A county commissioner I do a lot of work for asked if the Case 580B he recently purchased could be economically converted from the old style three stick backhoe control to the later joystick control. Neither he nor his operators can get the hang of running it as they also have a JD 410 joystick operated. Has anyone done this? Know what parts it takes? If it is feasible, I'll be looking for the necessary parts if anyone has them.
Virtually impossible. All manufacturers use a completely different valve bank, and pump, and there would be major changes to the cab. Even if you could fit the new components, tuning a machine that old would not be good. Time to trade it.
You mean joystick or wobble stick? The wobble stick is doable. You could even make your own with the right parts. Look for an older case machine with the wobble sticks at a salvage place. I converted my 4 stick skidsteer Backhoe to wobble stick pretty easily my making my own setup.
Im with Desertwheeler, youd be much better off converting to dual wobble stick controls over joy stick/pilot controls. Considering Case has had wobble sticks as an option for quite some time, itd be reasonably easy and affordable. Also consider that Case didnt offer joy stick/pilot controls until the first 580M in 2001. You would need to heavily modify a 70's Case 580B to install Case 2000+ technology into it. You would probably need 580M valve bodies, custom hoses, you would need towers and the joy sticks as well from a 580M as well as electronics for thumb wheels etc. All this and it still might not work since backhoe operator stations gradually got larger and more roomy as newer models came out which allowed options like pilot controls. Its just not worth dumping that kind of money into a B when you can just invest into a newer machine and still spend as much maybe less. You would be in a much better situation if you upgraded either way, IMO. I still think the best bang for the buck Case Hoe's are 580L's. You can find them in wobble stick configuration quite easily and any operator should be able to adapt to them. They are also frequently $25k or less for some really nice machines. If the operators are really pushing for a pilot control backhoe, that is going to cost quite a bit more as that option really carries a premium especially on Cat and Deere hoe's. I have seen pilot control 580M's in the low to mid $30k range though.
I think the OP was inquiring about converting to 2 lever controls in general and not specifically wobble sticks or joy sticks.
Sorry for the miscommunication, Yes, I am inquiring about the joysticks of old like my JD 310A. The 'wobble stick' as it has been termed. I have checked Case parts diagrams and it appears the valve block is the same for both but only the controls are different. I called several salvage yards such as Brokentractor and GulfSouth and none have the necessary parts. Surplus Center lists a complete backhoe valve block with wobble/joy sticks for around $700 that looks like it would be a fairly easy retrofit if I can't find the parts as he is rather insistent about changing it over. I agree with him as I have tried to run the old three stick and hate them after coming off my JD.
wrwtexan, Don't order that $700 valve block just yet until you've gotten more replies from a few experts. Each backhoe has its own flow and pressures, release valves etc. designed to work properly and safely so as not to damage the machine and maybe the people around it. If that control valve block is not specifically designed for that old Case you may be buying trouble. I would be more interested it purchasing or building the linkage and levers. It's just a bunch of small ball joints and rods with treads, nuts and a bit of steel. Take the cover off of your 310A and have a look. But for now wait for more replies.
Call ASCO and see what they quote you on the conversion. Heck it might be under $500 and no lines would be open. This is a Cat but its all the same.
Here is how it is done on a 580SE -- it may be worthless information for a B series. There is a conversion kit on Ebay, I don't know if that is what you are looking for though. It is here ==== http://www.ebay.com/itm/Case-580B-L...Stick-Control-Tower-with-Valves-/161516030718
Hey caterpillar mech: Thanks for that pic. What is the standard then of what functions are done with the left stick and left stick wobble and rt stick and right wobble please?
I could see me doing a wobble stick mod on my old IH 250A hoe. It has 6 levers on a common shaft. The outboard on each end are outriggers so anyway the 4 in the middle would be nice to convert to 2 wobble sticks.
Thanks for the info and link Tinkerer and Caterpillarmech. I'll call ASCO Monday and see what a kit might cost. Restacking won't be an issue with all the o rings. I am surprised the valve sections have to be moved though as I would think they are all the same, just change the valve and cylinder pairing. The county JD operation is different from my 310 as someone has changed the valve to cylinder mating on one or the other machine. That can get me into trouble when I work on it.
If you haven't done it yet you can go to the casece parts page online and type in 35 for a two cylinder boom hoe or a 33 for a single cylinder hoe. You will see the 35 for the 580ck B series and so on for the 33, have seen some 33 on B's but rare. I have not seen but two B's with two stick controls in over 40 yrs. and it would be rare to find one in a bone yard since most were sold with the foot swing as standard. You will have to do some calling to find one if one could be found. The 35 hoe was used on the B/C/D/E series and had several up grades. The 580 C tower assembly could be a possible better find and I would custom build the linkage and not un stack the valve sections. They had some different valves and piping and trying to get all the parts short of buying the whole hoe and trading it out could be a pain on that (B) hoping the salvage yard sends all parts you need. So the recap if I was going to do this I would find a tower, two stick for a B/C/D/E/ set it down and make some brackets to secure at the base, custom build the linkages to hookup as needed. It would not be factory but functional and always put a sticker that shows the control functions.
Another correction to make is on the model of the machine. It is a 580 Super E but what I can see, there isn't much difference between the B, D, and E models. I called ASCO today and was told Case no longer has a conversion kit and even then, it would be cost prohibitive going new. Looking for a good used whole tower would be the best way to go. Looking through the Case parts page, the valve stack is the same as my JD 310 in that unless they have an integral relief valve in each section that is different, there is no reason why the hoses can't be switched around to obtain the correct control pattern. It looks like it might take a few fittings and hoses, but that would be a lot easier than restacking the whole assembly. I have made a few salvage yard calls and so far no luck in finding anything. I noticed on the Case parts page a note that foot swing was standard and hand swing was optional so they may be few and far between.
A two lever tower for a E should be a easier find and a quick fix compared to a B/C machine.
Here is a link to another discussion about the conversion. Posts #6 & #8 are authored by two members with possible leads to finding the controls. HeavyEquipmentForums !!