New to this forum. I have acquired a ** 50 (i think) Industrial loader/backhoe. I want to find out if in fact it is a ** 50 (or A or B, etc...) so I can purchase the right manuals for it. Searched the web and photos of a ** 50 Industrials do not seem to match up with mine. Here is what I know: - Partial Serial number on the inside plate says: 9A???52984. Searched the web with no luck on the last digits. Even emailed AGCO (new ** company) with no reply. - Loader is an **-300 serial # 1196-00 4437 - Backhoe is probably a ** 54 not the narrow 54S - Perkins diesel engine AD4.203 - Instant revese transmission (4 forward and 4 reverse) using a dual pedal design - attached some photos (max 5 allowed) The engines starts and works. Some smoke but seems to work fine no abnormal vibration. Hydraulics working, but maybe not as strong as it should be. Never reved it up to max. Gauges not functioning. Fuel leaks from injector connections. As well a leak occurs at the bottom of the engine transmission section (see photo 5180) that starts after 15 minutes, black engine oil not trans oil, from the metal gasket area. Tightened the four bolts underneath but still leaks. Any assistance would be appreciated. It is used for a non-profit organization for a youth camp. Purchased in early 1980. Thanks, Dan
Control panel doesn't look like a ** one . That's all I know
More pics for my ** 50 Indstrial Some additional picturs that might help figuring out what model this Industrial ** is.
I use to own one no bad just clumbsy little light on the front. Oil leak sounds like the rear main, the 4 bolt cover you tightened is just a dust cover. I think that is a two part rope type seal so if you drop the oil pan you can replace rear main seal. I have had good luck w/ the local ** dealer in finding parts but the machine is getting dated mid 70's I think. just need a mechanical oil and water gauge 2" round from your parts house and you will be in bussiness good luck good luck
Sorry , my mistake . I did some research and I was wrong . The Industrial ** I had worked along side , years ago , had a different control panel than yours and I presumed that all Industrial models were the same
Oil Leak If you look at the last picture on my initial thread you see the engine/tranny sitting on a cross member (you see four prodruding female threaded outcrops, lack of a better description facing sideways and outwards) probably used to attach some option to this side. Where the engine/tranny are attached to this cross member are the four bolts that I tightened. This cast frame part is thick and the leak is coming from the connection above between the engine/tranny and the cross member below. You can actually see the type of seal. Looks like a washer at each of the four holes(underneath where I tightened the bolts). I ran a flashlight in between and there is a gap between the engine/tranny and this cross member, except, of course where the 4 bolts attach to this via some type of metal gasket.
I attached a pdf with photo and I drew some arrows where the leak is coming from. Hope this helps
As gravey mentioned it sounds like a rear engine crank/main seal. I'm not familiar with your machine but in most cases the joint between the engine and trans was not designed to be leakproof. Engine oil is leaking from the rear of the crank and there is not supposed to be engine or transmission oil inside that casting. If the machine has a dry automotive type clutch oil could be saturating the friction disc.
that is the dust sheild in the pdf not a gasketthe cross menber is for the loader I think. rearmain I bet but there is a oil line off of the rear of the head that could be leaking down. good luck
The clutch has never given us any problem and this leak (i have been told) has been there for a while. Only starts to leak after the engine has been running for 10-15 minutes. I thought I could unbolt the four bolts, raise the engine/tranny a bit from the cross member and then remove that plate and replace it. I am getting closer to finding the actual model (MF50 or MF50A) from AGCO and hopefully can purchase a parts manual that will show a breakdown of this. Maybe it will narrow down the problem and a fix. Thanks for all your advise.
Well I guess I was wrong. It is not engine oil . Was using the backhoe to dig a 300 ft ditch and noticed that the leak is transmission related. And it leaks. So I guess this is a major job of disassembling the Perkins diesel from the Instant Reverse reansmission and repairing whatever is wrong. Might as well replace and repair anything else while they are in there.
this link on my website is a pdf of the service manual for a ** 50 B, working in Tennant Creek at a roadhouse, the Fergie hadn't worked since 1984, got it running and had to scratch for a howto, havent got the parts list yet whoopie, first actual post
Have ** 50A TLB Very Similar Better than that I have the Operators Manual. I will scan and provide to you. Not sure how anyone could survive without it. Mine leaks at the front engine seal. I've only had it for a couple of months. I use it quite a bit. Love it. KJC
I am picking up a Massey Ferguson **-300 serial 1196 00 5427. Wondering if you have found any further information on these tractors? It's been a difficult search for good information so far. The backhoe looks to be in pretty good shape, a few seal leaks on some of the implement hydraulics but over all pretty good. 1335 hrs on the meter. Please let me know if you have any info on these. Thanks First forum post.
I have the MF60,TLB, and the leak you describe is or was identical to mine. That cover with the four bolts is an inspection cover, there should be no oil coming out of there. If you look to the left of that cover, you'll see a little hole, about half an inch round, this is where your leak is most likely coming from. It's in between that plate and the engine, off to the side just a bit. Here's what mine was doing.... at start up, and about after 15 minutes, it would start to leak from that hole, ( I also thought it was from that plate) I'd say about half a quart of leaking, then it would stop. It would only do this on start-up's. Drain your trans oil, it should NOT be black,,although back in the days, they did use motor oil on some of these. Put in new trans/hydraulic oil, the kind that use both oils in one. I can't think of the name off hand. If this machine hasn't run in a while, the seals may have dried up, giving it fresh oil may solve your leak problem, it did for me. It may take a week or so, but the "trans" oil leak will slowly begin to get smaller.
Hey Dan, check out this add, a fella has one for sale, similar to your's, it's a 1976. http://qc.kijiji.ca/c-autos-et-vehi...nt-lourd-PEPINE-**-50A-TBL-W0QQAdIdZ485637266
I think this machine is a ** 40 not a 50. The first machine I ever drove was a 40. The 50B was a bigger machine
Could someone help me with the gear shaft broke, and new or used should find a number of shaft 522655M1E3 herein view of the shaft.If anyone would know where to ask. http://aijaa.com/dFEjhe
Have you checked at your Massey dealer? If it's unavailable, type in the year and model of your massey and "google" it, you may come up with one thats selling for parts.
I have asked the shredder, but less common model turbine gearbox. other models can be found in more parts of the transmission.I have used "google" no axes turbine gearbox.
Tips can be given to potential some of which could be found.I'm sorry for my bad english.
Hi, just bought a MF50A 1976 TBL and I would like to know if you can still provide the operators Manual. Thank you Regards, Glen
Hi, 87redsixer, I just bought a ** 50A and I am looking for the operators manual. I find the ** 50B manual but the backhoe is a little different. Would it be possible for you to please send me a scanned copy of the ** 50A operators manual. Thank you very much
MF50A Operator's Manual Can you email me at [email protected] File is too big 12Mb Thanks
If you have that scan still can you send it to me?
Hi guys I'm new to this form so not quite sure if posting in the right section. I have a 1973 Massey Ferguson 50 industrial tractor (MF50 or MF50a). It's equipped with a back hoe. The tractor starts right up. But wether on or off the steering spins freely. I have already changed the power steering pump which is ran by the timing gears and no change. I have disassembled the steering valve and inspected it the plunger showed no signs of any scaring so I cleaned and lubricated it and assembled everything back together. Still no change. I opened the hydraulic lines that go to the steering cylinders and no pressure in either lines. I'm thinking the only thing left is the obital valve which is really pricey. So I want to be sure before I go ahead and replace it. Any input will be greatly appreciated! I'm unfamiliar with this hydrostatic steering setup. If anyone can explain how exactly this setup works if appropriate it as well!! Thanks!
I have the same tractor. did you ever resolve your problem? Mike
I have just bought a ** Backhoe. Registration tells me it is a 1971 (that may not be accurate) and the previous owner told me it was a MF50A. Serial is 9A110504 and the loader is model 300 serial 1196003744, fairly close to some of the other numbers previous. It has the 4spd dual pedal "instant reverse" transmission. My problem is brakes. I have a single hydraulic pedal on the left front of the steering wheel and dual mechanical pedals to the left rear. None of the AGCO parts manuals show the single hydraulic Master cylinder. Do you know what model this would be?
"I have a single hydraulic pedal on the left front of the steering wheel and dual mechanical pedals to the left rear." On instant reverse models, it has right and left hand brakes on the left hand side of steering wheel. they can be operated independently as turning brakes. Without a photo I can't understand what you have.
Without a pic I'm guessing. Do you mean you have a master cylinder that controls both brakes hydraulically? Nothing power or driven off the engine hydraulics, just a typical master cylinder with a slave cylinder at each brake? I believe I saw that on a 304, not a 50, maybe it was an option? What is the problem besides no brakes? Do you actually want to get those brakes working? Do the individual mechanical pedals have any effect right now?
Yes, as well as the 2 mechanical pedals under the seat, there is a single pedal to the front that goes to a single hydraulic master cylinder (which I cannot find in any of the parts catalogs) and the axle has the internal wet disks and is built for the 1676387M92 slave cylinders. It all looks very OEM. So far this is the only picture I have, I'll take more.
Mike, Delmer, I have photos. Here is my brake set up: The seat is pushed back to get a good photo of the floor and pedals. The two rear pedals are independent mechanical and the front single pedal is to a single hydraulic cylinder (which I will show below). Other side of the cab (front) is the instant reverse forward/reverse pedals. Here is the single brake master cylinder that I cannot find a replacement for: The line to the slave cylinders is off at the moment, as are the slave cylinders. one was mounted above the spring at the far right side of the photo. I have ordered new slave cylinders. These where totally seized. I was able to free up the master cylinder and filled it with mineral oil on a recommendation. I was told mineral oil (ATF or light hydraulic) fights corrosion better and the seals are made for either. Good idea? I am told that the serial number 9A110504 is for a MF150A. I picked up an operator's manual for a MF150A and it shows TWO front hydraulic brake pedals. My local dealer's fische shows no hydraulic brakes on this model. My questions are: 1) Is this a MF150A so I can order the right parts 2) What is the part number for the brake master cylinder 3) could/should I convert it to dual hydraulic brake pedals? What parts to use? 4) Is it a good idea to run mineral oil instead of brake fluid? 5) any idea what model of backhoe this is for ordering parts, especially rotation cylinder rebuild?
I have the exact same master cylinder somewhere, also rusted up and leaking. I'm not sure on the oil vs brake fluid, I can't argue with that logic. I'd try to find seals for the master cylinder you have. Most likely it's a standard bore and won't be too hard to find seals, you just have to DIG, and be prepared to substitute. That sure would be nice to have dual hydraulic brakes, but I suspect it would have been easier to buy a backhoe that had them to start with. Most backhoes that old are lucky to have two functional mechanical brakes... What do you need on the swing motor? I'd say you're going to need to match it up with parts drawings to know for sure what parts it will take.
Hey Delmer, it is and odd mounting. Most master cylinders mount from the front, not those two top bolts. If I could find another I could twin them side by side and just run each to each slave cylinder. Pedals would be easy to gear up using the original as a pattern. I'd prefer to use common ** or generic Master Cylinders if I could find one. I have motorcycles that use mineral oil for brakes and clutch and very pleased with their life and operation. Water will collect in the low spots but they tend to repel water better to begin with, especially when submerged. Previous owner was using brake fluid. New slaves can run either but I don't know what this master cylinder is. Earlier I called it a MF150A, I meant to say MF50A. I'm a new guy...
Swing cylinder leaks and is a known weak point for these machines. I'm told the backhoe is a MF54 but the tag is missing. I'd like to find a source for seals or rebuild of the swing cylinder in case it fails or the leaks get worse. An old car enthusiast gave me some help on the brake master cylinder. He said it was a very common design in the 1950's and 60's. Chev truck, AMC and even Jeep CJ5 up until late 60's. All of them are 3" mounting bolt spacing, 1.25" from rod. An example is AC DELCO 18M932 Totally interchangeable and very common and cheap. Wilwood even makes a direct replacement for Hot Rods. Problem is the bore diameter. Originals were from 5/8" to 1.25" depending on application. 1" bore was very common. The slave cylinders are the same deal, many bore diameters. I ordered the original for the tractor but don't know the bore. Running dual master cylinders generally requires a smaller bore than a single. These are cheap enough to experiment. All the new replacement cylinders specify DOT3 or DOT4 fluid, no mention of mineral oil, so may need to rethink my fluid. Just waiting for my slave cylinders to arrive... This site has been a wealth of information for me. I am hoping this brake information is a help to others as well.
If an ** dealer can't get maybe try Minnpar for the seals for the rotary cylinder but there is a post from a few years ago where someone had bought the last swing motor they had and I don't think had any more parts. The rotary cylinder is made by Cessna. I have a similar style rotary swing cylinder on my Cat backhoe but is from Cat. It was leaking because the shaft was worn. It was repaired by metalizing (spray welding). Luckily the vanes and seals inside were still good as Cat said to basically check if a dealer may have stock. The seals for the end caps and shaft were still available. It cost me about $1300 to have a shop repair it. It wasn't something I wanted to try and tackle. The shop had never seen one before but had all the tools and experienced hyd. technicians. Nige provided me with some service info from Cat. JD also used rotary swing cylinders. You could get lucky as apparently it is common for just the large O-rings on the end caps to leak. Here's some pertinent info for you. https://www.tractorbynet.com/forums/parts-repairs/149575-massey-ferguson-**-54-backhoe.html https://www.tractorbynet.com/forums.../368232-wtb-cessna-rotary-cylinder-parts.html https://www.urparts.com/index.cfm/page/enquiries/enquiryId/151041/
Hello all, I bought a 1974 ~MF50??? Loader-backhoe Model # MF54 Serial # 1409007488 (If anyone knows the exact model so I can look for a manual) that had all weak hydraulics but everything moved. I assumed it was pump related. I took the pump apart and found the front housing was warn on the driven side and the previous owner tried to repair it by putting in some bronze thrust washers. The washers where not the correct size and left a gap that was .085" x ~.200". Being a machinist I made a better thrust washer with .002" clearance and re-installed it. The pump should have had a positive effect however I started the machine and unfortunately the hydraulics where worse. The loader barely worked and the Backhoe section was non operational. I put a gauge on the loader circuit and am only getting ~400PSI. I took the whole front control section apart and cleaned and checked for any problems and checked the hoe section for broken relief valves but I cant find anything wrong. I don't know what the previous owners have done so I am at a guessing game. I have checked the supply side for leaks and replaced the suction hose, and all is good. I did a flow test into a bucket, and without any pressure it was ~20Ltr in about 10seconds at idle. In regards to the loader and hoe control oil zigzag (neutral) circuit sections. If there are two control sections, is the first loader oil zigzag circuit section blocked or have a pressure relief valve so the rear hoe has oil? My next step is to block the hoe section and retest the loader section. If anyone has any ideas please let me know. Thanx
Jeff, that MF54 is the backhoe (only) model, as is the serial number you gave. It will require a separate repair manual, as will the 300 loader, which has its own serial tag too. The tractor serial will be right in front of the shifters, low on the dash. My 1971(?) serial was 9A110504, tag and its rivets barely visible in this photo: The 1964 CJ5 Jeep master cylinder is working fine. I received the wrong slave cylinders. Wrong line size and no bleeders but U have them working. Hydraulic brake works well. How was your pump spline and shaft mounts? Any more picts?
Hi Steve, Thanks. I'll send more pics next time there. The spline is warn and I have a new coupler to replace the warn coupler and will replace the pump when I have everything sorted out. Funny thing, the hydraulics work now but not sure what I did as i only checked and cleaned parts.
You're on the right track, the coupler is a standard spline and easy to get. The only caution is to keep the end of your coupler away from the end of the worn spot, either give it clearance so it doesn't engage that worn spot, or make the coupler longer and only engaging the non worn splines. You don't want the coupler riding on that transition and putting axial pressure against the pump shaft. I wouldn't worry about those splines, grease them up, take apart to clean and regrease in a year (two bolts and the hoses stay connected, right?), and forget about it until failure. This machine should never be involved in safety sensitive work (like lifting over people) and this pump shaft won't decrease the reliability one bit.
You could use Loctite 660 to repair the splines. Was originally developed for repairing keyways on Mazda Miata's. Can be removed with heat. Lots of good reviews. Apparently is stronger when not used with the activator and heating a little will speed cure time and also increase strength. I discovered it looking for something to tighten up a bushing. https://www.henkel-adhesives.com/us/en/product/retaining-compounds/loctite_660.html
I think that one's supposed to flex a little, so I wouldn't try locktite.
I looked for the serial number but can't find it where you thought it might be. anywhere else it might be?
In that picture I see the 4 holes where the plate was attached, beyond that I do not know. Automobiles for the past decades have had a second serial number stamped in a significant location. Tractors?
Ya that serial # plate is missing so now I have to figure out which it is. Does anyone have any idea of what 50 version this is? Engine size currently unknown (any idea of where identification is?) It has 4 forward and 4 reverse with one pedal for forward and one pedal for reverse. There are 2 brake pedals. One goes into the left and one in the right rear axle so assume it is wet brakes. The right has a brake locking mechanism. The spit hole between the engine and tranny that is discussed earlier in this thread is leaking tranny fluid. It starts leaking when the machine gets warm. Is THD fluid what goes in there? or is it ** specific?
Hi Jeff, THD fluid can be used in all points except engine in these machines, although I believe ATF and power steering fluid are recommended in the appropriate places. ** THD fluid is rumored to be superior. I have been using good quality generic THD fluid for about a year now, so far so good. I leak about a pint an hour from the Cessna rotary cylinder and various minor connections and seals. They are wet brakes, and I am successfully using a 1964 CJ5 Jeep master cylinder ($35 new) on the single front hydraulic brake pedal to work 2 slave cylinders on the axle. I still have the two mechanical differential brakes at the rear of the floorboard too. The rear pedals do not have a lot of power, I have to stand on them to get brakes. One of my brakes was locked on and burnt out when I bought the machine (paint actually discoloured). It still works so not worth breaking the axle apart to replace the 6 or 7 disks yet at a cost of about $30cdn each.
Dang I love my MF50. Best shovel and wheelbarrow I've ever owned. Best antique vehicle I've ever owned too! I've had it trucked to several sites where I've needed it. If you are not pressed for time many truckers will cut a deal if I can wait until they have an empty return run. Deal is I have to be ready when they are. No excuses. Latest job was a rocky road leveling. Photo kind of illustrates how and what had to be cut down. These remaining outcrops are bedrock, which the MF50 will not touch. I graded around them and broke them out the hard way: Drilling holes and cracking the rock with wedges. Anyway, about the hoe, problems with loose pins. She was plenty loose when I bought her, and I try to keep her lubed up. Some of the grease fitting were missing or not flowing, so I replaced them, usually having to drill out the old hardened grease and counterbore a bit to tap new threads. I tried to drill and tap some new grease fitting for pins that did not have them, but found the pin bushings are hardened and you cannot drill through them. These pins must be removed every so often and coated with grease. When grease stops oozing out of these I pull them and coat them in grease again. I also replaced the pins, which really tightened the old girl up. Used cold rolled mild steel shafting, I believe 1.25" diameter by 11" long if I remember right. A couple of the non-rotating holes had gone oversize so I built them up with weld and ground them true again with a 1" stone and die grinder. The swing cylinder is loose, so that will be the next job. I lifted it up and had a look at it, the spline looks worn, both external and internal. I suspect it will be a weld and grind job on the male spline. If I was willing to take the rotating cylinder apart a local machine shop could do an excellent job on welding and cutting a new spline. The female spline, I am not sure. I've heard suggestions of Loktite or JB-Weld. Again the local machine shop could machine a new spline to weld in after drilling out the old one, but this will be $$$ and lots of heavy work getting it there. Suggestions?
I'd have to see what the splines look like and what they do. Loktite is for gluing things together and JB weld isnt strong enough. Is there a manual that shows any parts with better pictures or just the owners manual? Yes the bushing inserts are hardened steel, they could be drilled with carbide before installing or after but it's a lot of work, or you can drill the pin and put a grease nipple on that. I think I might try bronze bushings next. I am starting to work on mine and have noticed a lot needs to be done. I just bought 2 new front tires but the rears will blow the sides out soon. I found out mine is a 1974 MF50A
I just put 2 new fronts on mine. Was running with 16" truck tires and tubes, installed 11L16" ribbed implement style tires like this: No brakes or FWD on this backhoe, only steering, and the truck treads used to tear up turf. These low pressure tires roll easier, and will support a bucket of rock and yet clear mud quickly and easily. So far I am happy. Turns and rolls easier and not as damaging to turf as more aggressively treaded tires. So far I am happy.
I found a thread on an old forum from Big Dean that listed serial numbers: 1969 9A63158 9A87324 1970 9A87325 9A107518 1971 9A10751 9A128141 1972 9A128141 9A152024 1973 9A152025 9A182760 1974 9A182761 9A207680 1975 9A207681 9A232539
Sadly, Big Dean Austin passed away in March,2016. He was a wealth of Massey Ferguson knowledge.