I get calls, maybe 4-5x a week from independent tractor mechanics wanting to know this or that & how to fix a leak or how to get a tractor out of the field.. What to check & how to fix it.. OR how to pull a pump.. and I tell them.. It doesn't cost me a dime to "help out".. OR so I thought.. I started saying>> "I'm sorry but I no longer fix pump/tractors over the phone.. IF you would like to bring me the equipment, I'd be happy to have a look at it for you.. OR you can pull the pump & bring it to my house & I'd be happy to repair it for you.." " YES, I DO make service calls to LOOK at your machine.. for a fee".. I haven't had a call in a week.. LOL NOW don't get me wrong fellas.. I LOVE helping you guys out.. but its these guys 15-20 miles from my house that are pocketing all the money off the info I give them over the phone.. Fixing a leak & throwing a "rebuild in a can" on the pump & charging 650.00-1000.00 that pizzin me off.. SO I STOPPED..
Onya mate, you gotta look after the hip pocket.I went and looked at a job and the bloke wanted to know how I was going to do it, so I told him.So the smart *** went out and rented a machine. Next thing I get a phone call from him complaining that the machine is doing a bad job and wanted to know how to fix it.It told him that he should have got someone proper in the first place and he will have to sort it out for himself, then hung up
Good move. No need to finance the "enemy" (competition)
Yeah that ain't cool. Happens to me on ocassion. I've learned to omit one or two crucial details just to keep things interesting.....
Especially with Idiots that cant even explain the problem properly to begin with?
Yep, can't name parts or even give details to help me narrow down if it's even a piece of yellow iron......lol At the day job on occasion the operators can't articulate what's going on either. Lots of headbanging going on and there's no Metallica playing!!!
I just found this out recently.. I just hope my name isn't attached to THEIR "rebuilds".. I was joking w/ one of the independents about a leaking top cover I walked him thru.. I said, you probably painted the pump & sold it as a rebuild, for 400.00?? His response was, 400.00 hell !! I charged him 1000.00 !! to "pull" the pump, send it out to be fixed & reinstall..lol.. OMG !!! THEN it hit me.. this prick spent 11.00 in orings & gaskets, and NEVER removed the pump.. & robbed a customer !!! WITH THE INFO I GAVE HIM.!!!!! That's just something I can no longer be part of.. THATS EXACTLY WHY, I get on here & do what I do for FREE or at a MAJOR savings for you guys..!!! on account of the greed in the industry... Honest hard working people, getting ripped off because they forgot to change a filter or forgot to turn the fuel petcock back on.. its bull ****.!!! Not this kid.. I gotta sleep at nite..
On a somewhat similar subject. This made me recall about 40 years ago when a local junk yard owner had talked to my boss about getting me to rebuild the transmission in his Cal front end loader. I wasn't wanting the job but went to look at it anyhow hoping I could convince the guy to pull it out for me and let me rebuild it and then get him to put it back in. Well when I got there it was a much older loader than I was familiar with but I took a quick look at it. Sure enough it would not move, did not even try. I noticed how much mud and crap was on the floor and how stiff the brake peddle felt. I reached down and pulled the left peddle back hard and loader started to move. See on these machines the left brake peddle sends air pressure to the "neutralizer valve" in the transmission. With the peddle being stiff from dirt and crap on floor it was not releasing all the way and holding the transmission in neutral. I did a few quick loops around his parking area in forwards and reverse to his surprise! Told him to spray the peddle good and clean cab out. Tried telling him "NO Charge" but he stuck something like $40.00 in my hand. Often wondered how much someone else might have charged or how far they would have ripped that loader apart just to make it look like they had done something.
You play a dangerous game when you sell work that you don't do. Eventually there will be a problem with the "professionally reman" unit , and you will be exposed as a fraud and con man. If you do some quick and dirty repair, be upfront with the customer, charge accordingly and you will make a life customer who will net you a lot more money going forward. Concerning phone help, I have a few close guys I go to when I need advice and it is a two way street. I have stopped work to answer a question they have or loaned a spendy specialty tool to them. We can all profit by helping one another occasionally. Don't rip off customers, don't abuse knowledge databases, and take care of your back! (I had to throw in that last one as a reminder to 30 something super men).
I work for a dealership, as a resident tech, and certainly receive my fair number of phone calls from customers, and fellow mechanics. It can be something as simple as "what oil goes in this reservoir?", or "how does this come out?", or "what might cause this?". As a resident, without a close shop, I typically take these as favours, because a time will come when I need a welder, or a press, or a dry spot to rebuild something. I haven't had any experiences just as yours yet, as far as I know. I can understand your reaction though, that's just insane. I've had it drilled into me that Honesty is very important in this industry.
I've always regarded fuel pumps as the origin of black magic and voodoo. Something that is so mechanically simple can cause big chunky pistons to melt away. When it comes to pump timing, I check it very closely, and recheck before ever turning the key. I have never pretended to know all the nuances and quirks of pumps. I always defer to the local pump shop. I had some yayhoo put a junkyard pump on a fresh in frame Mack engine. Dropped it in really hot and ruined all my work. Then they sued my employer for the repair. Tied us up in the courts for a couple years. It's a shame, what some folks will do.
TPG, I thank you for the help you have given me...it is a shame I can't [normally] send work to you being on the wrong end of the country. But I will try to get you something if not time sensitive one day. As for providing phone support, I give it to people all the time. I try to give the narrative of how I would fix the problem from start to finish. I also try to give all the "if you see this then you need to fix that while you are in there" things that could happen. This usually encourages then to just have me out and do it myself. Keeps everyone happy.
I have been fortunate to find forums like this with people kind enough to help out with their knowledge when things really get nasty, the dealer gives up or most especially on a weekend when there is no dealer. Be it equipment, cars, electronics or machinists I've got some amazing help and suggestions. I am grateful for it and try to give back when I can and pass along what I've learned over the years. I understand though being in a position of being the one that always gets called when a tool is needed, something needs fixing or welding, a few bolts from the crib etc. The thing that really gets to me is the "oh man, I owe you for this one" but then when I need a helping hand nobody is around. I still help people but I've started charging for things that actually take hours of my time. I figure if they would have to pay someone else to do the work I should not be giving it away. They could learn if they wanted to or build their own shop, buy their own equipment so why give away my time, materials and equipment.
thats the way to go pg . BTW case is still running strong. I might be a good mechanic but i would not even tear into an injection pump lol. Im very happy with the stanadyne pump you rebuilt for me.
I give out way too much information but I don't mind. I need help to. I've been hosed a couple times on some big jobs by my competition but being helpful gets me more work than I can handle. I see contractors in every trade come and go. If they constantly depend on others in the same field to sustain their business, they fade away soon enough. A hack will generally always be a hack. I don't worry about them. If a guy just needs a bit of info and ends up being my competition, so be it. That is what keeps us all at the top of our game. A person can have all the info in the world but the difference is how they use it. A local contractor and my self were having a conversation with a few locals and one of them asked him "Doesn't it **** you off when you see someone else doing dirt work and it's right in your backyard?". He said "Heck no! This is America man. Anyone can do the job and we all want to eat."
I DO AGREE w/ you Twisted.. but 100% are independent TRACTOR mechanics.. they SHOULD BE bringing the stuff to ME.. I don't call THEM to fix a tractor.. hydr. brakes, ignition.. stick w/ what ya know.. Like was said.. a hack is a hack.. I'm done w/ these guys.. Now if "someone" was to call me from Conn.. Indiana, N. Carolina, or Texas.. I'd answer the questions.. 15 miles down the road?? they can KMA.. I'm done.
It sounds like they are abusing you. Nobody likes to be a doorstep.
What are you talking about? I thought everyone on this forum worked for free????!!!! I thought my $25,000 tool investment was for kids I haven't had yet!! I thought we were just doing our civil service and fixing things out of the kindness of our heart!!! I need to start charging people!! What went wrong!!!??
I know I'm a "diesel mechanic" but last time I tore into an injection pump (VE) the pump-shaft snapped in half. It was for a friend, we split the cost on a new pump. HA.
I have seen way too much of this crap with "Hydraulic shops" For some reason Hydraulics are Black Magic also. I have seen more than one shop (all out of business now as it should be) screw people over by doing the old "ring and roll" thing. Clean a pump or motor with Brakleen and paint it. 2-3K for a relief valve adjustment. Yep... I've seen that. Been told once or twice "If your honest, you wont make money" That's just so wrong in many ways.
If I can't sleep at night after the thought of doing something like that let alone the act of it I won't do it. I have a conscious just like y'all. Karma is a biotch!
For sure. I remember THE FIRST engine I built for a customer, a CAT C7. Shipped it to Florida for an ice truck. I didn't have the tooling or know how to change the rod pin bushings, I was freakin' out and thought the engine was going to blow. Turns out its still running and it's actually pretty common for shops even dealers to leave the bushings alone if their condition isn't too alarming.
I guess we all have stories like this, it just hit me REAL hard when he told me he charged 1000.00 for something he didn't do.. I was relaying this story to a guy at work & he told me one>> He would get calls in the evening also.. 1 nite an independent called him about a Cummins truck that wouldn't start.. He relayed the info about the compressor coupling might have snapped & not driving the inj. pump?? So my buddy rides over there & finds the brass elbow at the pump inlet, cracked at the threads.. replaces the 2.00 elbow & fires up the truck & leaves.. About 3 hrs later he gets a call from the shop owner to come over.. The shop owner had taken & masked off the engine around the air compressor & pump.. & painted it.. & charged his customer 3 GRAND.!!!! & told my buddy>> THATS how you make money Son..
Usedta have a electrical rebuilder, who when he had a starter or generator, with bad insulation, on fields, would take matchbook covers, and insert between field and housing, paint and call it a rebuild. He's outta business, now, but every once in a while the guy I take mine to will show mw one of the matchbook rebuilds, that has popped up...
We had a little trouble with the Ford 4000 tractor . " Lucas CAV pump ". She was surging on RPM's like it was about out of fuel ? Checked the tank , had 3 or 4 gallons in it yet . Got lucky this time , installed new fuel filter & she's fine now . Was afraid to call but see I'm still on the list Know completely what you are dealing with thepumpguysc
Just to save your faith in humanity, I had a late model Bosch that was loosing power after a half hour or so of full load but had good fuel supply going to it. I couldn't see anything wrong externally so I called my local shop owner and ran it by him. Told me it was likely a slight air leak at the tank draw tube (top draw). Sure enough, I dropped the tank and the suction hose had compressed over time and the clamp had loosened. I could see tiny bubbles going into the clear prescreen element. Tightened everything down good and called it ready for field trial as I couldn't take it home and run it on my dyno. Owner called me today and said it was running great. They had tried everything they could think of to no avail. Talked to my local pump guy soon after and told him I was writing a charge into my bill for him! I figure a half hour of his rate will keep the info coming. We collaborate and I do a lot of his field R&R's but still like to give credit where and to who its due. Side note, my bill won't make my weeks pay!
Back in the early 80"s when I first started, I worked for an international co. doing fuel injection work in Florida.. THEY had a tech. dept & a guy manning the phones for 8 hrs & it was a "pay to play" gig.. When you called & asked a question & he knew the answer or the procedure, you gave him you cc # & then proceeded.. I "jokingly" said that to a few guys over the phone.. "I'm gonna need you cc#"... The response was less than kind.. I have 1 guy calling me right now.. he's been trying to get his pump off for 3 WEEKS now.. I get 2-3 calls from him EVERY weekend.. I finally told him.. sorry I don't give out any information.. IF you would like me to COME THERE, OK.. OR you could bring me the tractor.. Then the song & dance & sad stories started.. My trailer got stolen, my brothers trailer got stolen, its got flat tires... bla, bla, bla... I said, MY TRUCK runs just fine.. goodbye..
Hey man, just checking, 62 miles down the road is still ok, though, right?
Yeah, we're good Mitch.. I especially like talking to you on the phone.. at least you know your sh**.. & we can converse apples to apples.. & besides, you've never called me & said, HEY, I got my pump torn apart & scattered across the work bench.. How do I get it back together?? lol. Its mainly the ones that shouldn't be holding a wrench to begin with, that bother me the most.. & want everything for free.. Quite often I have to stop them & put them back in their place.. LOOK BUDDY, I didn't break the tractor.!!!
Replace tractor with car/truck and I get at least a couple of these a day. There's a great fake phone call vid on facebook that's not quite safe for public viewing but exactly on point about the average phone call a parts counterman will get. I remember George Carlin who said " Think about how dumb the average person is and you realize half of them are dumber than that." Sometimes I see that person in the mirror but that's a story for another day. Be nice to counterpeople, we might have just got off the phone with an idiot.
I've had a few bosses ask me to lie and or help with screwing a customer over-no joke. My reply to them was {then you have to let me know when it's ok to lie to you}. Each time I loaded my tools and moved on because you know your the next target to get screwed over. Truck Shop
TS> I HAD TO do that for YEARS.. pencil whip warranty forms.. until I got sick of it & told him NO.. I kept a log w/ job #'s, actual problem & customers name.. I still have it.. I should have heeded you advise & moved on 20 years ago.. lol
The phones have been REAL QUIET for the last couple of weeks, since I started the "NO pumps repaired over the phone" policy.. I even had several emails from folks wanting my tele # to discuss their problem.. I DO give it to them BUT remind them.. I don't sell parts & I don't fix pumps over the phone.. I haven't had 1 person call me.. lol
I had NH Hydraulics do that, they pulled a piston hydraulic pump all apart and said the pump can't be fixed and has to be completely replaced, and oh, re-assembly isn't included in the free estimate. Needless to say I had to re-assemble the pressure regulator and relief assembly by wear matching parts, pins, bushings, spools and springs. Then installed $350 in john deere parts, lapped the top cover and the valve end of the barrel and its still working perfectly today.