. The vessel also wanted to make it mandatory to always wear ear plugs. Normally not a bad idea but the foreman agreed with me when you're doing a root pass, weld test or something critical sound can be very important.
I would insist that the dimwit wear NOMEX clothing next time he cuts his grass, after all, mowers have gas tanks and they could explode. To those who think we have a bad attitude: If companies would quit promoting safety managers with room temperature IQ's who are incapable of reasoning and allowing them to set policies and procedures perhaps these safety programs would have more credibility.
I have heard this reasoning before and I don't like it. The hard hat is not to protect you from a falling I-beam or whatever. It is to protect you from a rock or wrench that somebody left laying on the I-beam and now it is 40 feet overhead and gets dislodged and comes whistling down. I can't tell how many times I have seen that with logs or whatever. Sure the log will kill you dead but there is always a rock, stick, chunk of loose bark also waiting to get loose. And it is the small unnoticed things that fall much more often than the big thing that is held by hydraulics.
I had a family member tell me that during a safety meeting, a supervisor did a safety share about repairing the block heater on his car at home. I guess he disconnected the battery to prevent getting shocked.
Agree .... My old employer Instilled both Fear and Confidence in us . We feared for our job at the first part of the speech but at the end walked out with the confidence to complete the task . Glen had a simple 3 day trial time on any new employee . After 3 day's He would either keep or send ya down the road . Man he could weed them out fast . Thanks for the education " Boss Glen " ! He had just a little attitude . LOL ! You mix up some attitude & positive thought in the work crew be surprised what can be accomplished pretty quick !
Yep... This^^^ In no way am I complacent about safety. Period. But these overpaid morons that want to dictate what we have to do to work... And usually get less done in a shift, need to get a job first. I worked in a vault under a booster pump station and the safety guy wanted me tied off with a harness and STEEL lanyard in case I had to be "pulled out", I had to weld under and over 8 pipes, I told him the steel lanyard was an electrocution hazard... Big blank stare. Finally they put a watch guy in the hole to hold the wire, sheesh.
Over Edjycated Idgiots they be and will remain. I agree in that any, ANY college grad "Safety Qualified" person has to take a job In The Real World for at minimum two years before being able to spew the sh_t they do at a job site as a safety rep. That and qualify at no less than the second lowest position on the site before can be the safety rep. Many janitors are better schooled and better prepared as a safety person.
Hey Birken, Our safety rep had us MANDATED to wearing hard hats while walking the plant GROUNDS and switchyard, due to "Electrical Flash Potential" so we would not get burned. Yet the clerk staff walked between buildings at will without them as they were not operators so Not required, really!!
I was just going to say that. Most safety people have no clue how to do our jobs. The last safety girl we had was pretty decent though. She would actually put on coveralls and work alongside you for a bit so she could learn what was involved with the jobs we did.
Another thing that "burns" me (heh heh) is the mandated FR clothes at all times when working within 100 feet of a QO circuit breaker or some such nonsense. I am an outside company so I have to go by the site owners rules of course but I don't normally carry or have FR. When you are not working on any power of any consequence but you have to wear FR coveralls but nobody cares whether you wear a hard hat or any head covering nor a face shield. To me the danger of an arc flash is 99% hot substances impacting the face and head but the coveralls do nothing for that.
I still have my Fire Retarded clothes, the shirts will be grease rags when I service my equipment, the jeans, well at least they are Carhartt. We had to wear the FR stuff full long sleeves all through the plant EXCEPT when we did the radiologic areas then they issued FR Protective coveralls you could bake bread in.
I don't mind the FR coveralls. They aren't required at our shop but some customers require them at their jobsites. Actually don't notice any difference between FR and non-FR to be honest when it comes to comfort.
Forgot to mention ...... Knock off with the negative waves ! Brief message from Donald Sutherland / Odd Ball . LOL !
There wasn't any high work being done in the shop. The shop was very well laid out with marked walk ways and kept very clean.
Will drop a " Hard Hat " on when needed .... Not often . One draw back I notice from them is due to the brim on the hat ya loose a lot of " Peripheral Vision " that would signal you to get the hell out of the way of the way otherwise ....... Same way with ear protection . You can bundle yourself up so tight with safety gear to the point ya wont know when to step off the train tracks .
I see you live in Alberta. I think if you worked in the Gulf of Mexico like I did, you would notice a big difference in comfort, especially in the summer when it hovers near 100f and humid every day. Even without FR clothing, wearing a hard hat and safety glasses makes work dangerous because scalp sweat fills the inside of the glasses with beads of sweat and you can't see. Physical exhaustion and heat strokes do affect safety, as so the encumbrance of safety gear when climbing, as they hinder balance and snag on things, causing your body to unexpectedly swing in an arc. But most of the safety geniuses are COMPLETELY OBLIVIOUS to these facts because they live in a world of policies and procedures and are incapable of reason.
And they sit in comfy offices only venturing outside when forced to, to 'Find' a safety violation to justify their existence.
Damn y’all should just start a screw Safety thread. Not sure how this went from a thread on getting guys involved in safety to its to dangerous to wear a hard hat and glasses because I’m sweating. That deserves a don’t be a pussy and get back to work.
LOL!! I knew someone would chime in!!
We regularly see temperatures in the summer into the mid 90's believe it or not.
Lol I live where he’s talking about it was still in the 90s last week. We have fall/spring for about 4 months the rest is summer. You know it’s hot when it’s to cold for you to go to the beach unless it 90 because the norm is 100.
On any of the bigger construction sites the welding helmet would be on the hardhat. One may get by without in a fab shop or in a shelter but no where else. Incidentally OSHA rules on hardhats are not that strict. They state that head protection must be worn if you are in danger of striking your head or having something fall on your head. It is not a OSHA requirement to wear one where there is no head injury danger. However every insurance company I have every dealt with required them at all times.
On the contrary ..... This is a safety thread just as Nige started it . We are just tossin a few basketballs / ideas around & sharing stories where it went overboard . We use plenty of safety gear on jobs . Head , ear ,eye, respirator , fall protection ......... Use it when it's needed ......... I aint gonna drop on the Sala harness to climb up on the truck or trailer . Use it for crawling up on grain bins & other high fall areas . I don't heal up as fast as I used to . http://www.capitalsafety.com/en-us/Pages/Home.aspx?WT.mc_id=www.salagroup.com
LOL ! Use fall protection when ya actually need it . HeavyEquipmentForums Pay no attention to the sign ......... Customer will tell ya what to do .
Worked on a job where ladders had to be tied off to weld steel connections. Safety wouldn’t let them climb the ladder to tie it off ,told them they had to use a high reach to tie off
OSHA requires ladders to be tied off. They are allowed to be held by a second person while being climbed and secured. OSHA makes a lot of fine money on unsecured ladders.
That’s what the contractor was doing . Safety man told them they needed a high reach
Apparently one that is not even book smart. Rather thankless job. We found it real hard to find and retain good, sensible safety personnel.
Same job made concrete contractor build bridge over two foot wide footing trench.3’ wide ,42”railings,balusters 4” spaceing Contractors got together and told construction management company safety guy goes or we go .he went.
Getting pretty bad when the BMX riders have to take the Safety Guy to school .......... Opinion is just that .... An opinion and that's all cool but it's not a law ......
I can see having a welding/hardhat combo on a construction site but in a fab shop where you're mostly just welding there's not much chance of something landing on your head.
LOL ! Wheeled in to the hardware store to grab a sheet of dry wall for the Old Man's project . Problem was it was raining and a 4' X 8' sheet wont fit in the Jeep Cherokee . Got the big " freeze " form all the employees at first when I asked if they could cut a few pieces off the sheet so it would fit in the back of the Jeep ............. They then proceeded to lecture me on there " policy " not to cut anything to exact dimensions due to liability ............ Ok .......... Whatever ......................... Then td25 went in to " Old Man Mode " . " Hey folks, we aint tryin to send another feller up to the moon I just need a few pieces cut off this 4X 8 sheet so it will fit in my vehicle . " " Any other time yall seem to know it all when I'm buying a big end item and now ya caint cut a sheet of drywall for old td25 "? Had to shame them into doing there job and it worked They cut it and did a fine job after the pep talk . They just needed a little confidence . Don't hurt a damn thing to spread a little confidence around to coworkers .