Hey everybody. I have an old 1960s m444 skid steer that needs an engine. Can anyone tell me what engine I can use or a we'd side to look at. One side drives the mechanical drive and the other runs flywheel, fan, and hydraulic pump. Tho this engine needs electric start, and a way to couple the hydraulic pump to the recoil/fly wheel/opposite side as drive clutch. Any help?
It came with a 15hp onan twin opposed
I have seen guys weld another shaft out the recoil side on kohlers check some of them out in the power range your looking for and see what will fit in the housing.
That is interesting, I will check that out. What would be the cheapest 20 +-4 HP with electric start that you guys have come across?
I have gotten small engines from smallenginewarehouse.com and from Ebay. You would probaly be better off having some one with a lathe drill and tap a shaft as long as the load keeps it tight.
I am in the process of repowering an old M444. I've done a lot of leg work and I can help you quite a bit. I found a lightly used Vanguard 18HP engine locally and I'm in the process of performing the installation. I would suggest you stay away from anything Onan. They've stopped making parts for these engines and there isn't much available online. A newer more modern engine with electronic ignition will serve you better. Some adaptation and ingenuity are required to complete this job. It's not that hard - like working on an overgrown riding lawn mower, really. A cut of no thinner than 3/16 sheet metal to bolt into the frame, some 3 inch square tubing stock to get the Vamguard shaft up to the required height, and then decide how you want to rig your hydraulic pump and drive your belt. I decided not to use the variable speed drive with the newer engine. Rather, I bought an old snowmobile secondary clutch online with a shaft bore that matches my vanguard engine (1'' with a 1/4 keyway.) ill have to remove the spring clutch mechanism and just bolt the sheeves together with spacers (set at one speed that is acceptable for working around my yard.) you could hire a machinist to get your new engine shaft adapter to fit the variable speed drive system - to me it's just one less thing to fail me down the road so I did away with it. On the flywheel side you'll need to power your hydraulic pump. You'll need a stub shaft adapter to bolt to that side. Make sure you get an engine that has one of these available. Koehler or Vanguard are your best bet. Check out ebay and make sure the stub shaft adapter is an exact fit. Once you get some sort of shaft out that side of the engine you'll need to figure out how to rig to your pump. Use as much of what is currently on the old engine now. likely you'll have to do some measuring, cutting and welding. Go YouTube and see farmerphil's video "bobcat engine swap." This will give you an idea of what you can expect with a repower. His bobcat is a 610 so the hydraulic pump was attached to the original Wisconsin engine. He had to mount another hydraulic pump onto the crankshaft side, which you and I do not have to do. It's a great video though and it'll give you some inspiration in keeping this great old American machine running. Hats off to anyone keeping these historic pieces going. I'll have a fully informative video up when my repower is complete, probably in a week or 2. Feel free to contact me if you have any questions. I'll help if I can. gc
I had an M444 that had been repowered with a Kohler K532, it worked very well. I'll see if I can find some pictures of it as I had to tear the engine down for rebuild and I know I took a bunch...
i almost bought a real old bobcat that was repowered by a 20hp chineese yanmar copy it was pretty cool and seem to run decent not sure how long it would last but according to the guy any yanmar part will fit the china replica from injector to rods and pistons
http://onanparts.com/
Ok, so I found some pictures of the Kohler installation in my old machine. Some are with the engine installed and some with the engine removed. I really liked the Kohler engine in there, the only issue was that the drive sheave piston stuck out the left side of the machine so far that there was only about an inch of clearance between the hydraulic fitting on the end of it and the left rear tire. Otherwise it worked like a charm and had great power! I have more pictures if you want 'em, these here ones were the better ones...
Update: Rigging of the hydraulic pump to the flywheel side is as follows: Stub shaft (attached to flywheel) then lovejoy coupling to hydraulic pump shaft. My stub shaft is 1'' with a .25 keyway; my hydraulic pump shaft is 3/4 splined with 11 splines. You can buy the coupler jaws seperately to fit each size then assemble the coupler with your rubber star in the middle. The whole rig cost me about 50 bucks at Surplus center: http://www.surpluscenter.com/Power-Transmission/Shaft-Couplers/3-Piece-Flexible-Jaw-Couplers/
Interesting thread! I have an M500 with a bad Kohler 662. I have acquired a Kohler Command 25HP V twin for it. Watching this thread for any pointers that may apply to my larger machine....
I don't believe your 500 is any larger than the 444. In fact, most of the non-engine parts seem to me interchangable. I'm sure your Command Pro will be more than adequate, so long as you have the correct stub shaft and couplers for the flywheel side. I already took my machine for a test run with the 18HP Vanguard and she goes like hell. I'll have a video up soon. gc
I agree.....I think the 500 was mostly a bigger engine than the 444. I have watched vids on youtube on clutch removal and overall they look like fairly simple machines to maintain. I see complete Kohler retrofit kit engines offered for the 500... They include some special parts and a flywheel side stub shaft. Of course the price is about $1800! I have a machine shop, so I will be making the adapters myself. Can't wait to see the video!
M444 repower I finally got her up and running! The engine I installed is the Vanguard 18HP. It is almost new with about 15 hours on it. I picked it up from a guy on Craigslist who purchased it online for his Jaguar mower. He paid $1100 for the motor and then the transmission on the mower let go. He sold the engine to me for $750, as he had no use for it. I have to say I am really impressed with the 18HP. The machine is much more agile than with the old Onan 25Hp (which, blowing oil and stalling out all the time, was probably giving me 12HP.) Anyway, here is the video. Hope this helps! http://youtu.be/r2fEUwRCnoY
Great job and great video!