HI All, I am looking at buying a farm (approx 67 acres) and it needs alot of clearing (almost all is 15 year old growth since it was previously timbered). I am looking at 2 machines that are in similar condition (per the owners since they are relatively far away (500 miles)...Both reportedly 30% UC.... The 977K is $5500 but the 973 is $16500.....I like the lower price of the 977 BUT do you think it's worth it to get the newer machine because it is hydrostatic? I am in the lawn care business and I like the hydro machines WAY more than the old belt drives....I also drive trucks with Automatics more than sticks...Would this mean I should get the 973 over the 977? Any opinions would be greatly appreciated. Thanks! Andrew PS - I realize both machines are huge but since I am not an expert operator I think the extra power and size would make up for the lack of expertise....I can operate my Case 680E backhoe very well tho (I have to say I do gravitate towards the bigger stuff OR would you think I should go smaller so in the future I could possibly do some side jobs excavating for others without having to resort to hiring a low boy all the time to move my stuff?
where are you located? i think you would be more then fine with a 55 or 53 sized machine...brush clearing really doesn't require a huge machine like a 77 or 73...i do like the size of them, but added to that...a 73 for only $16500 is going to be in rough condition the size doesnt make a difference in operating...they all have the same controls...we have a 955 and it is simple to operate, especially in a wide open field...downside they burn fuel like its their job
HI, Thanks for the reply....I am in Charlottesville, VA.....I do see way more 953's running around here than 973's (I've only seen one of these up close...WOW).... A while back I hired an excavator top clear some land (he had a 955) and it did an amazing job on some really big trees... Interesting thing about the machines tho is that is sees like the really big ones are often priced lower than some of the smaller ones (I guess because the smaller ones are more "mobile" for transport from job to job. and hence maybe higher in demand?.. The 973 is claimed to be in good shape except for the 30% UC....I kinda like the idea of Hydro since they seem WAY better from the adjustment standpoint.....(at least on lawn equipment)....NO constant adjusting....just keep the filters clean and fluid changes every once in awhile and you are good to go....Of course if a pump or motor goes AARG...The company that owns the 973 says it is ready and the only reason they are selling is because of the economy being slow and it was their back up machine anyways... If you had to get one what would you do?...Go the extra $$..or play it conservative? Thanks! Andrew
One thing you dfinitely don't need to do is compromise on machine selection in this economy. You should be writing the ticket. Forget anything with 30% botton on a big loader - do you know what they cost to replace??!! Also - consider more seriously the smaller machine if you saw it work on your property - you'll save money in fuel. A 977 is not really an economical machine.
"I could possibly do some side jobs excavating for others without having to resort to hiring a low boy all the time to move my stuff?" I have a deere 450c trackloader and without its counterweights or backhoe or winch it weights 18k pounds, making this little bugger a dumptruck trailer load at minimum. If I were you I'd be looking at a cat 939 or 943, Deere 450 - 555 & and I'd try to find a cherry machine. Now a 977 and 973 are not just lowboy loads, they are oversize loads, requiring heavy trailers, heavy trucks, and permits to move. Figure a operating weight of 60k pounds for a 973, not sure on a 77k. I'll bet that when you go to fix the undercarriage that you will spend more in that then you did for the rest of the machine. Also working a worn undercarriage in forestry conditions is a recipe for throwing a track and sliding down a hill, and with a 977/973, that fix is going to be expensive to say the least. Find yourself a much smaller machine, in much nicer condition, it will be well worth it.
Check out these 939's http://www.machinerytrader.com/list...Grp=939&GUID=FA0FFF80D5AF4F2984A1DD6A097C3B03 . (Also search the Deere's, I am just a Cat guy ) I don't know exactly what a bottom complete with idlers, rollers, chains, etc would cost for a '77 or '73 but I would imagine you would have way more in your new undercarriage than the purchase price of the machine. I am currently getting prices for my 953C for just pads, bolts and sprockets plus a P&B turn. Cat's price for the turn, parts and labor is around $6K and that does not include the rollers, idlers, labor etc for the rest of the UC and those are the expensive parts. Something to consider also is before you purchase any machine just go to the local parts counter and check prices on things you know could go out or just normal maintenance items. Smaller machine usually means cheaper parts and O&O costs.
Do you have any pictures of these machines? Post them here and I'm sure you will get some very good information from the members. I would believe that each of these machines would probably be in pretty bad shape. If you are considering the 977 get some oil samples from the final drives. Rebuilding just one side would be way more than the cost of the machine. The smaller machines are amazing, if you have a little more time, it will save you a lot of money. If you are clearing land, look for a 4-1 bucket, it will make your life much easier. RT
HI, Interesting.....I do agree a lot can be done with a smaller machine but I am wondering too with the huge machines the job would go sooo much quicker right? (of course assuming no breakdowns!).... On a side note concerning fuel usage, I have read that in towing....sometimes the bigger engine actually uses less fuel overall (I think the theory is a small engine straining uses more fuel overall than a larger engine that is "loafing"....could the same idea apply here or is the general though that the 15 year growth would pose no problem for the smaller loaders? Andrew
The two things you should be looking for are a 4-1 bucket and good u/c. A 4-1 bucket is like a thumb on excavator, you can do without one, but unless bucket volume is crucial, why would you? With a 4-1 bucket, unless working in hardpan, rippers aren't a requirement. I like the rear engine loaders better, better weight distribution, longer idler life, better visibility, etc. Both of the cats are rear engine, but the most cheaper deeres are front engine. CAT 943s CAT 953s Deere 655s Deere 755s
Both of who Cats? He is asking about 977 and 973....a 977 has the engine where it belongs.....in front.
A 973 with 30% U/C is no deal at all, and both those loader are big for his application, theres no reason to be burning that much fuel if your not moving big dirt. I was just showing him whats floating around web. I don't know how serious he is about doing jobs after finishing his land but, the bottom line is to move a machine without a lowboy a 943 or 953 are the best options. a few good 953s all on the east coast a couple in NC http://www.machinerytrader.com/list...6043323&GUID=F4FC34ED864B4EE2BEE49B7AF9D94358 http://www.machinerytrader.com/list...6573350&GUID=F4FC34ED864B4EE2BEE49B7AF9D94358 http://www.machinerytrader.com/list...6290270&GUID=F4FC34ED864B4EE2BEE49B7AF9D94358 http://www.machinerytrader.com/list...6522849&GUID=F4FC34ED864B4EE2BEE49B7AF9D94358 http://www.machinerytrader.com/list...6408585&GUID=F4FC34ED864B4EE2BEE49B7AF9D94358
Well I agree 100% with that.
another thing to remember is it will be easier to learn how to run the machine correctly and efficiently if the machine itself is a little smaller. I think an older 943 in good condition would be right up your alley. Another thing to remember is those big machines are quite heavy and do like to get stuck under circumstances (like operating in the woods). It would be a lot easier (and cheaper) to get a 43 unstuck vs. a 73.
a 943 would be perfect for you...we have one and it might be my favorite machine to run we have a 955 for sale...$22.5K i believe...great U/C. great paint, starts right up...runs like a champ
Hi Guys, Thanks for all the input so far....As far as me doing work "on the side" after using it on my property, I haven't really done a lot with the equipment I have in the past BUT this winter I am going to try to hustle for some extra work (my regular work is lawn care but the onset of cold and the fact that all othe leaves are already picked up leaves me basically unemployed (happens like this every year tho so it is nothing new)). Currently, I mainly have smaller stuff that I can move with my Pickup and trailer (like my Ford 8n with all attachments or Allmand Backhoe or Gehl 4400 skid steer).....I do have a Case 680E That I actually had moved once for me to dig a septic for somebody...Mostly small stuff for smaller jobs... Any loader I am thinking of getting would definitely NOT be something I could move myself until I get a Dump Truck and Trailer (I know about the CDL thing and actually had a CDL learners but since the truck deal I had before went sour I never got the full blown CDL). After hearing all the plusses and minuses of equipment so far I hate to admit it but I am leaning towards something..... BIG ;-).....Ironically from the cost standpoint....The big stuff I have found is way cheaper... machine for machine and condition for condition than the the smaller stuff.....While I realize fuel may be an issue on the bigger stuff I hope to offset that by burning WMO like I do in my diesel Pickups... I am going to horrify myself here in a bit and try calling the local Cat dealer and see what undercarriage parts cost for the 977 K or 963.....Man I hope I hit the lottery! Andrew Of course I may try the low $$ aproach for a bit and see how the ol 680E and 8N does against the growth.... PS - Assuming I might go down in size a tad...Is the 955 significantly less able in terms of brute ability?....I have read here that some hydro machines are not nearly as powerful as a lesser manual tranny machine?....How does the 955 do VS say a 953...or 943 They seem fairly similar?
I did notice the price differential your talking about. Just for kicks i was looking at some comparable 953/963 and the 963s came up cheaper most of the time. If set on going big i would suggest a 963/755 b/c of the more manageable weight. With an operating weight around 25t it's too heavy for dump/tag. Without a dump that is not much of an issue, but some else will be able to move it with a lowboy reasonably. They probably wouldn't charge much more than to move a 953/943, so not much lost there. As mentioned earlier, the lighter weight will make it easier to get unstuck, and you probably will get stuck atleast once. Also a lot of parts are gonna be cheaper than their 973 counterparts, just b/c of sheer size differences. U/C hydraulic cylinders, engine, and drive components. If you get a trackie without rippers you might look in to a winch for it. A friend of mine use a hydo winch to self-extract and to skid high value logs out when he does land clearing jobs. They aren't cheap, but are quite handy if you see yourself doing much of that. Don't get me wrong, if i found a deal on 973 setup right i would seriously consider it, but i would be hard pressed to justify my extra cost of ownership. Your mileage may vary.
IMO, you are better off paying more for a machine in good condition. A low priced machine that will soon need work is no bargain. It certainly won't seem like a bargain when it's sitting there needing twenty thousand in repairs. I really like the 955 traxcavators. They are tough and versatile machines. I sold my two 955K machines about fifteen years ago. One was tight and in great condition, while the other one had a lot more wear. It still would do the job, but was not nearly as much fun to operate as the machine in better condition. The 955s are great for digging basements and holes like that; they will go straight up a basement wall with a full bucket of dirt. Around here at least, excavators have taken nearly all the hole digging jobs, and newer traxcavators are rare. Based on my experience, a good 955 won't need much maintenance or adjustment. Unless parts are worn out, adjustments are not difficult. The 955 will do almost anything that you ask of it, as long as the ground is not too soft. They have a narrow track and aren't good in wet conditions. If you have wet conditions, you will need to learn tricks like chaining logs to the tracks or have a neighbor with a D7 to pull you out. I ran a 977 a little and know that they will do a lot more work than a smaller machine in the same time. Like the 955s, the 977s are cheap to buy, and if you can find a good one, it might be the machine for you. One question I have is why you want a track loader instead of a track dozer? Most people around here that want to clear land use dozers. They have wider pads, a wide blade instead of a narrow bucket, much better traction, and can clear a lot more land in the same time. On the other hand, it's tough to load trucks or dig basements with a dozer.
Mmmmm 973's they are a sexy beast in any environment. But they do have their downfalls..... As CM stated he is looking for a U/C for his 53 and coming in at almost 7k is cheap for a 73. The track loader I had most of this season just got an undercarriage. It got a complete job and came in at almost 20k, and all work was done in house. They also like fuel... and lots of it. I was burning on average around 130 gallons a day and as high as 170 gallons a day workin her hard. They also don't like contaminents in the hydrostat system. My old loader has been in for a new pump drive and drive motors every 1300hrs for the last few years. The other loaders Sureway has seem to do better, but there are 2 machines that are brutal on pump drives. The 953 and 963 are just as capable in most respects to the 73. I have had a lot of seat time in all 3. I like the 53 because it seems more like a sports car, the 63 has more grunt and still quite nimble.... the 73.... She's a friggin beast. A track loader does sound like the right machine though. Some guys like dozers for everything, but once you spend some time getting intimate with a track loader you can find a way to do everything with one. I like being able to carry stuff with me, and using your teeth level the ground in front of you leaves an awesome finish without packing the ground too much, using the bucket flat leaves a great finish and will pack the ground a bit to leave a solid base. All the twisting and turning you can do with a track loader also helps with leaving a nice base. You can do a lot of work in a day with a track loader. I'd like to see anyone keep up to a 973 in almost any application with a D7. Heck... they are even great for pushing scrapers if you get the desire to do so.
:IMO:usago with the 977
HI, Thanks for the continued input.....I was thinking a loader would be better for clearing land because everybody I have ever seen clearing land uses one.....Simply break the roots as necessary and the height of the loader bucket can easily leverage against the tree to topple it.... As of right now I am kinda leaning towards the 977 just because it'll be less than a third of the price of the 973 BUT I'd sure like the hydro from a maintenance and perceived ease of use standpoints....I am not 100% sure that is fair to say BUT I know hydro lawn equipment is far easier to maintain and use than belt drives....I'd imagine the same is true for larger equipment as well... Decisions decisions.....why can't I just win the lottery? HA Andrew PS - Do people here burn WMO in their equipment like some diesel truck owners do in their trucks to save $$?
Just poking around eBay I came across this 977 in your state. http://cgi.ebay.com/CATERPILLAR-977...3286.c0.m14&_trkparms=66:2|65:3|39:1|240:1318 Without looking at it, who knows how good it is. But it sounds promising. Have you actually looked at the $5500.00 977? That amount of money usually won't buy much more than a thoroughly worn out machine. I hope things aren't so bad in VA that they are selling good machines for that price. You mention liking hydrostatics and automatics. The powershift transmissions on the 955 and 977 machines are very easy to operate - no clutch that you have to push for shifting gears or to go from forward to reverse. A final piece of advice. When looking at a used machine, look at three things: Condition, Condition, and Condition.
its your equipment, burn what you like. But I'd check the cost of a fuel injection pump and really check it out how to filter it, how it reacts to seals, and effects of detergents, before i'd burn it in mine.
Andrew, The comparison you're making between lawn equipment and heavy equipment is not a valid one. I have a landscaper friend who ran Buntons, both belt drive and hydro, so I know what you're talking about there, but believe me that 977L isn't belt drive. The Cat powershift trans and pedal-controlled clutch and brake steering systems were well engineered, easy to use and gave very good service without need for constant attention. Also, you'd think a lot less highly of the 973's hystat if you lost a pump or motor and had to replace it. As far as your idea that a big machine will get more done than a small one, that's more or less true as long as the conditions are right. Be absolutley sure that the entire 67 acres is firm hard ground, because a big track loader will sink like the Titanic in soft ground and can be very difficult to extract, especially without the help of another similar-sized machine. As far as the undercarriage is concerned, is the 30% measurement from Cat, or by the owner as he looks at it through the window of his truck as he drives by? Either way, though, it means it's just about finished. There's been a lot of good advice given in this thread, and as much as I like big machines myself (I have a 983 LOL) I have to say that a smaller machine in better shape that's closer to home would seem like a better deal than either of these two loaders. If it really comes down to one of the two I'd favor the 977, they were a very good machine and you may be able to find used parts more readily. Or not, after the Great Scrap Drive. :beatsme
Hi Guys, Well, for better or worse (hopefully better)....I went and got the the 977K after talking with the owner at length earlier today on the phone (I didn't actually see the machine ...one of those eBay sales things but the guy had 100% good feedback for 265 sales of equipment so hopefully I won't be his first negative! One thing that did concern me a little was the fact that the owner said that the engine uses abut a gallon of oil per 9 or 10 hour day....He claims it doesn't smoke bad enough to see blue smoke but at least I'll know the machine always has relatively fresh oil in it... Short of buying an operators manual for the machine is there any site out there where I can read about the machine? The SN of the machine is 11K2434 BUT when I called the local Cat dealer they said that the SN wasn't right?...Any ideas on how to learn more about this machine through that SN? Thanks for all the help guys....I may have more questions after I see what I bought ;-) Andrew PS _ I told him the work I had in mind for the machine and the owner thought that simply adding engine oil and hydraulic oil (the cylinders "weep") the machine should be able to do it without fuss...Of course he also mentioned if I let the machine sit for awhile I would need to jump it started and that he would recommend batteries....hmmmmthe costs are starting already!
Well, now that you did it, we'll be needing the pictures.
A least you found a place to store your spare money...
:cool2 Your probably going to get to know that machine very well from the inside out.
:lmao:roll:falldownlaugh
Machine is to be delivered later today (12-10)....Supposedly the truck gets here from NY around 2 PM....I can hardly wait.... Oh....Does anybody know what size batteries this thing uses?...Owner said they were weak and had to be charged and that I may have to jump it when it gets here....I am fearful of trying to jump a 24V vehicle with mt Dodge (diesel) 12 V system for fear of frying the trucks electricals so I'd rather just get 2 batteries from the get go I'll try posting some pics when it gets here... On interesting thing was I was going to send the owner the money via Pay Pal to cover the machine and shipping (so at least I am "protected" by Pay Pal....He didn't want to pay the extra to Pay Pal so he said he would send it to me at his cost and I could use the machine before I had to pay him (with a regular check once I was satisfied)....He said if it wasn't as described he would eat the shipping..... wow....I said if he is that sure about the machine send it! ;-) ......With his 100% positive eBay rating (265 sales of equipment).... I am hopeful that it'll all work out for the better....HOPEFULLY! ;-O Andrew
http://cgi.ebay.com/CAT-977K-TRACK-...ryZ97121QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem Is this it?
Hi MY BABY !! ;-) ....Yes that is it....It actually looks WAAAY better than the pics....(I'm not sure how that happened tho) It was a little scary unloading it from the truck....My helper almost....Well, you'll have to wait for the video!....I am going to try to put a video on You Tube shortly (well maybe tomorrow...I have to download the pics and video into the computer THEN TRY to remember how to upload videos! She seems to run OK....I did have to pop for 2 new batteries....Have to look her over more carefully tomorrow...may try pushing a tree or two just for the fun of it....I'll try to post better pics and the video soon. Thanks for all the help here. Andrew
At a gallon of oil a day it's about ready for an engine overhaul. Having said that, it will run and make power for many many hours yet as long as it doesn't get low on oil. Just consider the oil a fuel supplement!
You're killing me, man. Pics AND video.....C'MON!!!!! Get 'em up!
sounds like everyones waiting for a train wreck
I think those tracks are in better shape than my 955 . I think you will be happy with it and end up like me and can't get off of it enough to fix it up
HI Guys, I have a nearly 10 min long video of us off loading the loader BUT it is having a seemingly hard time uploading to You Tube...I'll try to upload some pics later tonight. Andrew
Sweet, Let me know if you need some help uploading anything! Cant wait to see this beast!
HI, HELP! HELP!......I just can't get the video to upload on You Tube....I edited the video down to 9 or so minutes (the orig uncut video was about 14 min but You Tube has a 10 minute limit I think) BUT it still won't let me upload.... The reason for the upload problem is for some reason the upload includes a lot of "black" space at the end of my video (remember my original uncut vid was 14 plus min....well for some reason the computer "makes" the video run the entire 14 plus min even tho the actual moving pics part is only 9 minutes.....Any idea how I can "chop" out the last 4 min of black space? ( I am using the windows movie maker software that came free with my computer (I use Vista)) AND I can't get the video to "end" at the right part so I only upload 9 or so minutes to You Tube.... Thanks! Andrew
My "New" Cat 977 K Oh....I did say I would post a pic so hopefully the pic file is not too large to upload....(I'll try one first)..... Andrew
Oh...It has some unusual box looking thing welded to the top backside of the bucket...Any idea what this is for?....I am thinking maybe a large beam was put in it to act like a fishing pole to lift heavy items (like a boom pole on a tractor)? Since I plan on pushing over a bunch of trees I was really hoping the canopy was a little "beefier"....I later learned that this is basically a light duty "canopy" and not a true ROPS... Any idea of the strength of this VS a true ROPS in protecting your head from falling limbs?....I have seen pics online of some loaders that has a factory looking ROPS that goes around the canopy I have....Double protection!....Doesn't seem like too bad an idea....Any ideas who may have one that would fit mine? Andrew
That box looks like a reciever for a demolition pole or a tree pusher. Ask him if he still has it. In this economy, you might be better off having a local welder make you some heavy sweeps for the front.
http://cgi.ebay.com/Caterpillar-977...3286.c0.m14&_trkparms=66:2|65:3|39:1|240:1318 Check out this toasted 977L on Ebay. It's not far from you and has a real ROPS. Would make a good parts machine
Nice looking loader! Can't wait for the video. Here are a couple of pics of the brush cage I made for my HD9 after I got tired of getting hit in the head- might give you some ideas on something to fab up if you can't find a factory setup for a reasonable price.
HI Guys.... NEW Video is UP ;-) Enjoy, Andrew
HI, Nice cage Diesel Dave....I may have to do something similar! Andrew
Oh.... The video is under videos by "kingssalesandservice" on You Tube. Andrew
Congrats on the new machine andy! To post a link, just copy paste it to here, like this http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6rYAvEiCHRc&feature=channel_page Btw you had me browning my pants, and i wasent even there!:drinkup
I thought for sure that they would have had that load on a lowboy for one, and a 7 axle rig for two. 77's are what 60k pounds... And what about the height, he looked pretty tall...
HI, Thanks for the doing the link Deere.... Stumpjumoer....I'm not sure how high or how heavy the machine is....The owner contracted the shipping co to send it to me... At first, the owner told me he would have to have the canopy removed and the exhaust pipe cut down for height rules and he also told me originally that I had to have it offloaded on a berm of dirt because the truck that it was being shipped on had no ramps and was not a detachable (low boy type) trailer either.....I was relieved when he said he had to do neither when he found the trucking co the loader ended up on.... The only thing that worried me a little was when the truck made the final leg of the trip to where the loader was ultimately unloaded.....we had to cross several "small" bridges with weight limits of 12 and 20 tons....I guess the spread axles of the trailer helped since nothing seemed to be bad afterwards (Of course that same spread axle (according to the trucker) kept the truck and trailer from being driven up the last road (I've had other tractor trailer / lowboys go up the same road). Just curious but where would one find the machine's serial number....I've looked and looked but can't seem to find it (there was a number in bead weld on the bucket but it was nowhere near what the owner said the SN was and the Cat dealer said the SN the owner gave me was not valid. Thanks! Andrew
There should be a serial number plate about 2"x 1.5" just above the floor in front of the steering pedals. I have also seen them on the left side of the gearshift console. Also, the serial number will be stamped into the frame on the rear of the tractor frame usually on the left side. In most cases it will be rusted and/or painted over on a machine of this age.
HI, Thanks Lonestar.....you were right...ther ID tag was under the "dash" by the steering pedals.....I couldn't find anything on the frame where I thought they would be hiding.... Andrew
977 is such an awesome wrecking machine. I've seen these things used for heavy demo in the city and they are just so impressive.
HI All, Hearing how expensive undercarriages can be, I decided out of curiosity, to see just how expensive they really are so I called a local Berco dealer in Ashland, VA to see what some undercarriage parts would cost for my machine (977 K SN: K112434 )..the results are as follows (NOT including freight charges): 1) Sprocket teeth segments (enough to redo both sprockets).........$ 958.00 2) Rollers (each).....................................................................$ 305.00 3) Pads ( $50 each pad....need 82 pads total for both tracks).........$4100.00 NOTE : You can by a package deal (they call it a "Track Group" that gives you all the rails and pads for both sides for......................................$9500 I didn't get a price for pins and bushings or the front ideler BUT as you can see it is pretty pricey if you need alot.... I need to weld grousers since they are getting low and I was quoted a price of $2.18 per foot on 1" high grouser...(My machine has triple grouser pads....seems like it would be very tedious to do....Are full length welds needed on both sides?.....I know there is alot of stress BUT that is A LOT of welding!...The man at Berco said I could "cheat" by only welding the outer two grousers on each pad.....What are your thoughts on grousers? Do all 3 or do the outer two on each pad (They have grousers as high as 2 " .....BUT the man said to be careful not to get too much traction because if the tracks can't slip you risk messing up the final drives....How far can you go before that happens? (grousers are available in 1", 1 3/8", 1 5/8" , 2").... Seems to me I'd consider "going large" so as to never have to go through that welding ordeal again BUT I don't want to screw up final drives....That sounds painful AND expensive!! ;-O Also, the cylinders are leaking a bit of fluid....Is it hard to replace the outer seal (the cartridge looking thing was hanging on the rod on 2 of the cylinders but I tapped them back in....still leaks a bit tho... Finally, Anybody know where to find a Rops like in the following link (I already have the canopy looking cover under the HD 4 post ROPS....I just want more beef overhead....Just in case!.....Front sweeps would be nice too)....I did see if they wanted to sell the ROPS only but they weren't too interested in that.... Here's the link: http://www.machinerytrader.com/list...568548&GUID=e00f2bea4c864865916da3f1f77ce4ade Thanks! Andrew PS - Also FWIW, the man said my machine was a 1966....not sure if he was right or not but that's what he said in case it helps anybody out there
Andy, Most track loaders have double grouser pads, at least that is how it is around here. Excavators usually have the triples, but I guess it is what you want. I dont think welding the two outside ones would cause any problems. As far as the hydraulic cylinder, you just need to get a set of packings and re-seal it. If the head does not have the small bolts and washers to help keep the dust wiper in place, clean it up good and use some retaining compound to hold it in good. Also, after you install the wiper seal, you can use a center punch and get close to the edge of the seal and peen the head into the seal a little to help hold it also.
Andy, You might check with Atoka Mfg. in Oklahoma. They manufacture cabs, sweeps, etc. I have used them before. I wouldnt overdo it on the height of your grousers. A 977 final drive repair usually starts out at about $3800.00 for aftermarket parts.
If you have a heavy equipment wrecking yard within a few hours of where you live, they might be able to help you with a ROPS. Sweeps are a good idea if you are taking trees down. Even then, it's still dangeous work. Dead or weak trees have a way of breaking off and falling back on the machine. And deadly sticks come up from the side when least expected. Regarding the undercarriage, are you saying yours is worn out? Or are you just pricing things? As you discovered, a complete undercarriage will cost 20,000 and up, without labor. You may want to have an experienced person look at it and tell you what really needs to be replaced. Some parts may be fine. The grouser pads are probably the last thing I would replace, unless they are badly busted up. If you want to increase the traction without changing the grouser pads, you can weld on pieces that are about 1/3 of the width of the grouser on top of the worn grousers. Stagger them, with some in the middle and some on both sides of the pads. That saves material and welding time and provides an aggressive footprint.
Undercarriage if the pins havent been turned yet on the chains, you may be able to get away with just turning them and changeing the sprokets. Keep in mind whether you turn the pins and bushings or put a new chain on it make sure that you pout new sprokets on it! like you already mentioned instead of new pads it isnt that big of a deal to weld new material on. my 2 cents! Good Luck!!!:drinkup
Before you spend anything on it i woudl put it to work and see what i really had!!!!! Nice to find out prices ,but it might not be worth the time and money if the rest other things are worse and in need of repair. Put it to work unless it is to bad to move,then let us know if it worth buying parts for? As far as grouser i would go with some 2" bar stock and just weld on one par per pad.That all most dozers use or have.Good luck. I'm wanting on work pics opcorn:usa
Not bad! $5500 and it runs. Not bad. If you plan to replace the sprockets you must turn the pins. Hopefully they have not been turned yet. When they wear the radius on both the pins and sprockets widen. The new sprockets will have a much tighter radius and the worn pins will not seat properly, causing accelerated wear on the sprockets. I used to own a 977L, a 14X 6000 series with a 4in1 and rippers. I re-grousered with 2" and replaced the sprockets and turned the pins. A good, hardworking machine. I also have considerable time on a 973 and can say there is no comparison as the 973 will run circles around the 977. That said, the machine you bought should do a good job for what you plan to use for. Just take it slooooow and easy. Do all your work in 1st gear and travel in 2nd (maybe). Remember, she's an old gal. I also ran a 983 20 years or so ago. A 977 times 1.5 What an animal.
HI Guys, Thanks for all the info and help so far.... Concerning the undercarriage, On this machine it is really not as bad as all that....I had an old HD 11 that was FAR worse (sharp sprockets, bushings worn to the pins, rollers that didn't well....roll easily etc...rails or rollers that were worn so that the rollers were cutting the pins etc.. Truly a miserable undercarriage BUT I worked it until we finished what we had to do (altho it did throw the tracks twice...AARG).... I'll post a few pics of this undercarriage....not really too bad (at least compared to what I had before!)....I was concerned about the grouser height tho because the bolt heads are about the same as the grousers! (yes 3 per pad) . The previous owner suggested rotating the pins (I'm not sure how to tell it needs doing tho) and truthfully I didn't realize that if the bushings were rotated I needed new sprocket segments....hmmm Just curious but why would a 973 run circles around the 977?....is it because of the slightly increased HP and extra heft or is it because hydro is in fact that much better than the powershift tranny and clutched turns?.....I think the rear engine placement is a plus that may be helpful too in providing better forward vision as well as better counetweighting the front bucket in extreme lifts? (I did like the fact that using hydro both tracks can still have power where as in a standard setup (non hydro)....turning means no power in the clutched track).... I haven't really worked the 977 yet....nothing but rain here lately!....I probably need to look over the machine carefully tho because the previous owner mentioned that he thought one of the sprocket segments may be loose on the tight side....Hate "wallow" out any holes because of loose parts. What do you think of the undercarriage? or do you need more and better pics? Thanks! Andrew
Im totally with Construct'O on this one!! it really sucks to rebuild a 977 from scratch, get a picture of the machine overall condition and then start to think about what to replace and in witch order tripple row pads really stink if you work on something else than pavement, single or double are a lot better for pushing power and grip! the 977 will have no reability problems, but turning is a little bit affected, the machine turns better with less traction. before welding the groussers a would check first the thickness of the pads, if they are worn in the edges or bent, then i would rather replace the pad(s). also using hi quality materials when welding is suggested, using rebar or some other low quality steel will wear of quite fast. I saw the video and i'm still shaking man that was a really scary movie your helper probably don't have any experience with trackloaders or trailers! he was lucky to not fall from the side.
A lot of good information from people. My opinion is there is way too much emphasis put on pads, especially from track salesmen. A dozer needs max. traction, a loader hardly ever does. I only ran a 977 for a week but I don't remember too much track spinning going on. I would run the pads until they start to bend or the bolts start to fall out - just my 2 cents.
Care to explain that?
Undercarrage For what you want to do and from the photos posted I would leave the undercarrage alone. Yes, the pads are shot, but so what? At least they are all there and do not appear to be broken. As for the pins and sprockets, I seen much worse and the track adjustment looks more or less ok. Just work it and use the money saved for all the oil you will be burning. As for 973 vs 977, yes to all your questions. Better balance, much better visability, and the hydrostatic with its variable speed and power always to the tracks was a huge step forward. Still, the 977K/L loader is a great machine. After all, it is a CAT. Have fun!
I got a little carried away. If your you're doing straight pushing on dry hard ground, digging out of a bank say or pushing bigger trees a loader can use more traction. It just that most of the time loading or grading or cleanup work you don't need much. A big dozer spends its life doing hard pushing or pulling.
If you were looking to run this machine daily making a living, then a lot of work would be in order, but if that was the case, you would have bought a newer machine. For using it on your own property, where you have the time to work slowly and carefully, you will be in good shape from the pictures you have shown. You have plenty of track and sprocket to work at a slow pace for a long time. Was the unexpected right turn on the unloading video due to a sticking clutch or brake, or just lack of operator experience? Whichever, it was hairy for a while, especially when you consider there is no ROPS on the machine. That I would address first, especially if you do not have a lot of experience on these machines. ROPS and a seat belt is the difference between walking away with a headache and a bruised ego, and getting hauled away in a bag. Just remember, they are called "accidents" because we did not expect it to happen. If used with care, you can get a lot of service out of it. Take care
So andy, hows the 977 holding out?
Andy, I've operated both machines and I would not venture to say that the 973 is that much better than the 977. I did all kinds of work with both and actually, for fine grading, I liked the 977 better. The 973 is easier to maintain and work on. I didn't do much loading of trucks with the 973, but worked steadily for months in Arvada, Colorado loading out ten-wheelers with the 977 and I never hurt any of them. I've also done a lot of back-filling around housing and apartment basement walls with both and found I liked the 977 better for that too. Good luck with your machine.
Well I just came across this thread and had to put in my two cents. Congratulations on the 977 always was one of my favorite machines. I have never run a 973 so can't compare the 2 but for $5500.00 and it runs if you get a good summer out of it without too many repairs you are way ahead. Of course if it breaks thats another story but they are a tough machine in my book. Steve
RT Engineering: Are you a Navy Man by any chance? MCB9???? Just wondering.....My Dad was stationed there in the early to mid sixties.. be glad to talk with you about heavey equipment and share some stories..!!!
I am in track repair/new u/c all of the time. I strongly recommend you know for sure what condition the undercarriage is, before taking someones word on it. 30 percent means wore out to me. Also, $5500 now and $10000 in 3-4 months is not fun.
I thing you have got a real good deal. Don't buy new on the tracks. There are a lot of used track pad and rails. It looks like you will easy clear 65 acres. Be sure to check the oil levels each time you use it. And don't forget to change the oils when needed. Good luck.
Hi, I would personally get the 973, I have a 977l and it seems to always be breaking down. I take good care of it, but it always seems to work itself apart. I also have a 963 and I haven't had an major problems out of it. It's fast and gets the job done and it's a little easier to have it repaired and to get the parts. For my 977 we have to order most the parts, but that is my opinion, and u could probably get by with a 963 it's a good size for clearing.
your chains dont look that bad...30% seems a bit harsh . we got out 977 with a u/c way worse then that and used it for a pretty long time .Like everyone is saying if that was a machine that you had to work everyday all day you should be concerned ,but if its just gonna be used to clear your farm its fine as long as you don't have any major problems and there is a after marked company that sells bottom end parts for 77's it was 9k without shipping for new chains rollers sproket teeth front idlers . wich is a really good deal . ill try and dig up the paper work on he company .
977K weight about 42 - 45,000