hi im in another posting for my backhoe having no hydraulics but i figured i might get more help quicker specifying my current issue i have the pressure control valve still bolted to the backhoe as its too awkward to remove but i too the plug out the washers that were behind it and the spring. now the drawing shows washers and the orifice there andthen the valve but on here that doesnt work that way so i have the valve trying to pull it out but it gets stuck you can only pull it out a bit then just sticks i tried a scribber in there as the picture shows the valve has holes and also like screws so i figured i could twist it out... nothing works how do i remove it and clean it and hoping that my pressure problems is not the transmission charge pump
I think there was an update that eliminated the separate orifice, not sure. Here's what the new version looks like removed: If it's that tight in the bore there may be material or scoring making it stick. Should be smooth as silk in there. Is there a pressure line connected in line with the spool at the front? Might be able to take the fitting out and push the spool from there.
ok my end looks like that at least what the grooves for... so does that mean there is no orifice on here? and its awkard enough gotta take front line off? lol well hopefully something plugged in there as i think my charge pressure was 50 psi i think and i read somewhere today that be too low so i hoping pressure control valve fixes that i have no hydraulics no boom outriggers or loader... but i can drive it and steer as for blockage you say i can slide the valve in and out smoothly but when it comes out partial it feels like it hits a wall
Does it steer easily, like power steering, and do the brakes work properly? How far does the spool move before it stops? May be a shoulder from wear, or possibly a chunk of debris stuck in the valve.
From what I remember. Backhoe steered ok. Has been sitting two years as I never had time to work on it. As for how much comes out. Ya I guess the shoulder hitting. As you can poke it in and out easily. Bug claps or clangs whatever sound hitting you call it as I pull on it. Ill to to take lines off to get at top line. And push it out then. So tight in there
From your pic that big black dot is that a big hole through pipe so I can try to twist pipe and hook in
oh as in for brakes from what i remember brakes work perfectly fine... why are they also hydraulic?
oh and looking at the drawing for the 310 pressure control valve housing its backwards and so is that valve as how it goes in the unit as the thing goes the opposite way and so does the casing those 3 mounting bolts dont fit that way
There is a hole for the spring, don't know how deep it is. Brakes are hydraulic, I believe they're connected. The steering is for sure, tees off before the pressure control valve. They used the same pressure control valve on at least a dozen models, it's a generic picture I'm sure. Can you get a camera in there and snap a pic?
oh the spring came out that was the first thing that came out out i took the unit off i didnt know the side of the pressure control valve is used too this is going to be a problem i should have pressure washed the backhoe how the hell am i going to get it back up there dirt free it was a bitch to get out but here some pics you can see the front side its got a pin in there i tried using a screw driver and a punch with a hammer to tap that valve out the back but it wont friging budge but here a few pics i need to cut a 1 3/8 wrench in half its too hard to loosen these lines the side of the backhoe has to come off really
i left that line on as 1 i couldnt get it off yet and 2nd i not sure can i tighten that line back on if i put the unit back up later since everything is god dam tight in there working from under neath
Don't know what to tell you at this point, maybe drive it back in and try to wash it from all angles with some brake cleaner or something, hopefully wash out whatever it's hanging up on.
i tried with needle nose plyers to slide down that pin but she wont budge either,,. as i figured the valve might slide out the front it slides in and out of there easily just stops on the shoulder i guess
here is youtube video i made https://youtu.be/LWl5XMXV-nk it shows the unit and how the valve slides easily i just cant get the sob out... also i washed the area with parts cleaner brake cleaner and id slide it up hopefully no dirt inbetween then when its ready
Ah, it's probably okay then if it's moving that far, but to get it out you probably need to hone right where the threads end in there.
oh great how you gotta get hone in there lol well then frig i took all this apart for nothing ? lol ugh so its supposed to to come out the back right
so ur saying no point in removing it then that it should be working fine?
Maybe, I can see all the way through the center of that valve spool, I have to wonder if it's supposed to be like that, or is it the old style and the orifice is missing? As far as I can remember, yes it comes out the back. Maybe a round sanding tube, probably won't need much. Wish somebody with a technical manual or more recent experience with these old dogs would chime in.
ah ok ill try grinding it a bit then.... ya you can see right through there is no orifice what is the orifice for? and where is it supposed to go?? would that made my hydraulics weak as it was always weak but now i have no hydraulics period i guessing might be the pump hoping not the tranny pump this happened couple years ago and i had no oil cooler i was using it without one as the people before me bypassed it
so i ground it and still cant come out here is another video https://youtu.be/BGX8sMzGGZE i even had screw driver jammed in there in back trying to hammer valve out so i getting frustrated
Well, maybe just wash it out and quit while you're ahead? Hopefully somebody will have some knowledge of if that is supposed to be open all the way through, doesn't look right to me, but I've reached the limit of my old memory cells, sorry. Is there a shoulder in there that the spring pushes against?
no the spring slides inside the valve tube and sits against the Pin and thats it you have the 5 washers that sit in the end cap and thats all she wrote so i guessing it does nothing then since it cant slide on its own? or so?
JDparts.com shows a washer and orifice BETWEEN the spring and that spool in the exploded view. So it might have fallen out easily. It also shows the spool "exploded" out that direction, so that's the way it comes out. I'd remove that fitting and hose first, loosen the locknut on the fitting, THEN the fitting will be loose and turn out by hand. Then rinse the whole valve out so the oil is gone, then knock it back and forth to see if you can dislodge whatever is keeping that spool from coming out. Once out, you can see what was causing the problem, then find the orifice and put it back together. The oil cooler being bypassed is a little suspicious, could that "bleed off" pressure more than the cooler would have? It shouldn't if the valves are working right, but...??? Maybe put a valve in that bypass to see what happens when you throttle it back?
If the spring isn't pushing the spool up against the pin, there's something missing I think. The orifice is no longer available, but the updated spool replaces the old spool and orifice, IF you can get the old one out. Might want to see if you can find a complete used valve at a dismantlers, or take a gamble and buy the updated spool and see if it will work for you.
Delmer in last video i posted i already have the line disconnecting andthen was hammering with screw driver more to push it out wont go i was griding it i have tried heat to pull the pin out but it wouldnt come out as i figurd i could slide out the other end as for easilly falling out nope when i took the plug off there was no pressure really and i had to poke my fingers in there to try to pull the spring out so it wasnt under pressure but ill check the ground for a washer and an orifice.. on the ground but a dismantle place would that be the john deer place? as i only have the one in Peterborough.... ill try to grind more lip ill get a dremal stone grinding tip and hope it comes out it be nice for it all together what does the orifice do.. and whats the washer behind the orifice for?
i figured also that maybe using the backhoe without the oil cooler blew an o ring and thats why i have no hydraulics i should done more testing couple years ago but i got busy and since the backhoe outside you cant work in rain or snow lol dunno if a valve in place would fix that
I wouldn't bother with that pin. The pin was not meant to be removed. The threads don't seem to be holding it up, probably something stuck or a ridge at a groove on the spool. Don't use a grinder on anything like that. Fine sandpaper will work better. With all those ports you should be able to figure out where it is hanging up? Still might help to rinse the oil out and shake it around to see if you there's a broken piece that could come out. To find a used valve get the part number and go to machinery trader, you can enter the part number and usually find somebody that has that part number listed. TYPICALLY the spring would push against the washer which pushes against the spool with the orifice in between in this case. The spool controls the pressure by opening and closing one port based on pressure against the spring. With the spool open through the center like that I can't see how it would function, but that doesn't really matter, jdparts shows a washer and orifice so you need to find it, or get a new spool.
it has been a few years since i had mine apart,but i think it will only come out from one direction once you remove that stop pin.
i was grinding the lip or so by the back where the spring comes out with a dremel and a pink stone she worn down quick but i still cant slide the valve out the back nothing is getting it out.. what is a machinery trader? and sbarett if you think it comes out the side of the pin how do you get the pin out so far nothing has worked it will only slide as much as in the video feels like it hits a stop or a shoulder
dont remember exactly,but i do remember being confused about getting it apart.i think the pin just came out with a small drift,and i remember that it slides right out ,but only in one direction.
so there was no orific on the ground so it was never in there i priced out at john deer the valve its 147 bucks not cheap at all i see as for the pin i cant get that out even used heat it didnt work either as i have the whole unit off the backhoe
I guess it's all relative, no offense intended at all but in my world, anything under $500 is cheap to me. I'm poor but I've been working on equipment since I was old enough to shag sockets for the old man and I guess I'm kinda used to the prices. Not Komatsu though, lol.
lol ah damn ya i poor so i try to fix everything myself lol i priced out a new housing a pressure control valve housing is 1150 dollars lol so i not gonna grind anymore or hammer screw driver in there anymore i dont wanna score anymore the housing if i scored it with the screw driver i did notice i can see light out the side of the valve and the housing that it slides in is that ok or is it supposed to be a tight fit
http://www.machinerytrader.com/list/partssearch.aspx?partnum=AR65882&pst=starts Here's the machinery trader search results, you'll have to call/email for a price, but I bet it's not that bad, relatively speaking of course You do have a parts diagram for that valve right? look it up on JDparts.com otherwise. I still say that spool comes out the same way as the spring, unless I'm missing something. I have no experience at all with that valve, just looking at the pretty pictures.
Ah ok i might just order this part from JD they get it in 2 days... does this site also have the Hydraulic main pump as i was thinking of getting a rebuild kit and id rebuild the pump myself as for the getting the valve out i dunno yet the service guy at JD told me to bring it in the mechanic will look at it... i dont wanna damage the housing lol grinding did nothing
hi so I got the new valve and had them put it in.. it isn't able to come out from the back... it comes out the side where you need to pull out the pin.. they had to punch pin and wiggle it and pull out out and then they tapped out valve out that way... and they had to sand the new valve down a bit to get it in as they couldn't get it in but I waiting on an o ring,.. my next question about this one is I put a new O ring from my kit of o rings on the end cap but its poking out some is that ok or do I need to get one of there O rings? here some pics
Wrong O-ring. It will spew oil if you leave it like that. There probably five or six different types of O-ring kits if you include metric. This plug is most likely what's called an "O-ring boss" straight thread plug and will need the correct matching O-ring.
oh ok ill take it out tomorrow... what kinda o ring kit would I need. very frustrating I know Princess Auto sells a hydraulic O Ring kit.. as this kit I used is like automotive O ring kit I used the Oring kit on couple other plugs on here maybe they wont work either then? ill take pics tomorrow what O ring kits would I need for this backhoe since I don't wanna keep paying 2 bucks an O ring when a kit is cheaper???
also my o ring kit is made of Buna rubber... is that no good for hydraulics? and I looked up hydraulic ones and they are called nitrate ones and princess auto sells ORB fittings is that what I need? http://www.princessauto.com/en/detail/125-pc-replacement-o-ring-kit-for-orb-fittings/A-p8080913e
ssorry the rubber I have is butyl rubber not the buna rubber not sure if they the same thing?
Huh, I looked up Butyl and it says not compatible with fuel or mineral oils, but good for antifreeze or brake fluid. Buna-N is Nitrile and is normal for oil. The ORB kit will work for most plugs and fittings, anything inside like a valve or whatever will probably be a special size.
I was stating I made mistake the o ring kit I have is butyl rubber not buna(nitrate) rubber butyl is good for desiel fuels
http://www.hpaulin.com/Catalogue/400.pdf page 135 would those O ring sizes work for the backhoe? or does the backhoe use metric o rings? as I gonna take off my the butyl o rings I have since they not for hydraulic oils
Not metric, not in those days. From my experience you will never find a kit that has everything you need in it, engineers love to come up with odd special sizes for internal parts of things. I would suggest the ORB o-ring kit, which should cover most threaded fittings and plugs, and a universal kit like this may cover some of the internal valve and transmission type stuff.
ah ok so ORB is for only hydraulics right?? what does the ORB stand for. I was at princess auto yesterday and they said that kit covers the hydraulic hose fittings they sell at least ya too many o rings keep it standard lol so gonna try to assemble today and then get pressure readings to find out what pump is bad or what not
ORB stands for "O-Ring Boss" which is the standard straight thread O-ring type fittings used in hydraulic systems.