buddy barry's other grader which is a rental machine came back with the frog woren off the moldboard. a quick call to jade in edmonton and the new frogs arrived. so on monday i'll be welding them on the moldboard. any tips on this???? also the grader is a 1996 740a champion. thansk KoO Published Author
Ya Right ! ....been dare done-dat ..... Had that issue a few years ago ... thought no problem, hust crank it up and stick it back on WRONG Had the frog break off on my exc dig bucket , when I welded it back on it wasn't to long before it broke off again .... ... :Banghead Got a hold of Weldco Beales Manufacturing and asked whats the trick ... :beatsme They sent me 8 pages on the science of welding frogs Long story short, it came down to: ...:cool2 HEAT both the frog and the surface to be welded onto, to the point of when you spit on it the spit EXPLODES or dances on both ( you'll get the drift when U see it ) Until then don't even think about welding them together ! When its ready pour the 'OL 7018 to it and it'll stick for ever If a guy wants to get fancy he could use the supposedly better 223, but as the old timers say, can't beat the 7018, its way cheaper ( even Princes-auto has it ....LOL) and its easy to use, and puts up with alot of crap Did that about 6 yrs ago and everything else has broke but not the Frog Good luck ! ...... an' Cheers :drinkup
What's a frog?
Its the bottom of the moldboard where the bolts are. Sorry..had to throw that picture in there..lol
thansk guys, i have a better picture of the frog and how it is worn down plus a sot of the 2 piece frog to be welded in. thansk KoO Published Author
A frog??? You grader people sure are, um...different, G4m. :yup Ok...so where's the 'possum on a grader? :lmao
preheating and post heating should be applied to any high stress area, especially anything to do with GET... I see the effects of failure to preheat ALOT, and I'm still amazed at how many trained boiler makers/welders don't follow the correct procedures.
Thanks G4me you taught me two things: 1. What to call the base of the blade (it was written on the new part so I don't think y'all made it up) ... and more importantly... 2. I'm not the only smartass on here:notworthy
HEY!! Railroaders have frogs too!
Personally, I would call it a sole-plate.
LOL...I know but I just can't help it! Its the section of comebobbulatermishap that attaches to the sionoctic solenoid. You didn't even know that? lol On a serious note...its really a shame that an operator (or should I call them that) wears the blade out and gets into the "frog". Just plain stupid...Going to take alot of work to fix that... Looking at the pictures...probably the guy was just keeping an eye on the outside edges that he could see from inside the cab. The center in most cases will wear out first. Just have to get out and check it once in awhile....
You kiss it, and when it turns into a Prince, you change him ... :beatsme
Reverse yor edges for maximum wear Being an owner operator, I look to get the absolute most value out of GET's, so I keep a good eye on how far the edges are wearing & usually reverse the edges when the centre is wearing. By doing this I can wear them down to an even 10mm left & give them to friends with drag buckets that use grader edges upside down as cutting edges (the top side is still sharp).
I agree that would be the best way to do it, but if the center is worn down quite a bit more than the ends, and you reversed the blades the center would catch before the ends. Make it harder to grade a road until they evened up. But...if reversed when wear in the center is noticed then it would work great. When my blades start to wear in the center I put them on the grindstone to even them up. Grindstone = pavement...lol
I agree. I also use 8" cutter edges because I throw away a smaller percentage of the part versus 5". I can't imagine doing that to a moldboard. But I guess that's what you get with rentals.
I've stopped mid-day and reversed my edges so I wouldn't end up with that problem. I'll swap 8" edges 6-8 times in their life.
I had to laugh because that is what I was thinking.The pic done it.
At times you can see the Possum on the Grader under a shade tree asleep.Some call it an operator.
Frogs? I couldn't for my best figure out what you guy's where talking about. Welding stuff to the moldboard? I kept my fingers far away from the keyboard. Still i dont se the problem... Check out our setup; to reach the moldboard u got to sleep very loong and grind it for a long time.... (pic taken when new in 2007)
I'd take a bet thats what everyone was thinking...lol..course had to be me that threw in the pic...:naughty
Yea but you know the old saying? It's a tough job but sone body has to do it.
Bah ha ha ha ha. The Possum.
A possum is that little man that crawls around on a grader and fixes em!:lmao
thansk guys, i have been very busy so the mold board got as far as this. i hope this long weekend to have the time to work on welding the frog on becasue everyone will be at the cabin fishing, LOL. thansk KoO Published Author
it was a good day on the frog. i took my time and got the brackets all ready for bolting the new frog on for welding. it took a lot of time and measuring but when it was done it worked out. now on a nice rainy day this weekend, i'll be welding non-stop. the little forklift sure is handy for doing all the lifting. thansk KoO Published Author
I used to swap them out too but taking an hour or two to do that wasn't very profitable. I've switched to carbide impregnated edges. On the second year and still are straight and no more swapping edges. Rotate them in the spring and good to go for most of the year. There expensive but so is all the time it takes to switch edges.
pavement works great until you start a ditch fire on a hot sunny day. been there done that.:Banghead
Ha ha.. good lord..can't say that has happened to me...lol. I would usually give them a little rub first thing in the morning on my way to the job. Really doesn't take much grinding to keep them even. Now..this is what I used to do..I wouldn't encourage any new operators to think this is an acceptable practice. When meeting vehicles I would lift the blade or when a vehicle was following me I would lift. Remember that I live in a rural area with little traffic so I could get away with this. I had to keep my blades as even as possible at all times. I might be grading then have to shift to leveling asphalt on the same day. Very hard to do a good job on asphalt with the center worn down. But..as biggrader said...things can go wrong when doing this.
nobody ever noticed the scrape marks?
I wouldn't put much pressure on the blade, and any scrape marks that was left were gone in no time. Think of it this way..when you are shouldering how long does your scrape marks show?
Great thread. I've been thinking about swapping sides on the cutting edges and so after reading the post, I went out and did it. I noticed that the wear on the right side was more that the left. Guess I favor cutting material right to left. Wonder if would be different in the southern hemisphere? I'm thinking that I need to shim the circle and moldboard up now, am I asking for trouble?
let us know what machine u run. the expert's here will help you. try and keep them set right or you will have some awful pinion wear. I've seen some pretty loose ones in my life. Maybe even one of mine. ointhead
tightning up the circle I'm running a Deere 570A, taking care of 5 miles of small road. I can see about .2 inch between circle and topside wear plates with the blade up in the air. I also noticed some play between the moldboard slide rail and guides when I pick up the blade. I haven't noticed any wobble in the circle drive gear when rotating the blade. Being somewhat obsessive I have been going through the machine and cleaning up some of the issues that happen with old machines. I thought I might attempt tightning up the draw frame unit during the summer but have don't know what I'm getting into other than some big bolts and heavy steel. I have some tools, tech and parts manuals. Is this a job that I should leave to the pro's? Forget about it and run as is? I would appreciate some advice from those who have been here and done that. -Bob
i started welding at 1pm and finished up non-stop at 12 am with lots of pre-heat and 46 lbs of rods. the frog turned out perfect for first time ever doing this. i would like to thank the guys of the BBs for helping out and making my life in the great white north a lot easier. the grader is ready to go out on the job and everyone laughs at why i painted the moldboard when the gravel will only wear the paint off. i told them it has to look good for the pictures, LOL. thansk again for the help. thansk KoO Published Author
Just made a frog repair over the winter....but had no idea it was a frog that we fixed. Was just the bottom lip of the moldboard until now. We use a long heavy table when we make this kind of repair. Put the cutting edge side down and get yourself 3 bottle jacks and some chain. Place the bottle jacks at both ends and the center. Tie the chain down to the table and across the bottle jacks. Place a small piece of 1/4" flatbar in the center and jack them all down tight. Welding has a tendency to bow the moldboard back. By placing a piece of flatbar under the center and then jacking the bottle jacks down tight you place a bow in the moldboard in the opposite direction. Weld in sections and allow to cool. Remove the bottle jacks and it should be straight. Hard to explain so if you want pictures I will have my guy stage one and try to get some photos.