I have been thinking about picking up another skid steer (tracked). I really like the ASV/Terex/Cat track setup because the machine will also be used for snow removal. I have been considering everything from an RC30 to a cat 287 size. I am worried about the undercarriages on these machines not holding up. My two questions are.. Is there a specific machine to avoid? Is there a certain year that upgrades went into effect that fixed possible undercarriage troubles? I know two farmers that bought rc30s and have nothing good to say about them (but they also abuse their machines). Thanks for any input.
The ASV machines (undercarriage) in my view seem to hold up better than do the CAT counterparts. The only exception to this seems to be the 247 which is the smallest of the CAT MTL'S. The ASV machine was built around the undercarriage, they weigh less than the CAT machines and the undercarriages seem to hold up better, they are also better balanced. If you wanted that undercarriage I would try to go with ASV. Then you are getting the whole package as it was designed to be implimented and not a CAT skid steer wielded to an ASV undercarriage which no one not even CAT spent any serious time engineering.
That is a very good point that the machines were built around the undercarriages. I was leaning towards ASV as all my big equipment is Deere and a cat would be a black sheep of the fleet. But if a nice Cat was priced right I would never turn it down. A local landscaper I talked to has the new PT30 and had nothing but rave reviews about the machine (under 100 hours). After doing research I think if I got either machine I would have to adjust my figures over a regular CTL to compensate for extra undercarriage wear.
I love my asv. You just have to monitor the undercarriage for wear and make sure rocks aren't getting jammed in the idler scrapers. Some grease and maintaining and you should be good. Some people are stupid about how they treat machines just don't be one of those people.
I am a fan as well. However, I dont think the build quality is quite up there with some of the bigger players. Would love to see them get away from the Perkins/Chinese diesel. The undercarriage is great if used for the intended purpose. Get outside of light to medium duty applications and it will be pay to play in a big way. As far as machines to avoid, many improvements have been made with the PT series. Might be best to start there. Good luck!
Just wondering. What kind of improvements did they do? I thought it was the same exact machine with a different paint scheme.
On the newer PT 30's, alot more lift height, re-designed loader arms, bushings in all areas, 5% more hp, 10% better lift, on the PT 60's they have a 2 speed, metal face seals, steel rear wheels though that may be changing, couple inches wider, steel hoods in back over motor vs the old fiberglass, ( no change on the PT 30 though), these are the two models I am most familiar with, they made alot of changes because frankly there was some room for improvement.
74inchshovel, The Cat /perkins engine in the ASV that you mentioned was chinese. I always believed that they were made by Shibaura of Japan. I have a friend who has a PT80 that has one of these. It does a lot of work but does consume quite a bit of fuel. Still the undercarriage has been the major cost for him. All in all it is a performance machine as long as you don't go to any extreme locations. Firetrack
The 2.2L engine in both the PT50 and PT60 has been made in Griffin Georgia since 2004 at the Perkins Shibaura Engines LLC plant. It is the same engine currently used in the CAt skid steers and CTLs known by the name of 3024CT. The PT80 uses the same 3.3L Mitsubishi branded Perkins that CAT also uses in some of their skid steers and CTLs. None of them are Chinese.
Speaking of which. You have a good source for parts for that 3.3 engine? The dealer charged me $95 for a fuel filter on mine. The Perkins dealer near me only deals with boat engines.
Some are made in Griffin, some are made in Peterborough, UK. The same engine is made in small numbers in Wuxi, China but they aren't fitted into the MTL's or CTL's. The Wuxi engines are made to exactly the same standards as the Griffin and Peterborough engines.
Thanks for the info. It was explained to me that the Griffin facility was opened to meet the domestic production demands of 3024 engines for CAT and ASV along with the 1.1L engine for the CAT branded mower engines.
That's about the size of it, but when demand goes up, they're shipped from the UK, sometimes they come the other way. The 3.3 is a Mitsi, badged as Cat, you may get a deal on parts by going direct to a Mitsi dealer. The same engine is sold as the Perkins 800 series. Damned good engine, but hope you never need to remove the crank pulley from an early one.
The Chinese engines in theory were made to the same specs. However many say that never happened. Substandard components resulted in many issues with this version of the engine. At least thats what is said.
Have any of you had any problems with the engines in the ASVs? I have a little Shibaura in a new holland and have nothing bad to say at (1500 hrs). The two speed on the newer pt 60 would be something I would want. Do you think the extra speed would cause any more stress on the undercarriage?
I personally haven't had any problems with my RC50 engine. I understand that the same Shibaura designed 2.2L was used in both the NH and Case skids and CTLs. I was told the PT60 uses the same two speed Rexroth that the larger PT100 used. I guess I couldn't see any additional stress considering that most 2nd speeds produce less power than low speeds and ASV has a couple other machines that are just as fast.
Here we have to be careful. There are engines made in China badged as Cat or Perkins which are nothing to do with either brand. Sometimes you need a fair bit of knowledge to spot the fake. It's a menace, a Perkins salesman told me once if you win a case against a Chinese company in a court outside China, the win is worthless as it won't be enforced, and if you take it to a Chinese court you'll never win. Straight dealing, eh? This is one reason Cat have set up shop in China, to be able to enforce Cat quality and be able to sell inside China. Cheap labour has nothing to do with it. Ha ha.
My understanding is the issues were with the CAT manufacturing plant itself in China. These were not knock off engines but licensed engines that at the end of the day were very substandard.
What problems have you heard about and where have you heard them? I know in the UK there is a certain bias against anything Chinese because it's Chinese, I can also understand why for the reasons already mentioned.