Been looking at getting myself a small CTL for work (grooming MX track and MTB jumps ect) and i really cant tell which to invest in. Currently my options are the Cat 239D (Radial) and the Cat 249D (Vertical). The work load will be split between doing short distance movment of dirt/grading and filling up trucks. Most of our work is done using excavators but we still need a good option for moving lots of dirt quickly and making the most of all the other fancy gadgets out there (angle broom, forks, backhoe (maybe), brushcutter, ect). So, radial or vertical lift?
A vertical lift can do everything a radial can do but not the other way round. Choices.
Vertical would be my pick hands down....
So long as kids dont roll it while grooming the track haha
Ha Ha....Who would know getter than me ? If my seven year old CAT MTL with 7000 plus hours on the clock can hold up to all my abuse and then be handed over to three teenage boys who rolled it over twice that i know of and still keep going is the best endorsement I can make for CAT MTL/CTL equipment. I did replace both track frames , they were covered in full by CAT and came with a nice avenger. Change that fixed the issue....
I went radial, I needed the reach at mid-lift and figured that two arm pivots would get less slop than 4 over time. Just today I had to dump dirt between a new sidewalk and house, would not have been able to reach with a vertical lift machine. But a verticle will generally go higher and handle more weight for a given machine. Always a tradeoff.
And better reach at full height with a vertical.
The sight lines for grading tend to better with a radial lift. They are a more simple design and tend to be more rugged, less grease points. Vertical lift machines have more reach at max. height which makes truck loading easier. One rule of thumb is that if you spend most of your time from ground level to the mid point of the cab, you would likely be better off with a radial machine. If you spend more time from the mid point of the cab to the top of its lift height, a vertical lift machine would be a better fit.
After seeing your other post about the MTL, CTL difference, the new 239D and 249D machines are very nice, put a number of hours on a 239D with the "landscaper" tracks and it hands down pushed better then our 247's do, animal of a machine. The cabs are awesome, radio is in a goofy spot but other than that I loved it. How much are they saying they are going to cost you? Haven't run a 249D yet, but if its anything like the 239D I'm sure its great!
I'd prob go with vertical, I have one. Just keep greased good, stay on maintenance, when those loader arms get slop in them replace the bushings. I'm replacing the bushings on mine in a week, with 1200 hours on it....should've at around 750 hours. Just couldn't get the time to do it.
Cat reckons the 249D is almost exactly like a 239D, only vertical lift and a slightly better ROC 50%. Havnt got a quote on either yet but im heading down to my cat dealer tomorrow to demo a few compact excavators so i will ask them then
Also, thanks to everyone who replied! Looks like vertical is the choice over radial for 90% of what im doing. Thanks guys!
Here's another pro for vertical lift...much easier to do post holes with an auger attachment, since you don't have to move the machine to keep the auger plumb.
My thoughts too KSSS. I prefer radial because my CTL is mostly used for grading. The vertical lift machines come with more wear points as it's been stated and there is no reason to add maintenance to a machine if you are not getting the benefit.
Well said....Terra and don't forget way better break out forces usually
I have both....auger is harder on radial...but grading and mowing I prefer with radial....but radial sucks at loading trucks , but is way better and loading the smaller dump trailers...I find the radial has less" sway" when doing heavy ground work
So digging is harder with a radial, same with loading, but mowing and grading are easier. Maybe i should get a mower for mowing.... Haha Thanks for the help though!
No digging and grading is best handled with a radial machine. As rondig said, a vertical lift has more "sway" when digging hard material which increases wear on the additional pins and bushings. It's basically racking the loader arms when your digging hard ground.
Mowing is one of my best money makers...it gets my foot in the door with many big companies. I guess not too many guys do it around here. It leads to many more jobs on same sites. Everyone around here has an auger and buckets. Another HUGE advantage I picked up on for the radial machine is way better view out of the rear window...ran both today, vertical was augering and radial was on post pounder...
Not to hijack a thread- because I've run this same thought process as well. But have a question for those more knowledgeable- I have a CAT 242, which ending in a 2, is a vertical machine. As a newbie, when I bought it used didn't even know the difference. But a lot of my uses vertical is best for me- so I'm good. But- when I am doing hard pushing, there are push blocks on the frame that the loader arms land on, and are pushing to the front which looks to take a lot of load off of the bushings in the vertical lift arms. And as I recall, the owners manual suggests using them for that point. On newer C & D series vertical CAT machines, I'm not seeing these blocks anymore. Am I missing them, or no longer in the design, or what?
Pretty sure the 239D I ran had boom stops, they aren't located next to the front steps anymore, but down by the frame more.
Well, cat are pains in the arses anyway. They just removed both the Radial 239D and Vertical 249D from their lineups in australia. No info on wether they are bringing in a newer model (D2) so i guess i will have to wait. Also, after a furthur reasssesment of what we are working on and the sort of projects we will be doing i belive a radial may be slightly more useful
I tell my guys if it is breaker or post pounder must use a a radial machine....anything else I don't care which they use...we only had verticals at first and had to change pins and bushing every 500 hrs on the breakers and pounders....we get 3 times that on radials. The vertical machines load our trucks almost twice as fast though. I have a new holland 220 with pedals (vert), a c227 with eh controls (radial) and a CAT 299 xps that never leaves the mulching head. I am thinking of buying a new 90 kubota but on fence.