Okay after over 50 years in the business we are considering putting a Log truck of our own in the string. Thinking KW, 800 or 900, with either Whitlog or General/Peerless equipment. This will be a work truck with limited bling, give us your best advice....no not do it.... Scott
Check out Pederson Log gear, a bit lighter then the other companies log gear, but very tough as well. It's all anyone around here runs. They also have a new bolster design that is pretty neat, more like a turntable on a pup trailer then the conventional bolster design. Most guys around here also load their trailer behind the bunks. Rides better and gets around a lot better in the woods then trucks with the trailer loaded the conventional way over the bunks. A positive side effect is that it is also easier to load and unload. My dad has a 06 W900L and his biggest complaint is the turning radius. TThe driverside tire will rub the pitman arm turned full lock to the passenger side. He drove a Pete 379 and a T800 before this truck and both turned tighter. Here is a picture of his truck.
Welcome to the world of BIG time bureacracy headachesville. In California you get to deal with the Air Resources Board....scary the power those people have....Then you sign up for the BIT program...several hundred dollars there....they inspect your trucks and tell you everything that could possibly be wrong with your truck....you'll need to keep very detailed records of all your repairs....even have to tell them when you plan to change your oil......if you ever get everything working perfectly you get a sticker on your truck. You will need to sign up for the pull notice program....only $5.00....they can check your driving history.....(don't them folks already know?).....go ahead and sign up next for the CSAP program to drug test all drivers..........$215 yearly....Better pay your heavy vehicle tax or they won't renew your registration.....I spent 8 hours trying to do mine......nope....took it to the accountant....an hour later it was done.....$400 or so there.... Now you haven't even tried to cross the scales..........here it is a nightmare for a guy with an older truck......the CHP.....I'm trying to be nice here.....will inspect your truck....looking for any excuse to write you up....when he finds that you have ANY thing imperfect, and you will, he will write a fix it ticket at the very least....no problem?..... $25 for each item he finds... it can be expensive.... Why on earth would any sane man want to own a logging truck? I do it because I love what I do, it is very challenging and rewarding....(not the money kind). Yes, I would totally agree that a log truck is a very desirable asset to a logging outfit, just be prepared to have every governmental agency reaching in your pocket... Would I do it again? Absolutely! One last ramble....drivers, I don't know about your area, but here in northern Cal they are getting scarce. It used to be if you threw a rock into any crowd you'd be sure to hit a truckdriver. Not like that anymore. Here anyways. Take care.
Redwood Climber, why do you people put up with that crap? Haven't you ever heard of pitchforks and torches? Okay, I know. You're outnumbered and have no way to go anywhere else, but still. My parents had property outside of Hayfork. Beautiful there, pity you can't realign politically with eastern Oregon to form a new state.
The T800 is the greatest all around truck, in my almost-always-correct opinion. Lots of parts available, and good visibility. Question is, how are you going to set it up. Big power and lots of bling, a rolling advertisement for your company? Or something a bit more hired-driver proof.
A drivers truck, my wife has the bling account exhausted..
I don't know how they spec them in Oregon, extra axles and all that, but when you say driver's truck, at least give some serious thought to putting an automatic in it. You won't be putting clutches in it and the performance in mud is sometimes better, less chance of twisted off drive shafts, fuel economy arguably can be better, and of course you can find drivers for it easier.
It has been a while since I have sold trucks, but I will offer my pre-tax .02. Bling on a log truck, or any work truck, turns me off, and I think it attracts the wrong type of driver. What worked for me personally as a driver, was a respectable-looking, reasonably spec'd truck with a top notch seat and cab, a gracious plenty of power, and a 13 or 18 speed. Big stacks with some sound also worked for me, but that's just me. I see the seat as one of the most important components. A good, comfortable seat makes the day go by so much easier, and a crappy seat just adds to the other frustrations, and can even multiply them. I would prefer a KW, but would also consider Pete, whichever has the best dealer support in your area. I would also ask around about the salesman the dealership has assigned to your area. Unless you really know your truck specs (and that's a challenge in this day and age), a good, ethical, savvy truck salesman can be quite an asset. In such a case, he will already have a good idea as to what works and what does not in terms of specs, and also what works best in your area. I would also do some research of my own on engines, transmissions, rears, and suspensions. Especially engines. I hear some of the automatics are pretty good these days, but I suspect some are better than others. Even the tires, if they are good or bad, can have an effect on the bottom line.
I have Whit-Log bunks and trailer, and I like them. I would have one drop axles on the truck and only a standard two-axle trailer. It makes a decent load with less wear and tear on the truck. If you want to super train you can. I would get at least a 500 HP engine, no less. I like my Chalmers suspension It would be mated with an 18 speed. I disagree with Birken Vogt, having been back holding a steering wheel for the last 4 years; I have never met anyone who has done damage with a manual transmission. I met a sales representative who told me that automatics made for better drivers; I said all they did was camouflage bad drivers. With a manual transmission, you need to think ahead more. At 63 I am one of the younger drivers around here, I am probably one of the slowest also. As a hired steering wheel holder, all I want is a truck that runs well, no bling, lights that work right and windows that roll up. Oh, I also want a center pull on the front bumper; I really dislike those side sockets. I am driving a 2000 W900L lots of miles on it and it runs nice still. If you get something used, make sure the electrical works when you get it. I spent every night the first three weeks after being assigned the truck, repairing the electrical and rewiring the truck and trailer. Do yourself and the driver a favor, have your wrench grease the truck, that is the one thing I hate most about the truck, under it on a rainy Saturday in wet gravel greasing it, but I am old and I like to complain.
Does anyone out West still run a brownie behind a Roadranger?
Have someone hit you in the netherregions with a stick of doug fir, that will get the logging truck off the brain.
HAHA Around this part of the country the drivers i work with dont even know what a brownie is. ( its not a chocolate cupcake)
Sad state of affairs. 'New Age truckers'. Besides, I'm not sure they even make an auxiliary trans these days that would handle the torque of the modern day truck engine. Some things have gotten better, and truck engines is definitely an example. A weak engine will suck the life right out of a driver.
Welcome to the Forums Poohbear55!:drinkup I don't know what a "brownie" is either other than something that goes really well warm with vanilla ice cream...
It's the same thing as a wedgie. Back in my grade school days, giving them was my favorite part of recess. ROFL. Almost as much fun to give as a swirly.
Alright. I'll play nice. Years ago on the old 5X4 2-stick Macks, the knob on the main shifter was black, and the auxiliary knob was brown. So, the term 'brownie' became slang for an auxiliary transmission. Ever hear of the term 'double granny'? That came from the term 'compound low', with the main and the brownie both in first gear. Gears on the brownie were labeled lo-lo, low, direct and high. Lo-lo was so low that it was only to be used with low in the main box. I miss those old trucks.
Why would someone spend close to 200 grand for a new truck that might make 80 bucks an hour and 30 of that goes into the fuel tank. If you run used equipment then the benefit of smaller payments is offset by extra repair costs. If you want to buy trucks to get your wood moved they need to get paid enough to own nice equipment, pay the drivers a good wage, take good care of the trucks and still have a profit
I believe the term "brownie" actually comes from the name of the trans.I have a mid 50's 3spd a-box in my Diamond T...The tag on the side says "Brownlipe" transmissions....Cory
X2 isx
Interesting. Thanks.
Well, I learned something new here. I would like a brownie in my next truck. My current one has 2 speed rears, and you can't get 4 way lockers with a 2 speed.
Better make sure they still make one that will handle the torque. I'm not sure they do.
Redwood Climber said it best. If you absolutely have to have a truck then go ahead but don't expect to make much on it. They're a money pit. Your own truck is a convenience. Don't look at it as being a major money maker. Finding and keeping a good driver is always a major event. A good highway driver might not make a decent log truck driver until he gets some time in. In the mean time, slabbed trailer sidewalls, burned clutches, burned brakes, and the occasional slipped load are almost a guarantee. A driver, out there on the road with your truck, has the potential of involving you in a multi million dollar lawsuit if there's an accident. Even if the wreck isn't his fault you can count on being named in a lawsuit to recover damages and you'll have to bear the costs of an attorney. I don't mean to rain on your parade but I'm sure you've already thought of the advantages to having your own truck. It's the disadvantages you need to think about. That being said...a T800 with Cat power...at least 500...an 18 speed, double lockers, and either a Chalmers or KW air suspension. I've always had good luck with Whit-Log gear but anything will last if you take care of it and catch the little stuff before it gets big.
I agree on the T800, hands down. W900s may attract more drivers, but we're talking quantity versus quality. I believe in screening drivers carefully, paying a little more than the usual rate, and taking care of equipment, and taking care of employees. When I advertised for drivers, I screened them over the phone. One of the first questions I asked was, "How many jobs have you had in the last five years?". Then came the usual questions about their driving record, etc. With the right morale and motivation, you can move mountains. Still, unless I was thinking about buying a truck to support my own operation and deal with a shortage of reliable owner/operators, I too would think twice.
everything that golog it said but the the KW air ride. ITs horrible off road, Hendrickson primaxx is the cats pajamas on and off the highway.
I will repeat what I said a few years ago…. Want to buy a log truck?? You have two choices; take all the great advice you have found here, buy a truck, hire a good driver and have at it…. Or, take every cent you have, head down to the local beer hall, buy everyone beer until all your money is gone and you are broke. The results are the same, you are broke. However, the beer hall is much more fun. In a beer hall there is no rising fuel costs, unpredictable weather, no DOT, no tire eating roads, no shovel runner sticking a top through the cab guard, you get the picture…. :Banghead:drinkup
The logs cannot haul themselves and they need to be at the destination in a timely fashion so why not have control over how and when they get there? You should keep as much profit in house as possible and that is a good way to do so.
If you guys down there are only making $80hr then it's the truckers fault for working so cheap.
Thanks all, the driver has been a employee for the last two decades. A guy I really trust, he just wanted to move to another position so we are trying to keep him close. So far this year we are out nearly out $1 really, really large to our contract trucks, if we can keep a portion of that at home it may work out. If it doesn't we plan to sell the truck to the driver after a bit of time to garner some tax advantages(yes there is always that) .... It's at Whitlog as of Monday, not a KW....PB actually had better pricing. Photos and spec soon... We are going to track cost really close, so far we have paid or going to pay for FET, registrations, and drug testing consortium fees over $17,000...haven't hauled a twig yet. What a country! Scott S
Congrats. Which model Pete?
Sweet lookin' Pete there Scott! There are going to be nay-sayers no matter what, but I think as a timber producer, you should at least have the option to ship a couple loads with your own truck every day. Trucks seem to be getting harder harder to find these days, weather your wanting logs, gravel, or a piece of iron moved. The gravel pit I have been dealing with this summer to have gravel delivered to my job has had a hell of a time finding enough trucks to keep me in the dust. What I have never understood about those guys is they have a huge quarry and an even bigger sand and gravel pit and the don't own a single truck. So we come in, order 25000 tons of gravel and everyday its a craps shoot weather or not you'll get enough delivered in a day to run til noon!
First load will be in the morning, it will be a shame to get it dirty.
A few comments here 1) jdofmemi they do make a brownie that will hold up to any legal engine on the road. 2) Jason next time you order gravel pay an extra dollar a ton for the rock you will get more rock faster, maybe you should just hand it to the drivers when they deliver so the quarry doesn't just put it in there pocket 3) Scott s alls I can say is wow! I had a log truck in the late 90's I lost $18,000 in one year ( didnt have to pay income tax for 4 years after that) bad drivers, bad economy, after that I watched cost report after cost report come across my desk for years with dump trucks and never saw anything but break even and we did 100% of repairs in house, as I see it this is a wage earner for an owner operator (self employment is awesome) and like you said a bit of help with the taxes. Trucks for a good logging company are a necessary evil, same in Jason's case with construction. Everyone have a prosperous finish to your year and work safe......TIO
Awesome! Are the extra/tag axles not a viable option in Oregon, or just a case of diminishing return (not worth the cost for the amount of gain in your situation)?
We have been paying trucks for years with 5 and 6 axle trucks working the same unit, rarely do we see a real advantage.
Nice, very nice. Two stage or single stage reach? I cannot tell by the photo. What I did not see was the DOT #s. I assume they are there, but where? or are they too neat to see unless from inside a scale house?
This photo was taken before the lettering was done, the DOT#'s are below the door sill now. Single stage reach, we rarely have anything over 40'.
Have any pics of her loaded? That's a great looking truck Brett
really good looking truck man, hope it all goes well for you. trev
2 years on, how's it working out...?
Just sold it last week. We had a great run with it for the last two years until a company dispatch trucking system started a couple of months back. We could not come to a agreement on reasonable rates and we decided to sell. Scott
Sounds like some of Weyco's crap.
:Banghead yep
I was just reading this old post and seen this. Brownie was the name of the company that made the majority of the auxiliary transmissions back in the day. I installed one of our old ones from 40 years ago into my 2000 F550 and using it almost daily still. They were a great transmission and held up to a lot of abuse. They may have used a brown knob for the shifter but I had never heard that before. Mine shifter was built my me so no brown knob. My 3 speed Brownie has under, direct, and over drive.
The Brown-Lipe company was one of the first manufactures of auxilliary transmissions. That's where the name brownie came from. I believe they later were acquired by or merged with Spicer that built a great deal of the later transmissions.