i guess xcmark could probably answer best about the single arm boom on the jcb .how well is it holding up ? do you feel like you need to keep it on the uphill side when going sideways on steep ground ? does the amount of overhang out the back make your frontend light going up steep slopes with an empty bucket? if it seems like i talk about rubber track alot its becuse ive been looking for about a year and cant make up my mind and my main requirement is a machine that operates well on steep slopes . I have had to rent a terex/asv 11 times over the last 2 years and think there great but everyone i talk to acts like the tracks are junk and says to get the steel rollers/idlers but they all seem to be much lighter in the front than say a cat 277b or terex pt80
well everyone knows im a big advocate of the new jcb skid steers. the fact that most people thinking the monoboom being mounted on one side of the machine somehow has ANY effect on machine balance is a myth. that is a bogus claim! ask any physics professor (or jcb operator) and the last thing they would think is the machine would be off balance. if u have 4000 pounds on the left side of the machine, and 4000 pounds on the right side of the machine empty (obviously the machine is set up this way empty). then put a 2000 lb load in the bucket, you will have 5000 pounds on each side of the machine. put the machine on a slope and the same rules apply. if the center of the bucket was where the boom is then one would have an argument, but as is the geometry of transferring the weight from bucket to machine is a non effect. the jcb telehandlers have an offset boom, and they hold much more weight much farther away from the machine and have no problems. jcb always had the lifetime boom warranty, i dont know if they still have that or not. obviously if you are going to do nothing but pry up concrete with the left side of an 8 foot bucket all day you should probably get something else, not saying that any other machine could take that either. i dont know if jcbs are good at going up a hill compared to others. if you want a machine for doing real work, the asv track system is a joke. i will take steel over rubber and plastic any day.
im still learning which members favor which brands i just saw the picture with xcmark's replies but thanks for the input ive never seen one of these machines other than photos and always liked the side entry method
the JCB has a all steel bottom roller system , its not the smoothest system but I can tell you mine had its first parts put in by the dealer at 1600 hour. Most likey at that time its 2nd set of tracks but I can not say for sure , I didnt own it back then.
I was a Bobcat salesman for over 8 years and feel that offer an opinion with a bit of experience on track machines having personally sold over 200 of them, currently owning an ASV RC50 after careful consideration, and maintaining contact with many salesmen and Bobcat employees. I feel that my ASV ownership says something of what I think about how much of a joke the ASV system is. I can tell you with rock solid confidence that the operating cost of my undercarriage rivals and pretty much exceeds anything I experienced with the "all steel" undercarriages on the machines I sold. How did the ASV/Terex work for you? That would be the first question I would ask. I would also ask the question on why you haven't seen many JCB CTLs in the market, and wonder why they really don't get talked about on any of the other sites on the web that talk about equipment. This would be the same for their skid steers and most other JCB products. I would spend some time talking to your local Terex dealer about your concerns since you already have a pretty good idea of how they perform since you've rented them 11 times. Can you find a JCB to rent, probably not. I think that ASV has probably forgotten more about making track machines than JCB even knows. ASV/Terex has also just started shipping track machines to Sunbelt rentals which I doubt would happen on a whim (I've seen a few trucks on the freeway so far). I'm not sure about the size of Sunbelt anymore, but they used to be the fourth largest rental company in the US. They carefully analyze equipment before purchasing it. I must say something to the durability. I'm not aware of JCB having much luck in the rental industry, at least in my area. When you get a chance, try to get a demo of the JCB from your local dealer so you can compare the two machines. Good luck.
Thanks for the reply dig deep , the only reel complant ive ever had with the terex is very small amount of bucket rool back with the boom down . The whole track being junk thing was always a mystery to me because we have put as much 125 hrs on a rental befor turning in and i never noticed any problems keep in mind that we were carefull to not abuse them like running up on big rocks and turning or counter rotating in loose gravel .
No problem. ASV (now Terex) has been making rubber track machines since the early 80s and making rubber track construction machines since the late 80s. Terex paid almost a half a billion dollars for the company in 2008 and they're still making them so they must be doing something right.
the asv is a high maintenance, smooth riding machine. if u got time and money, get one. i would never own one because i do not tolerate machines that need maintenance more than once a year.
And this is from your own personal experience owning one on your farm????
Next time the JCB boys call, you might want to ask them why when sitting in the cab of their CTL you cant reach the door handle to close it. I sat in one at ConExpo and tried to close the door and no dice. Unless you are part Sasquach you cant reach the door. I mentioned this to the rep who was walking around the machine with me. He did not have a response. He said that they blew that. Kind of a big goof I thought. How does a machine make it through a multi million dollar redo and THEN you find out that you cant close the door while sitting in the machine.
ah. so i looked into the door handle problem. that IS a serious problem! im not really convinced getting in and out of a jcb skid steer is easier or faster than a normal skid steer, but it would be safer. one thing i like about the jcb is the cab is completely separate from the machine. i would imagine that would be strategic as far as keeping the cab pressurized as the machine ages. it will be interesting to see if jcb changes the door when they release the rest of the lineup. the problem is our bobcats have been such darn reliable machines, it would be hard to switch to another brand. basically, no major breakdowns in 8000 hours. i would never own a track machine of any make. more maintenance and more problems. i've talked to enough people to know the snowmobile tracks on asv are expensive to run. ...and it wouldn't take a rocket scientist to figure that out by looking at the different track designs the asv would take more time and money.
The JCB no doubt is safer, hard to deny that. The cabs on these machines are designed as a separate pod then mounted on the machine. Thats why they are so tight compared to how previous models were built.
We had a customer that had a 1110T jcb( I believe) and it stayed at the shop for the longest waiting on parts(And the customer)It came in two or three times for electrical probs and by the third time i loaded it up on his trailer and it just went back to his place and sat.It did run good when we loaded it up the last time engine wise.. I really was hoping they got it running right so I could try it out to see what it had.
looks like some are upset with the JCB SS, from what I have seen{and learned about} I'd own one. I do own a JCB mini ex and it is a great machine, I bought it used{private deal} and still feel they{JCB} stand behind it. I quess a good dealer can make a big difference in how well a transaction goes. I do have a bobcat dealer fairly close, but can say I wouldn't trust buying a roll of toilet paper from them. I'm not knocking bobcat, but if a person can't trust the dealer how could they trust the machine they're selling?
I sold (not just talked to people) enough bobcats to actual customers to know that the ASVs definitely aren't anymore expensive to run than the Bobcat undercarriage system, and the Bobcat system runs Rexroth drivemotors, Berco rollers and Bridgestone tracks just like 90% of the other OEMs. I remember when everyone was sure that the Russians had a bad *** military (all you had to do was talk to somebody) only to find out that their diesel submarine force was only good for supplying shore power as generators, their missle systems didn't work, their fighters were marinal at best and they couldn't pay their solders..sometimes you just can't tell from looking. Good thing you didn't go into rockets OR science.
i have contacted some people at jcb about the door issue. we will see what they say. word on the street is that gravel eats an asv track system alive? when you say asv is not more expensive, do you also mean no more maintenance? haha well im not old enough to remember anything about the big soviet scare from bak in the day. what did you think about the jcb skid steer besides the door issue? i know bobcat offers a steel track option, does anyone else?
The cab was well laid out on the inside. Seemed like it would be comfortable to run. Next year it sounded like they would be going E/H controls. Visibility was good especially considering how bad it was in the older models. They discontinued the free life time warranty on the boom. Now you have to buy it. Serviceablity seemed decent. Overall it looked good, hard to compare since nothing else is built like that machine is.
the jcb rep said jcb is looking into the door issue, and will probably have another door handle soon on their new skid steers. i would be curious to see if when entering the machine if i would naturally close the door behind me as i enter the cab, because that is how i normally enter cabs on tractors, combines, skid steers, and trucks, etc. i never sit down first then close the door. but on a jcb skid steer that might be the way you would do it.
You probably could but you still need to pull your self into the machine and with one hand pulling the door closed it seemed clumbsy to me.
My experience is different than what you are saying here. I have rented ASVs, in the past, and have had derailment issues. I demoed a Cat 257 (has the ASV undercarriage) for about 40 hours. The machine was used for dirt grading, pipeline bedding (with sand), and spreading/grading road base. When I decided I did not want to buy the machine they took it back. A week later the dealer called and said that I owed them $5,600. One of the front idlers (plastic) had a hole in it. According to them both tracks were ruined so they wanted me to buy those too. I don't abuse machines. I have high hour machines (even VERY high hour) as evidence. I used this machine in the manner I would have any other. This undercarriage has serious limitations (just look in the manual) that would be a deal killer if I was looking for a tracked machine. Restrictions like no driving across slopes, or no turning on grade transitions. This would be a great machine for mowing lawns I guess but I digress. How can $5,600 in 40 hours be concidered anything but VERY high maintenance costs? BTW that money is exclusively an undercarriage cost. That's $140 per hour plus purchase price, normal PM costs of the machine, operator, overhead, and, if you dare, profit. It's unfortunate. I really liked the way the machine worked. It had a very smooth ride especially when you consider that it's a tracked unit.
That sounds to me like your CAT dealer was trying to put the screws to you and needs to have their head examined. I've always contended that CAT had no business puting a 257 on that undercarriage anyway because it'sa ton heavier than ASVs machines. I have the same undercarriage on my RC50 and I couldn't dream of incurring that much cost in that short of time and I've done a lot of the same types of work you have done. I have well over 2,000 hours on the machine and I know it hasn't cost me that much, and I've puchased new tracks and a few rollers. Typical CAT. As far as not being able to operate on a slope...my machine has a slope indicator that came standard on the gauge console and the ASV manual even rates it for slope work. It must just be a CAT thing.
Hi all I love a good debate on equipment ok I have a cat 247b and it has the ASV track system on it. When I got the machine it had 2303 hours on it I have put 50 hours on it as at the moment I only work it part time. In that 50 hours I have operated it on side slops run it up on stockpiles done sharp turns on concrete drives and asphalt roads ran it on crushed rock as well. As far as wear goes I would estimate the tracks would need replacing in around 800 hours and I will change all the rollers as well when I fit new tracks. The cost to replace all the rollers and the tracks from cat is $12000 now the cost per hour taking into account the tracks lasting 800 hours will be $15 a hour that’s not to much of a cost for a smooth ride. A tire bobcat would be cheaper per hour but its not suited to the work that I do. If I did most of my work on the roads then yer I would have a tire machine As for machines not needing maintenance thought out the year yer right I like to see that. All machines when they work need money spent on them that’s just a fact of life Ok now all track machines will wear regardless of wether its rubber and fibreglass as in ASV tracks or steel as in bobcat and the like it all depends on what the machine works in and how its operated. Just run a D6 in sand and see how long steel tracks will last” I can tell you it won’t last long “. Here is a pic of the tracks as they are at the moment the rollers have some chips on them and the tracks have a few nicks but it all works ok…
$15 per hour just for track repair!!!! thats outrageous!! you landscaping types need to hang around us farmers more often. people talk about maintenance and how important it is and stuff...i am here to tell you it is overrated. but i also own sweet machines that are awesome. for example, we have a 95 hp john deere 1997 7210 farm tractor. we do the work normal people would have a 150 hp tractor on. we put 1000 hours a year on in rough conditions and abuse this machine like you would not believe. i run it through the shop every spring and put all new filters on it and change the engine oil; the coolant and tranny fluid have never been changed (9000 hours on it). i guess i do change the engine oil again in the fall (so every 500 hours). otherwise this machine gets absolutely no attention the rest of the year. the tractor runs and drives like new yet. our total cost of ownership per hour for this farm tractor is less than $4 an hour!! oh, and i am currently in the process of turning up the fuel pump to get another 15 hp out of it, and im not concerned this is going to cause any problems even with 9000 hours on it. oh and the tractor has never been to the shop its entire life. thats what im talking about. not to mention our 1968 international 856 with 11,000 hours still has the original engine that runs like new, and original tranny and rear end, cost of ownership on that machine would be hardly anything.
Ok well I’m not a landscaping type at all as I said I only work the 247 part time on the weekends I will use it full time in the next few (hope) weeks as soon as my boss gets a replacement operator for me. My normal job is at the moment is working in a quarry operating a 35t excavator a D6 dozer and a 966 wheel loader most days I spent 10 hours a day 5 ½ days a week swapping between all of the machines. But that said I spend about 70% of the time on the excavator my operating hours for a year are about 2200 hours a year. Now the machines at the quarry have to be maintained the oil is change with the filters every 500 hours and the loader and the excavator are serviced between 3 to 4 times a year. The dozer maybe gets 2 services a year just depends on how many times we use it. With my own equipment it won’t work in the conditions that the bigger equipment that I work with do but that’s no excuse not to maintain it. Now on some farms you can get away with minimal maintenance but try that with a $300.000 excavator hm I don’t think so…
Must be good to be you. If everyone else in the equipment world was lucky enough to have your experience there would be no need for dealers....the factories would sell direct and since machines never breakdown, experience idiots operating and abusing them on a daily daily basis, need engine oil changes, hydraulic adjustments, etc. all the mechanics would have to go to medical school. It would be like ordering from the Cabelas magazine.
ah yes, well, my strategies are somewhat warranted based on my life experiences. first of all you have to find out what the good machines are out there and get those, even if they are the older model without all the bells and whistles. i always said farmers are the only people who are willing to pay a premium for the older model over a new model. i usually buy all my machines slightly used with only a few hundred hours on them. i always buy local and generally know the history of the machine. i have always liked getting the smallest of the biggest, not the biggest of the smallest models because most of the time they are overbuilt. as far as my maintainance strategy. it seems to me if you are going to have a catastrophic machine failure, changes are there is nothing that you could have done to avoid it. its pretty much the luck of the draw. i have had 2 tranny failures in 2 different farm tractors more recently. one was a case ih magnum 7120 and one was a case ih mx200. these were both early hour failures, before any maintainence was even called for. at the time neither of these machines were abused because we did not have any farm equipment large enough to work them. i think we did blow every hydraulic hose on the farm once we got the 7120 because the hydraulic pump was 3 times what our previous ih 986 tractor had. the reason i dont bother to change tranny fluid anymore is because... the tranny went out of the 7120 just after i changed the fluid $14000, the neighbor changed his tranny fluid at the same time in his tractor and had problems right afterwards. i changed the tranny fluid in the dodge truck (this was all years ago) and the tranny went the next day. did the same to the oldsmobile intrigue and the tranny went within a couple days. so i said hell with it...and have not had a problem since. i guess you could say i somewhat follow the owners manuals recommendations of machine maintenance, i just triple their numbers that im interested in and ignore the rest. our honda 4 wheelers get 3000 miles a year put on them, we run them to about 9-12000 miles, change the oil a couple times, and thats it. never have any problems with them, except for the electric shift shenanigans sometimes. i do use exclusively cenpeco oil and grease which i believe in. i drive my machines around 2000 hours a year between doing all the farm work like milking the cows and such. i like to run the fine line between respectuflly abusing my machines, and just being retarded. obviously if it looks like im going to snap the skid steer boom while im leveraging things around, i back off. if im experiencing power hop with a machine, i back off the throttle so as to not cause harm. a lot of equipment has grown on our farm, but the tractors have not yet grown with the equipment, so its not uncommon for me to pull around 35,000 pounds with a 12,000 pound tractor. most of the time the work i do in my tractor could never be done by an average operator. if im in the skid steer the rear wheels just have the tiniest amount of weight on them just to make it look like im not going to topple over forwards. and when im in the process of dumping the back of the machine comes off the ground, but only to bounce back down once the bucket is emptied. its how i roll, i work with what i have and get things done. i dont see why the purchase cost of the machine would matter much. obviously if your running your machines 24 hours a day they are going to need more maintenance. doesnt seem like thats the case since most ppl comment that they have 1 or 2000 hours on their machine.
A review of the new JCB skid steer by Construction Equipment Magazine http://www.constructionequipment.com/article/top-operators-can%E2%80%99t-defeat-jcb%E2%80%99s-powerboom
You have to give a little to get a little.....by making the entire side of the machine the entry door, it does put the handle a bit out of reach when you are sitting in the seat, but I was able to simply lean forward and reach the handle, and I am only 5'10". I don't think it was a "goof", I think that's just inherent of the design....and it is quite easy to grab the handle as you are still standing/getting ready to sit down. I wish I would have known you were there....I worked the booth (specifically the skid section) Tues. and Wed. all day....you must have just got the wrong rep! (even though I don't work for JCB). So, the million dollar question, what did you think of them? I'm not asking if you are ready to go trade your Case in on a new JCB, but what were your honest opinions on the machine build/quality/comfort/features/etc?
While it is true that they no longer offer the boom warranty as a "Standard" feature, it is still available (as you noted) for a nominal fee (either $250 or $350, i've heard both and not yet been confirmed on which is correct). Their thought process for this was that they were putting the decision in the customer's hands. If a guy feels that he wants the extra piece of mind of having the lifetime warranty, so be it. Otherwise, he can save himself a few hundred bucks. No matter how you slice it, no other manufacturer is willing to warrant their two arms for any price.
yes. and i have seen quite a pile of broken booms on hew holland and bobcat. no other brands are around.
I was trying to remember what day I was there talking to the JCB guys and I think it was Wends. I sat in the tracked machine with the mulcher on it. I am 6' and I could not reach the door handle on that machine. I am not saying that the machine is a POS because of that only that it should have been addressed before production in my view. The serviceablity seemed ok. I liked the cab layout. Having the door on the side allows for more of a wheel loader type layout of the cab which was nice. Fit and finished gave the impression that it was a quality built machine, at least in view. I don't question the boom strength. I think the warranty is necessary simply because of the way it is designed. It makes guys question its functionality and durability. The real question is how it runs. That I don't have an answer for.
i have decided that you are probably making too big a deal out of this door handle issue. there are very few machines where you can close the door from the seat without moving. dont make me start making crap out of the engineering flaws on your case machines, flaws that are a lot more obvious.
Fire away. Maybe before being a JCB fanboy you should actually buy one, then tell us all about it. I had more to say but I will leave it at that.
Easy now the main reason for this thread was to get opinions on how well the jcb rubber track handles its self on steeper ground like 25 to 30 degrees range not to argue .The steep ground issue is 80% of why i need a ctl but the only 2 that i have tried are cat 277B and the terex/asv pt80 both do very well but im not sold on the asv track yet but all of the ctl's with steel undercarrige seem to have alot of overhang past the bottom rear idler.I want to worry about the oil pump picking up befor i get light in the front it is very common for us to have to work on slopes that steep our last retaining wall job required us to carry all the block and all the gravel about 300 ft on 25 degree slope and at an angle just to get material to the wall .The slipping of the tracks was awfull on the asv that what i really dont care for about them its not the wear i think that could be fixed by installing the aluminum idlers and rollers.
ah. all i know is you can run our bobcat on any slope it will go on and never had a problem. u see i would buy a jcb skid steer, however, they do not make my size yet. so i have to wait. how bout the oil filter location on the 400 series. the fact that you have to stand on your head to work on anything. (clearly worse on case) the junk 420 engine. the huge pain it is to keep replacing the hydraulic hose that blows that goes under the engine. 1 piece of glass on the outside of the cab and one in the inside on the side of the cab. tiny cab. there is no reason for that. there is no way to argue that it is not too small. 1845 cab was fine... y did they have to make it smaller? "pressurized cab" on the 430 420 and 440 where you can clearly see daylight through the floor. cheap door handle foot throttle linkage that sticks on certain machines. axles that you have to grease. do you still have to crawl under the machine and take the access panel off to change oil?
I once owned a 1845C and loved it when i went to trade it on a new case 430 in 06 i noticed when i sat in the 430 in a normal position i could only see about 4' of 6' cutting edge without leaning way ahead that was definetly not the case on the 1845C maybe that issue has been addressed on the new ones i dont know anyway i ended up buying a cat 236B that day and ended up spending 2000$ less due the trade in amount given .Dont get me wrong i like case stuff i have cx31b exc and a 580L both of which i think are top of the line.
Do you want me to run down BC or JCB? I wont run down either one. I guess after 16 CASE skid steers you would think I would have gotten smarter by now. I mean with the cheap door handles and sticky foot throttle (really), grease the axles? All those JCB models and they don't make a model to fit you?
ah i would like you to run down both. see what the competition says about my machines. hey i have an open mind (thats why im open to jcb) i never considered case until one day i accidentally noticed that a 440 series 3 is fairly sweet. since then i have lost interest in case because their new machines are crap in comparison. no jcb is eventually going to have 18 models. their smallest machine built in savanah is the same size as a 435 or 250. too big. im looking to replace the s185. so how many hours do you run your 16 skid steers to? my brother in law has a case 465 and he has had a a lot of problems with it and he always complains about how slow the boom is. yes i dont see why you would need to grease axles on a skid steer. what a pain.
You 2 better calm down befor i come take both your machines and put ya in 80's model mustangs with a t handel controls and no doors or foot throttles hahaha
haha. ah we have been running bobcat machines since about 1970. never had a major failure unless the machine was worn out anyway. of corse, this was before i was born. i grew up running the 743 and 773. that new black vertical boom was the coveted machine at the time.
Dave, alot of what you wrote about the Case is nonsense. I know we all have our favorites but come on. It is your loss for not trying a Series 3 Case. I've had a 70XT, 440 and 440S3 and they all have been awesome. Have you ran a JCB?
Dave....maybe the problem just isn't the door handle. I'm sure that a poor dealer network is primarily to blame for JCBs poor market share in North America, but even Volvo sold more machines than JCB. They actually might be the best thing that happened to JCB in North America now that they are branding the JCB product. BTW..JCB sold about 250 units in the US in 2008 before the economy completely collapsed. Komatsu sold about 450 and they're pulling out of the market????????
250 units!!! Wow that is low. I would really like to check out a new one, but i have checked every dealer around here and on machinery trader. Nothing to be had or any reassurance that there will be one in this year to look at! With that said; how can a company sell a product successfully when a customer wants to look at there machine and cant. Most people that are in the market for a new machine would drive on down the road to a "stocking" dealer that has enough faith in there respective product to order machines to market to there customers. My feeling is that most (not all) JCB dealers dont have the faith in selling a new machine so they dont purchase any for dealer stock. I'm not by any means running down JCB but i dont know how someone could put them on the same level as a Deere, Cat, Case, Bobcat when (in several cases) they cannot offer the same package as the above mentioned manufacturers. There is not a comprehensive US dealer network for parts, service, technical info (at least not like the mainsteam US dealers). Nor is there any abundance of machines to choose from. I know for me if i am on the fence about buying a new machine and i am waiting to land the right contract i dont have the time to wait for the dealer to order me a machine and wait for it be shipped (with long lead times so i hear). I need the machine right now so i can make the money to pay for it. Once again i am not bashing JCB saying they make crappy equipment. Also, i am only referring to skid steers. No matter how much i liked the machine i would never buy one for the lack of support after the sale (i am assuming from what i wrote above) and the very poor resale value (that i know for a fact)
ah well for me there are 6 locations within 1.5 hours of me selling jcb skid steers. talk about sweet. a lot of the things i said about case i admit were trivial. but the argument was originally about the door handle on the jcb, dont see how something could be more trivial. well. jcb is in kind of a tough spot. the problem with selling in the US is the size of it. the first thing you need to have if your trying to enter a market is a good machine. jcb clearly couldnt have done a better job on their skid steer than they did. so the rest will probably come with time. i already said i liked the case series 3. but...if i buy one...and love it...what would i get to replace it?? if the 440 had a vertical boom and the 435/445/465/450 cab on it (quite a bit nicer) i would buy a couple of them and hope someone has something within ten years to replace it. the jcb skid steer plant in savanah is turning out skid steers as fast as they can, it will take more time to get some sitting around. dealers probably wont want to stock them because they know people usually go with what they know... and jcb is not it. its hard to convince people they want something when they are stuck in a rut. its not that the dealers dont have faith in what they are selling, its that they dont have faith people will be willing to buy it. i put jcb with deere, case, nh, etc because jcb has a worldwide reputation of making good machines and they are third in the world for machine volume on construction equipment. i dont see why volvo branding the jcb skid steer does anything, because volvo hasn't been able to sell their own skid steers.
Dave..JCB's biggest challenge in North America are it's poor dealer network and mediocre product reputation. I'm not opining on the rest of their overseas markets. Of course the factory in Savannah is busy...they now build all of their skid steers there...for all of the other overseas markets where they are stronger. It's not difficult to see why their production has increased because of this. I agree with you that Volvo is not strong in the compact market either; however, when you consider that Volvo sold substantially more skid steers (scat trak) in the US compared to JCB you can begin to see why JCB has an uphill battle. I'm not saying they won't be successful; they are a private company and they have deep pockets, but it will be a long road to compete with the bread and butter of the US skid steer manufacturers.
I will make one last comment on this. I mentioned the door because it was as obvious oversight to me.. Its not a matter of just leaning forward and grabbing the door as in a conventional machine but exiting the skid steer to close the door. As I said, it does not mean its a POS just that it seems like a silly thing to over look. Given how fast the JCB rep was apologizing for it, I obvously was not the first to notice. I don't think I have ever seen someone brag about or discuss as much about a product that you dont own or intend at least in the near future to own, or to my knowledge even ran. I find that somewhat odd.
haha. not only have i not driven one, i have not even seen one! do you want me to go to the local dealer and drive one around just to say i did? im sure they drive around just fine. well i never used to be much into skid steers then suddenly stumbled across this new jcb product, it was love at first sight. i thought to myself..."this is a machine that makes sense." all i had to do was see pics of the skid steer and instantly knew that it was revolutionary. i thought to myself, "there IS something better out there." the side entry has to be the best idea ever. the no screen on the sides has to be the second best idea ever. the visibility is clearly amazing. they are the only ones running pilot controls which is also amazing (besides the little kitty cats and terex wheeled skid steers). they have the most fuel efficient engine in the world, and wont need urea any time soon. they have a LARGE modular cab; and imagine how easy cleaning out your foot area would be (a half hour job at least on the bobcat) [acually i always wondered where all the debris goes in the case foot area?]. the rear door is heavy and protects the engine. the pins and bushings are huge in comparison to others. 50 hour grease interval with half the zerks. i see a lot that i like about the jcb skid steer and nothing i dont. its about time someone looked at the conventional skid steer and said, "but why?" the only thing that remains to be seen is if they are going to be as reliable (not talking about the boom). thats a chance i would be willing to take, (not like im taking a big chance given jcbs good worldwide reputation) not to mention they have a 2 year warranty. and the safety factor. i get out with the boom up probably 1000 times a year, im a little concerned some time it will get me. oh and insurance on a jcb is cheaper because of safety reasons. AND the jcb skid steer is cheaper to buy than the competition. when i look at a skid steer to buy, there has to be reasons to pull me away from bobcat. all i see with the case sv185 is a direct copy of the bobcat s185, so why not just go with the original.
I would like to comment on a couple things here... First is that every major manufacturer has supply issues when rolling out a completely new product. When you decide to design and build something from a blank sheet of paper, you aren't immediately going to run your factory at full capacity. JCB is no different than anyone else in that regard. The reason my new JCB skids and track loaders aren't here yet is the same reason my new Alpha Series Case Skids aren't here....hold on to your hats....yes, even Case had to push back their new skids. (I know some have shipped, but I still haven't seen the units I have ordered...) John Deere has pushed back their new 9000 series 4wd tractors what seems like a dozen times (partly becuase they can't get the emissions right, and partly for the reasons mentioned above). My point is that all manufacturers take their sweet old time when rolling out new product, I'm just not sure why you are singling out JCB. As a dealer, I have never had more faith in a product than I have in this new JCB skid. I think one of the reasons is because it is such a far cry from where we came from (on skids). I just can't wait to get them out to customers for demos because I am 100% confident that we can now compete against ANYONE. I've got quite a few coming for dealer stock, as do a lot of other JCB dealers. I agree that a customer sometimes can't wait to make a purchase, and I don't fault them in the least for that. But I can tell you I have several customers waiting on their purchase to see the new JCB. I've said it once and I'll say it again, our old machines COULDN'T compete with Deere, Cat, Case, Bobcat 90% of the time, and as much as that sucks to admit as a dealer, it was a reality. However, my job is to show people that these new machines are the real deal, and I've never been more excited to show a new product than I am for this one, so time will tell. Lastly, I agree 100% that if you don't have the dealer support, a machine isn't worth a whole lot, no matter what brand it is. I know (and so does JCB) that their dealer network isn't as strong as the "Big 3". That is a high goal to achieve, but also know this, there ARE good JCB dealers out there, and there are also poor Case, Deere, and Cat dealers too. Strength of dealer network is very high on their priority list and won't happen over night.
I think the point he was trying to make about finding a machine didn't have to do with how many machines the factory was now building, but instead the lack of machines in the field due to dealer apathy and lack of customer demand. I appreciate how you champion the product since every product needs that. Perhaps if JCB finds another 200 dealers like you they'll be on to something. I'm not saying that they can't do it, but I am saying that it will be a long hard road to get there, and they'll have to do it with all of the other OEMs fighting them every step of the way.
I agree 100%....
WV Earthmover, Have you contacted your local dealer? Don't know where in WV you are, but we're in Charleston. We have the dealerships in Charleston, Louisville, Cinci, and Indy. We've been a dealer for about 8 years now.
Yeah thats about 2 hrs from me. What the name of the dealer that picked it up down there.
MH Equipment. Where in WV are you? I live in Parkersburg. Seed me a PM for more info.