To grandpa, old and worn, Bob, and all that replied. Thought I'd better start a new THREAD, as to eliminate any confusion on the previous thread about transmission. Thanks to all who have replied concerning front idler and track adjustment mechanism. As you guys have stated already I need to split the tracks, but I am finding out I need a special tool from Caterpillar to split master link. The rebuild of the adjusting mechanism seems fairly simple, just getting the tracks apart is the problem. Grandpa, BOB, old and worn, read your replies on my other thread and understand what you all are talking about. Doesn't sound like to difficult of a fix, if I can just get tracks apart.
Todd, if your master link has a pin, not the newer split link get a steel pin and weld a rod to it for a handle, then someone can help you sledge it out. If it doesn't want to move take a torch and blow a hole in the end of the pin, that will loosen it up but you need a new pin. Later Bob
Bob/Ont, a pic of the track.
Todd, can't see with the mud but have identified the master link? The master pin you drive out has a hole drilled into the ends of it. The SALT (sealed and lubricated tracks) have a large hole drilled in all pins with a rubber plug in them, that's the split master link you unbolt. Later Bob
Here is a pic that I found in another thread of the newer style alligator master that bolts together by the 4 pad bolts. You may have the older pin style and that would take a sledge and punch like Bob described.
Old and worn, thanks for reply. Is this the master link in the picture? If you can make it out. I will try to get some better pictures, just wondered if by chance this link being it is the only link that is different would be the master. And if this is the kind of link that you can drive the pin out with a punch, thanks.
I have never seen a pin style so I can't say for sure. Bob mentioned a hole in the middle of the master pin.
Yep Todd.... that's the master pin.... now drive the track ahead so that dimpled pin is about half way around the front idler. With it being on the idler when you go to drive the pin on thru, the idler helps to take the bounce out of the link assembly. Like bob say's make your own tool.. take a shaft that is a little smaller than your master pin, and long enough to reach out about 4 inch's past the track shoe,,, then weld a good handle on your driving pin. They get your most accurate maul swinging buddy and invite him over...lol. Wear gloves when holding onto your driver you just made,,, it might vibrate a bit.. It will take 4 to 5 blow's,( and I mean GOOD blows) to get the pin moving and then it should come relatively easy. If it doesn't move get a bigger hammer,,, bigger hammer operator or heat as bob stated. When the pin flys out at the end, leave your tool in the hole ,, when you pull the tool out there should be two rings and two washer's fall out.... and don't let the track fall on your damn toes... that hurts..... gramps.
Hold up a bit on my last post..... I took another look at your picture and I don't know what the he** kinda of thing you got there,,,, I've never seen a link like that... its not cat to my knowledge.
Look on the other side of the machine and see if you can find something similar looking on that track. I would be looking for a hole, dimple, just anything that would single out one pin from the rest.
That be a master link,just remove pad bolts.
Old and worn & grandpa, here are pictures of right side of machine. As you can see the links are different, these are CAT links that takes a special tool I believe. As you can see in the last pic, I don't know whether or not Iam coming or going. That's just for a little humor!!!!!
Sorry....I'm just not familiar enough with these different types.
Thats the master link in post 6. Just take the pad bolts out and it will separate. The chains are the same on both sides of the machine i believe its just that the oil filler holes on the driver side are on the inside and the oil filler holes on the passenger side are on the outside. If you took the tracks on your machine and switched them to the opposite side the holes you see on the passenger side would then be on the inside and the same thing on the other side, they would just be facing out. I hope that makes sense.
Truck... what kinda master link is that,,, I've only seen cat zipper link or the old drive the pin out types.??
I' m not sure Gramps. I have seen them similar to that type before but not that exact one. ITM is similar to that one in the pic but I don't think that is the manufacturer of that chain though. The brand name should be on the chain link toddcat and if you can find it maybe you can post it for us.
Hey guys, thanks for your replies. Truck 505 is exactly right, I looked on the reverse side and the links are turned with the holes in the center of the pins. On the left side of the machine the link pin holes are facing toward the machine. And I look on the top roller on left side in PIC #6 and it is stamped ITM. The top roller on the right side has CAT stamped on it.
Truck 505, checked links and found that they are stamped CAT and with a number, I will get more PICs of the links tomorrow, it should stop raining long enough to take pictures. I will post them tomorrow, hopefully it will clarify what type of links the machine has and how to break the tracks. Thanks for replies. Will have more PICs ASAP.
Grampa, there are aftermarket tracks with links like that. Solid Odd link is the indication. Later Bob
Thanks for the clarification Bob.... you can tell I use only CAT replacement parts...:usa
Grandpa the interlock can be seen from looking down on the pad mounting surface. They still pull together with the bolts like the Cat split link. I find them a challenge to knock apart but guess it takes practise. Later Bob
Bob/Ont , After examining the links they are ** ITM **.I still am having trouble figuring out how to break master link apart.And grandpa I would and do use only CAT replacement parts. These were on the OLD GIRL when I got here.
These ITM Master Links are some nasty bits of work, the design is very clever as it does not need the track plate bolts to keep it together, once the plate is removed the grip fix will be seen, I hate them and try hard to avoid them, it has taken me over 1 day to set free these links on 2 D8 chains, the first time I had to tackle (un-clip) a set I struggled for a few hours then called the ITM agents for a few tips, they sent me a detailed sheet with a good description of the un-clipping method, all I will say is its tough going and you need a good sized hammer, as once this joint has been worn into itself they near become solid, if I go to work on a tractor with this style of link in and need to split the track, I give it a go to undo it for an hour or so but if it still stays locked up I cut through it and press in a new (repair) link.
Sounds like a good idea gone sour TC. Is it like a chunk inside of a box sorta deal?
Bluox, Thanks for the reply. You are correct, removed pad bolts and master link come apart. Now just have two remove yolk and idler. And replace/repair track adjusting mechanism. Anyone have any tips or tricks of the trade on this fix, please advise.Thanks All
toddcat, it sounds like you have the simple link track, the 1 I thought you might have is a total dog to open, anyhow the seal job is fairly simple, the Service Manual will say undo the yoke from the idler and the adjuster, move idler forward, jiggle yoke on an angle then remove adjuster, the seal is inside on a rod that is visable now that the yoke end has been unbolted from the adjuster, the hard bit is often pushing the idler forward oh and it needs to be clear of the track (turnable) for this. p.s. Oldandworn the link I was thinking of is a great bit of design, even with the plate and bolts missing it stays hooked, its getting it open that is tough going.
tctractor- thanks for the help.can you tell me what you are talking about here ----track----{turnable**---------------{and it needs to be clear of the track (turnable) for this**. Thanks
Todd, he means the track needs to be flattened out to roll the idler forward and out of the frame. Just thinking back you may need to unbolt the track frame from the hard bar and the inner rear to lift the hard bar out of the way of the cyl flange if the cyl needs to be changed. Will talk about idler wear strips when you get it apart. Later Bob
Bob/Ont--Thanks for clarification on rolling the idler forward, will start tomorrow and with track apart and idler, and yolk moved forward. Will take some pics. Hopefully then I can remove and repair track adjusting mechanism. Doesn't sound to difficult now that (master link) questions have been addressed.Thanks
Maybe this doesn't apply for seal replacement access, but it is handy to loosen the track all the way before breaking it apart-makes it much easier to get back together unless you have something to push it back in. On the old ones we used to weld a piece of cable on to the big punch for something to hang on to, takes some of the mis-hit pain out of the holder's job! We also would freeze the pin prior to re-assembly, you could tap it in easily then if everthing was lined up well.
OTE=Bob/Ont;412613 Just thinking back you may need to unbolt the track frame from the(hard bar)and the inner rear to lift the hard bar out of the way of the cyl flange if the cyl needs to be changed. [/QUOTE] Bob/Ont --Can you please explain.Thanks
Todd... what he's saying is if you have to remove the outer barrel of your track adjuster cylinder to do your repairs, you might have to unbolt the roller frame assembly to allow clearance to get that cylinder completely out of your machine. Lets hope seals will be all you need, when you get to that point let us know..... gramps
It is possible to replace the adjuster seal without even stripping off the track, but its realy only half a job, but this task should be fairly simple with the track split etc.
Thanks GRANDPA for explaining! Here is where it stands for now, parts are ordered and (RAIN) is coming.May have to wait for a day or three or four to get back working on it.Can,t get mad at the weather! Wish I could talk to (#1tylr) Maybe he would RENT me some space next to his FATHERS old CAT inside the son,s shop.(Hpoe he let the old man keep the CAT inside) wonder how that ever turned out? Belive me I knwo how it is to have to work on the OLD GIRL out in the WEATHER! Wish I had a nice shop! Anyway will keep PICs and progress posted.Thanks All.
tctractors, Had to open master link no other way! Waiting for parts. Had some snow and lots of rain, will get started when parts arrive and if weather clears up. O what I would give for a nice SHOP! O well! LATER
toddcat, it is as I stated possible to fit a new pressure seal to the adjuster without splitting the chain, but as your chain is an easy split and there is no "need for speed" the method you are undertaking is the best trip, as you have already found the grease unit comes out without any frame strip, this same method is good for shovels from the 941 to the 983, you might have noticed that the pressure seal is just inside the bolt up face, your track groups look A1 and I see you used the master plate to good effect like a Pro.
The weather is better, all parts came in and we started back in on the old girl. But it did not take long to run into yet one other repair. A broken (SPRING). Ant that the LUCK! Will have to find one--This is getting a little hard on the old wallet. But when repaired it will last a good long time.Thanks to all for the help! will keep info posted.
Need to get someone to replace the spring Todd, they are very dangerous without the right tools. Another thing the curve in the old spring, it's due to wear between the ears on the front pilot and the bottom of the anchors that hold it down. That has been made worse with the idler moving up and down. If you could weld up and grind the ears to better fit under the anchors would help and the replacing the idler wear strips then shimming is a must. The wearstrips (1'X 1/4") are hard steel not coldrolled, get the right ones. How is the inside of the cylinder? Later Bob
Good advice as always from Bob. Those springs can KILL you (and that is NOT an understatement believe me) if the correct tooling is not used to compress them. As an aside try doing one on a D11, it makes the cheeks of my arse pucker every time we do one even though we use all the right tooling......... The problem is that the tension comes pretty much completely off the old spring when it breaks plus the loss of properties in the old spring over time make disassembly a piece of cake but getting a new spring back on is a totally different thing. Another thought and not wishing to get you in deeper financially than you are now. If the spring was bent & broken on one side, what's the other side like ..? Maybe you don't have leaking seals on that side but there could be trouble ahead .....
Yes, Yes, Yes, definitely having a professional deal with the spring. I hear you loud and clear on the repair of the dangerous spring. Bob/Ont, have purchased new parts, front pilot and stops, etc. And that should address what you were describing in your reply. Have all other parts except new spring, that seems to be the $$$$$ big one. Nige, will examine other side of machine today, and see if new parts are necessary as you stated. After looking at the old front pilot on the spring, that must take a lot of abuse and wear. So I will for sure check other side and other spring. Thanks for concern and replies. Will post pics and progress. Bob/Ont, have new idler wear strips! THANKS, Later.
Todd, the wear plus the low hold on the pilot makes it tip forward more, curving the spring and allowing the pilot bore to grip on the adjuster cyl. This is the cause of adjusters jamming up when collapsed to change tracks. Any time you back off the adjusters try to pump them forward to insure they didn't jam up. Many times the spring assem needs to be removed to get a press on the cyl to loosen it. Best to find this before the tracks are coupled up. Clean and grease the cyl surface as you start can help too. Later Bob
Bob/Ont, Have one side ready to install new parts. Checked other side today and as we thought needs all the same. O,well if your going to have a unit that will be ready to go when you need to work it, then it will have to be RIGHT. THANK for INFO!
Somebody's been a busy bee. Hey, at least you have an awesome undercart on your machine. No sense skimping on the small stuff.
If you're not married to CAT on the springs, www.tracparts.com has aftermarket replacements for many of the CAT part numbers. But if you're making a living with it, pay for the gold.
Might be an illusion Todd but the back spring plate looks bent back, should be 90Deg to the frame and are there two dowel holes for the anchors? Might have dowels broken off in them. I think you can punch them through. Paint makes the job look real nice. Later Bob
Sitting here looking at your machine made me think of another place for you to spend more of your money. Check the 4 BIG bolts at the inner rear of the frames, they tend to break. Later Bob
The recoil springs on some CAT loaders are just single springs without the small dia' inner spring section, compacted earth most usualy causes the spring to haunch up, the earth being stuffed up from holes open to the bottom rollers, to make the spring safe to strip down a broken or damaged unit is best done by cutting through at least 4 coils so the tension is zero, the none OE stuff works well so dont be scared to save some wedge, Oh and good job well done by the way, the dirt compaction is the cause of this situation happening.
Good spot Bob. It may just be the angle from which the photo was taken but it appears bent to me as well. Well worth checking and straightening if necessary before it's all reassembled.
Bob/Ont-- Thanks for the reply, I think the PIC I posted previously was just on a bad angle. The rear spring bracket I think is OK. I checked the BOLTS on the inner rear of the frame, they look GOOD!! Thanks for heads-up to check them.Thanks to ALL for TIPs & INFO, will keep progress posted!!!!
From those photos it doesn't look so bad, but IMO the top end of that bracket is bent ......
They are good Todd, digital photos leave a bit to be desired. Lat Bob
Bob/Ont & Nige----- The bracket is not exact, but I think it will work. And you say! Thanks for INFO!
Todd, heat and pound that piece up straight if you could. Later Bob
Bob, I didn't like to disagree with you until Todd posted up the photos with the set square but I was sure that bracket was bent ...............:tong:tong As Bob rightly says - plenty of heat and scientific application of FBH ..........
Bob/Ont---&---Nige, New parts coming in and making progress,just a quick update.
Toddcat955L, You are going to hate me if what I see is correct, but in the picture displaying the new dowels it looks as if the roller below that is moving laterally on the track frame because of how shined up the boss is, and the protrusion amount relative to the adjacent roller. Hopefully that is because of your paint prep. I should have gone back and looked at earlier pictures before posting this, but it is a lot easier to change the roller now if it has started to move. Nice job on everything! I went back to look at earlier pictures and didn't notice it being shined up so perhaps it was just your paint preparation.
Just wanted to update some of the progress, parts coming in, slow going without a shop. Oh well can't have everything! Here are some pics, going to replace the guards and wear strips on bottom of frame. Any INFO, or tips will help. Oxbow-- checked the rollers and all seem to be in good working order, all were replaced. Thanks for the reply. Going to remove frame and replace wear strips, cannot do this while attached to unit. it is wearing into the BOLTS on the guards that hold the WEAR STRIPS on ,as can be seen in pic,s. .
Thanks for the update Todd. Did you go aftermarket or Cat with the spring and seal kit? Any pics showing the rebuild of the grease adjuster?
OldandWorn--Sorry no PIC,s of track adj rebuild, will post PIC,s of that when I get to the other side! I did ues all CAT parts, except for springs-- JUST COULD NOT AFFORD THEM---these springs are straight and are very good quality.I think they will be adequate for on the FARM use.We are going to remove the roller track frame and replace the WEAR strips front and rear. not a costly job just labor intense,and we have a lot of that free! do not have to have anyone weld or fabricate for us, we have that covered. any tricks of the trade on WEAR strips or removing frame, Please post. LATER
Nice job you are doing Todd, aftermarket spring is okay. Cat sells Classic aftermarket blessed by Peoria. Later Bob
Any INFO on wear strips in the PICs I posted? could use some help and advice on this repair. Or with new undercarriage do I need to replace these.THANKS
I'm seeing your pics but I don't think anything is supposed to "wear" on them unless you are talking about something else. They look like guards to keep debris out of the sprocket and idler. There should be good clearance now that your idler won't be raising up and your sprocket and bottom rollers look like new.
Oldandworn----Thanks for reply, In this new PIC the wear strip is worn down to the bolts. And one bolt is completely missing and others are worn to only half a bolt head. Do I need to replace these, or if the uint has new rails and tracks are they ok left AS IS.
To me, it would seem like more of a cosmetic issue if you want to replace/repair them. The condition of the idler, sprocket, and the closest bottom rollers would dictate if your rails/bushings would rub on them or not. I have very little experience with tracked machines so maybe someone else can give you a more solid answer.
I would say that the wear you are seeing here was caused in a previous life by worn bottom rollers and probably also by worn pins/bushes on the rails. The wear strip is designed to be replaceable so that the complete guard doesn't have to be replaced that's why Cat made it a bolt-on. If it were mine I'd be replacing the wear strip and bolts. Are both sides the same..?
Nige---Thanks for reply! the WEAR strips on both sides of unit are worn the same.The BOLTS are worn off,and there are only two bolts left on wear strip.But do I need to REALY replace these? I look at other TRACK LOADERS and some don,t have any guards at all. I look at a CASE 1150c and it had RAILS and no gaurds or wear strips. just need to know before spending $$$$$ on new Guards & Wear Strips. Thanks for the INFO!!!!
The Guiding Guards and wear strips are both replacable and can be cut off the frame with new replacement items welded in place, the rear bolt locations on the guards are for the full lenght roller guard fitment, the wear strips just bolt to them and after a few years they always look as worn as yours, on the early shovels these were not standard fit from new, my 951B does not have them on the C series they are standard fit with a revised rear F/Drive case inner section with wear strips fitted, it is possible to repair the worn section to the welded on guards, bu t if they are bent and buckled its easier to chop them off and replace them.
tctractors-Thank you for the reply, I have completed the repair on the track adjusting mechanism. Everything dealing with the undercarriage is new, wear strips included. Should last on the farm a good while. Thanks to ALL for very helpful info. Moving on to next project/repair which I will start a new thread.