I have a Gehl CTL80 that I am having issues with. The battery light was flashing and would shut down the machine anywhere from 5 minutes of use to 45 minutes of use. I put a new alternator in and battery, but the battery light still flashes. I am still trouble shooting the machine and now it won't start at all. I have replaced the fuel shutoff solenoid, stop solenoid timer, stop solenoid relay, and charge relay. I decided to take the fuel shutoff solenoid out, and the machine fires right up. I was wondering if anyone had any ideas on what could be causing the machine not to start when the fuel shutoff solenoid is in. Thanks for the help in advance!
Take apart both triple relays and look for colder solder cracks. HeavyEquipmentForums HeavyEquipmentForums
If the solenoid works, check the connector and wiring next to it. It had gone bad on my machine and would randomly shutoff. I ended up removing the connector and wired direct.
Thanks for input so far guys! So I got the machine back running. I bought an aftermarket fuel shutoff solenoid and the plunger was a little bit longer than the one in the machine. I took a grinder and ground about 1/16" off of it and it fired right up. As soon as I started it up the battery light continued to flash. I took it out and used it for about 40 minutes. It stalled once about 10 minutes in and started right back up. I ran it for about another half hour and it died and would not restart. Any idea what is causing the battery light to flash and kill the machine? The alternator is new and seems to working and charging the battery properly.
Can you measure system voltage at rest, and after started? That'll tell you if the alternator is working. I'm really stretching my memory here, but, some of my little machines had an electrolyte sensor in the OEM battery. If a non oem, or sealed battery was used, the single wire on the electrolyte sensor needed attached to the battery positive to stop the warning. I looked in the tl150 parts manual and didn't see one. Also, one time I bought a takeoff yanmar 12v alternator from a boat shop (they convert to 24v), and it would not even let the machine run. Something about the yellow wire output. And, when the yellow wire out of the back of the correct alternator rubbed bare on one of mine, the symptoms were similar.
From googling. You see this thread? http://www.skidsteerforum.com/DesktopDefault.aspx?tabid=54&frmView=ShowPost&PostID=94211
I just got back from the store and the machine fired right up again. I got it back in the garage so will do some more trouble shooting tomorrow. Thanks for the help skata and heymccall! I will look into those things tomorrow and keep you guys posted.
Can anyone explain what wires to cut and where they are from this forum?
I do not see an electrolyte sensor on my machine. At rest the battery is at about 12.5V; when the machine is running the battery is at about 13.9V. I found one wire that the insulation was wore off under the control panel. I spliced in a piece of wire and the battery light is still flashing.
You double check the alternator connections? Check with multimeter.
So I took my alternator to get tested, it is good. I checked all connections, they are good. I re-soldered all the larger relays where there were cold cracks. All the other relays are new. Installed a new ignition. The machine starts and runs good for about 5-10 minutes now. The battery light is still flashing, before the machine dies it bogs down like it has a lack of power. I'm pretty positive it is not a fuel issue. I think it's an electrical issue. Does anyone know how to bypass this so the machine doesn't shutdown or what could be causing this?
If the machine bogs down I think it's a fuel issue. The only thing electrical on your engine is the fuel shutoff solenoid. It's either on or off.
The fuel shut off solenoid is brand new. I guess it doesn't bog down, just stutters like it is losing all power before it dies completely.You then have to let the machine sit for a couple hours before it will start up again.
Doesn't sound electrical. Next time it stalls, open the fuel cap to see if there's vacuum. Try starting it when open. Or it could be crap in your fuel tank. Check your fuel system. Filters. Water separator.
Ignoring the battery lamp, the other symptom points to partial blockage at the fuel line outlet on the bottom of the fuel tank. If you remove the water separator inlet hose (from tank) and place the end lower than the bottom of the door, fuel should run out like turning on a spigot. The tank outlet, by design, traps garbage. If it doesn't run fuel out freely, you'll have to drain the tank and then remove the outlet adapter, and clean, and preferably, modify it.
Ok, I changed all the filters and water separator. I will dig into the fuel system a little more. Thanks! Will the battery light flashing not kill the machine then if there is not a problem with the alternator or battery?
Post #11 or so here HeavyEquipmentForums I modified a fuel screen from a Deere loader. Problem is that the outlet has a sharp 90 with a small ledge. All it takes is one tiny pebble in there to begin to clog, not allowing grass blades and other light debris to pass, but rather to accumulate and plug it.
If your machine shutoff instantly, then you could suspect electrical issue. The only thing keeping the engine running is the fuel solenoid. It's either on or off. Everything else is mechanical.
I just drained the whole tank and cleaned the fuel line outlet, I blew out the fuel line going back to the tank as well. There was a lot of debris, rubber and dirt in the tank. I went out ran it for 45 minutes and the machine died again. Battery light is still flashing. I am pretty sure this is an electrical issue, just not sure where to go next.
Last week, I pulled the fuel shutoff solenoid out and it would start right back up. So I guess I am unsure of what is causing the fuel shutoff solenoid to turn off the machine.
My gut says alternator for the lamp flashing. Or one of the little wires is broken.
I took the alternator into an Alternator Shop a couple days and they said everything looked good in it. They took it apart and cleaned the brushes. I will look into the two wires that plug into the back of the alternator. Does anyone know where these run to? All the way up to a relay?
Check all your wires and connectors. I had a bad connection at the fuel solenoid connector and it worked intermittently. Or find which relay turns on the fuel solenoid and check solder. You may have one bad wire or connection somewhere causing both your problems. Check the grounds too.
When the alternator is working, the Blue w/yellow is the one that latches the charge relay.
I've been doing a little more research and wanted to run this by you guys. I found a forum that a guy used a mechanical plunger for the fuel shutoff solenoid and ran a cable into the cab to eliminate all his issues on his Mustang MTL 16. I was wondering if this is possible or if anyone has done this before. If so do they make a mechanical plunger that would fit this machine. OR Could you just wire the fuel shutoff solenoid to a switch in the cab directly from the battery to bypass all the electrical issues these machines have? I am going to dig into the electrical a little more this afternoon, but wanted to run this by you guys. Thanks again!
You could do that. But you'll lose the low oil and low coolant shutdown feature.
Ok thanks! I think I am just going to modify the fuel cut off solenoid and run a manual choke cable back to it to bypass the the relays and issues I am having. This is my personal machine so I am the only operator. I keep a close eye fluid levels and gauges when I am using it so I don't think I will have an issue with not having the low oil and coolant shutdown feature. I appreciate all the help from everyone!
I'd simply cut the red wire on the solenoid, leave the chassis side open, and connect the red of the solenoid to a key switch source. You'll still go on and off via key, and still get warning alarms, just no emergency shutdowns.
Ok I think I will do this instead, sounds a lot easier than fabricating a manual on/off. I'm just not that good with electrical stuff. This seems easy enough to do though. Thanks!
Do you get any other lights flashing when it dies? Did you verify that it's not your coolant level sensor that kills the machine? I believe you can just ground it to bypass to test when machine dies. There's other threads on here about this sensor. Fairly common issue.
All the fluid levels are good and the coolant sensor is bypassed. No other lights are blinking other than the battery light. I was getting very frustrated with this and need to get some projects done so I cut the end right off the fuel cut off solenoid so that could not kill the machine. I just went out and ran it for 45 minutes and it died again. What it the battery circuit could be causing this? The alternator was tested and was good. I switched batteries with a battery that was a year old, possibly this battery is bad too?? I might just go out and buy a brand new one... When I test the battery with the volt meter before and after it dies it seems to by fine though. The battery ground seems nice and tight too. Any ideas?
If there is no way to kill the machine electronically if the fuel cutoff solenoid is not in, could it possibly be the lift pump? I was thinking about plumbing in a pressure gauge on the out going side of the lift pump to determine the pressure that the lift pump is putting out. Does anyone know what psi the lift pump is supposed to put out?
I just changed out the fuel pump and that didn't do it... So I guess I'm still leading towards an electrical issue...
If you cut the pin off the stop solenoid, and you've changed the fuel pump, my money is still on a fuel restriction in the tank bottom, a crushed line, or a restriction in the water separator. On 2 of TL150s, they had a pebble in the tank outlet that eventually trapped straw. On the third one, after tank removal, I extracted a plastic shopping bag.
I also don't see where you fully disassembled the water separator. Quick and dirty, just buy a Napa inline fuel screen (p/n 3972) and put it in place of the water separator. That'll rule out an internal restriction in the separator.
As far as I'm aware , the only thing electrical on the engine is the fuel solenoid and lift pump. But the machine will run without the lift pump working. It's there to assist in priming. You have a mechanical fuel pump and mechanical injectors. I don't see how a voltage issue can stop it running if you modified the fuel solenoid to stay on.
I just wanted to give you an update on my machine. I cleaned the whole fuel system again last Friday. I took off the fuel water separator and put it in my ultrasonic cleaner and blew out all the lines. The fuel water separator had a bunch of white crusty build up that came out of it. Once I put the fuel system all back together it ran great. I used it all weekend about 40 hours of use and it ran great with no issues. I have not put the fuel stop solenoid back in yet but will do that one of these days. The battery light is still flashing, but I am just going to ignore it as long as the machine stays running. I appreciate all the help from you guys! Thank you much!
Good to hear and thanks for the update.