Hey Everyone, I am new here and figured this would be a good forum to join as I leap into the heavy equipment zone.... Quick about me - I was in the logging industry for a few years in my younger years...ran a lot of different equipment. Most scary/fun was a rubber tire skidder. A lot of dozer work as well. Ran a lot of different machines when I was ranching as well...Now that I am retired from DSU peterbilt I help friends run their ranches etc...I have been fortunate enough to purchase 40 acres of my own land with a home...which brings me to this site. My only machinery that I own is a Kubota L2800 with a backhoe attachment and brush hawg...I need something that can do a little more and faster...I need your knowledge on what to buy as I only really have one shot at getting the right one. Your opinions are appreciated. What I am looking for - I am wanting to purchase a Mini-Medium sized excavator 9K-18K total weight. Hydraulic thumb, blade, lower hours with good undercarriage. I am just not sure what to look for...Brands I have been looking at are either CAT or Komatsu. Currently looking at a Komatsu PC78UU-6, but I have no idea if it is a good one for my needs. I don't like that the pivot point is up high... $40K is about max price point...Is there any models you might recommend? Reliability is a big plus... What I will use it for - This excavator will be used for clearing blackberries, digging small ponds, replacing culverts, cleaning drainage ditches, building dirt road, moving gravel, moving scrap metal/junk, skidding logs, and clearing small mudslides....this machine won't be used too often, but often enough to warrant buying one and not renting consistently. I am not worried about moving it too much as it will sit at the farm... Anything I am missing? Really appreciate the knowledge and insight this forum will for sure bring. Thank you all!
Here is the one I am looking at. Yesterday I learned about gray machines and that I should stay away from. themhttps:// www.haleytractor.com/inventory/2007-komatsu-pc78uu-6-sutherlin-or-97479-10891865i
Also, what are those kinds of excavators most useful for? Digging out trenches? Thanks!
Hey Skiddinlogs51: I'm one of the least experienced guys on this forum and I'm surprised others haven't reined in just yet to give you input. My suggestion is to rent a machine that is close to your general specification before you buy. That way, you'll get a feel for excavators and the idiosyncrasies of these beasts. With your general experience I'm sure you will operate just about any type of equipment at expert level in no time. In my case, I have very hilly, rocky, oak and manzanita covered terrain. My goal was to cut fire breaks and walking trails on my 18 acres. Most of the land is not accessible-too wooded. So, on the advice of others I rented a Kubota U55-4 (the biggest machine I could find in my area) which is 12.8k pounds, a full cab with AC (it gets hot here in California). I rented this machine twice and put 250 hours on it. The rental company said that they acquired it at 1200 hours and it was a bit heavy for most of their rental customers--so I made a cash offer and bought it at 2,100 hours. The tracks are a bit cut up from demo work but otherwise a great machine for under $40k. I think I could sell it for about that or a bit more. It's a 2016. I haven't used any other excavator. My opinion: This Kubota, like the tractors, seems well built. I have a 4 way dozer blade (a six way blade would be killer for trail making). The weight is fine on my asphalt driveways when I need to traverse these. This is a zero turn radius. I don't need that feature and wouldn't get that feature if I were shopping today--because it makes the cab tighter and general foot controls off-set and cramped (I'm 6'2"). I use this machine usually once every 7 to 10 days--and it makes chores other than road building a dream, e.g., taking down an old out-building, removing unwanted landscape, trenching, etc... It has 11k break force at the bucket curl. Would I get a smaller machine? No, I think this one is the lightest weight (hydraulic power and weight matter) that would serve my road building purpose--especially log handling for cutting. The biggest trees that I'm taking down are Oak at 70ft length and 2.5ft across. Heavy. So, with a lighter machine I might get into trouble. My general research following this site and others is that most name brand machines are likely reliable: Case, Komatsu, Takeuchi, John Deere, Kubota, etc. Stay away from Gray market machines if you can. Know who used the machine and for what purpose (will give you an idea about use and abuse); know enough about the mechanics of these machines to detect wear on drive sprockets, idlers, ram joints, etc... and general engine condition. Bottom line, if you rent a machine you will know quickly if you need something heavier or lighter. Is there a dealer in the area that can help with service if need be? And, like me, you can learn a bunch real fast from the expert operators on this site. Best in your journey, Allan
That one has a sideshift boom. We have 2 of the bigger version, PC128UU-2 and PC228UU-1. We utilize them for digging trench along a curb or building, or digging trench offset in narrow alleys. They're not bad machines, but many parts are unique to them and the vertical boom pins get sloppy fast, when abused or neglected. I say stay away from the offset boom styles if possible. I had a PC95-2 and never could get it to stop running HOT. In Cat, maybe a 306, 307, or 307.5. Much easier to get parts and quite the knowledge base on here.
Hi Allan! Thank you for your input! It could be that I am new that not a lot have chimed in, which I understand. The price of that Kubota sounds unreal! I haven't seen anything remotely in that price that new...maybe it's an Oregon thing...Seems Covid has really escalated prices. There is a CAT rental company 20 miles south of me that I have gone back and forth on renting...They want a lot per day, though. Something like $450/Day and can't go over a certain amount of hours etc. Going to go look at that Komatsu tomorrow that I posted earlier to get a feel for it and maybe some others. Dealer said they buy them at auction and change all fluids besides coolant...I need to get more familiar of what to look for...leaks...final drive...etc. I would prefer a 4 or 6 way blade, but it seems the are only on newer Kubotas out of my price range...I can always back blade etc. The property I own is in a big draw for the most part. 10 acres bottom land and the rest forested hillside...once I am proficient enough I want to cut rode through the hillside. Thanks again!
Thank you for the advise! I have heard those pins/bushings need to be replaced often etc. Was one of my main concerns. I need to be patient in my search. Thank you!
You might find a machine closer to your low end, 9k pounds, can perform most of your tasks okay. I don't think my 12.8k pound machine would handle "forest" but can handle everything else on your list. In Oregon I'm thinking you have big Redwood and Pine trees. So, maybe when you cut your mountain roads you rent a much larger machine if possible or pay to have it done. In my case, if I got into bigger trees I would chain saw these down and then dig out the stumps that needed removal--which could be a chore if these were really big trees.
Good points. I guess it's more open forest...does have some big trees. I will try to line the road to not have to cut down too many, but there will be some. Road will basically be a 4wd/atv trail...so not needing to be perfect. I think I should pass on that side boom Komatsu...something is telling me it maybe isn't the right choice...no idea on price either...they want $35K for a 2007 with 4,500 hours. Seems a little steep?
Something along the lines of a Hitachi EX 60, Komatsu PC60 a JD 75C or even the older 7 ton Kobelco's were all good Machines. If you want something newer that is very undervalued that you can usually pick up for a good price is the Yanmar line of excavators like a vio80 or the SV100.
Thank you! I will look into those. I need a place to start lol. Not from experience, but I have heard to walk/run away from any Yanmar, JD, and Mitsubishi? I am sure everyone has something to say about each brand... What would you consider "Newer"? one other thought is what would you consider to be high hours? I have read/heard 8K-10K hours is high mileage...Seems like most machines I see are right around 4K hours. I only use my tractor 150-200 hours a year would be my guess. Thanks again!
Looks like there is a JD 75D and a 120C, and a 590D (Might be too big) for sale....decent looking. Also a 2006 kobelco sk80CS-1E for sale and a 2017 CAT 305.5...decisions...
Also, I assume everyone prefers steel tracks over rubber?
Also liking the looks of this case CX55B....low hours. 12K # machine
I'd read this link: https://allclass.com.au/rubber-vs-steel-track-mini-excavators/ I think rubber tracks are the way to go for your situation if you will cross asphalt driveways/roads or any hard surfaces (pavers, cement, compacted areas). I have a 1/4 mile of asphalt driveway on my property. I stay off it in hot weather but need to occasionally traverse it. If I had steel tracks I think I would tear it up. I don't think the size of the machine matters much with mini excavators because the weight distribution per square inch of track is similar between a 9k pound machine and 18k pound machine--because the heavier machine has a larger track area.
If you don't need a blade you could get a bigger machine. I saw a 120-2 Hitachi that had the slows for under 20k, and that might be an easy fix.
I would need a blade for sure with what I want to do.
I’m not a professional, but a seasoned amateur so please take my opinion for what it’s worth. It sounds like we have similar needs and uses. 1. I started with a Bobcat e42/angle blade/extendible arm. Now have Bobcat E50/standard arm/fixed blade. Difference in machines is more that would indicate on paper. Although total weight between both are very similar the e50 is substantially more capable. Tracks and undercarriage are substantially heavier on the e50 give it a much more stable platform. 2. Fixed blade on e50 is substantially beefier than angle on e42, plus less maintenance to worry about. This should be a worthy consideration regardless of brand you decide on. The angle was convenient from time to time, but it was also one of my maintenance issues with the e42. I don’t miss it. Machines in this weight class certainly benefit from the stability from a blade. 3. For this size machine and intended use, I prefer rubber tracks. I like the fact that I can drive my machine virtually anywhere without fear of substantial damage. Concrete, workshop, grass, etc. only time I really had concerns was doing demo work in broken concrete. I’m careful when doing woods work…logs and stumps can be issues. 4. Standard length/fixed arm maximizes lift lift capacity of given platform. That is more important to me than reach. Professional, for hire owners might have different opinions, but the above works for me.
I've also heard very good things about the Bobcat e50, reliability and hydraulic lines are well protected on the inside top of the boom. Stability with a blade on these smaller machines is really key too as OTG AuGres notes.
a 120 with a 48" cleanup bucket can move a prodigious amount of dirt, but yes it takes some time to get up to speed. With a thumb you can pull a 7' grade beam too.
Honestly, from what you describe you want to do, I'd be getting a compact track loader.
I bought an old 1991 Cat E70B [ 24" tracks ] that was pretty beat up for 15K, and put a boot 5K into it fixing it up [ probably 10K of free labor ]. It is 50hp and weighs in a little north of 8 tons with the blade according to the specs. She fits into my barn with a 10' door for so I can work on her inside and store for the winter. I have a neighbor close by that has a Cat 320 [ think 36" tracks "] excavator and a Cat B5 dozer. Both of us drive on concrete pads/floors and do no damage. That is not saying you can't with metal tracks. You might want to stay off asphalt, especially when it's hot. Lawn is sand and gravel base, and you can drive across it with no problem. If you want to turn on dirt/grass , you have to lift up with the bucket and spin the tracks so you do not dig in. But I get by. So, don't over look long lasting don't rot in the sun metal tracks.
Skiddin- You're way more knowledgeable and experienced than I was when I jumped into buying my own piece of heavy equipment for hobby use (ie- not trying to make money with it) so you'll find the right machine with patience. I bought mine at auction but looked long and hard to find an older machine (no emissions, few electronics, etc.) that was in decent shape. Spent more than I wanted but I'm glad in the end. Since you're looking at the smaller side of an excavator with a very reasonable price point (ie- you're willing to pay for quality and condition), put feelers out to the local dealers, construction guys, and better, small equipment rental companies (the big-chain rental guys just auction everything off to not deal with tire-kickers) and let them know you're in the market. If you're not in a rush, you might get lucky fishing that way.
I bought my Bobcat E42 mini-ex after I figured out my Deere tractor couldn't dig trenches LOL. An excavator is mostly a one trick pony, having said that my E42 is quite useful when the tractor can't do a job.
Thank you for your input! I have a family friend that has a E50...I think that is what it is anyway...I used it a couple times on his property and really enjoyed it. Only used it for moving a boulder pile and moving logs around. Seemed capable. The weight is decent on those too.
Thank you for the idea! I have called a couple...some don't seem to take me seriously lol. Some seem a little sketch too...worn out machines that they bought at auction and want top dollar for. I like the idea of renting from star rentals or whatever it was called a machine that fits my needs and then eventually buy it from them.
I have gone back and forth numerous times around what will be my 1 machine to do everything OK. Looked at dozers for a while, then skid steers...excavator always seemed to pop up as the right decision for my needs. My Kubota tractor does about everything I ask for it...just doesn't have the grunt for some situations etc. Backhoe attachment works well on it...was able to dig out my drainage ditches etc. Also have a box blade and rake. The brush hog does a good job, but only in certain situations/areas.
I sold my Howse rotary mower that I used on my compact tractor and bought a flail mower. Big difference. I can mow real close when I want to and much more maneuverable around trees. The down side is I can't mow in reverse.
See that is the thing, you don't have just one machine, that Kubota fills in all sorts of gaps so I agree an excavator is the right choice for you.
Skyking1: Yes, you are right. I started with a compact tractor/backhoe. The backhoe only has a break force of 2,200 pounds. The compact tractor is great for mowing, scraping/leveling roads, mulching/chipping with a PTO attachment, post hole digging and limited pipe trenching. It struggled taking out big bushes and small trees. The excavator can clear landscape, build roads, take down moderate trees without chainsawing first and my 2.5 ft across tree stumps without much trouble. The excavator is great for moving rock (many 1k to 2k pounds) and leveling pads. So, it's a luxury to have this U55-4 Kubota sitting at my disposal. I've also learned that with an enclosed cab you can fearlessly tackle large hornet nests as you clear brush. Not so on my tractor. BTW Skiddinlogs51, Skyking1 on this thread is one of the experts on this site willing to share knowledge on many topics: road building, maintenance, machine configuration, etc... He is a great guy to follow. I've learned a lot from him.
I've moved large live oak tree stumps with my E42 that my 66 HP tractor couldn't - not even close. I also prefer grading with the E42 over the box blade - you can't beat a blade and tracks. I can reach places with the hoe the tractor can't. However if I could only afford one piece of equipment, it would have to be a tractor. Owing both is fantastic. I do miss my dozer but I don't really have enough work for one.
It really depends on your needs. If you need a loader bucket a mini ex is a really bad substitute. If you need PTO things it is even worse I would be speculating, but I imagine that you got your dozer things done while you had it. I had a line on a 120-2 Hitachi that needed a little work, and I talked myself out of it because I really don't need it. Part of me really wanted it though
Also left out the Takeuchis. They have a 9 ton machine with a blade that can do pretty big things. For what you're doing I'd try go at least 8 ton machine to maybe a 120.
Thank you! I am kind of liking the idea of a 12ton machine...Seems like it would do the jobs I need it to do a little easier. That Bobcat E50 I am kind of liking...seems like things are hard to find right now, though...and priced pretty high like anything it seems like these days.
I appreciate your input! Would you mind if I sent you links to potential purchases for your advise? I pretty much have one shot at getting this right lol. Thank you!
Ok, if you don't want to post them publicly here for some reason. I would consider just posting here more heads are better.
Touche. I will do that. Good point lol. Need more caffeine.
The Bobcat E50 is a 10.7K lb machine or about 5.4 ton. I think that's what you meant not a 24k lb machine or 12 ton. My Kubota U55-4 is a 12.8k lb machine or 6.4 ton.
Man...I really needed caffeine this morning apparently lol. Thank you.
Here is the case I was talking about...I like it, but price is too high for me... https://www.buzzardsequipment.net/i...r=1&lo=4&accountcrmid=9355&settingscrmid=9356
When you get into 24k + machines you will be playing with the big boys.
Oops
If plan to keep the machine just on your 10 acres, I wouldn't worry too much about going bigger. Bigger is more expensive to run and maintain, but you can't beat weight and power for moving dirt and killing trees. Seems like the little diggers that are easily trailered with a 1-ton truck are more sought after by the general contractors/smaller construction guys. Something that is too big for a 1-ton truck to trailer but too small for most construction sites might be your sweet spot.
Any thoughts from the experts on this Kobelco? Seems like a decent unit...looks a little rough, though. https://www.machinerytrader.com/lis...007/2006-kobelco-sk80cs-1e?ST=oregon&CTRY=usa
Look around for comparables. Look into available service and parts. It has been beat on, I've never trashed a bucket cylinder but that one has been changed, probably due to Wreckem Ralph at the controls. all the ass and side rash indicates a lack of concern, and that probably got the chrome on that cylinder dinged enough to take out the seal.
For 40K I think you could find a better machine. The Kobelco looks used and abused. I'd prefer steel tracks over rubber as they won't get damaged on rocks or stumps, etc.
Want to go bigger? You can probably buy this for less. https://www.ebay.com/itm/2008-Komat...ed-Cab-Thumb-A-C-155-HP-bidadoo-/164982781783
Ooo I like that one...pretty high hours, though.
Not enough lead time for me to go look either. I was just down the road this afternoon in Auburn. I don't care for that cheesy bucket. A little small for cleanup, and you would immediately want a digging bucket for it. Pinned on no QC.
I think my best bet right now is to rent from a place local and see if I like it...then buy. Looking at united rentals right now. They say if I buy then the rental fees are waived...
Looks like they have a Takeuchi TB290 to rent.
I would take a good look at the Tak. I have a TB175 (little smaller and older) have had very little problems. Biggest thing is jumping the tracks on stumps when in the forest. Have found that doing jump turns with the sprocket at the back have reduced that problem to almost nil. I really questioned if the rubber tracks were going to hold up. They were at 50% when I got it. They are sill going strong 400 hrs later.
Will be looking at a Bobcat E45 and a TB260 here soon at the rental place. Liking the TB260 because its a 12K Machine compared to E45 10K...a little higher price, though...3K hours on both machines...I think price is around 43K for E45 and a little higher for TB260. They don't have quick disconnect...I can't remember the name...something like Roy evans something...lol. Not sure what to think of Takeuchi using a Yanmar engine....That Kubota engine draws me lol. Said I could rent one for $1K for a week...If I like it and want to buy they will take that off purchase price...
The newer Bobcat mini-ex's use a Doosan engine - my 2019 E42 has one of those. I would have preferred the Kubota just because I'm more familiar with its track record but the Doosan seems okay. I had a little Yanmar 2QM15 engine in a sailboat and it was a faithful performer but maybe you know something I don't about Yanmar engines.
Many of the competing units use the Yanmar. Only Kubota uses Kubota in the ones they compared. I attached a comparison...a little dated tho.
I’ve been pleased with the Doosan engines in my Bobcats. No engines issues at all. I really like the one in my new e50. At 49 hp, it seems to labor a lot less than the lesser hp I had in my e42. I almost always run it in the eco mode at less than full throttle. The 74 hp engine in my t595 is very strong, it’s just a thirsty devil. Not sure if it’s a Bobcat or Doosan thing, but I much prefer the Bobcat emissions setups to the John Deere/Yanmar package I have in my 4066R. I have to run the JD/Yanmar at full throttle or it goes into regen mode quite often.
I'll take a look. Thanks! The ones I am looking at I believe are 2016.
I actually feel more comfortable with the Yanmar than I do with the Kubota. My previous Taki 153's all have been Yanmar. I never had an issue with any of them. My latest Taki 257 is a Kubota, and it seems to run well so far, I don't have near the faith in Kubota post emissions as I did pre-emission.
My 2010 model year Deere tractor uses the John Deere 4024T diesel, when Tier IV started Deere went to the Yanmar engine in their compact tractors. Haven't noticed any complaint trend in the tractor forums about the Yanmar except accommodating regen.