I purchased my first tractor last year and I'm running into stalling issue. It would run for about 20 minutes then stalls. Runs and stalls...gradually worse and worse. I had friend vent the system about a month ago and it ran fine for about 20 hours. Injector pump? I don't think so because it would run like crap from the start. Fuel Lift Pump ? How do I test if it works or not? Since it has 3000 hours on it, I'm going to replace the fuel line from the tank. Are filters and fuel filters are new. This sucks! My neighbor has a 30HP Kubota and he runs it all day everyday. I have an 80HP tractor and cant get more than 30 minutes each day. He just laughs at me....:Banghead I don't know what to do at this point....
By the way, does any know where I can get a service manual for not bend over price?
First you have to make sure you have good fuel flow from tank. So many times I've found something blocking the fuel delivery pipe inside the tank. Make sure you don't have water and dregs in the bottom of your tank, drain some fuel from bottom of tank if possible. As for your lift pump, if it looks similar to the pic below and has a sort of lid on the pump that's held in place by a screw, it's likely it's a lift pump that has a strainer inside of it. Remove the screw in the center and remove lid. You may find that stainer clogged, I've seen it happen many times.
:iagree seeing as its a perkins eng id say likely the lift pump, had the same problems a few months ago, changed lift pump (after doing the things like atco said here) and it never looked back!
Thought it was the fuel line because it had pin-hole in it. Replaced with a new fuel line from the tank. thought that would solved the issue but it didn't. It ran for 45 minutes then stalled. Left it overnight, wouldn't start. Then primed the lift pump....then it started. I drove it about 300 ft then stalled. I just ordered a new lift pump. What else can I check while waiting for the stupid lift pump.
how about the shut-off solenoid? Should I take a look at that also?
Two thoughts on this. 1. Rag in the tank. A piece of rag floating in the tank will do this. Everything is fine until it gets sucked up against the p/u, the suction holds it there until the engine stops. Then the rag floats free until next time. 2. Pinhole in fuel line. I had this happen also, didn't leak a drop but let enough air in to eventually stop the engine. Suggest you get a can of fuel and temporarilly draw from it. This will prove weather it is a tank/line problem or a pump problem.
Next task: drain the fuel tank and inspect it! So I was outside with nothing to do so I just went ahead and replaced the fuel filter, primed it using the lift pump and also slaken the fuel pipe union at the thermostart. Saw and air bubbles came out. Okay....air out of the system. Started the tractor and it ran fine or about 20 minutes....stalls.... I waited a minute then started the engine and drove back to the carport. I noticed along the way that once in a while the engine would lose a few hundred rpm's then came back to normal.
What's going on in the system that allows me to re-start the engine after it stalled if I let it sit for about 30 minutes or so?
Just a thought, I don't think any one has mentioned it. Have you checked the air vent in the fuel cap? If that is blocked the engine will run for a while and then stop when the suction builds up. If you remove the fuel cap when the engine stops, you will be able to tell by the suction on the cap, if that is the problem. RnR.
I took your advice and tried something different just to see. The hydraulic tank cap looks identical to the fuel cap so I switched the caps. Well, it still stalls after after 15 minutes of work. I also noticed there were diesel leaking out from the cap/filler area. I don't know what to make of that since the tank was less than half.
Is this a special fuel cap? Can I get it a local automotive parts store?
So I went out to try to get it restarted by priming the system using the lift pump and slacken the thermostat union...Well, I can definitely see air bubbles coming out. but where is it coming from? that's the million dollar challenge. I replaced the fuel line coming from the tank. Fuel filter has been replaced. Air filter has been replaced. Shut-off solenoid orderd. Lift pump ordered. Fuel cap will be ordering....
westladog, you're making a real big mountain out of your molehill. From what you've been describing to us, you either have a fuel delivery problem (lift pump), fuel restriction problem (clogged line), or hole in fuel system (sucking in air). Yes fuel cap, as suggest by Rocksnroses, can also be the problem, but he suggest using the machine without the cap when it crapped out, not changing it out with the hyd cap because some hyd caps are not vented. And you really haven't told us what you have done so far. Troubleshooting a fuel problem should be a systematic process of checks. One would say first to check your tank for debris, but we don't know your machine, some machines have a fuel tank that's near to impossible to open up and view junk or the venerable shop rag in the tank. And I've even seen sticks and such blocking the fuel delivery pipe in a fuel tank, again, I don't know how easy it would be to check that on your machine. Does your fuel have a shut off valve on fuel supply from tank? I would try blowing back into fuel hose from tank with compressed air to remove any obstructions, be sure to have fuel cap loose when doing this so as to not expand tank. Possibly might replace fuel hose to eleminate any holes in hose. What about the fuel filter/filters? Are they spin on type? Or, are they the multi piece filter units that are used on so many Perkins engines? What about the lift pump? Did you look for a strainer inside lift pump? Or, did you replace the lift pump? These are several things you need to do and we don't know if you've performed these steps. Well, it appears you have done a few things and posted while I was yet typing. LoL.
Thank you! I really appreciate your comments though. I'm going to post of some pictures.....
I posted some pictures for you guys can see and offer some suggestions. http://www.photoshop.com/users/westladog/albums/6d45c4bf49314e6986acfa726bf3a3d0 I found and another leak in one of the fuel line holes so I replaced that line too. Either I didn't vent it properly but it still stalls. I'm going to try to bleed the system again tomorrow.
I can't offer much more LAdog. I freakin hate those CAV filters! When the hell is the Brits going to quit using them and use spin on filters instead. :Banghead You did check the o-rings that seal the bolt that pulls the filter home didn't ya? I don't see that lift pump having a strainer screen in it. Without being there working on it myself, at this point, I'm just curious about something clogging the fuel delivery tube in tank. Not much else I can offer.
You can't give up on me! I just went out and replaced another fuel line because I saw that there was a leak. I just noticed that there is a drain plug for the fuel thank. Yeah! So I'll drain it and go from there. I'm going to start from the beginning. 1. Fuel tank - drain and see what I can find. But it's hard or impossible to pull the entire sending unit though...I'll take some pictures of it. 2. Fuel filter - I'm going to need a second opinion on this because I may not have installed it correctly. The first time I changed the fuel filter, I ended up clogging it instead. 3. Replace every single fuel line that I see. Might as well, it's 7 years old and 3000 hours. 4. Replaced the lift pump when it arrives. 5. Shut-off solenoid - I don't know about this one but I already ordered it. 6. Fuel cap - going to replace this one too. But will try to use a rag just to test though. 7. Pray real hard!
Fuel flow? Tank--->water separator-->lift pump--->fuel filter--->injector pump....? I've changed the fuel line from the tank to the water separator and from the water separator to the lift pump. Now, I just need to make sure that there is no restriction from the lift pump to the fuel filter. How am I going to do this when the line is a metal line?
If you can wait for the lift pump to arrive i would go there first! Fairly common problem on perkins engines, so common i keep 1 or 2 in stock all the time, at least one in the van!
Thanks! Man! there were times this weekend that I wanted to take my pistol out and shoot this thing. I need to work on my motocross track and prepare for the rain season...
You did make certain there was nothing blocking the pipe where fuel comes out of fuel tank?
Update: I just remove the tank and found only a screw inside the tank. I also made sure there was no blockage. I bled the system and now it's running idle for 45 minutes. Is it bad if I leave it running for an hour? Let's see what happens tomorrow when I take her out for a light workout.
nope, won't hurt that engine a bit.
any predictions?
Good news guys! I think the problem may have been solved! I'm not 100% but it ran for an hour on a load and it didn't stalled. I replaced the fuel lift pump. Since I changed both the leaky fuel line from the lift pump to the water separator and the lift pump itself, I'm not sure which was the problem. I replaced the fuel line first but it still stalled. May be because I didn't vent the system completely? But after the new lift pump went in, it ran great. Let's see how it goes the next few days....fingers crossed. If this works, then I've learned a few very important troubleshooting techniques: 1. Start from the fuel tank. 2. Check everything start from the fuel tank. 3. Follow the flow of fuel. If it's a fuel problem, you will eventually find where the problem is. It's also best to pressure wash the engine first so that it's easier to see leaks.
Today, it crap out again. I replaced the lift pump and it worked. It has only been two years since I last changed it and I don't use the tractor that much! No more than 200 hours at most.....wth
I have the same problem. Mine is a 1997 Fermec 640 B. It runs perfect for about 15 mins then stalls, cranks a little will start back up and stall again. Wait a few mins then start run for another 15 mins or so and stall. I have been working with a mechanic on it for the last few weeks. We have installed new fuel lines, had the injectors tested, had the injection pump tested on a rack for an hour no problem, pulled the lift pump off no leaks seemed fine. Still stalling! Took the pick up out of the tank inspected the tank for the tenth time. Finally bypassed the lift pump with an eletric pump still stalls. Took the fuel separator apart all looks good. O-ring still in good shape. New fuel filter. Primed the system. Starting to go crazy. It has to be getting air from somewhere. On Saturday going to try a new separator. Wondering if this is a common problem? My mechanic works with a Perkins guy he hasn't heard of this issue after everything we have done. If anyone has an more ideas please help. I'm new to the forum. Just bought this tractor and a Bobcat T180 for our new ranch about nine months ago. Thanks!
Forgot one thing also replaced Stop Solenoid
Have you checked the fuel cap vent?
Yes, I could blow through the cap. It seems to be venting good. I ordered a new cap because mine isn't sealing anymore and splashing fuel out. I will double check the cap is venting properly. My mechanic is coming on Saturday to try a couple more things. I will post the results. Thanks for the suggestion.
Hi There, those seperators are prone to drawing air! have you tried bypassing it? Aiden
Hey, thanks yes I tried bypassing it. I think we have found the problem we bypassed everything from the injection pump back. We have concluded that it must be the pick up in the tank. I just ordered a new one. Hopefully that is it we ran a hose in the tank with a socket on the end to hold it to the bottom. It seemed to work. When the part comes in I'm going to run it for a few hours and I will report back. Thanks for the help I will keep you all updated.
I had this problem with mine. Replaced the fuel lift pump and it solved the problem. It had junk built up in it restricting flow.