I ran across these 4 motors one day, turns out they was in a friends barn they was used to run generators in an industrial application, They have played with the idea of scrapping them but before that happens i want to start one just to see it run, the one I took pics of has been disassembled for some reason not sure why, the others are complete, They run off propane and start on compressed air....... I am sure I could figure it out but does anyone have any idea how to start one ? I planned on hooking up a BBQ tank just to take a short vid I cannot find one on the internet anywhere, does anyone know how to tell how old they are or any specs ? Pics don't do them justice, they are about 8' tall 15' long and 6'wide at the base Also does anyone have a use for them ? Otherwise they'll probably be scrapped sadly enough Pj
Hi, I have been a lurker on this site for several years now, as I enjoy reading about old equipment. I hate to see anything like this scrapped so I registered here to try and help save these engines. There is a forum for people that collect this sort of thing- http://www.smokstak.com/forum/index.php - if you would want to post this over there? Or, if you like, I could do that? Greg
There's an antique machinery club near me in Connecticut that might be interested in preserving one as well. They have several stationary engines housed in a building for display and most run. http://www.ctamachinery.com/
That's great Greg I would appreciate that, I did a little reading on smokestak but couldn't find anything specific to this, if you don't mind posting this over there in hopes to try and save one or all of these old critters I would greatly app it, on a side note Greg I cannot PM you my email addy until you get another post and activate the PM feature send me a msg when you do and I'll gladly reply Steve thanks for the link, would you happen to know anyone over at the club? They aren't going anywhere anytime soon they shut the place down about 10 yrs ago they was still running at that time. I don't know how we are going to get them loaded to be honest. The building was built around these motors we may have to remove some roof panels and crane them out...... I don't have a clue what they weigh, the flywheel is about 3' in dia about 9" thick. The compressor they used to start them is still operational, the other day I had air building up and was close to getting enough psi to start figuring it out and then my buddy got nervous and made me stop lol. Next time I'm there I'll bring a gas bottle with me and a video camera The only thing that is missing is the generators, the control panels are still mostly intact but thieves have gotten a lot of the wire out of them, however if someone needed a control cabinet or switches or etc, I'm sure they are getting pretty rare as well. On a side note I can't imagine what these consumed per day in LP but apperantly it was a lot because they have a large tank outside (my guess would be 2tanker loads) and the old timers say it was filled more than once per week on many occasions Check out the size of the press.....yes that's a beer bottle on the table if it gives you some idea how big it is, oh btw it's going in my shop I gotta spot cleared out for it already Pj
That thing with the four knobs on it is the governor looks like a Woodward UG-8. I have access to Cat literature on Cat diesels that use this same governor so if that would help I could try to email that info to you. You say these ran on propane so I'm guessing they are spark ignited and not diesel engines if so you need to get power to the ignition system. Should be very basic like an old Chevy or Ford. Would love to be there to help. Be sure to get a video of it!
Yes please do, I'll PM you my email in a second, Any idea what the extra lobe on the camshaft is for? The best I could tell it is what timed the compressed air in the cylinders for starting ? Pj
The old propane or natural gas engines like shown had 2 18mm spark plugs per cylinder with a coil for each and a magneto spiking the coils. They were generator sets the Woodward governor is the type used to parallel 2 or generator sets. That is all I can remember and that may way off. But the governor as kshanen posted is right it is hydralic
I knew someone at the club but I can't off the top of my head remember who it was! I'll think about it a bit, and try to contact them and find out if they have any interest.
Yair . . . . powerjoke Just another thought on that cam. Perhaps they used the same shaft if the engine came out in a diesel version? In that case the extra lobe could operate the injection pump . . . such large low speed engines usually had a separate pump for each cylinder. Looking at the pictures again though, the lobe looks to be lighter than the main lobes and you could well be right with the air-start suggestion. I seem to remember the English Mirlees diesels started with air just to #1. They had to be barred back to TDC on the hot stroke if they failed to run at first attempt. Cheers.
Not a Worthington, or quite as old, but here is a pair of 48 liter Natural gas V-12 Cats if anybody is interested. They close in a little over 12 hours. http://wisconsinsurplus.com/ Sheboygan WI
It's actually running a pushrod if you look carefully between the PR tubes you can see it, also on one of the lobes you can see a slight wear pattern.....
Nice looking G398! Any idea of what they ran? If I had a natural gas well in the back yard and a generator mounted to the back I'd be set! Front seal appears to leak a little, but that's no big deal. Think UPS could ship it?
Does it work a valve in the head, looks to be a very thin pushrod? Another wild guess, is it triggering the ignition system?
Nice looking G398! Any idea of what they ran? If I had a natural gas well in the back yard and a generator mounted to the back I'd be set! Front seal appears to leak a little, but that's no big deal. Think UPS could ship it?
It looks like they were running municipal water well pumps. I didn't call to find out the details (like if they could load these) otherwise I'd be hiring a flatbed to go over and pick them up. About $1,000 apiece right now, under $150/ton?
Re the Cat engines. We used to have a few of the diesel versions of these engines running gensets to power plants with no heavy AC power. Some V-12 and at least one V-16. The V-16, D399 was mounted on a flat bead trailer with an aluminium van type body over it. You had to duck down under air cleaners to get to the place to start it. Hand powered fuel priming pump and another hand pump to prime the oil system. After priming fuel and oil you heated the glow plugs for a couple minutes then hit the starter button to engage the two 36 volt 50MT Delco starters. Very impressive to be standing in that close area with all that power running. High idle speed was all of 1,200rpm but when you were standing there and a load was put on the generator and the twin turbos spooled up and the 8 foot fan was creating a wind storm in that trailer you knew this wasn't a weed eater you were standing next to! That was one of the few engines I ever worked on that you could remove a rod without pulling the pan or a head.
Years ago I worked with a bunch of Cleveland Diesels with distributed air start and they had an extra cam lobe for each cylinder. More than likely thats what these are for. The scrawny pushrod more than likely operates an air admission valve. By the way, those Clevelands took 450 PSI for a cold start,175 for a hot start.
a barbeque tank would be lucky to get the air purged from it. sure as heck will not start or run it. you need at least two 100 pounders spliced together to even try. see if you can get logged on to the wmstr site theres lots of guys there that will be glad to help. they have a HUGE 'snow' brand engine there that burns natural gas, four cylinders, two pistons, one connecting rod. 600 hp at 300 rpm. flywheel weights 18,000 pounds, it starts on air & has 8 spark plugs, magnetos etc, & they would be interested in these engines.