Some of you are wise in the realm of small business, I need some input on this because I feel like I'm investing too much of myself for something that I don't really have control of. I'm currently working hourly for a guy in Stockton, he's the 3rd generation owner of a business started 60 years ago. Once a primary dealer of the Detroit Diesel brand employing 30+ people, they now just have a couple guys left building mostly 2-Stroke Detroits for customers nationwide. IS THERE ABSOLUTELY ANY WAY this business will survive 5-10 years from now? Here I am at home on a Sunday fabricating an engine adapter plate for an old engine stand they have, I'm not getting paid for this, I'm just passionate about this work and want to see his business keep moving but whats the point? I'm going to work for Union Pacific in two weeks and and wont be able to dedicate that much time for him. Is there a market for strictly the antique and hard to find/obsolete? Theres got to be 1,000's of these engines still out there in need of rebuilds or support but is it my place to really care? In a year or two his main mechanic and parts guy will mostly likely have moved on so what then? The owner is not a wrench so he doesn't get down and dirty he just gets the work in and out and pays the bills. Also, jumping into building a more modern line of engines is out of the question given the tool and labor investment would be huge and risky. What to do what to do....
I have no doubt there's a niche for somebody. I have friends in other areas of expertise that make great side money and/or a good living. I do the same on the side myself. I don't mess with newer stuff. Half of what I work on was built before I was born. The key is to know what it costs to make said repairs and price the work accordingly. With that said most the the guys tinkering with older stuff do so as a hobby so you won't make a killing. You seem to be situated around a lot of parts that could be had cheap which is a huge advantage. It would take a lot of time but you very well could become a goto guy for the old stuff. Just like your current employer there are a lot of guys retiring or dying off and with them goes the knowledge. If you love it be smart about it and make a nice niche for yourself. In this day and age of technology you can get your name out fairly easy, evaluate potential projects and even ship stuff for a fair price. Idk what the railroad will think of you working on the side. My boss knows but I also know who butters my bread and to keep things in check...... I'll be your midwest rep!
Bell bottom jeans went out of fashin but one day they will come back as something new and the marketing will say you have to have them. Just when is the question.;-)
But I'm wearing bell bottom jeans right now!! The time is now!!!
Haha I almost said the same thing! I hear my older girls talking about stuff being so new and trendy. I laugh to myself as I recall that stuff back when I was in school.
Thanks Jeff. So my concerns aren't necessarily with how I could benefit, I'd rather just get paid hourly by him and jump in when theres work and I have extra time. The railroad doesn't really care what you do outside of work as long is its not drugs. I have already done "the running my own business thing" and it cost me over $100,000 so I'm not going that route. The guy is just stressed out all the time and constantly reminisces about the old days and how things used to be.
I have a friend that's the same way. Tries to relive his youth! I'd say if it works and you have the time go for it. You'll learn some more new stuff and may end up with your choice of tools etc when he finally hangs it up. The past is just that unfortunately. My former inlaws own a diesel injection shop and their business model hasn't changed in decades and they wonder why they're just getting by.....
I started the fashion on the buzz haircut. Only thing is it took 40 years for the rest of the buzzers to catch up. I still buzz the wee bit that's left.
Actually I just started free ballin' again, aka commando. This whole thick jeans in the summer just aint good for the crotch you know.
2-cycle Detroit business in S.Cal was killed off mid-90s. Pedco (Virgil Cooley) Santa Fe Springs is permanently closed, other 2-cycle players passes away. Legally you can use 2-cycle 1,000miles or 100hrs per year, that keeps changing! Bit of research, Ironman 2007 wanted to purchase Pedco for few $million, the deal is still going through court.
There is a HUGE market for the 2 strokes on the water.. The problem is, most everyone you call wants to "repower" it.. saying, you cant get parts or its not worth fixing.. SO the customer "Chevy wires" it together till something else falls off & try again.. 10 YEARS as a MAIN BUSINESS?? I say NO.. BUT if YOU learn & know the product, they'll come to YOU.. I'm not going to say your stupid for doing something you LOVE [building an adapter plate].. BUT.. small business owners THRIVE/PREY on guys like you & me.. YOU see it as helping.. he sees it as saving 500.00 & not costing him a dime.. Think about it.. Take it in & ask 250.00 for it & see what he says..?? You'll find out REAL QUICK if I'm right..
Didn't Ironman close their doors? Last year they auctioned off their entire shop.
Good advice, I'm charging SOMETHING for this plate and your probably right. Just to get my hourly pay felt like a business deal I had to haggle.
Being in the same state as you, I see about 2 Detroits a year since they have been mostly banned. Looking at this site, though, I see lots that still have them. Way back when they still existed I called a DD guru for help on one. He was getting ready to retire even then. So advertise nationwide. Make sure you are making good money is step 1. You are going to have a lot of phone calls and tire kickers I am sure. Going to have to include that in the business model. But I'm sure there's enough units out there to keep 1 guy busy for many years. You have to get the reputation, though. Rise above the hacks. And provide peace of mind for the customer however you can accomplish it.
Get a parts base>> know WHERE to get them & who to talk to for parts & tech advice when needed.. Knowing the product IS NO GOOD if you don't have the parts to fix the problem.. So start looking over shoulders & keep a DETAILED reference of locations, names & #'s.. I relied SOLELY on my daytime work for parts.. THEN I went out for almost a year.. kinda hard to order parts from work if your not AT WORK.. I HAD TO call & set up accounts w/ MULTIPLE companies.. Now I don't even bother going thru work.. I just call the vendors up, give them my name,acct # & the parts are on my door step.. Hopefully, sometime soon, going to work, will entail getting on my golf cart & driving thru the BACK YARD..
Being the source of knowledge and parts is half if not more of the battle. You might be in a good spot now to gather info and connections for parts. If I stumbled into a pile of motors and spares anywhere in the country that was priced right I'd buy the lot and send containers to be loaded up. Then again I tend to think big.....
I was styling the bowl hair cut , tee shirt & flower pants back in 1973 . It was all cool given I was on a Green machine that made allot of noise . LMAO ! http://www.heavytruckforums.com/showthread.php?263-Some-Holmes-750-action&p=2598&viewfull=1#post2598 Hair is thinning a little now . Age creeping up but still making noise & movin dirt
Used to be a mobile Murphy mechanic that came around....you would schedule the visit in advance so he could plan his route. No idea if it still happens. Ed
Yep, out of business! Lost their *** on emissions installs, not their fault. "Ironman’s after tax profit in both 2013 and 2014 exceeded $1.3 MM. However, the previous couple of years were difficult for Ironman. The supplier of one of their main products (Cleaire) experienced a recall and subsequently went bankrupt. Ironman lost roughly $10,000,000 when their product in inventory became worthless, and they could not service their trucks until a replacement product was found and verified".
Bumpsteer, I know what you mean.. Every couple of years our test stands need to be certified.. there was 1 guy in the country who did it.. He stayed on the road, in the air & in hotels, 50 weeks outta the year.. He's no longer w/ us & theres no one to take his place.. I had a problem several weeks ago & called the manuf.. they said, "I don't know what to tell you".. WHAT??
Get plugged in to the Marine market. 6-71s were VERY popular engines in both pleasure and commercial vessels.
The real issue is what kind of life do you want to have for you and your family. The railroad will take up the bulk of your working life. If you want to watch your kids grow up and have quality time with both your wife and kids you will have to scale back the extra work opportunities. If you needed the money and had to put the extra work in to provide a living income to ensure your family's needs then you gotta do what you gotta do. I suspect though that even though you really enjoy working on green, it will get in the way of the important parts of your life. I'm guessing that the railroad will provide ample opportunity to work overtime which will be a far superior income stream than the headaches of overhauling engines on the side. Keep what tools you have and put screaming greenies on the back burner. You can still pick and choose a money making project if it comes along.
John C. has it right.. The question started> will the Detroit 2 stroke last.. answer> as a viable business plan in 10 years NO..BUT>>There will ALWAYS be Detroit 2 strokes.. learn them, know them, buy the o/h/repair manuals & hold on to them.. Just DONT sink your LIFE into them.. unless your willing to fly around the country repairing them as an "on-call specialist".. OR relocate your family to the coast where they are plentiful in work boats.. tugs, fishing trawlers, tour boats..ect..
I'd be all about the jet-setting "on call specialist". Where do I sign up for that? :-D
Oh Blessed with a real Detroit specialist circa 80s...The DOCTOR JOE, he did know his ****. Silver engine paint, well Doctor painted 12V71T gold! So, engine has issue on jobsite, story via buddy. Doctor arrives, 'I am the Doctor, where is Golden Boy'! ***, who, what? Doctor is in Detroit heaven...
Best advice right there I must say. I guess I have an addictive personality, I'm obsessed with this stupid sh*t!
Lots of airport equipment still uses the screaming jimmys. Would expect they will always be there.
I do ALOT of work at the Chas, International AP.. Boeing built their HUGE assembly plant next door [dream liner] & share the runways.. Mostly Perkins & 4&6BT Cummins is all I'v seen.. in the plane pushers/tugs & baggage trams.. I havent seen their generator rooms tho.. I'll bet THATS impressive??
A lot of the old push tractors use detroits and the k loaders they use to load wide body aircraft
There will be a market for it, knowledge and lots of parts for the old engine's You can't imagine how many will still. Be in service 20 yrs from now
I have a 3 cylinder aluminum block in the shipping container at my place. One day I might get around to puting it in something.
Interesting, havnt seen the aluminum blocks in person, only photos, what were the advantages of that? The weight?
That and as I recall they were also used for mine sweepers as the aluminum did not cause as much "interference" with the sensors.
I recall reading somewhere that the larger Minesweepers in WW2 were wooden hulls powered with non magnetic stainless steel Cleveland Diesels, the idea was to not set off the mines that were detonated by steel ships. The Clevelands were a GM product with 601 cubic inch cylinders and had an all welded block similar to the EMD diesels.
Well if you want to build your own mine sweeper, never know might have a pesky neighbor to worry about, here is a link to a 4-71 Block on ebay: http://www.ebay.com/itm/Detroit-Die...-military-mine-sweep-high-block-/182489401100
It would survive if they connect with rite customers . Contrary to popular thought these two stroke Detroit's will be around for long time yet . Just looking at the military models take the M113 . Company says 80,000 units worldwide . That's allot of 6V 53's ! Someone has to provide parts & service for them ? http://www.baesystems.com/en-us/product/m113-family-of-vehicles Looks like they do ship repair as well in San Diego . http://www.baesystems.com/en-us/product/san-diego-ship-repair If I was a young feller I might drop a job application in with them . Be a secure job & probably make a good earning to retirement .
Turns out there no hope for that dying business!!!