Ok let me throw this out here, as I was asked. Any problems with just using syn. engine oil in the winter & regular oil in the summer ?? I myself use Rottella syn. yr round.
There would be no problems at all. Synthetic and petroleum oils are fully compatible. I'm just wondering, why not run syn. oils year 'round? Syn. oils have a much greater resistance to thermal breakdown that you would see during the summer months.
I know several guys that run Rottella in the cold for easier start ups.
Like I said I run it yr round. But a fellow excavator looking to save a dime & was looking at running it only in the winter.
NOT a problem whatsoever switching in the winter.
Even though I'm a die hard Schaeffer fan, the reports I've heard indicate the Shell syn is a very good product as well. I think even hot rod magazine touted it as being excellent for cam wear in high performance apps.
Ive been running the Rotella syn in my Dodge/Cummins pickup,and it starts MUCH easier than with conventional oil. I rarely plug in,and i never have ap roblem.I also switched my old Ford 1910 tractor to it for the winter,so it starts easie when loading my salt spreaders in the winter,it too never gets plugged in,and starts MUCH easier.
One of the biggest , if not the biggest, advantages to synthetics is the ability to handle temperature extremes. Both cold and heat. Most know that 80% of engine wear occurs at start-up. Cold flow properties are very important, in the cold, so to speak.
I use the Schaeffer 9000 5W-40 in my Unimog and owe it's ability to get cranking in the cold to the oil. I have a VW Tdi that wouldn't start this AM, the Redline 15W-40 is just too thick for temps in the teens. Needless to say it will soon be changed to the Schaeffer.
You can use synthetic year round 5w40 premium diesel oil which has a -44deg. to +486 deg. range. check out the info through greensynthetic.com I use this in my 6.2 GMC and 190D 2.2L they turn over way faster in the winter with no heater needed. They don't evaporate in the summer either.
I have been using the castrol syn in my truck I could see the difference the moment I put it in have had no problems starting this winter with no plug in.
Syn oil Stay with syn oils year round. What hours do you put on the equipment in the winter? Would it need an oil change in the ??? spring are there more hours that could go on the oil? Would your summer oil have to be changed early with the hours on the oil? would this leed to short hours on summer oil with the cost of it? Having to stock two engine oils or have to top up either?
Premium synthetic diesel oil ( DEO ) by Amsoil inc. 5w-40 has a Caterpillar ECF-3, and ECF-1. Normally it is changed once per year on average 10-12,000 miles or longer with oil analysis at oaitesting.com . Inquire through www.greensynthetic.com and click the amsoil product links. On the right be sure to see the product guides which will build a list of oil and filters plus for your equipment - there better than the parts store books. Thanks for your inquiry, Dieselnich
The only thing to be careful off that I am aware of is putting it in high mile/hour engines. They sometimes will have false seals in them. Basically the seals/gaskets are gone but it does not leak because it is sealed up with gunk. Synthetic oil cleans an engine far better then conventional oil does and will clean out that gunk producing a leak.
Brian, down under, we used to call synthetic oils "hi detergent" and they will create leaks and compression blow-by in old engines for sure. I liked running a single grade of oil for everything had, so I chose straight 30grade for our Queensland climate. I used oil from Mobil who supplied Cat dealers under a different brand (& more expensive). I used it in 3306 Cat engines, transmissions and hydraulics with no problems. I also used it in Utility work vehicles and even the wifes car. Thus all the oil came from a single source. Life's pretty simple if you make it so..........C ya...........Ray
I would recommend using a synthetic and changing the oil based on oil analysis results, not engine or operating hours. Oil analysis is the best way to know what's going on inside your engine. It will point out problems like: a coolant leak, dirt ingestion, wear metals, fuel dilution, soot levels in diesels, oxidation levels, nitration levels, additive levels and numerous other items depending on the level of test you pay for. I always give my customers all the knowledge and information I can on the benefits of oil analysis, as it provide you the customer, owner/operator the most economical oil change intervals and preventative maintenance program money can buy. Most oil sample kits start at around $10.00 for the very basic, and go up to around $30.00 for the most advanced. This is money well spent, so please consider it. Thanks, John
Newer Diesel and gear boxes. One thing thing to add, new automotive diesel engines require synthetic oils. VW Jetta & Jeep Liberty uses Mercedes diesel 0-40 synthetic oils. Also my sheet pile hammer requires synthetic oils, change 40 hrs. if non synthetic oils change 8 hrs. plus the synthetic oils are less foaming. So the synthetic oils go 5 times longer in the pile driver gear box is I run synthetic oils in all drill motor gear boxes now because of the non foaming and added life. But how much of the synthetic oil is actually dino-petro oil if any?
Synthetic is expensive for equipment that is in steady production. Regular oil will perform as well, and is cheaper. Now if you have starting problems, synthetic may be good for the cold weather, but I'd go back to regular oil in warmer times. If one uses synthetic for steady production equipment, an oil sampling program is a must as the oil has to be run longer to try to make some of the increased cost worth it. The sample results will indicate to you when it is time to change. Do not use synthetic oils in Detroit 2-strokes. Do not use multi-vis oils in Detroit 2-strokes.
Darryl, Greetings, you bring up a good point on using the proper oil in today's new diesel engines. The VW requires a oil that meets the European specification. My neighbor is a VW mechanic and said his sees problems all the time with sludging in the VW oil pans that plugs the oil pump pick up tubes. He said the problem is people are running a conventional 5W-30 engine oil vs. a synthetic that meets the VW spec. On your drill gear box, I'm curious what you run for oil, and if have ever done oil analysis at 40-hours. You are most likely saving money on buying the oil if you can go 40-hours with synthetic vs. 8-hours with conventional oil. I know that with most of the AMSOIL oils, the break even on price is typically 2.5 to 3 times the run time or miles. In your case you are going 5 times longer. If you don't mind, please send me the oil specification and equipment application. I have a local company that does geo-piering and they have expressed interest in synthetics as they are having to perform $40K overhauls on the machines prematurely. They are pushing the machines and realize that comes at a price. Maybe I can provide you with an other synthetic option that may reduce the heat, reduce the wear, reduce your cost and keep your machine in production with longer fluid drain intervals. Thanks, John
I am using Chevron 75-80 synthetic in Pile hammer & Drill Drives. The problem with drill drives is there is no place for the wear particles to go but into the lower bearing.
Surprise I just drained the jeep 2.7 merz. diesel the synthetic oil was just as black and bad as it gets. I think part it's the dam small oil pans on these engines. That's only like 77 hrs. I wonder what is going on to get the oil so dirty. I have had my mechanic doing the oil changes so I didn't know what the other changes looked like. The recommended is 12,000 miles /60 = 200 hrs. With oil like I am changing I doubt the engine would last very long. Like I say 100 hrs. the heck with recommendation. I will probably use 3000 miles / 60 = 50 hrs. that because of the small oil pan 6.4 quarts. That's what we try on the 5.9 Cummings 7 quarts 3000 miles and that is 15/40 Delo non synthetic oil and it still looks good when it's changed. You would think that with this ULL sulfur diesel that we would see some improvement in the drain oil condition. So I pose the question again what is the real difference in dino-petro oil and synthetic, how much if any dino-petro oil is in synthetic and is it just the additive package in the synthetic oil?
What is the difference between conventional oil and full synthetic oils? Darryl, The difference in dino-petro oil and a full synthetic is that dino-petro oil (conventional oil) is pumped from the ground. A full synthetic oil is engineered and formulated in the lab, and is not pumped from the ground. The lube engineers and lab techs take a molecule from grain, a molecule from a fatty acid and a molecule from propane and depending on the application formulate a specific lube molecule similar to a hydrocarbon molecule. The big advantage to a full synthetic oil is it contains no impurities like conventional oil. Conventional oil that is pumped from the ground contains impurities like: paraffin wax, sulfur molecules, nitrogen molecules, tars, and other items that are not desirable in a lubricating oil. The paraffin is what gives conventional oil the poor cold flow properties. In order to get the conventional oil to flow, a lot of viscosity improver additives have to be added. A conventional 15W-40 diesel oil will flow down to around -18 to -24 degrees below zero. A full synthetic diesel oil like AMSOIL will flow down to -48 degrees below zero. By being a pure base stock free of impurities like sulfur and nitrogen, the oil can be ran longer. It is more resistant to acid formation, oxidation and nitration tendencies. It will handle more heat, and will not coke or form carbon like conventional oils. There are many more differences I could cover. If you would like I can scan in some of my training literature and handouts and email them to you. After reading through them you can call me or email me with any questions. Be careful as there are a lot of hydro-cracked and iso-dewaxed conventional oil out on the market stating they are a full synthetic. Some liberal judge allowed this to happen. Ask your lube rep what base oil category his oils are. If they are a Group 1 base oils are the least refined. While some automotive oils use these stocks, they are generally used in less demanding applications. Group 2 base oils are common in mineral based engine oils. They have fair to good performance in most areas. They are conventional (dyno) oils. Group 3 base oils are highly refined mineral oils. Although they are not chemically engineered, they do offer improved performance in a wide range of areas. By definition, they are considered a synthesized material and can be used in the production of synthetic and semi-synthetic lubricants. Group 4 oils are polyalphaolefins (PAO) which are chemically engineered synthesized base stocks. PAOs offer excellent stability, molecular uniformity and hence improved performance. On your gear boxes, do they have any yellow metals (bronze bushings)? Does the OEM call for a GL-4 or GL-5 spec gear oil. I'm thinking a 75W-90 would perform fine. If you are having a lot of wear in the gear box and heat, a synthetic gear oil would have a higher film strength to keep the metals apart. AMSOIL offers gear oils in 75W-90, 80W-90, 75W-110, 75W-140, 190 and 250 SAE. AMSOIL has assisted a lot of customers with gear box and differential issues. If you are partial to a particular brand of oil, I would recommend seeing if they offer a fully synthetic product. As for no filtration on the gear boxes, a simple solution might be to install additional magnets that would capture and hold any wear metals. They can be removed during service to see how much wear is occurring and will prevent the wear metals from running around through your gears and bearing. I've done this on gear boxes, transmissions and sumps. You would be surprised what they will catch. When using conventional oils you will find more fine metals on the magnets than when running a good full synthetic oil. Hopefully I have answered you question somewhat, there are many more areas that PAO oil out perform conventional oils. Thanks for the questions,
I looked in the service book for the pile driver there is the recommended oils GL5 75W90 yes I know about the magnetic plugs and we have added them. Another bad place I had was on our Hestian center pivot disk mower. It did not have any magnets and the main gear box wear out the bottom bearing, there is no way to completly drain due to the output shaft on the bottom, like a drill motor & added magnetic drain plugs . Thanks Darryl
Darryl, Is the Hestian disk mower like a Lely brand; where the PTO drives a belt that drives the right-angle gear box? Lely calls for a 85W-140 gear oil. This gear box pulls a heavy load especially in wet hay or grass. If the 85W-140 is not holding up and the gear box is running hot, most likely it is being overloaded. The OEM's like to sell parts, as that's where the money is made. I like to find solutions to why parts are failing. It may purely be as simple as stepping up to a synthetic with a higher film strength and possibly a heavier gear oil like AMSOIL Severe Gear 190 or 250 SAE. I'd like to have a crack at helping you cure this problem. I sent you an email to get some more details. Please reply and we'll see I can be of assistance. Thanks, John
Are synthetic hydraulic oils compatible without a system flush? I'm changing the fluids on my snowcat, and I'd like to put in a synthetic AW-32. The cat currently has a non-synthetic AW-32.
I use syn 5-40mobil oil year round in skidsteers and 210,290volvo excavators from brand new no problems and we run sometimes when its -35C to +40C we do oil samples every 500hrs when we drop the oil its always come back good and have no issues. Syn year round only way to go.