We purchased a Cat 330 in August of 22 that came with Earthworks and all the bells and whistles. Our older GPS system from Trimble (GCS900) has worked almost flawlessly, with the only real issue being to see enough satellites in some of the areas that we work in. The new system has been plagued with connection problems between (I am way over my head in describing these components) machine ECMs, receivers, and IMUs, which I think are the individual sensors. This manifests itself in error codes, inability to calibrate for tooth wear, inability to receive data, and general lack of reliability. Fortunately, we usually have the GCS900 system on site to double check things. Our Sitech technician is really sharp. Yesterday I was about to come completely unhinged at the cost of these systems, and that the "efficiency" that they provide makes them pay for themselves. The amount of time we spend, often with three or four other machines sitting idle waiting for our technology to decide to perform, has been ridiculous. We are working in a relatively remote area with no cell phone service, and our 330 communicates via LTE rather than satellite (with the dealer for diagnosis purposes). It's a three plus hour drive from the closest dealer store to our site. I got our tech out there yesterday to try and figure out what is wrong. He found the problem and, at least for now, it is working perfectly. My understanding of the issue is: Our receivers are licensed and programmed to use specific satellite systems, one of which I believe is called GLONASS. For whatever reason, our machine is the only one in our dealer's system in which our receivers were trying to use satellites from a non-licensed newer satellite system. I think he said that it is a system run by Japan, not that that matters. Our tech was able to go into the machine administrative system on lock out all other systems, and we are good now. I have questions as to why Cat, Trimble, and our Cat/Sitech dealer allowed a machine to be sold that wasn't automatically set correctly as a default, but the point of this thread is to make other folks aware, despite which system is used (Topcon, Trimble, Deere, etc.), that perhaps it is worth mentioning to your tech if seemingly unexplained problems arise to ask them to verify that the receivers and base are only using the correct satellite systems. On our machine there was no fault code or error message that gave any indication that the data received from the satellites may be compromised. Again, this is all way over my head and I may be characterizing the issues incorrectly, but if you run into something really weird with your system it might pay to mention the possibility of using incorrect or un-licensed satellites. I suppose if a person wanted to put their foil hat on one might even suspect cyber-terrorism in this day and age. It pays to check in on control points every day!
I love GPS for it's utility but when you have a stakeless jobsite and it goes down for whatever reason it can certainly raise blood pressure.
You can say that again! When Sitech was setting up our 325 with full auto they had an issue with the system communicating with the machines ECM. The machine was still at the dealer we had not taken delivery fortunately. They fixed the problem and "knocks on wood" - so far so good. Very strange your one machine went rogue on satellites. What was the machine doing? Giving wrong grades or just not doing anything? Thanks for sharing the problem - might just help out a frustrated member one day.
As I imagine is the case with yours, in Earthworks we have to do a tool tip calibration rather than just a blade/tooth wear measurement. At first everything was fine except that the elevation was off .4'. We got around that by entering a vertical offset. Then, it began to get off on horizontal. Next, the ecm(s) would not communicate with the imu(s) but would give an error stating no communication with the left receiver. We tried shutting it off, swapping sides with the receivers, and shutting off master key to reset which has worked in the past, but no luck this time. Finally, we switched receivers with our old GCS900 receivers off our 320D. The system was up and working, but roughly .5' off on both horizontal and vertical. The 320D worked just fine with the new receivers. We made do with that and the rover until the tech could get there. I wonder sometimes if we experience problems just because of our location and obstructions from mountains and trees, but certainly the same issues can occur near buildings.
I'm not great on the 3D Trimble side, but have pretty extensive experience on the Cat side. Has anyone really spent the time to go through this machine and set it up right? I've found the guys doing PDI dont really understand grade, and don't take the time to do a lot of the setup that should be done for the machine. The Trimble guys just slam a radio and receivers, do a measure up, and go on their way. The machine is really less than ideal because it don't get the attention it should from either side and performance suffers. It's gotten better as you can factory order machines with full blown 3D now, and it gives the dealer techs a lot more available tools and info. Are the IMU's yellow 6 wire or black 4 wire? And you can still get a PL631 product link radio that communicates on satellite for VisionLink. I personally think they work like crap, but if you have no cell service, it's better than nothing.
We have a GeoMax TS and TopCon Viper system base station, and rover. Trees and mnts are a huge issue. Realizing none of that has to do with Trimble, but more of a misery loves company post. We have the same issue with geography. Trees are a real problem and it doesn't take much. Perhaps the real issue is its not that it doesn't work, it sometimes will work its just the grades are off. So you cant just assume its correct when the conditions are not in the clear. We still use the Topcon LPS system with a prism for grade control. If there is an upside to this we can sometimes, set up the LPS to operate where the GPS cannot. So we can double check at times. But trees are the biggest issue for us, it would be almost better if it just told you that the signal is problematic than to give you incorrect grades. Oxbow if your still working of hwy 75 on by the dredge project, I can imagine with those tall mnts you could go without any signal. Maybe adding LPS to some machines would be an option. Its not really that expensive to add that option if you already have GPS at least from Topcon, not sure on Trimble. As long as the TS can see the prism it is incredibly accurate, fractions of an inch accurate. I will also add this, we were having major issues with the ECM and IMU not communication as well (Topcon). My dedicated techno nerd developed a work around, but it took a long time, did not always work. I finally just called out Topcon and discovered that the software versions were not compatible ( which shouldn't be my problem, they installed it during set up, but whatever. The tech got everything up to date and current and it works like a charm. Perhaps your issue is similar? You may have different versions of software that are not jiving together.
The above is a good suggestion and applies to Trimble as well. It's worth checking into. Working in mountains with GPS can be frustrating due to the inconsistency of the accuracy. The accuracy can be dead on for a week and a half then suddenly randomly shift inches or more vertically and/or horizontally for an hour, half, a day, or a week. One way to deal with it is to check a known good grade every hour, give or take, and adjust your offset to match. This is a bandaid solution but can be the difference between keeping the project moving forward or coming to a halt. It's imperative your operator is aware of the weakness of GPS in this environment and is constantly watching for inconsistencies. Some things that can help. This assumes the machine is working correctly. - When setting up your base station, set it as close to the center of the valley or clearing as possible so it has the widest possible view of the sky. - Adjust the base station antenna elevation mask from the default of 10 degrees to 20, 25, or 30 degrees. This narrows it's view of the sky and helps prevent receiving reflected and multi path signals. - Avoid setting up the base station under or near power lines and sub stations. - Know what your elevation mask is and keep all equipment, trucks, trailers, porta johns, etc below that line. I have seen my grade in the dozer jump 3 tenths when the roller operator parked 30 feet from the base, causing multi path signals. I try to keep a 100' radius around the base clear of anything that's taller than the antenna. Obviously not all of this is practical on every job. The big ones are setting the base with the largest view of the sky, avoiding power lines, and adjusting the elevation mask.
This thread may be some valuable info for us. Our 325 is acting up being consistently off .3-.4’ compared to the dozer. Tech has came out but still head scratching. Will report back BTW - our Cat dealer bought out Sitech Alabama and FL Panhandle.
have u done any remote flashes. Seems to screw earthworks up on the cat hoes. Put u off grade takes time to find grade jumps up and down on monitor and reading are diff from flat buck to curled out. Are Sitech dealer did some updates got it running better then new. They have are new 336 and 352 working perfectly too. Boss singed papers with are cat dealer not to send the flashes