I had just sent a message to one of the poster here about how good this machine is doing. Then yesterday I went to the ranch where this one is and find the old 930 (no letter after the model number) wheel loader doing all the work. They told me the IT28 had started making noise and smoking blue smoke from under the hood not out of the exhaust pipe. What I found was a large size oil splatter on the right side of the engine compartment (all reference to location is from sitting in the operator’s seat) I can’t see where the oil is coming from. I started the engine and shut it down quickly. It sounds like the lifters have collapsed or rods knocking. I have no idea where to start looking on this unit any ideas will be greatly appreciated. Phil P
Start by letting us know the serial number.
Location of the oil leak may answer a lot of your questions. Hopefully its not a hole in something that isn't supposed to have one.
When you say smoking from under the hood do you mean out the breather or is there an exhaust leak?
S/N 3CL00239 The exhaust is on top of this thing. The smoke was from the area below the top of the engine there is an oil splash on the fan guard that covers about ¼ of the fan guard. This area is just below the injection pump. Oil is just everywhere I didn’t see any place that would indicate a source. The oil level is at the bottom of the hash mark on the dipstick that indicates it needs oil from the sizes of the engine I would guess it needs 1 gallon of oil. The coolant is at the proper level. I am just finishing an IH Case and then they went under a low tree today and wiped out the roof and exhaust system on the articulating IH Case. If I was full time and not just trying to train a young fellow to take over the maintenance for this outfit I would defiantly not worry about job security. LOL Phil P
It's a 3116 engine. Not an injection pump but a governor. There is a steel tube supplying oil to the governor and from your description, it may be the source of the leak. However smoke and knocking suggest you may be too late. I would start by cutting open and inspecting the oil filter.
Thanks for the note. This one is on the back burner the other equipment is more important to keep running. The oil filter will be cut open for sure. The blue smoke I am sure is from hot oil sprayed on a hot engine. This unit started surging at idle and on occasion would stall at idle about a month ago. This would come and go I found that by increasing the idle speed about 25 rpm that would go away but the idle adjustment screw is frozen in the aluminum housing of the governor. So I left it alone. This outfit is on a large ranch and that machine failed while running from the north end to the center of the ranch a run of about 4 miles when this happened. The operator said he heard the noise first and when he looked back saw the smoke so shut it down. When I got there I had him start it. It was hard to start, did not accelerate like it should and made the rattle or knocking noise I had him shut down it may have run 20 seconds total. They towed the machine about 2 miles to the shop. I didn’t even think you could steer them without hydraulic power but the operator said it was hard but did steer. I stared it in the shop it was hard to start and made noise more like collapsed lifters than rods. I only ran it for a few seconds and shut it down. I have turned the battery disconnect off and removed the key so it can’t be started again. I advised them to see about leasing a machine for a month or so the only other one we have is the 930 wheel loader and it takes half a day to change from forks to bucket. Phil P
Phil, please use the default font when posting. The larger font makes your posts difficult to read. Thanks
But thank goodness for sentence structure, paragraphs, and punctuation!
Steve will do Phil P
Dang! how did we let a fast learner in this place?
Hi I got time today to remove the oil filter and cut it open. There was some metal but not a large amount like I find in some on engines that had a serious failure. I installed a new filter and started the engine. At startup there was some screeching noise and knocking but went away suddenly after a few seconds of run the screech started again. At that point we shut down. Here is a video with sound for you all to look at and see what you think. Phil P
Some metal? I'd prefer no metal. Post a photo of the filter chop.
Hi I have been cutting filters open for 60 years on equipment that regulations require a filter cut every 50 hours. When we found no metal was more concern than some metal that it took a magnifying glass to see. I took 3 pictures with a high res camera and can’t see the metal to much glare from lighting. All I can tell you is there was no metal that a magnet could pickup. When I laid the segments of the element down with my finger I could see a few bright colored things that I assume were aluminum not the correct color for brass or copper. When I open a filter from an engine that has had a major failure you don’t have to look for the metal. This is what I expected to a find little surprised that I didn’t. This unit was due for service we are on 500 hour service interval except for the late model equipment that the manufacturer specifies a 700 hour interval. The sound the engine made on this startup did not sound like crankshaft bearings or pistons if you listened to the video you can hear a high pitched screech associated with the initial noise both stooped abruptly and then when the noise started coming back if was preceded with that screeching sound just briefly. The oil line to the governor is not leaking and the fuel lines associated with the governor are also not leaking. This machine lives in the swamp so is always packed with mud and foliage. The radiator and coolers are cleaned with compressed air daily. Phil P
500 hours on that engine between oil changes is IMHO pushing it, even with modern lubricants, and especially considering the working conditions you describe in your post above. OEM recommendation is every 250 hours or 3 months, whichever comes first, in "normal" operating conditions. The "screeching" noise sounds external to the engine to my ears - bearing in the fan drive somewhere maybe.? *Other opinions may be available. Also don't lose sight of the fact that you may have two parallel unrelated problems that by coincidence happened at the same time, or close to it. The oil "leak" - crankcase breather.? Maybe related to the extended oil change intervals. Then the noise which as I said above could potentially be a bearing at the fan end of the engine.
Hi I agree what I heard today sounds like something external. I am fully aware that I may have more than one item giving trouble. I finished the AC on the Case farm tractor today and only have to close the hood (it takes 2 men). Monday I will take some fan belts off and see if I have something in that system going bad. I have sent an oil sample off to Kansas for analyses. They will tell me what metal items in the engine are contaminating the oil. The other thing that is bothering me we do fuel filters more often than anything else. I did the fuel filters on this unit about 3 months ago. The engine had started surging at idle and sometimes stalling at idle. When I pulled the primary fuel filter it was full of microbial material. I am having trouble getting them to treat their bulk fuel tanks. I never got that surge out of the system the idle screw is frozen in the governor housing. Before I can go much further addressing that problem I need to know why so much fuel goes thru the governor before it goes to the secondary fuel filter. I have been unable to obtain any material that describes this fuel injection system and explains how it functions. This machine is too old to be configured like the newer high pressure common rail injection systems. May be it is more like the 2,000 HP GM EMD engines I worked on in ships. This is where formal training is so valuable. On top of that my Caterpillar experience is limited to these 2 machines and 2 9UD6 bull dozers I rebuilt the engines in 45 years ago. I am only part time as a consultant with this outfit and will be gone for a couple of weeks starting the middle of next week. I thank all of you for your input. It is apparent some of you have extensive experience with the Caterpillar equipment. Phil P
They are what's called a MUI (Mechanical Unit Injector) system. Low pressure fuel goes through a galley in the cylinder head and each injector is actuated by the camshaft to produce injection pressure. The large fuel flow helps take away the heat. Similar to the old 2 stroke GM injectors, if you're familiar with those.
I’ll post up the SysOp for the fuel system for you tomorrow. It might pay to climb into the fumes disposal system and clean out the screen that mounts on top of the valve cover. Changing oil @ 500-hour intervals could have led to some smudging and consequent blockage. The wire mesh screen can be cleaned with diesel or any other solvent you have to hand. Algae in the bulk fuel tank (if that’s what’s plugging the filters) could be a potentially difficult problem to overcome, if what you say about maintenance on the property is even half-way true. They’re just not going to “get it”.
Cmark Thank you I have extensive experience with the 2 stroke GM products 53 71 and 92 series. Then does this engine have a rack like the Detroit diesel? Nige I have been requesting them to treat every load of diesel delivered. Just the amount of treatment for the amount of fuel delivered. They have the idea this would result in over treatment so I get it now and then but not enough. All fuel dispensing equipment on the tank farm have filters I change every 3 months. Even when I show the management the stuff I get out of the primary fuel filters they still just order treated fuel every once in a while. The 930 has been put into sever service now and I haven’t been paying attention to that unit. It was destine for the scrap yard when I found a spindle, got it running on 3 cylinders and put some used tires on it. I notice yesterday it now is running on all 4 cylinders and doesn’t need either to start even though the heaters are not working. I think Monday I will bring it into the shop and do a good service on it. I have no records on this machine not even how long they have had it. One thing about the service environment it is wet but not dusty I don’t have problems with air filters with the exception of the O turn radius mowers and I service them every Monday morning. Here is something for both of you to think on I work on engines that are scheduled for their first oil change at 2,000 hours that is not a typo error. They use a filter system that is permanent and is washed out with a petroleum product specified by the engine manufacturer. Then the cleaning fluid is sent to the lab for analysis. I will let you guess what kind of engine. The reason I will be gone for a couple of weeks is to do the oil change on one of these engines in order to make enough money to keep playing with this old antique equipment these guys have. LOL Phil P
Yes it has a rack. Identical in principle but different in detail. Have a look inside the rocker box and it should look kinda sorta familiar. I get your point about drain intervals. Scheduled fluid analysis has made preventative maintenance a much more nuanced topic. As always it's about economics; What is the cost of carrying out an oil change and sample at 250hrs vs just a sample? If the engine only takes 10 gal of oil, it may be more economical to change it at every service than to carry out just an analysis, find out it should have been changed and then reschedule the downtime to go back and change it. With a 500 gal sump, the figures would most probably work out differently.
As promised, the SysOp for the fuel system.
Hi I got the Case 7110 electrical system squared away this afternoon. So I took the time to remove the fan drive belts and check the alternator and fan bearings to see if the was the squawking noise we heard. I found the water pump drive belt loose so tightened it and put the fan belts back on. I ran it for a couple of minutes this time and I can hear the knocking noise but it is not near as bad as it was in the past. Have a look at the video and see what you think. Phil P
Seems that the video didn't upload correctly. I can't see it.
The bearings in the water pump belt tensioner are famous for failing in these engines. When that happens the water pump belt slips and the engine overheats. These engines are pretty sooty and dirty running I would recommend more frequent oil changes.
Couldn't agree more. I almost had a stroke when the OP said the user was changing oil at 500-hour intervals.
I run 500hr oil change intervals on my old mechanical motors. I have Deere 6059s running original everything's with over 22k hours. I did lose the third 6059 at 19k hours when the balancer separated. Windowed the block and oil pan with a main cap. Drove it on a trailer with no oil, drove it off at the other end, with no oil...innards looked like a 5k hour motor, save for the added ventilation. I just don't see a problem with 500 hr intervals. I'm running 400 hr intervals on all my newer stuff, though. Never seen a sample that says that I'm doing it wrong on either interval.
Nige Try this link https://youtu.be/5imZCDkJ1_A
Says the video is private.
I just fixed that I am not a lover of YouTube so I am not very use to the way it works.
I’m only talking about a 3116 when I say 500 hours is high. If they aren’t tuned exactly right they produce a lot of soot in the oil.
Somebody’s knocking shut her down! You had me cringing by the end of the video.
The link works now for me ! At 3:24 in the video --- yikes !!! Time to get out the wenches !
Yup, she got the death rattle .....
Yep not familiar with that engine but sure does sound like someone is trying to get out fast!
I agree. I've seen a fair bit of oil analysis that suggests the 3116 are "dirty" unless they are set up 100% on the fuel side. Additionally from the OP's descriptions of the operation it sounds as though it's not exactly kind to a machine. If you had a mind to you could easily classify it as severe service. That in itself would qualify to cut the oil change period in half from the one recommended in the manual, although the recommended interval is every 250 hours anyway. If it was my engine no way would I be changing the oil every 500 hours, it probably comes out the drain plug hole like tar.
Hi I have a couple of minutes this morning. I haven’t got the oil analysis back yet. The oil changes haven’t indicated anything abnormal Nige and the rest of you any guess as to what is knocking? This happened all of a sudden no prior warning the machine was being transported from the north end of the property to the middle about 4 miles when the operator heard the noise come on suddenly and shut down immediately. Also the engine has 5,963 hours on the meter. Phil P
Pull the valve cover and check every valve rocker and push rod. Then drain the engine oil and see if there is metal in it. Also, check the water level in your radiator and make sure none of it is in the oil pan.
Hello all. I am back from my trip to Texas to take care of a couple of turban engines that I had contracted some months ago. At least these were just an inspection and oil change that was simple and fast. Now I have all of the engine information. All metal was high from Lead to Tin. From the information I got from the operator that was running it when he shut down for noise and then the assistant manage ran the engine more after towing to the shop I suspected a major rod bearing failure and the additional running of the engine has cause one of the bearing shells to shift enough to tighten the rod up on the journal so it is now hard to identify what we are hearing. As a precaution I have sent a transmission oil sample in for testing. If it returns nothing abnormal we will remove the engine and send it to the machine shop for rebuild. Now I have a question for you all. I found an IT28G located in Florida with a bad transmission engine model 3056 Selling price about what the engine rebuild will cost us. Has about 11,000 hrs on it. Can that engine be put in the IT28F? Phil P
Both IT28F and IT28G use the 3116 engine model, however there could be differences based on build date, etc. No idea where the 3056 comes into it......... Serial Number of the IT28G.? With that I can compare the two engines and let you know. My 2c. With 11k hours on the other machine the engine is probably close to being ready for rebuild anyway. Make of that what you will.
Thanks Nige The first page I pulled up on the Internet has the 3056E engine listed I did another search and find it is the 3116T as you noted. My machine shop is not very complementary of the 3116 so when I thought the G had a different engine in it I would consider that rout. I am not interested in purchasing the same engine with high time on it so we will continue to go with the rebuild provided I don’t get a bad transmission oil report. Phil P
Money between rebuild engine and Florida engine equal... Service hours between rebuild and Florida engine … zero vs 11,000 Answer is ... Unless you want scrap metal sitting around. Some of us have that compulsive engagement.
I agree even though we have 11,000 acres to hide the left overs I still would not go for a used 3116. Phil P
I'd like if I may, come to the defence of the 1.1 and 1.2 MUI engines. In my experience they are a good engine if properly maintained. I suspect they get a bad rap from people who don't have the knowledge or tools to repair them correctly when they do break. This is an oil analysis history for a 3116 we used to look after. A model of reliability until 9500hrs when you can clearly see the analysis flagged a problem. (This turned out to be due to a split air intake hose. After the repair the wear metals began to trend downwards again but the decision was made to sell it.)
Cmark You are correct with the first line of your post. The machinist wasn’t talking about field reliability he was talking about the tooling he has to rent in order to do the job correctly. I don’t have much for records for the machine I am working on but I believe it is in excess of 15,000 hrs. Phil P
I sold a 322bl with 23k hours on original 3116 and injectors. Only resealed rocker box covers and replaced front crank seal.
Hi I have been unable to find the engine serial number. Our local dealer says Caterpillar doesn’t have it in their records. I did get the arrangement number 1017528. Cat has advised me there is a factory reman located in Alabama for $22,000. Here is the oil report for the transmission. What is your opinion about the reliability of the transmission? Phil P
One sample in its own is of limited usefulness, but on the face of it yours doesn't look great. The Aluminium is notably concerning. How was the sample taken though? Seeing as your machine isn't running, your sampling technique probably makes the analysis unrepresentative of the actual condition of the transmission.
Hi Cmark I agree with a lot of what you say but take this into consideration. Totally unknown time in use years or hours of the oil. The only fact I have is the filter has not been remove in the last 8 years. The oil sample was taken from the oil in the filter when I removed it. I have cut the filter open and did find 2 small pieces of aluminum and that was all. Before I authorize the purchase of a reman engine for $23,000 I will drain that transmission and pull the screed / magnet for inspection. Please remember they have 35 pieces of equipment and no full time mechanic. I am training a young fellow to do the service but in the ranching business it is normally considered that everyone work cattle, fix equipment and mend fence etc. For this reason servicing equipment is not on the top of the list. Phil P
Given your current situation, draining the oil, checking the suction screen and cutting the filter is about all you can do to guess the state of the transmission. Your oil sample report can't be relied on. I'm not trying to disrespect you or tell you you're doing it all wrong and I fully appreciate that everyone has different circumstances to work under. What I am trying to do for anyone who wants advice within my area of expertise is give an honest opinion.
YIKESSSSSSS!!!
I wish I could get engines for that price. Even Reman ones usually have another zero after the $23,000 to get anywhere near........
The 101-7528 engine Arrangement Number is unique to the IT28F, it's used in no other model. Your local dealer is correct. No engine Serial Number appears in the system for your particular machine. After having looked at a bit of engine data I reckon there is a good chance that the original engine is one of three, all Arrangement Number 101-7528, that were built around that time frame but were not allocated to a specific machine. The Serial Numbers are 98Z02279, 98Z02285, & 98Z02292. Now I could be wrong and all three may have been built for the Parts System but my bet is that one of them is quite probably in your loader. What Part Number of Reman engine is the dealer offering for $22k.? 10R-7258 or 0R-4881.? A last curve ball. If there is no sticker on the valve cover bearing the engine Serial Number, and neither is there a plate on the cylinder block with the same number, is there any possibility that the engine currently installed is in actual fact NOT the original OEM engine that was in the machine when it left the factory..?
The noise I heard in the rev up vid sounded HORRIBLE, piston tapping valves back closed or worse trying to turn sideways in a bore. Can see a scalded piston with the aluminum levels in the oil or burn't crown.
Hello Niger I have a strong suspicion you are correct with that last stamen. I would guess the lack of any ID on this engine indicates it is not the original or at least has been out of the machine for a major repair. Just as something interesting to me your screen name. I worked in a country in Africa with the same name. It was a pleasant stay for a short period of time even though I don’t speak French. Phil P
Niger I am back. Would you have a recommendation for draining the fluid from the IT28F transmission? According to the manual it holds 9 gallons if the drain plug is anything like the one in the 930 that means I will take a bath in hydraulic oil. LOL Phil P
A small difference. the African country has an "r" at the end of it, my name doesn't....... If it has hydraulic oil in the transmission then it's got the wrong oil in it...... it should have SAE30 TO-4 for climatic conditions in Florida. Unfortunately that model is not equipped with an ecology drain which would make it easier. A further suggestion, the best time to drain the oil is when it is at normal operating temperature. This may or may not be an option with the current engine problems. Did you ever get the Reman Part Number from the dealer.? See post #52 above.
Hi Yes I didn’t notice the absence of the “R”. No I haven’t talked to the dealer about that yet. I had been so busy that I didn’t see your question until too late. They did say the 1017528 was not available but a replacement for it was the price quoted for the 3116 factory remanufactured engine was $22,890.00 plus shipping. As for the fluid in the transmission I have no idea what is in that transmission I have not changed it so just don’t know. TO-4 is a hydraulic fluid just not the same 10W fluid used in the lift system. I just call all of hydraulic fluid. I guess I should call it the transmission fluid. LOL I did use TO-4 30W in the 930 and I do agree with you the TO-4 fluid has more friction inhibitors Than plain old hydraulic fluid. Phil P
Hello All Here are some pictures of the transmission screen and magnet from the IT28F. I do not know how many hours and only know it is 7 years plus sense last oil change. The stuff on the magnet doesn’t alarm me much. The 2 shiny pieces are aluminum and that would go along with the elevated aluminum in the oil analyst. View attachment 210603 Phil P
Sooner or latter I will figure out how to properly upload pictures Phil P
NOT Good.
Nige The fellow that quoted me the price retired today but the fellow in the parts department was able to access his notes. The Remanufactured number is 10R7258 Phil P
With unknown hours since it was last removed, maybe not as bad as it looks at first glance. Those bits of cork on the LH side are part of the gasket for the filler cap IMHO. A filter cut and a look at what's in the bottom of the pleats might be more revealing. Elevated aluminium as in how many ppm..? Again with unknown hours on the oil going by the SOS numbers is a cr@p shoot. Maybe it needs a pump..? Pull it off and have a peek inside maybe.? Part Number 10R-7258 is a complete engine, not a long block. That was my worry.
Nige Thanks for your thoughts The oil report is attached to post #46. They recommend oil and filter change and resample in 250 hours. The drain plug was clean no sediment at all. When I wiped the bottom of the transmission with my finger thru the drain hole there wasn’t anything there either. I cut the oil filter open a week or so ago and found nothing there. When I drained the oil today it was clean when in the sample bottle it was the correct color and you could see light thru it. I am seriously considering repair or replace the engine. Please let me know what information you have on engine 10R7258 and what concerns you have? Phil P Phil P
The 101-7528 Part Number is a brand new zero hours engine. Buy that Part Number and you get to keep your old engine and turn it into a boat anchor or whatever you choose to do with it. 10R-7258 is the Part Number for a Remanufactured engine. It was rebuilt to zero hours by the factory. Typically the price of Reman will be somewhere around 60% of the price of a new component (101-7528 in your case) Your old engine has to be returned to Cat in order to qualify for what is known as a Core Deposit. The way it works is that Reman Price + Core Deposit = New Price. Lose your Core Deposit for whatever reason and you end up paying new price which will be a lot more than $23k. I strongly advise you to speak to the dealer Parts people and ask them to clearly explain to you what hoops you have to jump through in order that when you send the old engine back that it qualifies for a full Core Deposit. While you are speaking to them, ask them how much the Core Deposit actually is. It will focus your mind wonderfully.
I had a look at your oil analysis. Because it's only a single sample with no previous history to establish a trend the analyst has simply listed all the places that aluminium can come from on an IT28F. See below. The suggestion to change oil and filter and pull another sample in 250 hours is standard bearing in mind the lack of previous history and the numbers shown in the analysis. NOTE: The oil might look clean to your eye but it is full of small particles in the 6-15 micron size range. The target ISO Code for that oil is no more than 20/18/15, the sample actually analyzes at 23/22/20 which is 8-16 times the number of particles that would be expected in an "acceptably clean" sample. Again, hence the recommendation to change oil and filter. My worry is that it was drained cold and that may not have helped to flush out these small particles. Personally once it was up and running I'd let it go for a couple of weeks and change the oil & filter again. Other elements are also in the "Action Required" range. Below is a list of the more important elements along with the Action Required ppm value. Silicon is relatively low. When I say this I mean that it is low compared to other elements in respect of the "Action Required" range for a sample with 1000 operating hours on the oil (please note the highlighted comment). You can see why they have singled out aluminium in the analysis. As I said earlier my first suspect would be the pump. Cu 23 (Action Required <27) Fe 17 (<14) Al 13 (<4) Pb 3 (<4) Si 5 (<5)
Thanks Niger for your thoughts Here is my dilemma. This unit has rust on the lower portions of the cab from the dirt that has been allowed to sit on the floor for extended periods of time. The hydraulics for the lift system is reasonably sound. Purchasing another used machine leaves us with unknown reliability until you have operated it for some time. The $22,8##.00 is the total amount including the core charge. The way this thing failed I would give odds in favor of you that this core is not going to be accepted. They know the price includes the core deposit and they are also convinced the core will not be accepted. The dealer assures me if we don’t return the core there will not be any additional charges. I don’t have any idea what it would cost to have the transmission disassembled and repaired as needed. At this time we can’t make up our minds whether to just see if we can trade it off for another used machine or remove the engine have it dissembled to see how bad it is which would leave us with an even less valuable piece of equipment . Looking at what records I have on some of the other equipment these transmissions and gear boxes have been overlooked for many years. I mentioned the appearance of the oil out of this one because the oil out of the 930 transmission was black. The local dealer hasn’t even returned an estimate to R&R this engine let alone give me any idea of the labor cost to dissemble the transmission for inspection. Phil P
Here's my 2c based on the above. The criteria that I am aware of for an engine such as this one to qualify for Full Core Credit are: - It has to be able to rotate 2 complete revolutions (1 firing cycle) using a turning tool on the flywheel. Your engine is a runner, albeit badly, so as far as I'm concerned that ought to qualify. It has to be returned in the same packaging as the Reman unit was delivered in - that is 100% doable. It should not be missing any blank plugs or cover plates that were on the Reman unit. (e.g. things like a cover for where the starter motor fits) - digital photos are your friend here. It should not be missing any parts. As far as I can see (and I'm not there) your engine should qualify on all counts. Has the dealer explained it to you differently.? Ask you dealer about Damaged Core Credit and what the criteria are for that as far as they are concerned.
Regarding your transmission IHMO it's nowhere near as bad as you are imagining. I wouldn't even consider removing it for teardown & evaluation without FAR MORE in the way of diagnostic confirmation than you have right now. All I'd do personally is throw new oil & a filter in it, then change oil & filter again a month down the line, and keep getting regular oil samples to establish a trend. If your current machine is repaired, you have a known quantity. If you trade it for another machine (I assume a used one), then you start again from square one with an unknown quantity, which I think is where we came in 4 pages ago ........ YMMV. Check your PM's.............
Hi I am unable to figure out how to send you a private message.
Click on the box on the left with "Nige" or his picture, and another box will come up with "start a conversation" that's what you want. It's just confusing because it's not called private message.
Yes it is confusing to those who have been on the forum for a long time because at one point it was actually called "send a private message" so many here including myself may use that "old term" at times!
I've been out of the dealer game for a bit but if it runs you should get your core back. I found this - have a look. https://www.toromontcat.com/docs/default-source/reman/customer-version-core-handbook.pdf - the wording seems to be what I remember. Hope this helps.
I am back and found they haven’t even cut the PO for the engine in this unit. And now the 930 engine has started getting worse about this low compression cylinder. Phil P
Hello All Here is an update on the IT28F. Caterpillar has just informed me the ship date for a factory reman is 5/27 a month away. This should give me plenty of time to get the radiator out of the unit and have it cleaned or re-core as needed. Phil P
Here is an update. Cat tells me the ship date is still good. We have started the job. Removed the radiator and it is on its way to the same radiator shop our Cat dealer uses.
Take photos - lots of photos......
Hi Niger Yes from this point on there will be many photos. Up until now this has gone by the manual and there wasn't much to take apart that isn't easy to put back on. I did remove the alternator and it will go to the shop for new bearings. The rest of the work will be performed by myself and a fellow that has more recent experience. Phil P
Hey there Phil, you look as Old and Crusty as I am, good luck in that.
Hi Have a look at this page and don't forget to read the small print. http://sallyscoffees.com/it28/
Hi all A little more progress. I picked up the enegine from the Cat dealer Monday 6/1. Here are some pictures. http://sallyscoffees.com/it28/Day2/ http://sallyscoffees.com/it28/Day3/ Phil P
What did that set you back?
Run thru my dealer...
I just giggled at the .020 over...not indicative of a bad rebuild, but seldom have I seen more than .010 over.
Take your point but the block is still only 2nd oversize, there's another one to go after that. I bet the crank is new though. One weird thing is that the reference Serial Number on the engine data plate for obtaining Parts & Service information (GRK01071) does not relate to any machine model that I can see, although data is available for the engine itself - originally built in August 2010. It was a 7C-9097 Arrangement which corresponds to a 928F but the engines in the 928F were 4TF-prefix. Something built for the Parts system maybe..? So long as it's built to the 101-7528 Engine Arrgt the OP needs is all that matters.
Hi Didn't do much on day 4 but it is apparent I will be doing a great deal of cleaning on day 5 LOL. The last 2 pictures are of the transmission control valve. http://sallyscoffees.com/it28/Day2/ http://sallyscoffees.com/it28/Day3/ http://sallyscoffees.com/it28/Day4/ Phil P
Seems pretty cheap to me. I was told a neighbour here with a D5N had a rod do a bid for freedom, six months to get a new block and US$30 000 later the engine was going again. Others here with a D6R with a Cxxx engine, rebuild cost them $30 000 as well.
Hi The 3116 is used in many applications not just Caterpillar equipment there are many in semi-trucks as well as other applications. This model engine make me think of the Detroit line of engines many of them on the road as well as stationary applications. My next project is going to be a Detroit DD15. Phil P
Really nice slide show you put together, Phil !
Thanks
Hi I didn't do much on this today we just tried the chains out we will use to lift the engines and cleaned some of the mud off the back of the old engine. Have a look at day 5 www.sallyscoffees.com/it28 Phil P
Hi We put the new engine in the frame yesterday. ALL went well. Here are the pictures. http://www.sallyscoffees.com/it28/ See Day6 Phil P
Looking good!
Hi Here are today’s pictures. The last 3 pictures are of a wire that was just hanging down beside the old engine not connected to anything. Can anyone tell me what it may have been for? I have determined the old engine was not the original engine apparently a reman like my new one that the sticker on he valve cover has been destroyed. http://www.sallyscoffees.com/it28/ Phil P
Any chance of finding any numbers printed on the wires themselves that and the machine S/N 3CL00239, got that, would help determine what they are/were for. Or if there is a tag wrapped around the harness that plug is one would also help. Looks like one is white? The other purple? Does this engine have an air intake heater for cold weather starting? Or does it have an ether injection for cold weather? Not that I would expect either to be needed much in FL! Checked the "As Built" for the 3CL00239 s/n and it was built with the ether injector system so that would mean it did not have the intake heater system as one over rides the other don't want to spray ether into a heated coil in the intake! So if the wires are white#311 and purple#310 that is why they are not used on your machine.
HI Thanks a lot I would say that is what they are. You are correct we commonly don’t need start assist. The old 930 I put a head on now starts without hesitation without any start aid. Phil P
kshansen These wires are white and orange white 522 and orange 513 Phil P
Then I'm assuming you don't have A/C on that machine as those numbers and colors are for A/C
Thanks No AC for sure it is an open cab LOL
Good morning all Here is the rest of the story. We ran the engine on the 11 day of work. We first spun the engine with the start run solenoid disconnected until we had oil pressure on a gage connected to the test port. Then I started the engine it started much sooner than I expected I thought it would require a lot more time to finish bleeding the air out of the fuel galley. We had only bled the fuel system using the primer pump. Day 11 is a video of the start and engine run. I also checked all hydraulics and transmission on this run. We had no fluid leaks at all in the engine compartment. I receive full core credit when I returned the old engine. I thank everyone that has given me advice on this project. http://www.sallyscoffees.com/it28/ Phil P
Hi One last note All of the gage and the EMS system seem to be working. Even the fuel gage works. This is very unusual for an open cab machine in Florida. Phil P
Just thought I would give you an update. Both the IT28 and the 930 are doing well. Everyone that operates the IT28 says it has a great deal more power that it ever had before. Phil P