I'm hoping to gain some knowledge/insight about this vintage of trucks from the guys who drove them. I didn't grow up around trucking, or the truck industry. All of my experience has come from the dairy farm where we haul grain, forage and have a dump truck for farm related projects. I've logged quite a few hours in Ford Louisville's and recently some hours in a Mack CH600. I find the Mack quite enjoyable as I am a taller person and it just has more leg space in the cab than the Louisville's do. But what about other brands? Given that you can get a Cat or Cummins engine hooked to whatever trans you desire in any manufacturer's frame, why would I buy a Peterbilt, Kenworth, Freightliner, International, White, Mack, Sterling etc instead of another? For example, say there's a Peterbilt, Kenworth and Freightliner all equipped the same. All the same vintage (25-30 years old), same mileage, same 3406B cat, 8LL transmission, all three are day cab trucks. Wet kits already installed, ready to do some farm work. Why would I pick one over another? Pick the one that's physically closest, or is one brand have some superior features worth having? I'm not brand loyal, or trying to start a loyalty war here, I just don't have any experience here and I'm trying to gain some insight. Were there some trucks/models to avoid from that era? For a day use truck, rough environment work area, why would one stand out over another? Maybe its not brand but some other features that I should be looking at.
what kinda work you got planned for it? Suspensions are proprietary for the 2 paccar , Mack, well Mack has a couple different set ups, long taper leafs , camel backs etc. Tight turn work, you'd probably wanna stay away from the paccar. fragile under abuse. Freightliner had a weak day cab construction near the rear mounts FL70 cab was a heap . What wet kits, GPM? Flow and pressure matched to the work? Bridge laws in your area? set back axles? like ford was common for. For tight maneuvering heavy loads bad roads, I'd look to camelbacks from Mack or Hendrickson under a glider. Walking beams, not arched springs. Of course if you're looking at air ride, Mack loses a bit. Stay away from older Reyco , it was garbage that couldn't hold alignment. Axles, Spicer, Mack, Rockwell? Lockers? There's a lot to consider besides engine and trans. I hope I didn't muddy the waters too much.
White, Sterling and Ford are orphans. Manufacturer specific items like door latches and window regulators and other such parts are a real hassle to find and often princely when you do. The best brand for a farm is who has the closest dealer to you. JMHO.
What Repowerguy said. At that age they all have the same problems, might as well get one that is easiest to get parts for in your area. You are right about the engines and trannys. The company I work for runs all Kenworth because the dealer is 30 miles away and runs a parts shuttle to our shop 2 days a week. Peterbuilt is next door to KW and they don't run parts.
Dealership location is the biggest reason we run mostly John Deere equipment. Deere dealer is 5 miles from us, closest case is 25 miles. The Ford's certainly get the job done here, we have 5 of them (all dump trucks, forage boxes), but can be a pain when something breaks.
We have two things we're looking at. We have an aging and undersized F-750 to replace and a L9000 with a severely rust jacked double frame that needs to go. The F-750 is currently for sale, but no bites since we listed it last October so we're thinking about pulling the box and hoist, adding 4ft to it and placing it on a bigger tandem axle truck. That would suit our needs better. All of our trucks have Hendrickson suspensions except the Mack, which is air ride. The L-9000 can sit for a little while as we search for a heavy enough truck to replace it. She's a heavy spec rig with 22 ft dump body and lift axle.
That L9000 is gonna be hard to replace. Double wall frame on hendricksons? I wouldn't even consider anything from paccar.Great highway rigs , just ain't up to snuff when it comes to stump pulling in ugly terrain and toting 38-40k on their back. Have you considered a vocational stretch like say repurposing a cement mixer or something of the like. Any old NHT or NTC powered OshKosh out yer way? Maybe worth looking into?
I'm not any brand loyal either . Would base the decision off how close the truck is to home " so you can take a short drive to go look at it in person " . Then just overall condition of the truck & asking price verses what your willing to pay . We run a mixed variety of older trucks on jobs and the bad part is " I'm always looking around for another one " LOL Pretty hard to go wrong with a short day cab tandem tractor of any brand with walking beam suspension . I have been " eyeballin " this 1974 White for awhile . Looks good for it's age and would fit in fine for us if it checks out . Time for a little trip to Tennessee . http://www.truckpaper.com/listings/trucks/for-sale/4764299/1974-white-road-boss Not suggesting colson04 should go after it , but that is the type of truck he needs with the walking beam rears & short wheelbase .
Most of this depends on what your GVW is. Unlike what is said above there is nothing wrong with KW or Pete. Most truck spec's for a dump up to 52K gvw the truck was built with double frame, heavy suspension and rear drives plus a 18K front axle. Freightliners built with the classic cab have always had cab issues. The Fords you can't hardly buy part's for, Internationals are tough but like all of them they have their issues. It just depends on how much your willing to spend. Look on BigIron.com there's an AutoCar going up on March 22 IIRC. I don't like the power plant in it though. http://www.bigiron.com/Lots/1984AutocarDK64TADumpTruck Truck Shop
I agree with Truck Shop. Paccars are all you see in logging and dump service around here. Freightliners have a reputation for issues is all I will say. They are not that bad but Petes and KW rule the day. All 3 dealers are way too far away. But I would not turn away a FL with the options I wanted vs a Pete with the wrong options.
The guy I work for has done very well building logging roads in the Pacific Northwest with used Paccar products. I maintain them, they are fine off Highway rigs if set up right. Any brand of highway truck will be trouble off highway.
That auto car on bigiron is one stout old truck, but I just don't see many autocar's by me (never mind trying to hire someone that could shift the 5x4). There's old ford's (9000's) around everywhere by me for doors, etc. in used parts, never see any autocar's. If you have ford's and like them, I wouldn't hesitate to buy another one. Tough/ simple trucks. I imagine finding a rust free one in michigan wouldn't be easy though. I find most of the used kw- pete- freightliner stuff by me (midwest) is not set up for vocational use. Most are long hood, air ride, long wheelbase, forward set axle, over the road stuff. Visibility and turning radius are not their strong suits. If you want something simple and tough, set up for farm use- I would look for double framed mack or ford. That would be what's easiest to find by me used. There are paccar trucks set up for off highway use- but not near as many used, in the midwest area, as you would find out west in the logging areas. I wouldn't try to marry your f-750 to a bigger tandem, it will end up being more work than its worth. I'm not a freightliner fan- cabs aren't great. Pete's are nice because cabs are pretty tight, and they don't rust out. Kenworth's are nice trucks too. International's are just odd- they've got mix and matches of cabs/ hoods/ sleepers combinations to no end. I kind of liked the old square nose big cab one's (9300?) I've got a 8100 and its like riding in a metal can with some rocks. much cheaper built. I've got a Western Star also- and its a really nice truck - quiet, tight cab. Night and day in build quality to my international 8100. Both around the same age (Late 90's). What your buying in a big truck when comparing brands in old stuff, is the cabs. They all use the same engine, trans, rear end options. I could see dealership support being important if you have 15 trucks to maintain, but with 3 big trucks, and 4 cranes (which use truck undercarriages), I rarely go to the dealership for parts, and they are all a hour away from me. I get almost all my parts from the heavy duty parts suppliers, most of the parts I need- brakes, drums, trans, or rear end parts, aren't dealer specific anyways. Vocational use on a farm- Mack or Ford- hard to beat steel panels and doors when your muddy and wet and covered in ...... Nicer trucks eterbilt, kw, western star
Freightliners OTR tractors set up for heavy haul with a drop axle {at least the ones we have} use a 7/16" wall single frame rail. Freightliner started that 10 years ago. Truck Shop
I run a few 30+ year old KW's and buy all of my parts except some chassis and cab parts from the freightliner dealer because they deliver. If you have part # it's all the same crap underneath. Yes spec'd out right is 90% of a truck the rest is the driver. If you run more than 1 truck keep everything the same brand, engine, tire size. Makes parts and repairs SO much easier. Through the years there has been a mix of whatever ive owned. Fords and Macks, good work trucks but those days are gone. IH hated everything in, out, ontop and underneath.
Spotted this Pete 357 cab & chassis in northern IN . http://www.truckpaper.com/listings/trucks/for-sale/16984749/1998-peterbilt-357 Couple short tractors closer to home with walking beam rears & wet kits . Ford has Cummins http://www.truckpaper.com/listings/trucks/for-sale/6066851/1994-ford-ltl9000 Hendrickson has Cat engine http://www.truckpaper.com/listings/trucks/for-sale/5602471/1988-hendrickson-vt100
[ Geared a little low but a great foundation with a great frame. Something that you could bury the tandems up to the frame, dump the clutch in LL and idle right out. Most guys dont understand the 35k pricing when they can get a old road tractor for 20k less. Put 50k on its back and the heavy spec truck will say "ok" and the tractor conversion will say"help"
Here's a the L9000 were looking for a replacement for. I'll try to get a pic of the frame next time she's hoisted, wasn't worth a cold start last night.
Why would you want to replace that? Unless the frame is shot keep fixing. Can't be beat too bad, the grill bars fall off when the hood hinge springs break or a guy pounds it to death. I never have understood where a guy would rather spend 50k to "update" to a new used set of problems than spend 5k to fix what he has.
I'll post a pic of the frame when I get a chance, but right now I can slide my thumb right in between the 2 frame rails. Aside from the concerns over the frame, the truck runs great. 6v92 has gobs of power, truck runs well, tracks straight and can handle a decent load. For reference, how much do you guys think fixing a rust jacked frame would cost? We could pull the box at the farm before sending it off to a shop, we've done it before.
Too bad this one is air ride. https://kalamazoo.craigslist.org/hvo/6024467787.html
I did my 87 close to 10 years ago. It rust jacked between the rear insert bad and wanted to keep the truck before it cracked on the radius. Suspension is a walking beam. I had 2,500 into all new crossmembers, gussets, trunnion crossmembers, suspension hangers, frame insert, all new bolts. 2500 blast/paint. Months work on and off on whatever your time is worth in the off season. I picked a few out of the bone yard and now have a fab shop build my gussets from steel because the KW aluminum ones like to crack and their over $300 each x4 per member. Every 10 years or so I'll have em burn a handfull out on the table and keep em on the shelf. All of the hendrickson center trunnion parts were fabbed along with the insert. It never sees salt in the winter and I calked all the pieces/seams together so I should not get any rust jacking in the future.
Was thinking the same DoyleX . With the right overdrive transmission & tag axils that Pete would make one hell of a grain hauler from field to farm .
I was told of a 9000 that got a new frame for around 7000 in a shop Is the outer frame split? if not take a maul to it air chisel ect and knock as much out as you can all of our double frame dump/ plow trucks are jacked some a lot some a lot more...
I haven't forgotten about this, I've just been busy. I look at trucks a they come up, but since we bought a tractor and hopper bottom we aren't using this truck nearly as much as in the past. Here are some pics of the rust-jacking:
Yeah colson04 , the pictures help . Looks pretty bad don't it . The good news is it looks a lot worse than it is . Amazing how much the rust will expand . Just looking at the picture would guess you lost about an 1/16th inch of flange due to the rust . Raise the bed & block it , beat the hell out of the top flange with a sledge hammer and the rusted flakes will fall out . I think the truck still has some time left in it .
Full double frame? My '80 KW just had an insert over the area the rear suspension bolted to. Half a day to beat the inserts out. Not a bad job. Hate double frames for exactly this reason. I'd take a tall and heavy single rail over a double frame anyday of the week.
Look at the radius on the outside rail. Pushed apart that bad I could about guarantee it cracked length wise. There is enough of those old fords around. Find a good foundation with the single drop ford frame, big steer axle and start building.