At what temp is it too cold to pave with hot mix asphalt? Is it just a matter of getting the mat compacted at the right temp as it cools?
Here's a good source of information on paving temperatures as well and a wealth of other information. http://chelsea.k12.mi.us/education/...29cf3/1261174468/02741_Asphalt_Paving_cbf.pdf Of course, lots of paving for commercial parking lots and the like gets paved at much lower than recommended temperatures as customers just have to get it done. Makes for ugly joints though. The thicker the mat, the more you can get away with cold temperatures. The higher the wind, the more troubles you will encounter. I've worked on paving projects where the snow was flying and the base was frozen solid and the job thirty years later is still in good shape.
the 40f degrees and rising is what I've heard around here. I've seen the state reject several loads of asphalt a day .... during the early winter ...mix to cold ,the rejection temp, I have know idea what it is here.
I worked for a paving company for a few years and there were times we plowed off the snow to put down the asphalt. We'd do the binder course, it's thicker and finish isn't critical, but top coats would wait until the following spring.
like steve said i have also paved in the snow but that was just to try and get the job closed up and we'd do the top in the spring .....done emergency road patches after water main breaks when its in the 20's we'd put an extra ton or two on the truck to keep it hot longer.....alot of the problem is when it starts getting below 40s the problem is at the asphalt plant it starts costing them to much to heat everything up ,thats why most plants up here close for the winter
Yeah - this is a non-issue up here. Our plants closed up 2 weeks ago. I covered up 150 feet of trench last week using cold patch. That's all you can get here.
Tilcon had a batch going last monday morning at the Plainville,CT plant. I was kinda suprised since i was driving home from sanding icy parking lots...
State or federal jobs have specs for surface temp usually. I remember having to wait many times at the hot plant for the inspectors to give us a go ahead with regard to the temp. On the other hand, I've laid blacktop in driving blizzards so as to finish the job by a deadline or because we only had a few feet to finish up. Generally, it's up to the inspector or his boss.
we paved last thursday, just binder though. As long as it isnt DOT work you can pave whenever, one thing to keep in mind is you subbase it isn't frozen is it? Frost can create some real problems. Other than that some of the plant around here stay open all year. Oh yeah dont put down top, since the aggregate is smaller it cools to fast to actually work it the to a finished product.
around here most towns wont let u leave big road patches for the winter in cold patch, we've paved them in 1/2 binder up to the top , then in the spring the contractor if its held up good would grind it down a little or remove it all together a redo it the right way .....and its all up to the inspector or whats the bid say
You can actually pave well down to 0 or below. The problem with laying asphalt in anything lower than 45-50 degrees is that its harder to get compaction due to the asphalt cooling so quickly. Also frozen subgrades would prove to be problematic later on. Asphalt gains compaction due to the fact of the asphalt cement(looks like tar) being hot and actually allowing the aggregate to slide around in the mix and become closer to eachother and fill air voids. After asphalt cools it is harder to gain compaction because the asphalt cement cools and doesn't allow the aggregate to move as freely. You can pave smaller driveways and easily do patches well down to 0-20 degrees because it is small and not as much to gain compaction on. However, the problem with paving in such temperatures for most state projects is that they have compaction and laydown temp requirments. The asphalt cools too quickly to gain such compaction. I suppose if you really needed to pave in such cold temperatures you would need to run many more rollers and it just wouldn't be feasible.
Jimmyjack, John over keatons told me Dec 11, Is it!
hows john doing ,havnt seen him in a couple years ....if i remember right keatings keeps that plant open longer cause its a batch plant , thats early this year......i think narragansett improvement company in providence keeps there plant open once a week all winter
jimmyjack, Johns doing well but he has his share of breakdowns. Both plants Cranston and Achusnet closed Dec 11. Saw Peter Lynch and we may be going back maybe getting a deal there. We did miles of paths at Cranston country club nice to have a plant down the street Happy new year sam
O&G here in CT closed there plants on the 18th of December. For us here in Southwestern CT, we can take a ride to the Bronx or Queens in NYC, and there are plants open all year round. But the asphalt is like popcorn by the time you get back.
Well, the reason I asked was that there was an overlay project going on here and there were paving in temps right around freezing. I saw a lot of trucks sitting waiting to unload. There was an inspector with a compaction tester (nuke?) and I assume it was passing. We all notice that the overlay "sings" when you drive on it, with some sections much louder than others. I think that the louder sections were done in the mornings on the colder days IIRC. It's one of the roughest overlays I've seen in a while too. It was funded with stimulus money so I guess it didn't matter if it was made to last.
Is it only the compaction problem you guys have with the cold or is because it wont bond to the sub base and will de-laminate from the old base if to cold ? If it is a bonding issue , we use tow behind Infrared heaters to heat the sub base as the Asphalt or Bitumen top coat is applied .
At what temperature are you using these heaters down there? Our plants close because today, for instance, had a high of about 30 F. You better have a 10 ton roller on a 3 foot drum if you want no pocorn.....in other words, you ain't doing it. You need so much portable heat that the fuel cost outweighs the profit.
In the State of Maine,contractors can only pave wearing surface course at 50 degrees or rising and they can pave base or binder courses at 40 degrees or rising on state D.OT projects.
Down here it has to be 45 and rising for less than 2" and Engineers discretion for depths above 2"
Here is 40 and rising but it depends on the inspector.
We have paved with the temps down as low as freezing, it makes for some horrible joints, makes the customer and the crew unhappy and generally a miserable project. Add in the fact that if you are not paving a quality demanded mix design, the Reclaimed Asphalt Paving and Recycled Asphalt Shingles that the plant adds to the mix to lower their costs, flash tempers the mix at colder temps and reduces the amount of time that you have to compact it. Dependent on different specs here, most instances for paving here are usually around 50 to 60 degrees surface temp rising or quit paving with temps of 80 and falling! We have a project with a special mix pending that can't be finished right now because the spec demands 70 degrees surface temp. And it needs every degree of temp that we can get. It has so many polymer additives and high asphalt content that paves with the consistency of bubble gum!
I know this is a really old thread but figured I'd throw in my 0.02 anyhow. Around these parts they normally shut down paving plants by mid October. I'm not sure of the temp area that it needs to be for paving though we normally have snow on the ground by the end of October.
yes
State of Alaska, DOT&PF says no lower than 40. Although there have been special occasions where the contractor got away with cooler temps by using special mixes and extra care keeping loads hot between the plant and the site.
I worked as a road mechanic for a paving company in the mid-atlantic area & I have seen some really STUPID ****. I have seen asphalt put down in the rain, snow & freezing cold, too. Just recently, I saw another paving company pave during 25 degree weather. The mat was great after they were done, but it tore / pulled away from itself in about 7 different areas. It was just this week that they came back out with the milling machine to tear it all back out. I'm not sure if the asphalt cooled too fast in the colder weather, or they did not use enough tack (liquid asphalt) to bond it to the under-laying base, but it looked like amateur hour out there. Another major issue is COLD JOINTS. In the summer laying one lane one day, then the other (on a two lane road) on another day, everything is typically just fine. BUT, in the winter OLD JOINTS are too hard to prevent because the mat laid down the day before also acts as a heat sink; just pulling the heat out the new mat be laid down. As far as COMPACTION goes, you need to achieve about 1/4" of compaction for every inch of asphalt being laid down. SO, if you want to lay down 4" of asphalt, then you actually put down a 5" mat, because that amount of compaction is needed to bind everything together. Without proper compaction, the material will just break apart very soon. If you OVER compact it, it will also break apart as well. All in all, laying down a nice mat is not overly hard, but it calls for a good crew to put it down effectively & also to put it down in the most cost saving way, too. I sometimes miss that job. I was the junior man & I learned a **** ton very quickly. I learned enough to know that the paving company was in the wrong when they lay down a mat in that cold of weather. I ultimately laughed as I realized they had to bring out the milling machine AGAIN, then lay another mat down. I guess, they made too much money the first time, that they just wanted to do it AGAIN for FREE!! Damn, that was funny to see.
Kinda explains the 13 miles of road our county did that ended up with 1.5" wide cracks every 20 feet. Beat you to death at 55 MPH.
Years ago it was 40and rising,not so much any more .I have paved many NJ state jobs where the water in the rollers would freeze while running.