Looking at picking up a Case 850b track loader here locally. I've looked at the machine once already, and it looks good to me, FWIW. Having a diesel mechanic take a look at tomorrow. The loader arms have quite a bit of slop in them, several inches of side to side play. Everything else seems to be good, perfect UC, and purs like a kitten. Where should I be focusing my attention? Thanks ahead of time.
It's an early 80s model.
We all love images, take a look....
They are a good size machine around 75hp, and 20,000 lbs. and a 1.5yd. bucket. They made some changes in the later series, C/D to wet brakes and the cummins engine. The machine looks like it's had some paint, can't really see the track system, pin and bushings, looks like a loose pad on the rt and a little heavy wear on the rt sprocket, idlers have some adjustment left looking at the bolt stops on the truck frame. Your engine is a 336BD/BDT case. I would run it some and watch your gauges and oil levels. I would also check both final drive lube levels and note the condition of the lube. The machine has some age but still has life left in her, most will need some pin and bushings to tighten them up. I would do the two top loader arms and tower pins first and try to get some of the side to side travel out. The U shaped metal strut on the rt hand side with the two bolts is your service strut when working on the unit with the loader raised, unbolt it and place it on the lift cylinder rod while working or servicing with the loader up.
Thanks for the reply. I put the machine through its paces today for a good hour. It has a leak from what I believe to be the transmission / left final drive joint. Seems to be trans fluid leaking and the owner says he had it in the shop about 10hrs prior for the right side leaking and it was just loose bolts. I was not able to view the leak in the joint due to it being out of viewing ability. Is there an easy way to gain visual access to the left side of the transmission case where it meets the final drive? What would torquing them require? It has 'new' batteries that don't seem to want to hold a charge, even w/ the disconnect being used during being parked -- I suspect a charging system issue. Oil pressure cold is around 40 something PSI and moves up to the 60s or so full load. Maybe slightly less. All gauges work, and even after an hour of driving around and continually using all gears with many turns and pushing around a brush pile that could spin the tracks, it didn't seem to bother the machine too much. Never saw trans pressure get above 50% in the green. I also don't see any activity on the amp meter--all other gauges work. Alternators seem readily available if that route needs taken. The working hour meter registers in the low hundreds -- He supposedly only put less than 100 on it in 10yrs. The motor has no blowby and fires right up, even with weak batteries. The motor sounds better than my 3cyl 38hp Kubota diesel with only 400hrs on it. It's a n/a motor, and the airbox filter assembly cover is missing.....MIA missing, so I'd certainly need to find a replacement. It idles a little low I think and will surge when cold when the throttle is backed all the way off. Give it just a tap and it jumps to ~800 rpm and sounds perfect. I have no doubt it will take no less than $2500 to get it where I feel it needs to be but, that puts its price close to a newer 1155e about the same distance from here for not that much more. This old farm needs a couple hundred hours of track loader seat time to get it remotely where I want it. Loggers can be rather messy.
It is tight around the final, and you will have to remove the rear belly pan, counter weight, drawbar, loosen the front final mounting bolts. The final is pulled up to the trans case with shims in between to set the ring gear clearance. The studs are 1/2" and use 1/2 locknuts, the shims get coated with red lock-tite and compressed between the two housings and then the drawbar/ counter weight, front retainer bolts are tightened up. Trying to tighten it down with out loosening the other areas will not work and most times not removing the final and cleaning the two housing ends and applying new red glue will still have a slight drip or leak. You will have to bend up some wrenches for some of the nuts to tighten in frame. It's not a bad job. You may also get lucky and flip the seat, remove the batteries and plate and see a hose/ tube/ loader control valve leaking rather than the final. Your 1155e will have a cummins 6t-590 engine, around 120hp., weight around 25,000 lbs., 2 yd. bucket GP, biggest difference, weight/ hp./bucket/ counter rotation of tracks, and a lot newer.
Look closer at the rails, take a measure from any pin on either side to the fourth pin away and the same side of the pin, divide by 4 and you will have a average wear measure for the rails. Look at and feel on the bushings, see if they are wearing/worn, if the wear shows on up side away from sprocket as may have also been turned once. What I can see of shoes/pads someone has welded grouser or steel to them at the end original bars as were three bar shoes, could be many more hours on this machine than showing if has worn off the OE and now a second set of grousers on the pads. Rock it op on the bucket and roll the lower rollers by hand, should move pretty smooth and no extreme side play. If need to do under carriage anytime soon can get really expensive, shoes, rails, bolts and rollers sprockets, worn out rails can have a bad habit of rolling off when under hard working pressure as I am well aware of.
Take it from someone who has had both an 850B, and a 1155E. If the price is not that much different, go with the 1155. Because it's a heavier/more powerful machine, you'll be happier with the difference in its work ability. Like was mentioned above, the 1155 has a cummins engine, which is easier/cheaper to find parts for. You can find most engine parts at your local auto parts store. The counter rotation is a major plus when working in tight places like on pond dams, or in the woods. The 850 brakes were never really any good. They are acuated by master cyclinders and slave cylinders. On case machines, you don't have to use the brake peddles to turn, so the brake master cyclinders would rust up and stop working. The 1155 has wet brakes which are actuated hydraulically via the transmission control valve. Hope this helps.
I ended up getting the 850b. It needs a little work, but the engine was recently rebuilt and sounds good. Next weekend I have a buddy who works at a large truck shop and we're going to fix the leak on the final drive / trans case. I've got the bushings for the front half of the loader, 16 in total, inbound. Have a full set of filters inbound as well, and picked up 25gal of TSC Renew fluid to flush out the current. Suggestions on what to put in the final drives? The coolant looks good so I'm going to wait on replacing it. The loader doesn't like to perform both functions at once and I'm considering rebuilding the valves. The left brake needs adjusted as it requires slightly more distance to engage. The manual brakes don't even begin to work when fully engaged, so that needs attention. During the rebuild they just cut the wires to amp meter (only gauge not working) and I hope that information is in the service manual, which is also inbound. I really could use a larger machine - without a doubt. We'll see how this one goes. One of the shanks on the bucket are missing, any suggestions for replacement? Couldn't find a part number on them--and I see shanks for excavators, but I'm not sure of the fitment. Thanks for the input / ideas!
Ended up tightening the final to transmission nuts and that leak was stopped (they were rather loose). Fixed the brakes and a handful of other little issues, the manual brake was just missing a clevis pin and cotter pin, easy fix. Have another leak where a stud has backed out of the brake mounting plate. Found the stud/nut in the belly pan, hopefully putting it back in fixes the leak and I don't have to replace the o-ring. No oil is in the brake so I think the oil seal is fine. I changed out the trans fluid and the filters. This has caused the machine to report low trans pressure when warm. With all clutches in neutral, the pressure at idle is barely into the green, as clutches are activated the pressure drops into the yellow area. When throttle is given the pressure comes back into the green. Not sure if it's an issue, if it is should I look at the trans pressure regulator? The service manual is scarce of details regarding it. After changing the pressure filter in the trans, I noticed an immediate drop in pressure reported. Prior it was about 40% of green area of gauge, post it's 20-25% of the green area (this is when cold..aka 70 degrees f). Wish the gauge stated pressure, it would be easier to diagnose. Thoughts?
If you look in the center of the filter housing you may/should have a 1/8 pipe fitting, install a pressure gauge that will read up to a min of 350 psi. The pressure should be 270-290 psi at 2000 rpm. If you can check it at around 750-775 rpm and read the pressure, then at the 2000 rpm. The charge pump could be your issue more so than the pressure regulator. The reg can be shimmed for the pressure, but if the flow is not there you end up with a heating issue when you start pushing it hard and outside temps get warmer.
What kind/type of transmission fluid did you put in it? Never put any other type of oil in a Case transmission other than Case TCH Fluid, trust me!! I've had/have 3 Case loaders/dozers, and never had any transmission problems when running that fluid. If the pressure was higher before you changed the fluid, one...someone put a much thicker fluid in the transmission to make up for the lower pressure, or you may not of put the filter in the housing correctly. I would check it again.
Many months have passed, I had put it on hold for a few months while working with other things. I discovered they had put GEAR OIL in the transmission trying to cover up the leaks. It didn't do any good. I had only run it maybe 5 tach hours with it in it before I decided just to tear into it. Pulled off the brakes and completely re-did them. There were studs, bolts, nuts, and other such things missing. Replaced every seal in the torque converter housing (that could be done without removing it), trans input shaft, seals on the brakes (went with a large O-Ring on the brake mounting plates instead of the square o-ring from case) and replaced every o-ring I came across. Ended up using TSC Renew hydro fluid in both the trans and hydro. Trans pressure stays in the green zone on the gauge under use, at idle it's in the yellow portion of the gauge when the fluid is warm. Rebuilt a lift cylinder and replaced various o-rings in the hydro system. I believe in total there were 12 or 13 leaks, most with the trans. I put about 100hrs of work into it and have fixed all leaks but one. I suspect it's either the O-ring in the torque converter or the seal of the 'spinning housing'. It's a very small leak, and after 14 tach hours there is no discernible fluid loss. Had to turn up the fuel both at idle to fix the lope, and the 'high-speed' fuel delivery as the exhaust was always 'clean'. I could probably add more fuel under load as it just will not puff black. When it does produce visible exhaust, it's always light in color. I added 10 degrees of turn on the high-speed fuel screw and it has darkened it a little. I still feel like it's not enough though. It's burning just over 2gal/tach hr, which is low for the engine HP. Seems to have all the power it needs though, I can have the tracks spinning while using the hydros and it will stay up at RPM. I do think the spool assembly needs work. Seems like it's a pretty complicated piece of hardware based on the schematics. Anyone done any work on them? Would it be worthwhile to teardown and replace the o-rings in it? When I ran the engine with a lift cylinder removed, there was steady fluid coming out of the retract side on the lift circuit. It holds the loader up when running (and off for that matter) just fine, no noticeable leak down. I feel like it should have a little more capabilities in the lift and roll back. I don't have the required parts to hook up my gauge, I'm going to order the needed fittings to do it so I can't yet verify system pressure. Any tips or tricks in working with the control valves??
It sounded like the transmission fluid was probably gonna be the issue. Now that you've re-done the brakes, make sure and use them when you're using the machine. That's the big problem with the dry brake system on the older Case machines. If you don't use them they will start sticking and eventually stop working. It's so easy not to use the brakes as you really don't need to. As I stated in my earlier post, use Case TCH in the transmission on that machine and you'll be good. Have fun!
Just read up on this thread. I purchased an 850B this summer for work around our property,a walk out basement and various other items. As my machine had no brakes when purchased,I read this thread with interest.If I may,a couple of questions please ? I have no problems removing the brake assy for repairs,having been that far into the machine already to replace frozen non working brake cylinders as well as a broken hand brake cable. The question,the friction plates seem to be worn as the brakes are adj quite far out and still require nearly a push to the floor to work. Do you happen to have a plate thickness measurement,perhaps I could have them resurfaced locally ? Additionally,any other pictures you may have of the assembly would be great,the work you did looks great,and the clear pics should help with my reassembly. Thank You !
Don't have a measurement handy. I'd suggest a service manual, can be found on ebay. If there is too much travel until it engages, the arm with spring attached (also has the adjustment screw in it) can be removed by taking off the C clip and the arm turned 1 tooth. In the second picture, you'll see the notched shaft, left one is yellow and the right one is black. That C clip can be removed, the arm slid off and rotated down one more notch. Of course my yellow one is actually stuck onto the shaft which is why it's yellow as it was painted with the arm. I bought new aftermarket slaves -- $30/ea shipped. I painted just about everything I came across, including the new slaves, just to defer rust that much longer.
DMiller I have a 850 that looks like yours has the same setup for the cylinders and bucket I will be going through it over the winter trying to tighten up things that may have been looked over by previous owners.
I’m about to take my brake housing apart to fix leaks. I’ve never been inside a dozer wet brake housing. Can I replace both o-rings on the actuator shaft just by pulling the cover and snap rings? If so, how difficult is it to get the inner actuator lever splines lined back up?