Greetings HEF Members, LEGAL: My Attorney's have informed me that my Provisional Patent App is secure allowing me now to speak freely of my idea and hopefully gain some valuable insight and opinions from members. PREFACE: Years ago -about 20+ to be exact - I was working a project where the Underground Utility Contractor -name withheld to protect the guilty/innocent- was using a Warner Swasey Badger setup to be a dedicated wellpoint machine. I had the opportunity to speak with the Operator who informed me the company made the attachment that was afixed to the end of the stick in lieu of a bucket. This attachment was unique in that with a pull of a lever the water for the punch could be controlled on or off. Twenty some odd years ago we didn't think much of water waste but here in the 21st Century it behooves us to think conservation and in some cases it is mandated. With todays EH/Pilot controlled excavators it's no longer a pull of any lever but more a flick of a switch or push of a button located on either left or right control stick. I don't know about other's but often times there's no source of natural water ie: ponds, canals or lakes to draw water from for the jet pump. In these instances we're left with no option other than a metered hydrant adapter supplied AND monitored by the local water utility whereupon there IS a charge for gallons of usage and water "ain't" cheap these days. There's also the time honored practice of having someone at the jet pump to close the valve when the punch is pulled out of the hole however, this time honored practice is in reality a royal PITA especially when and where you do not have line of sight visiblity to the jet pump and the simple fact that 2-way radios don't like water either. Another fact of life while wellpointing is the absolute mess the punch makes when moving to a new hole or withdrawn from the current hole, an enormous amount of H20 at high pressure gets spewed all over the ground, the personnel on the ground not to mention the excess water erosion factors and the general mud pit you create during wellpointing operations. At times the need for dewatering via wellpointing is unavoidable but I know there is a better, less costly in terms of gallons per use charges and general water caused mayhem way. MY IDEA: Using the mental image emulsification from years ago and applying modern technology I have come up with an attachment that will work with any excavator hydraulically setup to accomodate a breaker or thumb so long as dual acting hydraulic plumbing is available at the bucket linkage. It's not a bad idea either that said excavator be equipped with a quick coupler enabling the swapping of attachments. Once connected to the machine with all hydraulic fittings secure all an Operator need do is turn on the water when needed then off when not. No longer are we needlessly wasting water and in a lot of situations you don't need that much water to actually punch a hole. With experience an Operator would be able to use the least amount of water to get the job done, saving money, general jobsite mud messes and appealing to the notion of water conservation as a whole. Along with this attachment there would be a single-axis only punch in whatever length or diameter required to facilitate dewatering. If you've ever used a chamber punch merely chained or cabled to a bucket hook you know how basically uncontrollable they can be. I have used buckets with massive plates welded to the inside bottom just behind the teeth or cutting edge where a punch could be attached and this arrangement always seemed to provide the most control while also allowing for down force without the risk of damaging a chamber punch. SUMMARY: Well, there it is, my idea and how/why I came up with it. So, whatcha tink HEF members, good idea, bad, have you seen or used anything similar to what I propose and MOST important would you purchase it? Just a friendly reminder with no intended insult, insinuation or accusation but this stupid idea of mine is currently protected by a Provisional Patent App therefore, any such "new" idea copying mine subsequent to the date of this thread's posting clearly will not be looked upon with smiling eyes. Thanks...
My idea: Good, or bad? Lol, well... they just laughed at mine... Won't be long till I make my money back, though.... http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cNZPRsrwumQ Just a bit more R&D... :cool2 Hmmm... I wounder if I should have gotten a Provisional Patent App.? Naaa... I think I'm safe. OCR... lol
OCR, That was actually supposed to be "use" it, the edit button goes away and there's not much one can do about that.
Thats not something I am involved in, I would love to see a picture or two so I could get a better understanding. Best of luck with it.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VXJZVZFRFJc Here is the Beta testing.
ddigger, I do apologize but at this point I am somewhat reluctant to post diagrams or photos. However, it looks very similar to a standard excavator hydraulically activated quick-coupler although larger with a hydraulically controlled valve assembly within it. Also, since I believe a single-axis punch is far more suitable and controllable there are rather substantial attaching plates on the bottom to attach the punch. There is a provision for a 3" swivel Cam-lock hose connection on the attachment and the same from the attachment to the punch.
No worries, so have you been field testing yet? And is this something you would manufacture yourself, outsource or simply sell your idea to a company? Again best of luck with it.
ddigger, Yes to the field testing, we will soon be installing deep sanitary which will require extensive "pointing" and we will be using my attachment. No to self manufacturing, my hope is to sell the idea. There have been some serious improvements in wellpointing technology which here in Florida we use frequently. The new pumps are beyond whisper quite which makes the neighbors real happy at night, Griffin Dewatering has come up with an outstanding solution for pulling points which is far safer and easier than a chain wrapped around the point. I'm not planning on millions, I simply believe that any idea that makes a job easier and safer is good for everyone. Thank you for your support...
It's fully armed now as well http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ptyV1cpE14o&feature=relmfu won't need them flying drone thingys anymore.
Hmm, All these videos of mechanized dogs, people acting like mechanized dogs and the latest being a mechanized bull are fine and dandy but the general gist of this thread is well, read the title "Excavator Wellpointing Attachment" and I'd like to stay focused on subject matter if possible. What a concept huh? Thank you!
Hi, SeaMac, Around this area some people drive the wellpoint to get water, now you have to grout a well 20' and need a well log that tells the dept and grout info to get by the inspectors and morgage company. How does your system work, are you boaring or driving and what about the grouting?? wosama
Hi wosama931b, The wellpointing I am referencing is for dewatwering purposes only and is temporary so there is no grouting or inspections. We punch -I guess you could call it driving- a hole up to 24' in some cases, drop in a point, connect the point to a swing and the swing to the header which in turn is connected to a pump. We do this when we dig near, at or below the water table so we can safely and with dry feet install whatever piping the project requires. The punch we use is obviously hollow so it can support water at high pressure provided by a jet pump though at times -although not as effective- directly off a hydrant. The inherent problem is the mess the water coming out of the punch makes if you can't control it on or off.
I am sorry for straying off topic, back on topic now, I don't know bugger all about 'well pointing' actually I had this mental picture of an excavator pointing at a well "there it is" however I am starting to get the idea. The question is will this attachment make money? In other words is it so much more efficient that it is superior in every way to the old school way of doing this job. Still not 100% fully understanding the concept but will this tie up an excavator, perhaps thus requiring an extra machine on site? Remember sometimes people are stuck in their way of doing things and in order to change you have to show them that your device is way better. Safety is a big thing too, is the old way potentially more dangerous than your way? Basically you have to do some sort of cost benefit analysis to determine if your design will sell itself. Are you able to build a prototype for a reasonable sum?
Hendrick, Man O' Man when you get back on topic you sure do GET back! I do hope it makes money, if not I'll end up with one very impressive prototype. I do believe it to be far superior to the old way of doing things and the general mud mess it creates and should go a long way towards productivity once an Operator gets used to it. It will absolutely NOT tie up an excavator so long as same is equipped with a quick coupler. As for safety, yes, I think with a more controllable single-axis punch and the ability to turn the water off and on at will makes for a safer work environment all around. As for the prototype, it is complete, will be in field test mode in one week and I was able to fabricate the entire thing for less than......hmm, me thinks I shouldn't be givin' that number away so easily but it was very reasonable. Lastly, I know people get stuck in an old way of doing things just like they get stuck in the mud mess they create while doing it the old way. Then of course there are those charges per gallon of water usage one needs to control when tapped into a hydrant.
Well that's the next question, are people able to fabricate their own device relatively easily? I am no expert on patent laws but it is somewhat of an grey area insofar as making a patented device for your own use. Guess it goes back to what you are able to claim as your invention and what is already in the public domain. I take it you have looked at registering the actual design of the gizmo? This may be difficult if you copied an earlier design, or slightly altered it with modern technology. Also my guess is that a provisional patent is not a full patent, as such you may not get a full patent if they decide your design has no patentable features. Anyway these things are the domain of patent lawyers, however if you have a prototype made you can use it make the design better I suppose?
Hendrick, The Provisional Patent App offers full protection, or so says the US Patent and Trademark Office as well as my Attorneys and one such legal eagle is my niece who is a Federal Prosecutor. There also had to be an extensive and rather lengthy search of existing patents so I feel comfortable that my legal concerns are satisfied. Now for the prototype, no it's not something a DYI'er should attempt, it took a Mechanical Engineer buddy and a Machinist buddy with state-of-the-art CNC capability and it's actually quite a robust and heavy piece of equipment. As far as research and current knowlege allows I have found no other attachment like it and should such exist well.......hate to potentially be a the bearer of bad news but patent protection IS protection. As I mentioned in a previous post, it will begin its trial by fire (water) shortly and we'll see how things go from there.
Due to an unforeseen delay in obtaining our dewatering permit it's looking as if the field testing for my attachment will have to wait until next week, at least I hope. Been stupid busy mobilizing a new 9 month project, only Pipe Crew Op on site and there's lots to do. As soon as we start punching holes I intend post photos and regular updates of how the "thing" is working out, good, bad or indifferent...
Well I hope it works better than expected and makes you lots of money, then you can hire me as your personal window cleaner.
Windows? What are these things you speak of called windows? I'm merely a photon running amok in your computer, or am I? :bouncegri