Wondering if a 9 speed behind a Cat 3406 would work OK off road in a dump truck or would be a bad choice? Another truck has the MT 653 behind a DT466. Which would be a better combination?
I'm not so big on the MT600 series as I am on the more modern MD3000 series. Especially now that they are so old. Most of the dump trucks and mixers around here run stick shift and they seem to get around just fine. Other things being equal I prefer an automatic but in this case the 3406 seems more attractive, also, but there could be a whole lot of other factors.
The 653 behind the 466 is a good combo for a 5-7 yard dump. how big are these trucks? The 3406 and 9 spd could be iffy offroad with 10+ yards and say 3.73 gears. Might be a clutch burner with the wrong driver.
In my area it would be the Cat with a 9-speed. There are far more guys hauling dirt every day, day in and out, with a big spec truck (Cat, cummins, or detroit) and eaton trans, than you would find with the DT466. If your just wanting to putter around the woods 10-20 times a year, and don't have a lot of big truck experience, the dt466 and auto wouldn't quite have the learning curve, and will probably serve you fine. It's hard to really compare those two trucks, because they're so different. You either need a big truck to haul lots of dirt, or a little truck for occasional hauling (or limited access, or under cdl). Most guys wouldn't be choosing between those two- unless its just a $ amount your comparing. You're not loading 20 tons on the dt466 and making 20 runs a day. The dt466 isn't a $15,000 reman bill, like the big cat would be. To me its like asking should I buy chevy or a ford: the chevy is a 1/2 ton pickup, gas, automatic, because I get 10 sheets of plywood once a year at Home Depot, the ford is a 1ton powerstroke diesel dually flat bed 6-speed, because I pull a gooseneck loaded with a skidloader and our concrete forms, every day. They're both pickups, but they have totally different applications. I think both engines would be fine with they're respective transmissions, but they are totally different beasts, I guess you need to decide which type of beast you need.
They are both tandem trucks. I'll be using the truck off road to haul sand from my neighbors yard and clay to build up a road at my MX track. I won't be using it when conditions are too wet and muddy. It won't get a lot of use but will haul twice as much as my 5 ton Topkick and have a proper dump body (Topkick has a grain box that is too light and way too slow). I'll use the Topkick as a water truck. Both trucks were at an equipment dealer but are going to auction. The asking price before the auction was $12,500 for either one. Here's some details. I really value the experience the members on here have. The IH appears to have everything that I'm looking for but would need to repair the floor boards in the near future. Not sure if other bidders will lift floor mat to check for rust. I'm hoping to get a truck for $10K or less for the amount I will use it. Thanks for all your opinions! 1991 IH 4900 DT466 with MT 653 (didn't see engine tag but looks and seems most likely a DT466) Pro's Runs really good, shows 830,000kms (515,000 miles) engine is clean with no leaks or major problems I could see, doesn't leak air Less learning curve and easy to put other drivers on Box is close to cab so more maneuverable Standard PTO and hoist arrangement Wide front tires Hendricksen suspension but don't know rating Less costly to fix Less fuel use Cons Body is good but floor boards in cab have rust. Rust appears to be confined to the floor boards so could maybe just fiberglass floor boards for an easy fix No tailgate, has an angled piece on back that would be cut off, could make a tailgate 1994 Ford L9000 3406 (didn't see engine) with 9 speed, former plow truck Pro's Runs really good (speedo changed so don't know actual mileage) Not a lot of rust, some by bottom of throttle but couldn't lift floor mat to check(floor mat in good shape otherwise) Heavy spec, 16K front axle, 40K Hendricksen rears Likely well serviced when a plow truck Has air trip tailgate Common for used parts Cons Front mount pump off crankshaft Space between box and cab so less maneuverable Higher learning curve and harder to put other drivers on Doesn't have granny low gear(s) Could hear air leaking slightly in cab after shut off More expensive to repair More fuel use Some cracks on hood
I'd go with the Ford for a multitude of reasons. That 9 sp. will have exactly the same low gear ratios of a 13 sp. of the same vintage. Off-road, the auto might be a bit more desirable, but that 3406 is a hell of a lot more engine than the DT, and you have 4 more gears to work with. You will love the live hydraulics, and if you ever want to spread gravel, the airgate is a must. Last, but not least, that Ford is twice the truck of that 4900, I'd bet the IH isn't even double frame.
I agree with Shimmy. You will be getting more truck for the money with the Ford. A little curious why the front mount pump is in the 'cons' list? We have an older Ford LN8000 with a front pump and I love it. I just leave it engaged when doing short hauls or on-site work. Just my $.02
Thanks guys! I thought most people would prefer to have a PTO pump. There was another guy I met who was looking at one of the newer dump trucks and he suggested the Ford too because there was nothing to fix. Maybe I'll go back tomorrow and check them out a little better. The Ford is the 1st one going up at the auction. I guess it's good I looked under the floor mat. The IH is double frame. I was a little curious why the price wasn't higher for IH. I put some pics up of the trucks in an earlier post. The place that had the Ford put new front tires on it. I could have went earlier in the morning and bought it but they weren't into any negotiating. I offered $7500(+5% GST) figuring they'd have to get 10K at auction to net them more money but they said 12K so I figured that was too much considering they had it for a while listed at 12.5K. The other guy figured either truck should go for under 10K. Hopefully this link opens to show the Ford. It has new front tires and half the back tires and they painted the box and wheels since the photo's below. Most of the description is wrong in their add. I'll have to double check it has a 3406. LoL There was no one around to help me lift the hood and I didn't want damage it on the frame around the pump. I'm guessing it might sell for about 9K. Would up to 10K be a good deal? http://www.alaskanequipment.ca/heav...MP+TRUCK-e5a1b2120a0e08bd0f0122b0c519e7b0.htm
According to the description in the link the ford has a 15 speed trans. If that is correct then you will most likely have plenty of low gears on the low range of the transmission.
That description is wrong. Just about everything is wrong actually. It is a Ford but I can't even say for certain it's a 3406. I think it might be but the hood was too stiff to lift myself. I'm think I'm going to go take another look.
The Ford snow plow truck may have a heavy hood because the pivot hinges are rusted from salt and corrision. I broke both hinges on my old snow plow truck after fighting the hood a bunch of times.. There's a reason they painted it. They are normally salt and choride eaten up bad by the time they are put to pasture. I have had my one and only former plow truck. The Allision on mine leaks thru the rear casting because of the corrision to the aluminum from the road salt.
They don't use a lot of salt in Alberta like they do in some other provinces but I thought it could be a little rusty too or need some lube. It didn't look real bad. I didn't want to reef on it too hard because I wasn't sure if it would hit the bumper around the pump. I wouldn't think you'd have to take the grill off to open the hood.
On my old front pump 8000 Ford the grill stays stationary with the radiator and the hood tilts open around it. Probably as many options as there was pump installers over the years.
Went back and checked out the trucks again since they're pretty close. The rust in the IH hasn't gotten to the floor supports underneath but is rusted pretty good under the floor mats. Rusted through on the panel about 4" wide beside the door. The Ford doesn't have a 3406. It has an M11-310 Cummins. Nice and clean, no leaks. It started right up ran about 30 seconds then quit. Not sure why but started up again and ran really good, 70 PSI oil pressure. Someone else started it a little later and noticed the check engine light was on. Not sure what all would cause the check engine light to come on. I've the heard the M11 is a great engine so I think that's the truck I be more interested in.
A friend of mine runs 4 IH 4900's with DT466's and Allison autos. They are setup with 20ft silage boxes and get run off road 50% of the time or better. Good trucks, basic but good. However it's one motor problem after another with them and each truck goes through a motor every couple years. To light of a truck and drivetrain for the work but it's what they have, especially for being used hard and loaded heavy while offroad. The motors and transmissions make to much heat running WOT at 5mph next to a chopper or loaded going across a field and it gives them a pretty short life span. I think I'd go for the Ford for what you are looking to do.