I'm wondering if anyone has ever had an inner safety element air filter deteriorate over time? Primary air filters for that matter too. Most manuals say to go by the restriction indicator but for machines that don't get a lot of hours do the filters go bad over time? Anytime I've checked older filters have never seen one that seemed deteriorated or showed any signs of failure. Inner elements always looked like new. New air filters usually come loose in a box. Do air filters, especially safety elements have a shelf life and is there any difference between sitting on a shelf and being installed under a primary filter? I'm all for changing filters when they get too dirty but how do you know when to change the safety element if it still appears in new condition? Is there a way to test them?
I don’t ever remember having an inner air filter element go bad. Our rule of thumb was don’t disturb the inner element and replace it when you replace the outer element. On the yard loader, The restriction indicator would usually dictate the frequency of blowing out the main element. If there was any sign of dust on the inner filter, there was damage to the outer, and it was time for both. I don’t know why the filter manufacturers don‘t bag the elements when they put them in the box. A lot of shops I visit have filters on the shelf that have dust inside as well as outside the box AND opened boxes where someone has searched for the one he needs!!
I imagine if you keep it out of the sun it won't go bad
I've never seen an inner safety element go bad either. I have taken them out just to check after 2 or 3 years but never found any signs of deteriorating. I don't have lots of hours on them so don't see a need to change them every year. The grader has a Turbo II precleaner. The main filter wasn't too dirty at all and the inner filter looked like new despite being over 10 years old. I didn't take it out and that's why I'm wondering if anyone has ever seen an inner safety element go bad? It is basically protected by the outer filter and is out of the elements. It goes through hot and cold periods but I don't think that harms filters or you'd hear about filters going bad after not being used in the winter. If the inner got wet I think could damage it but how is it going to get wet?? It would be nice to know if anyone has ever seen one go bad. Replacing them is cheap insurance but how do you tell if there's anything wrong with them?
Take the inner filter out and wipe inside the pipe with your fingers, if you wipe dust away you have a problem.
I took the safety elements out of the skid steer and grader. Both appear like new. The grader even had a Donaldson Safety Signal retaining nut that was still showing green despite the filter being over 10 years old. There were no signs at all the filter media looked deteriorated. There doesn't appear to be any reason to change them. Am I missing something?
I'd say not. Those look new.
I generally replace both on the smaller stuff at 500hrs. They aren't that expensive, $20-30 for the 2. My firewood processor will plug up before that sometimes. Last time, it started blowing black smoke like a flatbiller in Daddies old 12v Cummins Dodge. Thought I was losing a hydraulic pump or something! Course on the stuff running $100+ filters I'm blowing them out
Years ago I had a Franklin log skidder with a 4-53 detroit that was down on power and smoking way worse than normal, it was also heating. Tried all the normal stuff with no results. I had even changed the outer filter. Well, finally I replaced both filters and it was fixed. I later cut into the inner filter and it had soot embedded in it way down in the grooves where you couldn't see it. The exhaust ran right by the air intake and had been leaking a little. I have read that soot particles can drop well below 1 micron. Most air filters don't quiet reach those levels. I learned then you can be cheap on breakfast cereal, soft drinks, and sandwich bags, but not on trash bags, paper towels, or air filters. I always change them both. I try to buy Wix as well. You can actually wash paper filters gently with mild detergent as long as you let them dry good before reinstalling.
I haven't seen an inner filter deteriorate yet, and we have some older ones kicking around in equipment at the farm. I replaced the inner air filter on my Bobcat last year when I did all the major work. It was dated 1999. It was slightly discolored compared to the replacement, but nothing like the difference between new and used outer air filters. The media didn't look bad or damaged, I was just replacing all of the filters and doing a full service so I ordered the inner element too.
Inner filter says not to wash.
I have never seen specific what filter makers say but I have service manuals that say its fine to wash the filters. Now that being said, I do not do it. Recently did a Cat Platinum warranted rebuild on a C15. I assure you filters are cheaper. Could have bought a new half ton 4wd pickup for what that cost.
Inner safety filters are never recommended to be washed. It says do not wash on the inner filter on the grader. Outer primary filters used to be recommended to wash a max. of 3 times. I think Donaldson even had a special detergent for washing them. Blowing out filters is another can of worms. I think I'd feel safe going with the 40 PSI max. from 6-8" away recommendation.
What happens when you blow the. Out and the dust on the dirty side is now on the clean side
You have to watch how you're blowing it out. I seem to recall seeing something that covers the ends except for the air gun and you apply air to the inside to blow the dust out and covers prevent any dust getting inside.
Don't cheap out on toilet paper either.. ****** fangers!
You definitely want the inner safety element and sometimes a 2nd one with toilet paper. The one ply they put in a lot of public washrooms is terrible. You need 4 or 5 times more than you normally would and I don't see how they save any money with stuff you can literally see through.
I just had a inner air on a John Deere genset where the endcap came un bonded from the end of it, so thats something to keep in mind. Grasp the ends and giver a tug, make sure its still good
That sounds like maybe a manufacuring error or possibly a result of long time service. Do you know how long the filter was in the the machine? Both inners I took out appeared very solid and like new in every aspect. If I sell the grader I'll put a new inner element in. Not necessarily because it needs it but more so a potential buyer doesn't think the maintenance was lacking. It's not a big expensive filter but if there's absolutely no signs of deteriorating or failing to do its job, why spend the money to replace it. It would be nice if the manufacturers had a way to test the integrity of the inner safety elements instead of just saying to replace them with every 4th primary service. The Safety Signal retainer nut is a good way but should you go strictly by that?? I think every once in a blue moon even the top rated brands can have an issue. I had a Cat fuel filter spring a leak and I saw pics. of wire mesh from a Wix hyd. filter pulled out of a control valve. Read of a few instances where a filter was blamed as a cause for failure due to it being a lower micron rating and plugging faster. A common response is how can you fault the filter for doing a better job? Sometimes you have to use a higher micron rating to avoid plugging or reduced flow far too soon. Baldwin claims you can't measure 2 microns yet Cat and other brands claim 2 micron ratings on fuel filters. I can see in places with poorer fuel, using too low a micron rating plugging very quickly. Would probably be a good idea to pre-filter the fuel once or twice before filling a machine. Start off with maybe a 12 micron then a 8 and have a 5 micron on the machine. Just a 2 micron on the machine would be nothing but frustrating.
I have had a brand new John Deere canister fuel filter straight out of the box with a hole in it that looked like it was drilled it was so round, but whatever it was it happened before it was painted. There will eventually be a flaw in any brand. There can also be a flaw in an employee. We keep all maintenance items on hand and operators are responsible for maintenance. Yet we had a veteran truck driver run the two, external over the front wheel filters on a T800 so long that it collapsed them both. Only cost an in-frame with counter bore cutting on a 3406 kitty. That has been 10 years ago now I guess.
No I don’t know how long the filters were in the machine, but they definitely didn’t look new. The inner looked a bit ragged and aged for sure. Plus the machine was at the shop, for poor running, which turned out to be a horribly plugged fuel filter, so maintenance was definitely lacking. Zero indication of when the last maintenance had been, no dates or hours anywhere on it.
Maybe someone was taking the outer and inner filters out and banging them on something solid to knock any dust out? Maybe because the engine was running poorly.