Hi guys I'm going to college this fall for heavy equipment operation and maintenance and I'm going to be needing some tools. I got most of my stuff picked out other than the sockets because I'm stuck on 6 point vs 12 point? Which would you guys recommend? Do you see a lot of 12 point bolts in the diesel world where I would need 12 point sockets or would I be better off with 6 point so I don't round off the bolt? I need 1/4", 3/8", and 1/2" drive sockets in metric/standard and shallow/deep so maybe a mix of 6 and 12 point in each drive size would be good? Any help would be appreciated. Also if you have any other tools that you really like or think a diesel tech should have could you let me know.
Honestly it is very rare I run into anything that requires a 12 point socket. I'm working on everything from small gas engines up to larger construction equipment. I do have about 50/50 mix of 6 and 12 point sockets and I honestly can't remember the last time I rounded off a bolt head with a 12 point.
I'm with 92U 3406 on rounding things.... can't remember the last time... of course that could be age related As for 12 points being rare... they might be but when you need one you need one! Have run into them on various drivelines, starters and a few other odds and ends.
This is very true, seems like more and more things come with the 12 point bolts. Might be an idea to get 12 points in the shallow sockets and 6 points in the deep. Or if you are also going to be getting impact sockets that would give you the six points when you needed them. No matter what you have there is always going to be a time when you need something different. One of the joys of working on equipment.
You'll see 12 point on certain head bolts, tight clearance starter bolts etc. A good set of 1/2" 12 point impact will cover 99% of the 12 point stuff you come across. There will be the odd occasion a 1/2" socket won't physically fit and you'll need a 3/8 drive. Mine are GP and most of the 12 point haven't been used. Most common used are 1/2,9/16 and 3/4. At least the yellow iron I'm around on a regular basis. First set of good deep and shallow 6 point impacts need to be 1/2" and a good set of 3/8, impact if you want but it's not necessary with them. I've got both but it's an accumulation over 20 years. It's fun to look at all the shiny stuff on the tool truck but Amazon has good stuff too, also napa does 30% off their tools before 9am the second Saturday of every month. I like their ratchets, pry bars and some other stuff. Get good hammers, punches and pry bars fairly early in the process too. There's a nice set of punches Mahew has on Amazon that even include 4 bearing race punches. Good value and should last a long time. Just keep the dingleberries ground off them Good luck!
Swivel impact sockets. Absolutely love those. I have a metric set of shallow 3/8" and shallow 1/2" drive. Those babies have more than paid for themselves especially when working on compact stuff like forklifts.
X2 on that!
If you buy quality sockets there it's not likely you will round off anything.
You guys must work on better equipment and not have gorillas as friends that expect you to help fix their screw ups. The six point socket is the only way to go when you get in trouble. That's what the impact sockets are for. The chrome ones are fine 12 point. Another handy thing to get eventually is a set of the flex drive gear wrenches, they were just on sale at Maynerds for $30.
Delmers suggestion on flex drive gear wrenches is solid in my book. Great tools for many jobs. 6 points in impacts and 12 in crome is good in my experience as well. Have not rounded many bolts cause then it's way harder to get out! no gorilla arms here. I have also found you can't have too many extensions of various sizes. I'll have four on to pull a bolt with ease at a distance vs trying to squeeze my way into an machine and knuckle a bolt loose. Good luck in school, good career choice!
^^ X2 on the extensions I usually keep at least 6 feet of 1/2 extensions, a 36" a 24" a couple of 16/18's and various other shorter ones... it takes around 5 feet for late nineties ford E4OD trannys to do it with ease.
12 point impact sockets, connecting rod bolts-capscrews and nuts...Cummins K19 series, lots of 12point capscrews.
Just don't get too excited and over-buy things, start with a basic set that you know you'll need, then build off that. Take notes daily of different tools you may need or had to borrow. Impact swivel sockets are a must. And 1/4" and 3/8" flexhead ratchets. I can take a photo of a speciality tool cart I made that holds tools I use 98% of the time. Everybody is different, like I prefer semi deep metric impacts.
Yeah like he said a lot of 12pts I see are with engine work once you start pullin pans and covers off.
All these suggestions are good. Have you check with the school? I would think a school with a good program would have a list of tools that they recommend for new students.
Hey guys thanks for your replies I really appreciate it. I will definitely check out these suggestions. As for a tool list the school did supply me with one but it was very basic, they didn't list if the sockets needed to be 6 or 12. After reading these replies I think I will get 12 point chrome sockets and 6 point impact. That way I will have both for when the need arises. Also for tools I was thinking of going with Matco because they offer me a 60% off student discount. Have any of you guys used or heard anything good/bad about Matco?
I'm probably going to catch some grief for this, but oh well. When I started at a local Freightliner dealership I bought my impact sockets from Harbor Freight because it was all I could afford. They came in nice metal cases at the time too. Used them extensively with a half inch Ingersoll-Rand impact and never had an issue. Still have them today, 10 years later. I no longer use them commercially, but it got me in the game at a greatly discounted price. As far as the 6 vs 12 point question, I agree on a good set of chrome 12pts in all the common sizes. Especially the 1/4". Used 1/4" 12 point sockets on the square end of thread taps all the time. Can't always get the big t-handle where you need to work.
When it comes to sockets, I tend to stay with the cheaper sets. I use 1/2" drive 90% of the time and have a mixture of mastercraft, craftsman, and other automotive store brands. They've lasted me 8+ years, and the only time I need to replace them is when I loose them. For me, that's the big thing when it comes to sockets. I have a bad habit of leaving them behind, or dropping them into the abyss, so I just can't bring myself to by the expensive ones. For my 12 points I have a set of chrome 3/8" drive ones, and its always done me. I use them on driveshaft/u-joints and starters for the most part. I also have an SK 1/4 drive set, that has had many of the sockets replaced over the years, but I'm not sure I could live without it. Its come in handy in small places, and goes up to 1/2, and 15mm.
A bit of general tool etiquette advice. IF you're fortunate enough for a seasoned mechanic to let you borrow what you don't have for a specific task for God's sake don't loose it and damn sure bring it back clean. Also, some guys don't want you putting it back unless you know exactly where it goes and some still don't because the thought of somebody rooting around in their box is unsettling..... Hopefully that saves you an *** chewing
I really like gearwrench brand tools not just the wrenches but sockets and other hand tools too decent tools at a good price Nothing wrong with matco all brands will have there ups and downs I started school with a homemade wooden roll cabinet and some clearance craftsman sockets still have both 20 years later but only use the box for occasional tools I tend to have more tools than most and spend less money I used to cringe watching the foolish purchases on the tool truck
We would'nt be in Business without Harbor Freight! God Bless those Chinese children.
Matco is pretty much the only tool truck I will buy off of now. Snap-on and Mac ignored us for years chasing after the big companies (our shop only has about 10 guys). Matco always came by regularly and gave us great deals all the time. I can't complain, the tools are on par with Snap-on and Mac IMO.
Just pay attention to the financing numbers. The interest rate on an account with mac or snap on is above 20%. Buy tools as you need them. Different breeds of equipment require different tools. If its something I dont use much I'm not paying more then I have to. Amazon prices beat the heck out of tool truck prices.
25% credit is with corporate financing. Don't know about everyone but you can usually get a few thousand on the "truck" account, which doesn't have any additional interest than is already in the price lol.
I would get whatever Taiwan or USA sockets that you can afford. I was buying Snap On and proto but after losing a few into the "Abyss" I buy the cheap grey pneumatic or sunnex. Big thing I dont like about them is they are only laser etched. Sockets rarely break. Unless you're talking chrome on impact or something. I'd 2nd the motion for the Matco tools flex head ratchets, I like them the best. Snap on has a finer head but their locking mechanism sucks and the beams aren't as strong. For wrenches I'd look at Wright, Proto, and get the smaller sizes in the Snap on flank drive also. Angle wrenches from Snap on, especially if you have a student discount? I like the Matco screwdrivers, same ones napa used to sell, by witte germany. If you're looking for some decent cheap air tools, look at astro pneumatic, they sell a lot of stuff the trucks rebrand.
A good set of angle wrenches can be a life saver.....there are a lot of cheap sets on amazon but i prefer the snap on because the angles are a little different. I have a mix of different socket brands, most 1/4 and 3/8 are snap on. Most of my 1/2 is gearwrench. I have chrome 6 and 12 point and all 6 point impact because I have found times on a lot of newer equipment that a 6 point impact is just too fat to get into small spaces. I have found a lot of broken or rusted snap on and mac tools at the flea market for dirt cheap and got them warrantied on the tool truck no problem
Most Matco ratchets are rebranded Armstrong units and the locking flex head ones are awesome.
I don't have a Matco guy so I don't have anything matco. The mac guy we used to have gave up the mac brand and now sells gear wrench for double what it retails for plus interest, so the only tool man I will deal with is the snap on guy....when he actually shows up. I have so many broken mac tools it's unreal and no way to warranty them now except ship them to mac directly.
I had a broken mac ratchet, I emailed them a picture of it and asked what kit I needed to order from them to fix it. I never heard a response, but about 5 days later a ups package showed up with a repair kit for it. No charge. I'd contact their customer service, what have you got to lose? As far as the original poster and tools: You really need both. I rarely buy any tools new, when I do its something I usually can't find elsewhere. I've put together most of my tools from craigslist, and ebay. A few items from pawnshops and auctions. You can buy any name brand you want, for 1/2 or less of new price. Don't be short of tools and borrowing from other people, no one likes that. Don't pay new full price and you can afford to have both. I've been burnt, one too many times, with harbor freights cheap chinese tools, I buy nothing from them unless I'm in a rush and they're the only place open that has what I need. The last two items I've got from them were a 1" drive set on a saturday a few years ago, because I needed a big socket size I didn't have. The second time the ratchet broke, I just threw it in the scrap bin, and bought a Wright set. The last thing I bought was a set of wheel dollies to put a car on, in a rush also on a saturday, a couple months ago. The casters were junk and they got returned, I found a usa set to replace them for the next time I need them. I know its expensive starting out, but buy once/ cry once. Buy good USA tools, and they will last you your working life. But I wouldn't buy new off the tool truck, and I'm not real brand loyal. I've got old usa craftsman, S-K, proto, wright, mac, lisle, matco, and snap on. I don't use my tools everyday as a mechanic in a shop, its just to fix my own equipment. I also don't have any swivel impact sockets, I guess they need to go on my list, I'm missing out?
A tip I haven't seen mentioned is when you get a set of sockets or wrenches they used to come in a molded plastic tray in a box. I would throw the lid away and put the whole works in a drawer, then a Quick glance at the tool box and you know what's missing and go find it.
Dead horse but a few things to add.... A chrome 12pt shallow set in 1/4", 3/8" and 1/2". Deep impact for the rest. Any cheaper brand will work for the impacts. A better brand for the 12pt because sooner or later they will be on the end of an impact. Grind the impacts a little thinner on the end if needed to fit. Medium to better for hand wrenches because the cheapos flex or don't fit the head correctly. Snap-on bodies are too sharp for my liking. I like to have a few different brands of end wrenches (cheap is fine for the extras) around because the indexing is different. Sometimes you need to switch brands and do short strokes to get a fastener out. Flex-head ratchets are great but I like a solid one if possible. Same as using a swivel for an extension. They work but expect some busted knuckles. I don't know if you care but I've had good luck with aircat impacts. Best bang for the buck that I've found. Yes there are others that may hit harder but spend many times the money. A few psi of pressure can make the difference. I will burn up a cheaper impact socket (or 2) doing a complete pad change-out on a dozer or excavator so I keep a few high-end sockets in those sizes for those jobs but a set of Tekton or similar will get you by until there is some money coming in. Good luck in school. You are getting into a market with a dwindling availability of good hands. The boss can't just replace a good mechanic with a GPS.