Id like to see some pics of your road graders that are equipped with V-plows and wings.
If you expect to bust deep drifts ya better invest in a good set of chains. Mike
Have good chains. A good V-plow. A unique Wing.
I'm guessing areas that have more gravel/dirt roads have more graders but here in Central NY where gravel/dirt roads are very rare I have never seen a grader used for plowing snow. Heck can't recall seeing a V-plow in active use. Many Highway departments around here have them sitting out front on display with the town's name on them so they were used in the past!
I’ve never seen a v plow in use other then pickups growing up in the Midwest. I’m sure they have them where the road drifts over bad, never see one used.
Last time i saw a v-plow in use was about 25 years ago. We haven't had enough snow to get 4'+ drifts since then. My township has paved most of the roads and is down to only 1 grader. Now they do most of the plowing with trucks. My dead end road is normally in better shape than the primary roads in Lawrence, but if we every get real snow again, i'll be digging myself out of the drifts.
Winter of 75 my boss and his brother with a pair of 12s pushing the V plow
We had v plows on in late 2014 they had not been in use 19 years previous to that
So what do you use for a drift like in my first picture? Edit: My first two pics didn't load for some reason. This is the one I'm talking about.
Jonas, those pics make me feel cold and tired!!!! 40 years ago that type of road clearing was common. The graders of those times weren't half as productive as today's machines. Very common to see the State Hiway Department using two graders to push a V-plow. I've spent 3-4 hours clearing a mile of roadway many times. Back up and get a run at it, ram the drift at 10-14 mph, gain about 10ft. Back up and hit it again. In the picture above, by the time I opened that drift I had snow piled above the top of the cab on each side.
Here in Minnesota the snow plows, mostly trucks run 24 hours a day as soon as we get a 1/4" of snow. Less if its on a Sunday.(Double time). It is a rare occasion when the snow accumulates enough to need a grader, much less a V-Plow. Normally snow never gets over 2" deep on the highways because of all the plow trucks. Only about once every ten years in the worst blizzards the trucks get called in for a few hours but are always out again by 5 AM. In fairness if the highway patrol calls them they have to go. First idiot that slides in the ditch seems to auto dial the patrolmans phone to the maintenance folks. A friend of mine that is a supervisor for the highway department has to have a guy out driving all night testing the roads when ever snow is predicted. Our tax dollars at work dumbing down the population even more.
Well the town down the road last I knew still had their old Walters Snow Fighter, that was all wheel drive and does have a Vee plow but don't think we have had enough snow at any one time in over 15 years to need that old girl! Up north at the east end of Lake Ontario it can be another story. Our lawn was nice and green for the last few days with barely a touch of snow. Up the less than 60 miles away they got between 8 to 12 inches last night. When it does get bad, like when they stop measuring snow in inches and change to feet they will get one of these to tackle the bad spots: But for the most part the highway departments do a good job around us even if it does mean replacing or repairing a mail box every week or so! Last year was the first time I ran out of repairable ones so called the county highway department, they dropped me off a new on the next day! Ours is a free standing one in an old milk can so 90% of the time just need to dig it out of the snow and stand it back up with a smack or two to be serviceable again.
Old-iron, Dad used to talk about them using horses to plow up in the Hill City area back when he was a kid. Guess the area farmers would take their horses to the town barn for the highway men to use. When they were done with the horses they would just unhitch them and slap them on the rump and horses would find their way to their homes. And now we are talking about this new thing of self driving cars? Wonder how many guys managed to get home from the bar just by crawling in the buggy and let the horse find the way!
Going to be interesting to see how an autonomous 2wd vehicle handles deep snow with ice/packed snow under it. Will it know when to turn around and head home like a few humans do?? Mike
And Heaven Forbid if they can't get to town for more than an hour or so!!!!! To be snowed in all day would be horrible!!!! Especially if they lost Internet/Phone service!!!!
Although progress is being made,,,,, we are decades away from autonomous vehicles dominating the roadways. It appears that for the autonomous vehicle to be 100% effective every vehicle on the road must be autonomous. This gives it the ability to analyze conditions and situations by data it gathers from all others in it's vicinity. This data gathering is critical for it to avoid accidents, stalled vehicles, etc. Don't think we'll see it in my lifetime.
Here's another example of needing a V-plow. I had just cleared this road two days earlier. It's critical to move the snow back far enough to leave a place to pile the next one.
Here's what it looked like the first time I opened it. The previous picture was the third time it drifted shut that Winter.
Just out of curiosity I had to look up the average annual snow fall for Missouri. Seems the most snow is in the Rolla area.with 18.9 inches average per year. As a comparison Lowville NY in the last 24-36 hours got 14 inches. The average for Syracuse not far from me averages 123.8 inches! Had to check Old-Iron's area and according to the inernet Moose Lake Minn only gets 40 inches on average!
It's not always volume of snow that matters though. The wind plays a critical role in road conditions. I grew up in the Midwest snow belt, always saw lots of snow covered roads, but nothing too serious in terms of drifting. I started working in western North Dakota where it's flat, has marginal snow fall, but very consistent high winds during the winter. It's very common to have roads drifted shut on a daily basis without even getting new snow. It just keeps blowing the same snow around. On one site south of New Town, we had a lease road that we had to bust open every 12 hours for about month to keep the truck traffic flowing to our rig. We were burning a tanker of diesel every 3-4 days and had to make sure we didn't miss a shipment, along with the other necessary supplies to keep operations going. That wind kept up a relentless battle for access that I had never seen.
Here, the few grader guys that are left that ran in the early '90s will not put the v-plow on until they cannot push their way through with the dozer blade. Reason being the v-plow throws snow both ways, creating ridges on both sides. Push through with the dozer, wing the snow to the south or east and then the snow has a chance to blow on through.
Yep. Our volume of snow isn't the problem. Problem comes when you get dry snow, followed by cold weather and high wind. The one picture above of me looking over the plow at a drifted road happened because of wind, not snowfall.
Yep, I only carry the plow when I have to. I have used the plow to punch a hole thru toward the upwind side. Then keep rolling the downwind snow windrow toward the road bank until that half of the road is clear. In the end I have moved a considerable percentage of that snow toward the downwind side, reducing the chances of the road drifting back full. In these discussions I think it's important to keep in mind there are several types of snowfall. Each requires a different approach at removing. It even affects the angle or rotation of the moldboard to get the best results. Heck, I've even changed that during the day as conditions evolve.
Yep. But does the 123" lay all Winter or does it periodically melt off?? And if it lays all Winter I'd love to see some pics taken in late Winter!!!
I remember when I was living on a rented farm house 4 miles out of town at about 21 0r 22 years old. After being snowed in for 3 days and tired of me and the dog biting each other, I stuck my snowshoes on and headed cross country to town. Got to town and the town was closed up, nothing open but the laundromat and that was deserted. I warmed up a few minutes and walked back home. At least I was worn out and content to hang out for another day and 1/2 until the roads got plowed. That's the last big storm I remember. In about 1973 or 1974 or so.
True, more so the last 10 to 15 years snow melts off quite a bit between snow falls around here but that can vary quite a bit just by traveling maybe 50 miles north. One guy I worked with who lives just over 40 miles north of me has at times been snowed in with 3 to 4 feet of snow in his driveway and on the roads while you couldn't find enough snow on my 5 acres to make a snow ball! Then back in the mid `70's when I built our house for over a week I would come home from work and have to snow blow the drive at the house we were renting 1/4 mile up the road load snow blower on truck and drive down to new house spend a couple hooures clearing that out while wife work on the sheet rock finishing. Then load blower back up and go back to the rental and park in a snow drift till morning. This is what some of those a bit north have to deal with once in a while during the average winter: That might have been in just 24 hours!
Those city crews that have to clear those streets have my respect!!!! In my 50 miles I rarely have 1 vehicle to deal with and if so the farmer is usually just stuck and sitting in his truck waiting for me to pull him out. I deal with 25 mailboxes and driveways. Otherwise it's just plowing country roads with an occasional crossroad.
Here a an older video from a grader which i find on youtube:
I find another video from grader with V plow:
It's been a few years since we've had that type of snow,,,, but,,,,, I can soooo relate to that!!!!! After 12-14 hours of that you are exhausted. I've stopped and slept in the grader for 15-30 minutes and then go again. You get so tired you can't control the grader.
This is still from 2012 when I ran a Cat 140H. Now the Capital I One way plow is on a Cat 140M grader. Don't have a up to date picture
ovrszd, I know you said "late winter" but how about just what a town about 75 miles north of me has to deal with from the last week?
The majority of the roads in my rural part of MN are gravel and maintained by graders. I haven't seen any of the v-plows mounted on a grader for close to 30 years. The machines are getting larger and more productive is the biggest part. Now if the grader can't push through with a one-way, the call in some dozers. It seems like if the snow gets deep enough for a v-plow, the banks will be too high and drift in immediately again. We deal with more wind issues than snow depth.
That's awesome!!!! Unless you are living it,,,, then it sucks!!!!
That's my issue here as well. As someone earlier quoted our average annual snowfall,,,,, which means nothing,,,,, the following wind is what kills us. Our roads are not elevated with snow issues in mind. So when we get wind, rather than sweep the road clean, it deposits snow into the roadway area. After a couple pushes it gets so packed you have no place to store it....... We don't own a dozer so we rely on the V-plow. Luckily it hasn't gotten bad enough to recruit a dozer for several years. The township North of me has used a dozer several times in the past. Their roads and landscape are worse than mine.
And that area is not expecting to see highs above the teens till the second week of January and this Sunday the high is predicted as a -2ºF and the low is -19ºF , those are "Real degrees and not wind chill", so I would not expect to see too much in the area of a thaw!
I can't help but think of the 345 hooked on to a loader bucket clearing snow. You don't wanna know how long i dug around before I remembered it was working an avalanche. HeavyEquipmentForums
Yep, that's our expected temps too. We'll get some dangerously deep frost for us. We have 2" of powder snow on the ground so not much insulation.
A good friend of mine, who turned 80 this year, has a dozer. He would hire out to the local townships to help them clear roads using a V-plow on his dozer. No cab. Reverse the fan and fasten some sheets of plywood on the platform up to his chest. Upper body exposed. He would ride that thing all night. What a man!!!!
That's amazing. I'm guessing his CB handle is POP SICKLE.
Probably. He's a tough man. Not to sound degrading in any manner, men of those times didn't know any better. There was no alternative. It was necessity and their job. Think about the clothing of those times. I can remember putting on my shoes. Wrapping my shoes with newspapers. Then putting on my overshoes to try to create insulated boots.
Since dozers plowing was mentioned I saw this in a UTube video. It was in Wisconsin.
Makes me cold just looking at it. That snow looks like it's got a thin ice layer on top of it based on the chunks I see. My old CAT pull type grader wouldn't have a chance against that!!!!
There is a video of a double wing old snowplow on a Cat Sixty with V-plow floating around. The guys riding have to raise and lower the wings using chainfalls going by power poles. Tough guys indeed.
And it can be seen here ----->
That first little dozer cleaning sidewalks is running a little hot..... Steam and water is glug glugging out of the radiator which has no cap on it. I go 4 wheeling in the Rockies. If I go very early in the Summer there is still a lot of snow on the high trails. Those dozer guys have big nuts. They'll stick their nose off the trail to get the snow to slide down the mountain. Situational awareness is critical.
Liked that one! Not sure I would want a job as the "Wing Man" in that outfit! Liked that they included some sidewalk shots from Utica NY, not far from me. One thing I noticed is even after the plow went through the roads still looked impassable to anything other than a horse a sleigh! Unless they might have used a truck with a plow to "clean up" after the tractor.
I find a nice old photo from a Austin Western Grader with a V-Plow: https://www.flickr.com/photos/44693936@N05/5413502049/
I could have used that this last week in my driveway instead of the 24 inch walk behind three times a day for three days!
Glad you found that video Tinkerer. That is the one I was referring to. A friend near here has a Cat 10 sidewalk snowplow that he is restoring. Has a hand crank wheel to raise the one way blade and a latch to hold it up. I believe it came from the City of Superior, WI originally. If you search U-tube for Sasquatch's videos you can see the step by step rebuild. Khansen, That is a Best 60 in the video so the unit was pre-1925 when it changed to Cat. But then we have no way of knowing how old it is. With the wood V-plow my guess is that the machine was quite new. I'm thinking that there was still a fair amount of horse and cutter travel, especially in the winter. Perhaps they plowed a second time to clean it up. In the one scene they are winging out one side. You got me thinking about old truck snowplows. I would be interested in seeing some pictures of some really old ones. I've seen 4 wheel drive ones from the 40s but can't remember any real early ones. Hope someone has some to post.
Our safety lady would lose her mind over the guys on the wing. She thinks we should put up signs and have flagmen for plowing parking lots around town. Our winters are changing, the snow is getting wetter and heavier. We got a nor easter last weekend. It dumped 20 inches of snow, and then rained for 4 hours. So hard to push. This morning was minus 32 Celsius, Friday is going to be plus 9. Not sure what that is in Fahrenheit, but no wonder the roads break up.
Here are some pictures of my graders with v plow and wings on them
Hopefully by next winter my tandem axle 1937 Model 11 Cat will have the V plow and wing back on it and out playing. I got my parts machine home this fall and only need to change out the live shaft to have it powering the blade and plow again. I don't think my cab will be as snow free as the one on the 140M
Old iro habit do you have a YouTube channel? And no you probably won’t be as snow free in the cab as I’m in my 140M but still lots of fun moving snow with the old iron
Cat 140M AWD what is the grader in your first photo ? I'm having trouble identifying it. Thanks
It’s a 2004 772 CH Deere blade so happy got the township to trade that pos for the new 140M
I wish we ran our grader in the winter, but for the wear and tear it's just not worth it for what the province or municipalities are willing to pay. Every trip out is a good hour steaming off all that salt in order to stave off the rusties. I'm stuck in an L70F doing the forward and reverse parking lot shuffle. Some of the logging contractors have v plows on their graders. The government garages have them in their yards, but they have not been used in years. We have one that was used on an Austin Weston, but you would need a power saw to get at it. The wing and snow tires that came with my 940 were used one winter.
No, I've posted a coupe videos with my old stuff but no channel. If you search Utube for oldironfinal a field parade of some of my old relics will come up. The guy that filmed and edited it got a little mixed up as a couple times you can see a machine in the background that already passed. The 3 lungers Cat Diesels like the Model 11 do have a unique sound for sure.
Yeah I'd say going from a CH to an M would be a quantum leap for sure!!!!