Machine model : 324D Serialnumber prefix: EJC Problem: engine is not starting checked when cranking by cat ET * engine RPM is Zero * Injection actuation current is zero Replaced the following by new parts , but no change. - Primary and secondary speed sensors - engine harness - engine ECM Though replaced all the above still RPM and actuation current zero reading in cat screen. Additional information: before checking by cat ET another technician replaced all injectors and HEUI pump Any idea please. Thanks
If the emergency stop switch on the LH side of the seat base is activated it will disable injection, although I've never really checked as to whether it makes ET read zero RPM. May be worth checking it, and any aftermarket Estops fitted. Also check that ALL powers and grounds to the ECM are present. Apart from that, if the camshaft is turning, you should be reading RPM AFAIK.
Thanks for Your reply. * Emergency shutdown switch is in run position. * I checked all the powers and grounds to the Ecm. Three powers and three grounds. I checked all the pins. * There is no any short circuit in J1. And J2 is new harness. * No after market estops fitted * The speed sensor in the flywheel is reading 180rpm on machine control( hydraulic Ecm). The problem the primary and secondary speed sensors are reading zero RPM. and these are for staring and running the engine Thanks and looking forward
So is the camshaft turning?
Thanks for your reply. Let me check if the camshaft turning.
and from what I can see, you need four powers and three grounds. I'm not saying that it's likely to be the problem, but there's nothing wrong with being thorough.
The fourth power is when the start key switch is on. There is no power problem.
Power supply is ok, but I don't know the power supply to the speed /timing sensors. I meansuered it is 0 volt
Both speed/timing sensors are 2-wire from what I see on the schematic. That would make them passive - not powered in other words.
I am not 100% certain but isn't the engine RPM signal to the ECM supplied by the engine speed sensor (aka engine speed pickup)..? That's a Hall Effect sensor mounted on the flywheel housing. In your OP it is not mentioned amongst all the parts you have replaced. Try removing it and inspect the (magnetic) end for the presence of metal filings or similar. I've attached the Electrical Schematic.
Here's the location. It's also adjustable. You need to set the flywheel so that the centre of one of the teeth on the starter ring gear is directly below the hole for the sensor. Screw the sensor in until it touches the flywheel, then back out 3/4 of a turn and tighten the locknut making sure the sensor does not move while you are doing it.
This one on the fly wheel is reading 180Rpm. It is connected to machine control ( hydraulic Ecm). This has no a problem. Thw problem is with the two timing sensors connected to camshaft and crank shaft.
Thanks for your reply. But this sensor is reading correct
Yes these are the timing sensors. I replaced the following Secondary timing sensor 109-7194 Primary timing sensor. 109-7195 Engine harness 322-2733 Engine Ecm 262-2879 But still the rpm zero
Any fault codes in ET ?
Active code: 261-13 engine timing calibration: out of calibration
Have you tried removing the two speed/timing sensors from their location and crank the engine over on the starter while observing if the front gear train of the engine that generates the sensor signal is actually turning.?
That one I am planning to do it tomorrow
Personally, I would just flip the lid off and see if the rockers are jazzing up and down.
Ok good idea, let me see that too
Where did you get these part numbers? Those are some very old numbers that never came on an EJC machine. To be fair they do sub up to a 245-4630 which is a standard one piece with the bracket and both the upper and lower sensors. Did you by chance remove the plastic sensors from the bracket and mix the upper and lower positions in the bracket? If they are swapped to the wrong spot, I don't know exactly what it will do, but I'm sure the ECM won't like the pattern. Are both sensors bottomed out on the front plate against the shoulder? Do you have access to a scope? You can scope the pattern at the sensor connector and at the ECM connector and compare. These will be a simple AC sine pattern with a missing or long tooth (can't remember). I also agree you should check for cam rotation.
Thanks for your reply. The old sensors have those part numbers, even in the schematic these are the part numbers, so I ordered new ones which have the same part numbers. In the schematic it is given that 109-7194 is on the top and and 109-7195 is bottom. And the new one came with the bracket in the right position. I put it as it is but no change
Opened the valve cover, checked camshaft when cranking the engine , all valves are playing up and down.
Are the new components brand new or secondhand off another engine? Is the correct flash file in the ECM? What's the back story? Engine failed in service or won't start following a repair or rebuild? Both speed/timing sensors work totally independently of each other so if both signals are lost, it has to be something in common with both which AFAIK is only the ECM and camshaft gear.
An additional couple of questions. This is a C-7 HEUI engine. Has anyone looked at the injection actuation pressure while the engine is being cranked on the starter motor.? What convinced the people doing the diagnostics that the problem was in the electrical/electronic system.?
Thanks to all who gave me very good ideas. The problem solved. I got the camshaft retainer and bolt broken. The broken made the cam gear to be out of its place. The sensors were not reaching it. Thanks to all again
Glad to hear that you solved the problem.