From Webster. Noun--Mechanic-----A skilled worker capable of building or repairing machinery. A mechanic can be compared to a technician, the distinction being that the technician is stronger in theory, the mechanic is stronger in hands on experience. Which leads to this question. If you were having your car worked on would you rather have book smart or hands on experience under the hood? Which leads to this question. Working in this industry which would you prefer to be called, book smart tech or hands on experienced mechanic? And don't answer both, that's hog wash.
I don't care what anybody thinks about either word, which one pays better is the real question.
I know which I’d be considered and honestly I’m not sure if I think one is better than the other. There are times I wish I was more of one or the other. I’m stronger on the mechanic side, my brain rememberers assemblies, past experience etc. I’m a fair troubleshooter on new or unfamiliar systems so I’m less “tech”.
Like my mom used to say "Call me anything except late for dinner!"
Hands on. The technical stuff should have all been reduced to practice at the manufacturers prototype phase.
More Mechanic or less Tech or vise verse. When us old guys started in this field there was no term Tech. The term has nothing to do with the fact vehicles are computer controlled. Starting back in the seventies it was thought by big business/ industry to give workers a high class name instead of a pay increase. So job titles changed to make workers feel more important. Where it really started was for years the guy who picked up your garbage was the {Garbage Man} then he became a Sanitation Worker. The Janitor became a Sanitation Engineer and so on. In the late 90's the Mechanic became the Technician, to dealerships it sounded more stately, although pay never increased. And along with it no more overalls, the stately technician would be dressed in a fancy stripped shirt and matching pants with the dealership logo and Technicians name. It was the proper look the industry thought and wanted to convey. Even though the technician was dealership trained and dressed/all looking like clones had nothing to do with the fact does he really understand what he is working on. Friend who worked for Ford for 30 years remembered when the word came down from the top. No more overalls all service workers will be referred to as Technicians by the service department and dressed in company supplied shirt and pants. Quoting him {Like that's going to solve the problem of the fact their still factory trained idiots by redressing them and giving them a fancy title}.
A tec is someone why thinks he can fix any thing. A mechanic is someone that knows he may be able to fix it given enought time and money.
I prefer to be a Mechanic. My Dad didn’t teach me to be a “technician” as I was taught “mechanics” from a young age. Good example is, Cat 374D, lost all hydraulic functions. Based on hands on experience with them I already had a good idea what I was going after. Got to machine, checked logged codes and as suspected found a code for “intake manifold pressure sensor- voltage above normal” easily overlooked as it’s an engine sensor. Found broken wire on the harness connector and repaired. Hands on experience taught me that if that fault comes up you will loose all hydraulic functions. First time it was an hour figuring it out, after that a couple minutes. The problem with “theory” is many times the engineers don’t include the entire theory in the book, some things have to be figured out with logic.
I went out to my shop and checked my trades qualifications and they say I am a heavy duty mechanic and a commercial transport mechanic. My Dad's are hanging on the wall above mine. They say he was a heavy duty mechanic and an automotive mechanic.
When I worked at the garbage company I referred to myself as a garbologist and got pretty good at guessing what was in the bags by feel or the shake test-Forensic Garbologist . As far as all these "techs" all the guys we got fresh out of the diesel "college" were all about the laptop but had almost zero mechanical ability, they all had big shiny tool boxes though with 3 tools in each drawer. I used to tell them " a big shiny tool box does not a mechanic make" and got looks like I was talking chinese.
As the young viewer of this form I identify as a idiot If it's broke I'll find the way to the best and proper repair. I'm nothing that's what you tell everyone I got plenty of work to do as is. In all seriousness anyone whom I ran across who claimed to be a technician and would argue it couldn't fix a sandwich right I don't think the good ones always seem to just keep to themselves. As stated previously call me what ever and pay well just don't make me late to dinner.
Now I know 95% of the members on here cannot stand political correctness. Just where do you folks think political correctness started? It didn't happen overnight on some news outlet. It slowly seeped in starting with job titles. I can see someone working for NASA being titled a aerospace technician, that is a narrow field. But everyone goes along with it if it makes one think they are more important than they really are.
Truck Shop, thinking about it it's probably all my fault!! Way back in the late 70's, the county's landfill dozer went down. They hired my Dad and I with our D7 till they could get theirs repaired. People would ask me, "what have you been doing? Where are you working now?". I can remember the strange looks I got when I told them I was" currently involved with the mechanized reelavation of low land strata by means of rejected refuse." "Wow, really?" Yeah, I'm runnin a dozer at the dump!
I’m neither I’m a serviceman. Mechanical or electronic I can fix it. Do remember that those who sneer at the computer side of things are the other side of the same coin as those who can’t think beyond the laptop. You better be good at both and I’m as tired of carrying the ones who can’t manage the electronic side just as I’m tired of the ones who have poor quality of work on the mechanical side.
What about the Parts Changers? Techs and Mechanics are pretty badly outnumbered these days
Well actually I just thought of another reason Mechanic is the true title. The USFS does not want to pay their firefighters very much so they call them "Forestry Technicians".
I'm just here for the women and booze.
These feel good designations hit the forest industry years ago , Chokermen began to refer to themselves as Knob & Bell Technicians.( Oops meant to say chokerpersons )
^^^^^^what he said.
Because those truck shops, machinery yards and HEF are so well populated with women . . .
You all stay away from Bluox.....shes all mine!
It helps to have good imagination while laying on the creeper and a vintage Snap On calendar in the distance before a nap.
Of which we have a serious shortage of both .
Wife gives me the razz about some old calendars in my home shop, have to keep them pinned high on the wall. And another tax coming here in Canada on booze. Life as we knew it is changing
When I dragged wiggle wagons for CF I was not a driver I was a Transport Operator.
uh, im a mechanic. we dont hire techs, they tend to like to stand around watching me work. the industry has changed so much and it aint eaasy to keep up. i guess now im one of the old guys, but try to keep up with me. this aint what i signed up for.
I remember getting the topless pocket-sized calendars from my Snap-On dealer back in the day. Those always stayed in my truck!
Now ya got everything in the "spank bank" on your smarty pants phone.
My wife has been trying to throw out my old Snap-On calenders and plastic brand new mugs(still in the box) for years and they are not even the topless ones
Sounds like theres a need for an underground trading network to circulate these treasures.
When I work at the deere garage we had to take all the girly stuff down the Mennonites where having a fit about it...the customers where not supposed to be in the shop.
My old flip phone wont show recognisable pictures. Not much good for doddling with or even finding useful information,but much easier to stay focused on so called important stuff.
I can take pictures with my flip phone and send them to someone's smarty pants phone if I really need to see it with any detail.
My smart phone takes excellent pictures of issues for my customers, acts as the screen for my borescope, can accommodate a thermal imager, has a digital level for calibrations of grade control sensors or leveling a machine for lifting and blocking, can look up parts or service info while away from the computer, runs an inspection app for pre and post work inspections or used machine inspections, and also has an app where I can hold it up to the machine and get an augmented reality 3D cutaway laid over it. I can also easily text or call customers and send them photos of issues or videos, or even video chat them so they can show me on the screen the issue they are experiencing. It also acts as a WiFi hub for my computer out in the field. A smartphone is a force multiplier for the knowledgeable mechanic.
All made somewhere else.
A good repairman doesn't know it all he just has to be willing to put a foot forward and research the topic find information apply it to previous know how and make it work. Thats atleast how I describe my way of going about things.
I are Meckanik. Just don't put "diesel" in front of it. Always hated the term diesel mechanic. I don't repair diesel fuel, I repair equipment.
I’m not a fan of the term “diesel mechanic” and I hate the focus on engines that this industry has, and for one big reason…all the apprentices coming into it think that the only thing that matters is diesel engines. If you watch a recruiting video (UTI I’m looking at you) it’s all they focus on and they only show the easy to access ones out on stands or in truck chassis that are easy to get to. The truth of the industry gets left out. The engine in the dozer that you have to take off the hood, Tier 4 package, all the stuff on it, etc just to get to simple things is conveniently not mentioned. Fighting bellypans full of dirt and then mud packed up into the torque converter/pump hellhole and then having to get covered in oil and grit raining down on you while you fight to get that one ******* leaking hose (that you have to take off 6 other things to get to) sucks. Wrestling a greasy pig of a telehandler to remove boom sections and every thing you touch gets you covered in grease sure isn’t mentioned. Hanging upside down in the center of an excavator to install a hydraulic option that the absolute idiot of a salesman forgot to order won’t make it into those films. Chasing that electrical or hydraulic issue that drives you absolutely NUTS to the point your brain hurts to think about it and three days later you find was actually something so stupidly simple that it makes you feel retarded is never talked about. I feel a lot of these factors not being known leads to a lot of people leaving the industry who shouldn’t have been there in the first place. This job is a massive commitment to not only doing the physical work of wrenching but also to the knowledge required of multiple complex systems. Calling me a “diesel mechanic” leaves out 90 percent of the work I do on a daily basis.
Very true. I can count on 1 hand how many engines I've torn down and rebuilt. Its literally a fraction of a percent of what I've done in my career so far.
we don’t do rebuilds in my shop. We yank them and send them down to the rebuild shop at our main branch. Our shop isn’t rated to the cleanliness standards they are plus they have all the specialty tooling, massive parts cleaners that can wash the engine blocks, a dyno, a full machine shop attached to it, and they have people who’s one and only job is to rebuild engines. the closest we get to rebuilds is transferring stuff over to long blocks and sticking them in and that’s only happened three times in the decade I’ve worked here. And honestly I’m not exactly heartbroken over the lack of engine work. It’s a lot of stress for me because one little inadvertent screwup and you can kaboom an engine.
Same where I was. We had some tooling and the big dishwasher but it was mostly powertrain rebuilds that we did. Lots of grader brake groups/tandems, a couple diffs, etc. Even got to rebuild a dozer transmission. That was a fun experience, learned a ton on that job.
Doug, I think this may be the best statement I've read on here in a long time. Well done.
I wish I could say this I generally do 2 or 3 full engine rebuilds a year most deere small cat and kubotas. I've made atleast one of those expensive life lessons. But It's cheaper for me to do them then it is for me to farm it out. I have a bug hammer d722 kubota half assembled as we speak and a 4045 deere up next
If you felt like posting a thread of pictures of that it would be interesting. The little engines never get any attention.
Damn split tails, always trying to throw out your good junk. True story, my uncle's neighbor across the road got an ultimatum from his wife to clean out all the "junk" in his barn (he did have a lot of actual junk but some real treasure) When big trash day came around the neighbor loaded the shoulder of the road 50 ft. long 4ft. high and 4 ft. wide, pickers paradise. My uncle picked that pile for hours and half filled his pole barn. Two years later after some prodding from my aunt when she couldn't even fit the riding mower in the barn he loaded up the curb with some of the neighbors old stuff. That evening the neighbor came across the road and reclaimed all his good stuff back to it's original home with a big smile on his face.
I love stories with a good ending!
I did a lot of engine work in other people's shops and even in the woods. No one does that anymore. Rip it out and hand it off to the guys back at the dealer shop to do. Went to Alaska the first time in 1980 or 1981 and ripped a converter and transmission out of a H100 Hough. Tore both down and reinstalled in the machine. Worked the rebuild in a shed with two benches made of plywood and saw horses.
Too many special tools, nothing is made for field serviceability. Not to say any engine you get back from an "engine shop" is going to be any good either or come unraveled in 10 or 100 hours.
Good idea a touch late in the game on this one as it's all about done if I remember on the next I will.
Well lets see, I refer to my end as class 8 heavy mechanic. As far as engines and rebuilding goes, around 400 hundred-That's because I worked in a truck repair shop that contracted the assembly work for a diesel machine shop. I know just in Cummins 855 completes and long block form I assembled over 90 on the stand. Cat about 30. I wouldn't do the salt waters only on rare occasion so the other guy did those. As far as inframes I can't count. When I worked auto machine I assembled well over 100 smb chevy's the rest is divided up in all kinds of gas and diesel engines. But Eaton gear boxes is my preference. As far as hard to get to hard to work on--I started my career in foreign car if no one has worked it especially in the early years they don't what hard to get to is. It only takes working on one Fiat X19 to start thinking about swallowing a 38.
I think I'd probably panhandle before I'd work in an automotive shop. All that clip together plastic ****, chincy little quick connect fittings and chicken **** designs don't interest me one bit.
Not to mention unreasonable time pressure, cut corners pressure and retail customers.
And all the auto guys hate on big trucks and such . . . "grimy, nasty monsters where everything weighs 500lbs"
Well here's the funny thing about that--every american car garage gave me crap for working foreign car because of overhead cam and fuel injection. Well guess what it all went that way. Plus back then Mechanics went to work at a shop for life, you had to wait for one to retire or die, and the jobs were already shoehorned for another mechanic. Plastic? That's all a class eight is these days the designers took their lessons from the auto industry.
Very true. I have next to no desire to work on trucks either. I applied a couple truck shops recently and quickly realized its just not my thing. I love looking at nice trucks and love it when I get the opportunity to drive them but the prospect of fixing them just does not excite me.
Let them think that, then. Every truck mechanic knows what it is like to work on a car because he has to work on his own car once in a while, but not every car mechanic has laid a finger on a truck.
I dunno, the auto guy has to work on the roll back once in a while, so he thinks he knows what it is like to work on a truck . . .
I despise working on cars. If I had a lift it’d probably be a little easier but grass/driveway/garage work sucks on cars
Was a HD Mechanic from 1975 on to 1995 when Hired in at Union Electric, EVERY machine they had was tended by Automotive Mechanics. Moved on to the Nuke became a roving Equipment Operator, Just as much trouble shooter and in field repairman, then they added Operations Technician as our Title, meant nothing, Reactor Operators called for Equipment Operator for any given watch station on the in plant Com System. Nowadays they are All Techs and pretty much worthless as teeth to bottom feeders.
I will add my name to that list!!! Work on my own, DESPISE working off Jacks and Stands but will be damned to pay some knothead shop $100+ an hour to screw up what I can for free plus parts!!
Most of the dirtiest work I ever had to do was on cars. Tire crud and oil filters that drain onto the sides of the engines when removed. Valve cover leaks, lots of oil vapor from the breather and dusty roads and no one ever takes a pressure washer to the underside of a car. Black hands and broken finger nails with scabs all over the backs of my hands. As far as time goes on foreign cars, the couple of wrenches I've known didn't care what amount of time it took. They were working on Swiss watches and that was just how it was going to be.
Don't Discount the Salt Water Chevys'/Driptroits/Quarry trucks!!!!
Bunch of friggin' girlie men.
To add to the list of types of engines I rebuilt--I don't know how many at least 70. Little know fact these engines were only good to 4,600 rpm-crankshafts had no counter weights, otherwise know as a flat plane crank. Chevy had some for small blocks that were flat plane. Firing order on a VW was 1,4,3,2, find #1 turn it opposite of firing order to adjust valves a .006. For the crap people put those engines through it was fairly durable. You just had to understand the quirks to own one, just like any other pile.
Rebuilt a 1200 and a 1300 bug flat four Worked on a early 50s Bentley doing a tune up. Had not ever seen exchange spark plugs before. Had two old gals that Kept their Corvairs, gawd awful machines to work on without a lift. Dad’s buddy with the MG Bs was almost as bad as my HS friend that had to have Karman Ghias. Studebaker Avanti collector took a liking as to how I cared for machines, at least he moved away. Had four of the damn things.
I hate working on my own stuff but I hate paying $175/hr for someone else to do it when I'm fully capable. Been there, done that with the hoist. It makes it easier for sure but for the $7,000 price tag I'll suck it up and lay on the driveway to fix my own stuff lol.
A 36 and 40 hp. The oldest engine I've rebuilt while working auto machine, 1911 model 33 Buick for Howard Sorenson. Latest worked on 2022 Freightliner 122 and 2022 KW T990. Oldest Motorcycle 1918 Indian Power Plus, latest 2006 Goldwing.
There was a ad years ago by the Hostess snack company. {Fruit Pie Technician, Fruit Pie the Magician}.
Well you have me beat for the oldest, my oldest was that 1917 Mack AC in my picture to the left.
I hope to buy a vehicle lift some time after we move. I hate rolling around in the crap and i can’t twist like a pretzel any more
Had one of our tractors in yesterday afternoon, it just had a full service plus FHWA inspection the day before at the bosses new Penske shop. Was there for 4.5 hours. Penske Techs wear a headset so they are connected to a computer to tell them what to do next on Penske's 160 point inspection.-----------------------Anyway--------- It was due for drive tires which I had written up 30 days ago, so we jacked removed all eight, and guess what I found. Over to the office I went ---Something you need to see and bring your camera----boss. A severely cracked air disc rotor and a leaking wheel seal--out of service. I knew I would catch a major screw up.
TS, it’s like I tell them when they ask me, “well did you show them the right way to run it so that doesn’t happen??” I just say “no I didn’t because these idiots will be gone tomorrow and the ones coming next are dumber and lazier than the last bunch was” It scares me what will be rolling down the road after all the experience has left the building for good.
Would be interesting to see the 160 pt Inspection report
It's just horse **** is all just a bunch of mumbo jumbo to impress those who are easily impressed. One of our oldest longest with the company drivers was in yesterday morning {23 years worth}, No joke this is what he told the owner two weeks ago the best I can remember. { Your telling me the company safety record will stay the same and possibly better? In 23 years I have been pulled into a scale one time and that was in a brand new truck. It was leaking a little oil past the fill plug on the steer axle a factory screw up. That's a pretty good record in my book, I could go to sleep knowing I wasn't driving a wreck thanks to Mike and Gayle}. Funny part is he told the boss---- {when Mike leaves everyone of us is going to know within a half hour {Truck Shop has left the building}. That was a real nice pat on the back from a professional driver.
I believe people like yourself evaluate more than that list has and it starts as soon as you see and or hear that equipment. Much respect.
Well Deserved Respect in that comment and Driver's analogy.
the bazillion point ******** inspections always irk me because it’s plainly theater to anyone with any sense.
Correct, In many cases though it's what owners want to hear. As long as their ego is getting stroked that's all that matters at that moment. Buzz words/word salad.
It's CYA is all. If something is missed the blame is put on guy with the muffs on the sides of his head. Whenever I see check lists like that, I'm thinking the management doesn't trust their people to do something right, so they stifle thought and creativity with stupid check lists made by someone who may have brushed up against a truck or machine in order to keep from falling down. The crush any kind of thoughts of doing a good job with you have to do two hours of work in half and hour. Would any of you stay there for any amount of time?
Management tried to force us to do a ridiculous inspection and oil samples on the customer machines coming in. They of course complained heavily because the inspection and oil samples they wanted took two, sometimes three hours to accomplish and they were eating it. Now they want us to do a much briefer inspection. I have conveniently “forgotten” to do it 99% of the time because the field service mechanics aren’t tasked with it. The way I see it the hell I’m going to waste my time with this crap when they aren’t.
When it comes to performing a service on any piece of equipment a general inspection should be going on at the same time. Greasing is also noting problems as you move along. It's just normal procedure-greasing is just part of it. But so you folks get the drift of a 160 point Penske inspection-it includes checking crud like cig/cigar power outlets-sorry I don't have time for that foolishness, I have air disc brakes to rebuild. These services and inspections Penske does take 4.5 to 5 hours, asinine.
Exactly the issue. You can't do what is on the paper so to make time. you have to cheat. Now there is no quality but who will take the heat when something bad happens? The movie is not comedy any more. It's a horror flick.
Kind of reminds me of the Pre-Op forms we had at the quarry. A whole list of things that were to be checked. Funny how some would just run a line down the OK column to indicate everything was good, even checking of the box for inspecting tires on a D6C dozer or windshield wipers on an open cab skidsteer!
It's called a pencil whip inspection. I liked reading through old inspection forms on others equipment. Pintle hitch and safety chains--on a 53' gets a check mark in the OK column.
I suspect a lot of this asinine excessively detailed inspection crap is for the insurance comany records and fleets probably get a better rate if they can prove they have a very detailed record of an inspection even though it is BS in the real, day to day world. A 160 point inspection form probably looks very impressive to someone who works in an office tower
Laying on table next to the toilet.
Inspection reports are all about liability. The report said it was good on Tuesday so the problem is a new problem and the operator/Owner is in the hot seat and not the service company. In a court fight the lawyer quotes the contractors document from Tuesday and then the Owner has to prove the document is incorrect. The lawyer is the only one to make money now. We had that at work and the company was trying to prove the problem was new and not from lack of maintenance. We were on the hook for a $100k fine with the next one being in the millions. A lot of time was spent trying to prove the fault was in the “act of god” category and not negligence.
There are several factors involving a FHWA inspection-first and foremost it's required federally on a commercial vehicle. No inspection it raises red flags with DOT. With big carriers it keeps insurance costs down with a good safety rating. Oregon has the Trusted Carrier plate that goes with a scale bypass transponder, loose your rating you loose the plate and transponder. The fact an inspection is only as good as the person performing it--who ever signs their name to it will be last inline as the turd rolls down hill. An FHWA form is all about brakes, lights, exhaust, steering, suspension, tires, glass, wipers, cab access and seat, and any other safety related equipment. The FHWA doesn't list the engine, transmission or final drives-because those will let you know when attention is needed by blowing up. If it won't move no need to inspect. Fact is most who fill out a form don't even know the speed rating of the tires they are inspecting. Which is required.
I work off my own designed inspection forms and they are different for different functions. A trade in inspection is not the same as an inspection for safety which is different that an inspection to apply for a collateral loan which is different again than inspections for coverage or one for a claim. What they all have in common is what I call the dance steps. They all flow by how I work around the machine. ID numbers are first, check fluid next, if all are good enough to start the engine it's into the cab. Turn on the key to power up the monitor and diagnostics, copy or photo any codes and then inventory the cab controls, add ons and then start the engine. Now it's ground time while the engine warms a bit. Implements like buckets, couplers, thumb and any other attachments, stick length, blade types on dozers, tail gates on artics and so on. Back to the cab and start moving things. How much slop in the joints, how is the Rotec or the center hitch? Back on the ground again. What do the wear parts look like, Type and width of track pads, tire sizes and model types. Take a look under the machine for fluid leaks. Are all the pans in place? Back up in the cab now and try out all the functions, any noise or vibrations? Transmission, steering and brakes tested, stall tests done as applicable and park the machine. Open all the access doors and look for things out of place or missing. Take oil samples as required. Measure undercarriage or tread depths on the tires. Taking notes and photos of problems as all this is going on. Now, back to the office to type it all up. The point being in all this is flow. I don't jump to the engine to the bucket to checking oil in the final drives to measuring the undercarriage and then taking oil samples and now you don't know where you are in the inspection. That's what happens when pencil pushers don't trust their people and then try to dictate how a task should be accomplished. You have made the job slow and just a pain to figure out what should come next or have to fumble through the pages of crap just to make a three word note.
I believe that checklists ( task list) were an attempt to capture knowledge that was being lost due to retirements as well as trying to enforce some accountability into the staff by management that didn’t understand the work. How can you quantify a station check to a new employee who does not have any experience? You have the old guy make up a list of all the things he checks. Unless someone tells the new guy to listen, feel, smell when they enter a station, the checklist is of little value. Cam
I do lots of inspections on gensets. I made my own checklist and I use it. Otherwise I would forget something or other. Also a lot of things on the list are measurements that are taken and recorded. This can come in handy in diagnosing trends as time goes by.
I believe most of the old hands here developed their own styles where basically revolve on common sense and mechanical base knowledge. Drive machine into shop note slop, noises, braking and clutch, how started with any odd reactions. Lamps on checked on walk around along with physical values of damage, stress failures or indications, our own pre-trip. As is shut down on shop floor, hood open/cab up(old school), visual inspect of those aspects, quick visual on under cover items, obvious leakage. Then initiate drain and under vehicle inspection. Fasteners, brakes, again damage, leaks, roll out to coolant, belts, fatigue points, inspect batteries. Drain down complete, back under swap filters, install drain plug remove draining container(s), roll out fill oil. Start and validate NO leaks, begin repairs list on urgent’s or safety concerns, last are voluntary not necessity but need attention and ordering parts for those that have to wait as no parts. Out of service for no parts still happens. Does roll to flow. Should be able to get thru a service in under 2 hours then start repairs, it is NOT rocket surgery or brain science!
Most of what the checklists are is an attempt to "scale" repair operations. You can have one shop, with an experienced guy running it, a good boss, ect. Great. But now you want to make a billion dollars and set up lots of shops. You can't just build 50 shops and staff them with experienced guys and start returning investments to shareholders. It takes years to build up a good, tight shop. What Penske and other big outfits are doing is trying to apply the McDonalds model to service. It does work to a degree, but you are getting the same quality of service at the corporate shops as you get quality of food at McDonalds. You want a good hamburger? You need to find the diner where the owner is sitting in the corner booth hobnobbing with all the local old guys.
Which all of these posts above go back to a set maintenance interval to catch issues early. I had set the service intervals at every 10K and 20K miles for a short service and every 30K a full service on tractors. Trailers were set every 30 days which worked out to roughly 10k give or take and jived with a tractor coming in every 10k for a short service. Average driver puts on 10 thousand or so a month, some more some less. Now with the Penske program they don't do short services only full services. They have talked the owner into every 40K on a full. So what will happen is the tractors & trailers will have wheel seal, brake and tire issues up the Kazoo. Trailers will get hung out especially. The FHWA they perform doesn't mean squat if you don't have a constant follow up service interval. Washington and Oregon DOT are going to have a field day with the company equipment come June. Plus it's going to raise a flag on Penske trucks. I know a WSP DOT agent, I already notified him. I didn't spend 20 years building a top level safety rating only to have a corporate know it all destroy it, weather I'm there or not. Rules/laws are there to protect the other drivers sharing the road, not to be twisted by a corporate bean counter.
Really sad for Tate TS, yet happens each and every day to fleets across the nation.
I used to work at a rental shop years ago, I absolutely HATED those inspection sheets. Absolutely useless. The shop guys would spend an hour pencil whipping the check sheet and it'd go out on a job. More than once I had to lay in a frozen parking lot for 8 hours and fix all the f-ups the shop guys missed before the customer even put its first hour on it.
Where I live there was a weigh scale located at an intersection of two highways. The weigh scale was removed to change the intersection to a traffic circle. They are building a new scale with an inspection shop too. Its been over two years since the scale was removed so I expect there will be lots of trucks taken off the road when the new facility opens in the next few months.
MO added inspection barns at their heavily active scales so the Brown Shirts could work any weather. Full walk under pits so can really see the working side.
No need to be sad for the company, it was the owners decision. For the silliness of spending 6.5 million to build a shop and lease to Penske to do the work under contract was asinine. For 6.5 million he could have added another bay to the shop hired three guy's in their mid 30's to early 40's. I could have trained them to keep the fleet in good shape. With a lot of money left over. 99% of this had to do with ego and narcistic behavior of keeping up with his brethren in Idaho and their trucking companies. Which all three of them own Premier Truck Group shops. He is a micro manager from hell which will come back to bite him in the end-it always does. That's his problem not mine, I owe the company nothing, because I was looking for a job when I found this one. His dad bought the company for him, that pretty well sums it up.
As can note, I have ZERO Love Lost on Penske.
Last week we got a call from a local trucking company. They had an air problem with a 2016 Pete. The shop the normally use could not get them in for a while. They desperately needed the truck fixed. The shop they normally use troubleshot the problem as being caused by the air dryer and gave the driver a Bendix ADIS dryer. The dryer was cycling every few seconds. The shop foreman asked "Do you want us to troubleshoot it first?" Owner said "No the tech at the other shop did already". He said the door' is open drive it into the shop and we will get to it right away. I drained the air and slid under it and replaced the dryer. Once done I ran the engine and cycled the compressor a few times and it worked as should. I released the park brake to back out of the shop and I could hear air blasting from the rear of the truck. A major air leak. A air line to one of the brake chambers had rubbed through in a suspension bolt. I replaced the line and sent him on his way. I can't believe the driver did not know he had an air leak and I can't believe the "Tech" did not diagnose the leak.
Supposed to Chock wheels, shut down engine, Release Parking brakes and test for air leakage on Brake application on Pre Trip.. At least I Did/Do.
When I think "mechanic", I think Gomer Pyle who knows how to perfectly turn screws on a carburetor or what type button and adjustments to make on a NTC. When I think "tech", I think using a DMM to troubleshoot CAN bus and observing whether it has a relatively constant voltage (data flood) or pulsing or lower voltage (correct packets) and knowing how that works and what it means. I think to be competent to serve your customers, you need to be both at the same time.
CAN Bus Explained - A Simple Intro [2023] What is CAN bus? How to log CAN bus data? Where does J1939, OBD2, CANopen fit in? See our CAN protocol intro tutorial for the Controller Area Network basics! www.csselectronics.com
Birken:: #19 button and a PURPLE spring..lol
I will agree there are options within CANBUS that cannot happen on Hard Wire systems, yet WHY do they place lighting functions IE T/S, Stop lamps thru CB systems? SIMPLE is rather conspicuously missing here. 2012 HD Motorcycle, four wires from lighting circuit, three breakers/fuses, 2016 HD Same platform, SEVEN Fuses/breakers, ECM just for T/S/Stop lamps fed down three wires. HOW in the hell is that "Simpler"?
It's not--Over designed not necessary. A DT12 that had issues CANBUS was not communicating. Now when the Detroit Transmission Troubleshooter spends 2.5 days onsite and cannot figure out why it's not communicating Houston has a issue. That tractor was down for 7 weeks total time. End result was everything was changed out including the transmission which every piece was sent back to DT. Never did hear the reason.
Buddy of mine and I picked up our N-Line trailers same time, rode up together to have hitches installed(Free Labor) and wiring added. My own was a Plug and Play "T" in system for tail and ID lamps and two turn signals(Free), his was a Massive $197 module and a significant small harness, for $39. Mine a 2012, his that 2016 I noted above. JUST to run Trailer lamps. BOTH were Road Glides. His has been replaced once and may be needing again.
At least half of the dumb stuff I see is Engineers screwing with stuff to justify their jobs and show how smart they are. Even better for them if they can not only make it more complex but also more fragile then they can engineer the “solution” down the road and be the “hero” for what they screwed up. And god forbid you contact the OEM for help on something complex that you can’t figure out because they often don’t know their own systems. All I want is decently engineered systems and well written support literature that is easy to follow and understand so I can learn, understand, and fix what I work on but apparently that is too far of a bridge.
"Have you updated the software to version xxxxxxx?" I swear that's the equivillent of calling the IT department and they tell you to turn the device on and off again. 99% of the time it does nothing.
A bit off track but same issue. Bought a new tube heater to replace old for less issues. Heater won't work. PC led shows no issues. Call tech and figure out it's the gas valve. I cut the old one open and it had a freaking computer chip in it. WHY?? It's just a coil to open the valve. New valve I bought was old style.
I guess I'm a Gomer Pyle. Here's what this Gomer dealt with years ago. The start of component communication started in the 50's called the Electrojector, a design built by Bendix. Bendix sold the idea to Robert Bosch which refined it and named their redesign Jetronic, first installed in production VW cars in 1967. In the early 70's it was renamed D-Jetronic. Bosch Jetronic is where everything on the market today spawned from. At the time {not until mid to late 70's was any type of trouble shooting tool invented. It like all other things at the time were analog. There were no codes only a the procedure of measuring ohms and voltage. It had to be damn near perfect readings to operate correctly. Injectors used just slightly less than volt to operate. Now the system wasn't terribly complicated but just enough so the slightest variance in voltage caused major issues. The control box was not called a ECM or microprocessor but instead a Modulator with about 20 plus resistors inside, there was a map sensor and fuel pressure sensor. It operated on fuel pressure, with a cold start injector the precursor to what's common rail now. Troubleshooting was extremely time consuming. There were no weather pack connections, no sealed terminal ends, ground connections had to be spotless. The insulation on wire harness was the product of the period. Prone to cracking from heat and cold and zero abrasion resistant. It's always been thought a butt connector caused no resistance, well that went out the window. Splice a bad wire to a injector and have the possibility it wouldn't fire. A rain storm could cause nothing but trouble. Bosch really had no procedure at the time for troubleshooting even the dealer was stuck with very little training. Really it wasn't till OBD-II that things took a turn, I remember very well GM's equivalent to backyard throttle body injection-the electronic Quadrajet 4BB. Turd. Some just don't realize how lucky they are to have a system that has written codes and the availability of code readers and laptops. Walk up and plug in, wow that's tough. Although it still requires some basic understanding of a CANBUS system. Gomer Pyle--No I had my tin foil suit and coat hanger selection long before the rest of this tribe. And I'm good at troubleshooting that crap. Below is a photo of the code reader we had back in the bad old days. I'm still a mechanic
All we had in the 60s 70s and 80s until OBD I was what is pictured and Oscilloscopes. ANALOG O-Scopes, Caddy came out with 'Digital Command Control" in their cars, Absolutely SQUAT on diagnostics even for their techs, they had to call Caddy Corporate for assistance.
Many times I’ve started typing the reply I really want to send then have to walk away from my computer for 10 minutes. Or my personal favorite reply, where after I put “Performed Action X per service letter/tech bulletin, no change in results” in my initial contact message and the first reply is “Perform Action X”. Come here, I just want to slap, I mean talk to you… I swear the arrogance level of “these mechanics are just stupid grease monkeys” is so high they refuse to believe us when we tell them something, and funny you should mention IT because our IT department treats us the same way.
It's not arrogance--it's a game they are playing to get you or someone else to do it for them.
I got the exact same treatment when filling out DSN's. One smaller chain I worked at actually had a team of 3 or 4 ex-mechanics whose sole purpose was technical assistance. By far the best way I've seen it done, I could call them up any time during the day, bounce ideas back and forth etc. Always prompt and so much nicer than trying to communicate everything over text.
Unmistakable Cummins Supercharge Unit? Can still remember the wedding bands, get caps snug, bump crank back and forth to square them on the bolting. Studded mains, eccentric W/P bore, OLD series, 190?
The Simpson multimeter made me remember that mine finally died about two years ago, A replacement was over $300 so I went to Sears, one was still open at that time, and bought the $78 dollar digital special. There is just something about a needle swinging back and forth that is so easy to understand and interpret. Techs wear white lab coats, have university degrees and get seriously upset when the night janitor has swept the floor or dumped the trash. They cry like babies when they stub their toe or get asked to touch anything dirty. Those that I've worked around would dump a job at a hint of something tough and were the first to try to claim credit for someone else's work. I suppose we should start putting frilly collars on the coveralls of the techs now days. At least that way we would know who was trying to stab us in the back if we happened to make them look back by just doing our job. They used to be known as parts changers but that term is seen as derogatory now days. I'd hate to see some tech have their self esteem damaged.
Our company did this. Problem is, they put a kid with 2 years experience into the position. You can figure out how that is working out.... . Last week, we just found out they put another one with , Im guessing, 4-5 years experience?? into the role of in-house technical trainer..... .....this should be interesting....
Yeah you kinda want someone with at least 15 years experience in that role.
Companies are getting desperate where all they do is further the self destruction of those companies.
A big company I worked for in the 80’s had a “Tech Line”.. He was a very experienced fella.. The thing I found strange was, inorder to get an answer from this “Tech Line” was u HAD TO give a credit card #..!!!