Ok..here is the scenario; You are supplied drawings for siteworks and told to quote on the specifications contained in the drawings. Being the experienced professional you are you take the time to go to the site and whip the laser around, mainly for the purpose of verifying the contours in order to do the quantity estimates. After walking around the site for several hours doing lots of arithmetic you realise it is not you that is a numbskull (rather that your skull is becoming numb) and the designer has made a major testicle up with the drawings. Others are bidding on the job. You can remedy the situation but this will like double the cost of the earthworks (but you know this is what is going to have to be done anyway). It is apparent that nobody else has picked up what you have found. Q. Do you quote on the drawing "as is" or do you go back to the GC/Builder and explain the problem. The GC/Builder is in a competitive tender and the drawing is being used by others. If you go with the higher price you will probably blow the tender out of the water....but its the age old "bring em in low and hit em up hard for the extras"...that I don't like. In this case I have spoken to the builder and he wants me to quote on the specs so his tender remains competitive. Tenders need to compare apples with apples don't they??? But if your subbie is smart enough to work out a problem he should be rewarded shouldn't he/she?>? not penalised by losing the contract or by the other tenderer's benefitting from his professionalism ...this one does my head in ointhead
Stone Soup Just remember good guys usualy finish last. That's why I live on stone soup most of the time ointhead don't shoot your self in the foot!
squizzy, that is why i have no money either, too muchof a nice guy. since you are from perth, do you know these guys. they were up here drinking my beer. http://www.westernareas.com.au/ thansk
I would hide your beer cause there not gunna stop still its all gone. Those guys ruined my last holiday...as we headed into Great Outback...I warned my family how bad the roads are....bloody Flying Fox mine turned the road into a damn highway!..taken all the fun and corrugations out of an outback adventure...can't even go bush anymore without running into a bus full of Japanese tourists. Those guys even got....wait for it...."Air Conditioning" out there. Oh well...good luck to em...I used to drive a loader at a place called Kambalda some years back...they should know it.
I think you need to consider how level the playing field is, so to speak. You may not like it, but do you think that all, or any, of the competitors would be as forthright in pointing out the flaw in the plans? It becomes more a question of whether you're putting yourself at a dis advantage by sharing what you've discovered. Let them pay you for their shortcomings--not somebody else, or worse yet, get away with not paying at all. I do believe there a lot of contractors who got rich by recognizing the flaws in the plans and structuing their bids to win the job, then making their money on the changes and extras. Smart businessmen. As far as "hitting them up hard for the extras", I don't see any ethical dilemma if your charge for the extras is in line with what you'd have bid on a properly prepared set of drawings. Gouging them for substantially more...yeah, that would bother my conscience.
I appreciate the responses:thumbsup Its 11.30 pm here..and the tender submissions are due at midday tomorrow...I guess I'll just be an apple then no point being a turnip in a bobbing contest:Banghead
squizzy thansk for the info. hope we can get these guys to the great white north to go mining. as for the beer, they emptied my frig pretty fast, LOL if they drink like that at -34C sure would hate to see what +39C. thansk
give them a price for what they ask 4
Wouldn't the designer be responsible for the extra costs since it was his/her mistake? I think the answer is simple. You made a bid on the design you were asked to bid on. The fact that you did the extra homework and found the mistake just makes the answer even more obvious, to me at least. If the designer did their home work then there wouldn't be a problem.
I would submit a bid for the work as specified in the plan. Then a separate Proposal Bid for the changes to “remedy the situationâ€. Some contracts make the contractor responsible for verifying the site conditions before bidding. If you submit multiple bids you will have all bases covered.
Thats my point...get your own I can just see the architect coming forward and saying "Oh...a couple a thousand cubes of fill...no problem, I'll pay for that!" It would seem that designers are often not subject to the same rules that the humble dirt shifter is. Anyways, the bid is in!.."as per the drawing"...and the GC seemed more than pleased with our efforts...especially the little comments/clauses I put in about the referenced datum. Thanks again for the your comments.
Well, my guy won the tender. We got the walls, landscaping and tree removal. The Builder's regular guy got under us by a couple of grand for the earthworks which is OK by me as there wasn't much in it for me after I hired a loader. I had a meeting yesterday with the builder and his supervisor and I pointed out the mistakes with the drawings again and the areas which were going to cause trouble. He realises now that its a bigger balls up he initially thought. The earthworks will be OK but its likely the walls will ahve to be changed to suit...and I can't build a 10' high wall in one area cause there is not the room for Geo-grid or backing blocks. Its likely that area will be concrete tilt panels or a poured cantilever so I miss out on a big bunch of block laying. Anyways, we'll just have to wait and see. I may pick up some of the slack as I pointed out the carpark areas will need retaining if we run with the sensible level. On top of this the client has taken the drawings for another revision...so re-quoting is likely.....I can see Squizzy's bill now....walls $3K...stuffing around, meetings, finding balls ups and advisory service $27K The advice above would appear to have been good in that my guy won the bid. I'll let you know how it pans out.