I recently received a letter from the Massachusetts Registry of Motor Vehicles stating that I would need to provide them with my Federal DOT number in order to re register my truck. Well, I don't have a DOT number. I figured that since I don't transport people for hire, transport HAZ MAT or cross state lines I was exempt. Unfortunately it looks like they have changed the "interstate" to "intrastate". Maybe it was always that way, I don't know. I'm just a small time carpenter with a few pieces of equipment and hauling a few loads of sand or stone from the pit about 3 miles up the road and I hate dealing with this ****!
So, I decided to give in and sign up. What a ridiculous system. Took me soo long to complete. And of course, as soon as I completed the registration I began receiving emails, text messages and 'phone calls, all by people trying to sound or look like they were from the government claiming that they were here to help me. Yeah right.
And the FMCSA web site. What a bunch of crap. You can't just scroll through the regulations. You gotta click links to every section, which of course references other sections, Which I have know idea what the other sections say, but cannot read them unless I click back to the main page, blah, blah, blah..... https://www.fmcsa.dot.gov/regulations The only thing that I've got so far is that I have to implement a random drug and alcohol test program on myself??!? Unbelievable.
So, If anyone is familiar with how to navigate this mess I would be very grateful for any and all legitimate information. Thanks
I think you’re on track. I registered my truck years ago (Washington state) and obtained DOT number- intrastate. I don’t remember it being too difficult. There are updates you need to do every two years. My vehicle registration comes with a note that I’m required to have/show a DOT number, however, I’ve never been asked in 10 yrs. I also joined a drug testing consortium that puts me in a random pool. There do seem to be lots of regs and, the more you read ‘em, it seems there’s more you need to do. I’ve only gone to the FMSCA site a couple times and found I had to do a bunch of searching to find what I wanted...not sure I could find it quickly again. Good luck, Darryl
....and don’t forget annual vehicle inspections.
Last February I spent an hour and a half with a WSP truck inspector, very professional and very helpful. I run a Kenworth T600 service truck, I do have a DOT number, I am self employed with no employees, intrastate only. What it came down to is making sure I have my truck inspected annually. Since I do not haul for hire I do not have to deal with the UTC so I don't have to do any bi-annual reports and because I am self employed I don't have to do any drug testing. I to was getting all kinds of 3rd party emails about what I needed to be doing so I figured the best way to find out is talk to the WSP.
Thanks Darryl, I appreciate the input. Obviously you pay for the drug testing but is the drug testing consortium a service that you pay for? Is it a service through your local doctor or part of some online service?
Thanks excavator. I'm guessing you mean Washington State Police? If so, I think that's a great idea. I used to run Maine plates on my trailers. I heard for so many guys that "oh, it's perfectly legal" " save a ton of money" . So one day I went by the local state police barracks and spoke to the Commercial Enforcement Officer. "Totally illegal!" Which means also that if you have an "incident" The insurance that we pay so much for will provide you with no coverage!
There are several "random" dot pool companies. Mine is all online. It's called "Heath Street". $100/ year. Sign up, give them your drivers info, once a month they send out a email showing if anyone got chosen for a random. When I first signed up, I think I got chosen 4 times in 6 months, its been much less often in the last few years. https://www.health-street.net/product/dot-random-pool/
I’ve been using USHealthworks. Pay about the same annually, then pay about $70 when called up.
Most times a person in your setting can cut through a bunch of red tape by taking to a DOT inspector or weigh master when it comes to paper work and regulations. Because you have a small business yes you need a DOT number but there are so many things that don't apply also, so save your self the grief and talk to DOT. But remember regulations change yearly.
Currently I keep a pre trip log book in the truck, yearly state inspection, and health card that includes drug test.
The health card drug test doesn't cover the being in a "random" pool. Just keep your trucks older so you don't have the headaches of e-logs. The regulations are dreamed up by all the big trucking outfits with the insurance companies and bankers, then "suggested" to the pencil pushers in gov't, to drive all the little guys out of the game. Nothing like a monopoly. "Its for the children, and safety "
I do not thank you have to do that for yourself.
Actually the big trucking companies don't want the regulations anymore than the little guy with one rig. If everyone on here knew of the full load of crap the interstate trucking companies put up with from insurance companies to federal dot requirements most would have little to grip about. For instance in order to have a trusted carrier plate your equipment and drivers better not have X amount of violations or you lose it and your insurance premiums go up. I have to keep a constant count on equipment for service and keep it cared for in case the insurance company shows up for service records audit. and it better be up to date. Every trailer hauling prepared food must have a secure lock box covering the swing latch on the right door with a stout padlock-a mere 650.00. That has to do with home land security-and to be locked even when empty. The list goes on and on. What is killing the owner operator is the emission equipment and how unreliable it is. There is plenty of loads out there running refrigerated equipment. The problem for everyone is being able to cover costs of lost revenue because the catalytic system took a dump and it's down for a week. You have to own 14 trucks to cover 1 truck in the shop. We run 65 tractors and at least 3 are in the dealer shop on warranty repairs/or non warranty repairs at any given time anywhere across the U.S. Plus if your going to be in the trucking business you better buck up and have one of these also. You will probably be going broke if you don't-another added expense.
The Washington State Patrol truck inspector I talked to had been a trooper for 18 years and he told me that until he moved to the truck inspection side he had no idea what truck drivers/ trucking companies have to go though.
My semi is registered over 26k lbs for "Farm Use" does that mean I have to do the same? No hauling of any loads except for my personal junk.
That reminds me, I gotta do a better job of keeping a written service log.
You should talk to DOT for the state you are plated for, in cases like that where it is used for personal conveyance most states have limited regulations for that use.
Not to change this to a political thread because I hate political discussions or anything to do with politics online. But when deregulation came along in the early 80's implemented by RR that's when things started a downward spiral in the trucking business. Before that you ran permits for what you could haul and permitted in each state you ran. For instance {household goods fell under a certain permit, and that permit could be contested by other trucking companies in that area. If you had a Grand Daddy permit it was worth gold and was transferable. When deregulation took affect it allowed any and everyone in the business and freight rates took it in the *** and junk on the road. And in the end you have all the regulations that we have now to try a control the business. Petepilot was a old time trucker from that era and I'm sure he can expound on this also. In the old days the signage for permits on the side of a C.O.E. read like the reader board at the local Dairy Queen back in the 60's, out here it was common to see 11 states listed with permit numbers because most licenced for 11 western states.
I run into 'farm use' guys once in a while: no cdl required, up to 105,500 I think, and in WA I think... a hundred and something mile radius from the farm. Can't remember if there were any other limits but most of the guys have never been pulled over.
CDL is required for farm use in Washington. But the minute you load for hire the rules change. You can haul your own grain as long as it comes from your elevator on your property, if you store your grain in a pooled elevator then the grain is co-mingled and becomes commercial hauling. Plus if you have hired drivers you have to have them in a drug test pool if they work on the farm.--------Nobody gets away.
As everyone heard about my thing of getting CDL even though might not ever get pulled over just from how this rig looks, I got one and believe those on farms should have one too when a vehicle gets that large and heavy. When a vehicle gets over 26,0001 lbs it's out of the states hands on if you need a license or not, it's in federal jurisdiction now as they told me, even if it's registered under 26,0001 lbs the door or pillar sticker says otherwise. If not found they will pull the VIN and run it to get it, hope one has $2500 saved up or in aggravated cases $5000 and up to 90 days in jail for no CDL and that' doesn't include impounding or having to get someone with CDL to move it off the road.
Just prior to dereg I bought the KW and reciprocity from Red River Trucking Portland OR, maintained the name until went broke in 82 and was still paying that debt load including the reciprocity(Was in the Loan) as the truck went away. Started off Flat bed loads only then after dereg hit dragged everything from refrigerated and Dry van to low deck machine and materials moves, Eagle Division IML furnished the trailers and load outs.
...and if the heavy wrecker shows up you better hope that they let you sign over the title and call it even.
State of MO, so long as only hauling your own goods does not require CDL classification to truck type driven. That stated, as noted when stoop to hauling for the Neighbor or out of a grain elevator all that changes to CDL required, Correct Type and Endorsements.
I was talking to one of the farm drivers less than two months ago while he was unloading and he told me he did not have a cdl and has been hauling the vegetables from the farm he works at..( might be on the OR side of the columbia not sure...) He said he lives in WA and has been doing this since he retired 6-7 years ago.
I should have written that better Ronsii, The farm/ag regulations in this state do very, but it has to do with GVW. There are still many farmers around here that think they are exempt because they are a farmer. The ag regulations in this state are a gray area depending on the dot officer you talk to. But the fact is exempt in some ways not in others they still have to comply with dot safety standards and legal weight. They can also run over on hours but only during a harvest.
So this afternoon I had a few minutes so I called my primary care physician’s office. I figured that if they do the **** test for my DOT Health Card then maybe they are familiar with this testing consortium thing. I spoke with Mary, who is sweet and always answers the ‘phone, and I explained the reason for my call. After an awkward moment of silence, Mary replied,” well,… we do drug testing on patients that we prescribe drugs to so we can verify that they’re actually taking the medication and not selling it on the street,…. is that what you’re looking for dear?" No Mary, not quite. So I repeated the reason for my call, this time slower and with smaller words. Mary says “Hold on” now I can hear Mary speaking to someone in the background who has a slightly larger brain and when she returns she says, “ So you have a trucks?" Yes maam. “What kind?” Dump truck. “And you have a DOT number?” Yes I do Mary. “ Well, If you want us to watch you pee in a cup, we don’t do that here.” Mary,.. “yes dear” Thank you so much for your help today. “You’re welcome dear!”
This guy works for the farm owner, the owner bought a few of these trucks and keeps some of them road legal: I think they were frightliners... maybe 04'ish they license them at more than 80 grand the trailers are 53 footers and they deliver year round to one of the big manufacturers in the valley.
What type of manufacturing? The problem that has arisen is the fact the farm machinery keeps getting bigger and heaver. Farmers are try to exceed the 105 limit, One here this last summer got his ticket moving a low track 8 with two shank ripper and blade. Over width, Over weight and he had been doing it for some time til he got caught and it was a two axle lowboy and no drop axle.
The manufacturer slices/dices,cooks,seasons and bags the product. If I remember right they didn't exceed the 105,000 gvwt. I think he told me he does 2-3 trips a week to up here.
Found a pic of one of their trucks.
Trailer looks like agricultural commodities hauling ...Live bottom ... Potatoes ? I Saw many open trucks in CA hauling tomatoes years ago. Section 32934 of MAP–21 provides a statutory exemption from most of the FMCSRs, including those pertaining to commercial driver’s licenses (CDL) and driver physical qualifications (medical) requirements, for the operation of covered farm vehicles by farm and ranch operators, their employees, and certain other specified individuals https://www.govinfo.gov/content/pkg/FR-2012-10-01/pdf/2012-24106.pdf
Hold on folks, it's going to get bumpy soon. https://finance.yahoo.com/news/fmcsa-increases-random-drug-testing-201104336.html
Oh I've gotten enough mail in the last month and a half that CDL trucks are off my list as of Midnight next Tuesday. F### the state and Fed Gov. I cant afford having them in my pocket over two trucks that really don't do much. They can have my CDL next renewal too. Enough is enough.
Told 'em to stick their cdl up their ass a couple years ago. The once in a blue moon I get behind the wheel, its a farm truck. And they wonder why there is a shortage of drivers..... Ed
If you wrap a towel around your head they wont bother you.
And if they do pretend to not know English... Jut reply with... As-salamu alaykum
In the places we do a *lot* of repair there must be at least a hundred different 'drivers' that would fit that description... most barely speak a few words of something kinda like english they point and make hand gestures a lot.... they can't back up a rig with a trailer for ****! they can't seem to really drive without catching things with the sides of the rigs either and they have a great tan but they sure can get a CDL easy.
I always keep a turban and an ak47 behind the seat..... Ed
It's getting to be the standard thing to do I kinda prefer the AK-74 myself though...
Gotta be a little difficult finding ammo for that isn't it? Don't ever see a deal on 5.45X39.
I've found pretty good deals on the russian steel stuff, just be careful when you're grabbing mags and don't put them in your AR... they don't quite chamber
Yeah, if you can claim 'not for hire' and you're only dragging your own **** around then the paperwork is simplified as are the drug testing and log requirements.
Ronsii … About the Russian Steel .223 The word is the steel doesn't deform and seal the chamber as well as softer brass. The blow-by makes for a dirtier chamber. Previous anti-rust coatings on the steel made for extraction failures. Not so much currently. I've used 1000's of steel Tule and Wolf in a 5.6 chamber for fun. Maybe different in a .223 chamber. But, I like the easy pick up of magnetic cases. In the case of serious **** use, then I'll use Lake City XM-193 in brass cases.
Yeah, I *may* have burned through a case or ten wolf/tula/etc... steel case ammo. I know what you mean on picking em' up... got a few different mag tools just for that Btw, when I said don't quite chamber I was referencing ksss's post about the 5.45 ammo in a 5.56 chamber
Checked my mail in Montana I guess this doesn't affect owners who just have a CDL that is used for private use or farm use cause nothing about wanting me to take a whiz test in there. Though there was 5 months of local news paper piled up in there
a friend of mine has an F-550, that hauls a little firewood, so he figured he better get a DOT#...wasn't long after he gets a call from a "FMCA Officer" wanting to go over his DOT application with him...My friend agreed, since there were some questions that he wasn't sure if he answered right...after that, he said he would connect them with a "Safety Dept" to make sure he is compliant, and it would be $187 to complete his registration...he said ok, gave credit card #, and went through the ordeal... Wasn't long after, he got another similar call, from a different person...My friend, thinking it was from the real FMCA, said he just talked to so and so...they said he doesn't work there or something... So then he put 2 and 2 together, and immediately called credit card company and had the payment stopped and Card terminated...the CC Customer service person understood the scam, and were very helpful...
Yup, 6 weeks later and the scammers are still stalking me.
Some how the scammers get access to the DOT mailing list to get your address . Have the clerk at the Post office show you the difference between first class postage and bulk mailing AKA junk mail that most of the scammers use. Bob
They had his information AND phone # within a few hours...
DOT is still not our friend.
Been noted NO CDL for RV owners, HOWEVER, with the MO Brown Shirt DOT if they decide applicable they will fly a sign states ALL Trailers and trucks weigh, THAT includes RVs just as CO does. Have seen a number of treasured RVs behind the St. Clair Pevely and Caruthersville Scales, not seen any on I-70 at either end. STL DOT will stop them on occasion and the tickets DO stick.
All your DOT info (and every other company with a DOT #) is available on the DOT website.
What are they after with the RV's? We know the drivers are CDL exempt, even though some people with Greyhound conversions shouldn't be driving them . But what are they looking for?
$$$$$.
There is that.
Reason I stick to DOT regulations as closely as possible, inspect as if I was hauling for money, I know my height/weight each axle and have CDL even though it’s considered a RV here. Also as the saying goes, cover your *** in paperwork and knowledge!
Brakes, Lighting, frame issues, hitch issues, lack of capacity of tow vehicle for work performed, tires, safety equipment and most of all people inside towed vehicles. That from the neighbor Brown Shirt. He has had several with not only faulty but failed brakes, axle seals running oil across brakes, systems frozen in place, fluid leaks of brake fluid or PS Fluid with Hyro-boost systems, MASSIVE exhaust leaks, broken springs, cracked windows, just in general lack of maintenance or physical inspections before putting to highways. His worst was ALL the above and had Propane leaking so severely the station shut off their heat so as not to set off a fire, had a fresh filled 80g tank relief would not seat, owner had three gallons of PS Fluid and Brake fluid to refill for leaks. 81 year old Owner could or would NOT justify repairs costs had it towed off by salvage yard. Matt stated these can be beyond SCARY!! and they are on our roads EVERY DAY.
Had a Driver/Lineman in ESL IL, was caught DUI, fought it as was in a CAR not a truck so should not affect his CDL where of course LOST and lost license. The misconception is that while NOT driving as a Commercial Driver the license is unaffected by inspections of driven vehicle, UNTRUE, you drive a RV as noted that fails DOT standards that can affect your license or how you are approached as to use of your license, you Become a Highly Marked Target.
I don't drink and drive nor even enjoy a drink if and when I ever eat out. I do know even though not in the rig that CDL drivers are held to higher/stricter standards even in their POV (Privately owned vehicle) whether it be car or RV. Actually had to call up the insurance for my rig and asked why payment didn't come out this month, they said well your insurance dropped in price and won't have to pay for 2 months till it renews, which puts my car, pickup truck and this rig insurance at $149 a month. I don't just inspect and fix things for me but for everyone on the road and a broken part only leads to more in cost to fix the longer it remains broken. So if the DOT wants to pull this rig over so be it, I will give them the tour, won't be happy about it but I keep this place squared away pretty well. Lastly no propane is left on in here when going down the road nor after cooking, I have a AC/DC fridge/freezer and diesel heater.
OK, I see now. So next Tuesday when the brownshirts are bored they can start waving cars and pickups in? Kind of what it amounts to. I guess as a mechanic I don't even think about the condition of other peoples RVs but not being a commercial vehicle it kind of bugs me that they can pull that stuff legally. If they want to inspect mine that way, they are entirely welcome to... after they put in a car lane too. ETA... this is mostly a revenue scheme.
But you guys missed the biggest violations while operating a RV. The first thing they check is how good the tater salad and fried chicken is in the fridge by a taste test. Next they check the type and price of the beer in the fridge. If it's low budget brand your in for a big ticket. Lime Jello with shredded carrots that's a $150 buck ticket right there for putting carrots in it. Ice Cream you better be packing Dryers or their really going to get pi$$ed. Then they check the freezer, better not have any 80/20 % fat hamburger, nope 85/15% only. Mayonnaise- Best Foods only that's 50 bucks, and only French's mustard, that's a 75 buck ticket. Hot dogs, only 1/4 pounders that's a 100 buck ticket. And the buns no day old better be fresh, that's a 200 buck ticket. Best thing to do is sell the RV.
I'm really in agreement about the carrots.
The true violation there is the lime Jello. It's suppose to be orange jello, then the carrots are ok.. But only if there's pineapple in there too.
I like to see them clamber their fat *** up here pass the solar panels and come check the inside of our "house" out, might have to call EMS to pick one up from the ground. There is 2 steps upward in 53 inches of height to get to back porch between less than 24 inches of walk room between solar panels after they clamber over the tow bar for the car.
LOL, I was wondering how you entered... I thought maybe there was a side walk... hard to tell in the pics.
"...people in towed vehicles..." Bahhaha!! What's wrong with that? As long as they have their seatbelt on, right? Now if they're texting in the towed vehicle that's a different story. Has to be hands free.
I think in Wa. it used to be that passengers were allowed in a fifth wheel trailer as long as they rode in the portion over the tow vehicle. What difference would that make? I had a Heeler that would jump up on the gooseneck flat bed and back to the truck bed on the road, that was fearless. One day she ran off the deck trying to "chase" another dog on the ground and got her butt kicked by the other dog. She stayed on the truck after that.
When I was a kid I used to work a second shift teamsters job out of South Boston. A bunch of us laborers would pile into the back of a box truck and head out of southy after dark to points unknown. Back door would be closed but side doors open.
When I was a kid everybody put kids/adults in the pickup box... heck we'd always load up a bunch of boxes in yakima and wenatchee then head back across I90 with at least a few people in the truck bed.
In the 70s when we went on family vacations it was in a Chevy pickup pulling a 28' travel trailer, me and two little brothers covered most of the western US riding in the open. A crew cab would have been nice when it rained.
Just was glad to hear the BILs Idjit neighbor that lost his 5th Wheel in CO did not have his wife in 'The Galley' cooking up dinner as was their usual custom. Would have been a ride!!
Well now this thread has gone the RV route so you need a perfect rolling **** house song to go along with it.
The thing to remember with RV's is do NOT park them behind the big mining shovel!!!
My fault
Not your fault Spud_Monkey, there's hardly a thread on here that doesn't take a left or right turn some where.
Actually anymore a semi with a sleeper is just another motor home/chuck wagon. And with the caliber of some of the drivers these days it's probably more of a homeless shelter on 22.5 rubber.
*Looks around, where did that come from or in what reply is that to*
I saw a moving van the other day that I swear had a 12 foot plus sleeper that was 2-3 feet taller than the truck cab pulling a 45(?) foot possum belly bedbug trailer. How can you have any payload left on that rig? My 32' motorhome weighs in at almost 14,000 with full fuel and water tanks. I'm betting that sleeper was pushing 8,000 added to the truck.
I've seen a few of them types around here, they always look huge!!!! and at light I'm thinking some of them must run a separate 50kw plant just for the lighting
It's a fact, my company has three drivers living in there trucks and all three look and dress like a homeless person, not a very good image for the company. And it's very common these days, most every OTR has the problem.
Years ago I did an appraisal on a max sleeper so the guy could use it for collateral on a bank loan. Husband and wife truck and they drove all over the country. Puget Sound was where they had their house but they mostly lived in the truck. It was real fancy and comfortable looking inside.
Enough real estate on the roof to put at least 6 kw of solar panels that would power anything onboard and just stick a forklift battery below with couple charge controllers of about 1200AH at 24V and we are cooking. Won't have to plug in for next 7 to 10 years done right.
There are plenty with lots of square footage up top.. Just don't pull into a walmart parking lot cause you aren't turning this around there You can also get em' with tip out garages for your EMbike
They also have the smaller models for those with no room to park a full size at home..
You can even get the trailers with tip outs or anything else money can buy Some guys like the airstream look If you're not good with metal work then go with a custom wood sleeper.
Or.... do like spud and put a camper on the back. Could always go for that retro look Long hoods are always popular too.
My plan is to either A sell the camper I have or B keep it for short trips to put in the back of my Dodge 3500. Though overall I will buy a 20’ shipping container and convert it into a camper to put on back of this rig eventually and cover the roof with solar panels then have fold up like awning solar panels on each side.
And now they want my credit card info, "for security purposes"