2016 Freightliner Cascadia DD15, builds air pressure slowly-does not lose air with engine off. Start engine let idle and air pressure will drop from 110 to 70 psi in no time. I spent three hours finding the problem. Any guesses by the crew of HEF. Truck Shop
Unloader O-rings and an AD-IS combo wet tank/governor/air dryer?
Compressor head full of carbon?
Do those things use air pressure to operate a VGT? What about a fan hub leak?
The wastegate does use air but anymore they probably plumb it to the emissions crud also.
If it took you three hours, I could probably look and guess for three weeks. That said, the last air leak stumper I had was on a Mack with a National Crane. Couldn't build air pressure. Could put air to a tank and truck would hold air fine. Unhooked lines on the compressor- it was putting out air. Couldn't get it from compressor into the tanks. No restriction on the dryer. Wet tank, unhooked and checked plumbing, governor, reeds in the head. Me and the mechanic were exchanging dirty looks and muttering about "accidental" fires. Noticed that when I shut off the truck, I also had a slight gurgle in the hyd tank, I had thought it was just getting agitated by the pump settling out and rolling down. Turns out the air supply to the upper throttle came off the wet tank, and was leaking air in the swivel to the hydraulic system. When we were putting air to the truck, we were downstream into a different tank, so the flow back valves wouldn't make that part leak. Was only leaking into the swivel when I had the engine running because of where I was air testing it, and with the engine running, I couldn't hear it in the tank. Rebuilt swivel and problem solved, but it sure had me stumped for a while.
I’ve had fan hubs do similar....but that’s too easy. Dryer, relay valve, Hell I could name a 1000 parts! Lol
Both tanks dropping to 70? Or just wet tank?
I'm gonna say Gov/drier/unloader first , hi/low piston second (if it even has a manual)
And for my last guess what about the DEF purge valve
That’s ten years newer than anything I ever see. I’m curious.
Ronsii you nailed it.---But the DD15 has had several design changes along the way, so not all are plumbed that way. There is a air valve control electrically operated just below the turbo with a 3/8 air line feeding it which supplies air to waste gate. The control valve was toast also because no air should pass through at idle. And that is what made it so difficult to find plus the engine had to be running to find it. And there were naturally no dash warning lights or codes. When the driver finally showed back up I could ask enough questions and the right question-{Is the engine running any different?}. Oh yah it has a more power on the hills, bingo. And you can't buy the waste gate separate it comes with the $3,500 turbo only. You know I like a good challenge but this kind of stuff is just horse ****. I have said before it's a good thing truck manufactures don't build airplanes-in the old days the airplane designer was most likely the test pilot. Which put an end to bad designs in some cases. Truck Shop
Yeah, have heard of a few of these going bad and that it is r&r as a unit... bunch of bs I say It's always interesting talking to an operator after I get something sorted out and they'll just casually mention something seemingly non related that could have saved hours of troubleshooting... oh well, I do enjoy the challenge of figuring out problems that the previous guys couldn't but do they have to make it so hard
If you could buy the wastegate separate is it possible to replace in the field like you would have wanted to do? You know the manufacturer has a part number for what you want. Once in a while I have had good success digging around for a part number and ordering it by number. When they say assy. only. For $3500 bucks it would be worth it to me. If you know someone on the "inside".
I had forgotten about the wastegate air. I had a customer call me one night said she had a air leak on her turbo on a Cummins. I said you mean a boost leak. She said some little round thing was leaking air and the compressor could barely keep up. Was able to get a new one from Cummins and installed. Took the old one apart out of curiosity and found the shaft was riveted to the piston and could have repaired it. Will know next time.
No sir-ee bob, called Detroit technical and that part is not available separate from turbo. Thing is on the DD15 this not a common problem. The bad thing about this one is warranty was good up to 500,000 this truck rolled into the shop with 500,266. And out of the 60 tractors we have only ten have this type of turbo design. Truck Shop
As many trucks as y’all have I’d be pushing for them to help on it only being 266 miles over.....
Well we've pushed about all we will get this month already. Besides Freightliner chips in on the towing cost on anything under 200,000 miles on the odometer. They already ate a bunch of items on emission system problems and gave us warranty on top of what they repaired, to the tune of about $25,000. Truck Shop
Wow. That’s good then. When I had all the KW’s I had to lean on them to do what’s right a couple times. I bought a Pete that was a smokin deal and they took it as a message and suddenly they wanted to fix stuff that wasn’t broken! Haha
Well none of it ever comes easy, It's a tug of war the whole way most of the time. One dealer in Idaho just ate a rebuild on a Series 60 that only made it 510 miles. Friday a week ago I was out from 5 to midnight, towed the whole mess trailer and all loaded 130,000 lbs all together back to our shop. I really had that 12.7 liter in that KW working. Pulled the dip stick oil level was over and could smell raw fuel. Removed the rocker cover, hold down bolt for #3 injector broke and destroyed the follower, camshaft, cylinder head and more than likely that piston and liner. The injector was just hammering up and down and beat the copper and head all to hell. Rule #1 with a Series 60 always replace the injector hold down bolts and head bolts if the head bolts have not been up graded. There were no new injector hold down bolts on the parts invoice. So they are have a snack eating that 14L. Truck Shop
BTW if you guys ever will get the trouble with this unholy scourge called emissions! And would get the code saying it cannot reach the temperature or pressure, before throwing sensors, sevens injectors and purge valves at it - check your dryer and air system for moisture. There’s a lot of money lost because of that one! There’s no trouble code for moisture in air!
And what are you doing pulling loads like this with that hot rod Detroit?
Little off topic but about Detroit’s : few days back, saw a hot shot pulling trailer with looked like two cycle supercharged “screamer”, it was pouring rain, that engine was not tarped, and I could actually see the shiny screws of that supercharger through the open hole!
It's our company tow truck
Did that truck ever had an “ Carlile Transportation system” sticker on the doors? Looks awfully familiar!
Hey Truck Shop! Are you in Tri Cities or Palouse?
That's an old Pepsi truck for chr!st sake. Starbuck.
Well at least the oil will be a little cleaner for a while, I remember a series60 in a 94 frightliner that I drained an extra 10 gallons or so of oil out once... the owner said he never had such clean oil after that
It’s not just color that made me asking about truck being ex Carlile! They do not allow drop axles in Alaska, so a lot of tractors had a long frame to have better axle weight distribution and to conform to states bridge law, I worked for them in Tacoma terminal. I lived in Auburn for 16 years, now on Alabamas Gulf Coast.
Just swap that bum turbo onto a truck that still has warranty
Yeah those ideas have already been discussed but our trucks don't sit long enough to pull that one. Besides I'm the lead mechanic not the owner, he is signing the checks not me. Truck Shop
Local trucking company had a ISX Cummins fail catastrophically at 21,000 and change, dealer was explaining the rebuild process and warranty to the owner, his look said it all and when he lit in and lit up that was about all Cummins Rep wanted. They yanked and exchanged the entire engine to satisfy warranty and get the truck back into revenue where a reman was going to take at least a week longer to perform. He has two DD15s and a single DD16 in his fleet, likes all three as seem pretty well warranty resistant, he usually rotates machines at roughly the 450,000mile mark to avoid stepping out of warranty. Has a couple problematic ISX units with continual DPF unit and DEF recycle issues, Cummins is treading thin ice as to repeat purchases.
Freightliner did warranty the turbo. But Freightliner does have it's equal amount of emission and DPF issues with the DD15, It's only a matter of time and miles {250K usually} before the dash board alarms start lighting up on a regular basis. Truck Shop
I've heard that a nationwide freight company here that has a large number of western stars with DD15s has been pulling them out and replacing with Cummins. 200-odd sitting in a warehouse, apparently.
That seems odd, but to each their own.
I think everyone in this business wish that this emissions stuff just go away, together with “smart ass” democrat, big government, wanna be Europeans commies, fools who came up with all this nonsense! If LA has problem with smogs let them impose this thing to LA area only! Now they’ve gotten to trimmers and chainsaws, they don’t like cows farting, next they will be putting “emission” devices on our ********, to clean up our farts! Diesel particulets it’s just carbon, out which everything organic is made!
I don't know the details. Maybe they have a repower program, like another trucking company. They repower their trucks at 1 million km, which is about 3 years running for them.
To me just seems a major Unnecessary expense where not only are they swapping engines have to consider electronics to the cab and some IN the cabs have to be made compatible then the logistics of the conversions where end up with multiple spares storage and supply until they are all converted. Just a lot of what ifs to doing that. Here is just as easy to rotate machines buy new trade while still a decent return and move into the next generation. The conversion equipment also then somewhat falls off the builders list for repair parts so quantitative listings have to be made and kept up, become Frankentrucks.
And this right here, what DMiller said . This makes a good argument for fleets of gliders. Older chassis, dated pre emissions, no problem. You literally spec your truck. Run open pipes if you want. Still got your Jake's. No intake or exhaust restrictions. And nothing the EPA can do about it for now. I had heard a while back they were going after the glider market . Last I heard Freightliner was aggressively fighting back, they had a good program going at the time.
One large problem has occurred with gliders, 14L Detroit engine cores are nearly extinct. Those are not to be had anywhere, a core is going for 15k and up. Truck Shop
Yeah, but you have options, N14 , 3406E etc. Even an M11 with no emissions is a beast. C15 , iirc was a pretty much a 3406 with egr and an extra turbo. I get what you're saying, the core pile is drying up, just like the talent pool.
Glider kits Ref: https://www.ccjdigital.com/epas-repeal-of-obama-era-emissions-regs-for-glider-kits-advances/
The C15 prior to 2005 was single turbo, the C15 ACERT was twin turbo 2005 up. The big problem is most of these older non emission engines have already been into-some several times. Most of these engines are in need/require major machine work. There is not much point in installing a so-so engine in a new glider because the cost of a glider is damn expensive- In most cases depending on how it's spec'ed $140,000 plus when done. Truck Shop
Only way around it is the original purpose of Gliders wreck rebuilds. Find a total that HOPEFULLY the power train is Not destroyed, later model but less emission dependent and build that.
So we are stuck with gliders which are expensive and the engine you put in may be questionable. Or new emissions trucks which last 200,000 miles before the chickens and geese come out. Let us not forget that it is our government doing this to us in every segment of every business. Just dragging everything down as much as they can. Somehow this reminds me of the Soviet Union and Red China and how they messed with everybody and everything and caused shortages and famines and general misery. Not on as big a scale but we seem to be getting there by degrees. We need to put a stop to it and fast before it ruins us all. Allowing glider kits to come back is nice but we don't need 3 steps forward and 1 step back. We need to march this way back such as not forcing L.A. smogger trucks on people in Sierra County.
Your' PM rating is often is higher for Grass Valley versus Mira Loma-Riverside, I checked! Are stating that you do not care about your health or the general populist in Calif? San Fran and Sacramento Delta vehicular, industrial, AG smog-particle pollution typically blows eastwards. Cat C15,16,18s 40-70 pin ECM engines door decal Cummins is replacing 500,000 DPFs, cost $187,000,000.00 affects 60 engine families. Not trying 'cheat'; DPFs didn't last as long as predicted. Commercial owners will receive a letter from CARD March 2019 instructing how to receive refund for cost of replace. Issue was found by CARB during 'in use testing'; real world operating conditions. Cummins verified the CARB finding, okay we agree and will pay for replacements.
We have been working in enclosed shops and other places with Tier 0 diesel engines for decades and nobody is getting sick that I know of. The air district and everybody knows that PM here is blowing up from the valley, trying to limit sources in this county is a waste of time and everyone knows it. Attrition would have taken care of it but the stupid accelerated replacement schedule bankrupted plenty of small firms in the meantime during a downturn when they could not afford it. Us lowly grunts on the ground have known this was the case since 2007.5 when we got to beta test all these horrible devices. Remember we have had DOCs which worked fine from ~2004 to 2007. There was more PM than modern trucks but so little that you could never even see visible smoke. Most 7.3 Powerstrokes had DOC back in 1994 and they never smoked either. Remember all the figures on PM and lives saved come from the same people justifying their jobs. Kind of like the stimulus created x millions of jobs. How do we know it created x million jobs? Well we know when we spend yyy million dollars it creates 1 job so we spent z billion, therefore we created x million jobs.
Well breathing diesel emissions does cause blood to thicken, ever notice the old mechanics don't bleed much. Just a fact. Emissions are not going away and I'm glad I'm nearing the end of my years doing what I do. Truck Shop
And Medical Communities located world wide reviewing statistics. Not to difficult to count emergencies, heart attacks etc. During times of increased PM2.5 pollution events>>> https://www.theguardian.com/environ...ollution-linked-to-changes-in-heart-structure https://www.reuters.com/article/us-...-heart-disease-patients-unaware-idUSKBN1HO2NE Vehicles with DOC: tiny not seen particle pollution is MOST damaging to our health because PM2.5 particles and smaller cross over into the blood stream. I have a 99 T300 ISC8.3, after sitting for 30 days. Climb in, crank engine, wait for oil pressure, set idle @ 800rpm, jump out...nothing but hot air exiting from the exhaust pipe. NOT CLEAN ENOUGH-Scraping the vehicle for a total tax write off. @ Truck Stop, old mechanics that don't bleed with thickened blood! How many are pre-diabetic established by blood HbA1c test, also known as the haemoglobin A1c or glycated haemoglobin test? I see numbers 80% of the US population are pre-diabetic, a majority don't know their condition. 200 plus applicants for CDLs, 4 excepted...many rejects are diabetics. Once diabetic is on you med record; no CDL, happened to a friend working for Cat dealer. Dealer bought a non-CDL service truck for him. Contractors are purchasing more non-CDL service trucks, same issue...difficulty finding drivers. Real Science THEN versus NOW Typically used by Big Pharma to sell drugs or Coca-Cola reformulated is good for your health; actually good for the bottom line profits, insurance companies, med health community etc. Don't worry the 'girls' are going to fix our *** up society, they have a recent victory MeToo. Women say, 'they won't hire me'..other women replies, 'MeToo'. Take care guys, stay sage Stan
OFF TOPIC (um Air Loss) EXAMPLE THE SCIENTIFIC METHOD & MASS MEDIAS' SPREADING THE GOV's, Big Pharmas' and CDC's Fairy Tales CNN https://www.cnn.com/2018/09/26/health/flu-deaths-2017--2018-cdc-bn/index.html Greenmedinfo / You don't sell a drug, you sell a disease, George Merck, founder of Merck / Mid-term $$$$ foreign contributors to RNC = Merck, BASF = drug makers http://www.greenmedinfo.com/blog/cdcs-fictional-flu-death-stats-and-tamiflus-lethal-side-effects
Had been many a time with a engine using some oil and the customer looking to patch it one more time would drop the exhaust manifold, start the machine then standing alongside while being smothered in exhaust stare up at the exhaust ports to find the bad hole. DD, Cummins and Cat all done the same way and usually inside a building doors down with no exhaust fan(s). The quarry and in the hole of a river tow were the worst, almost looked like the facilities were on fire in most cases with smoke rolling out the doors we would open. 6/110 DDs seemed to make more smoke when NOT burning oil!! 12v149s were the loudest.
I think it is very important to remember, (or find out ) - what definition of “toxicity” is! Another question to find out which industry is biggest CO2 polluter - you will be surprised! NASA even made a video from space - but nobody has a courage to even mention it!
And another thing! Most of the “scientists” in state universities is in the pocket of Big Ag and Big Farma! The ones who was not ( Dr. Elane Ingram for example) - kicked out of universities to not to stand in the way of large contributions, donations and grants! So I guess we will never know the reality!
Cattle for meat and dairy cattle industry, factor in corn, grains for feed stocks...arg equipment for growing, pesticides-chemicals etc. Huge carbon footprint. Nice Green Lawns.... Universities professors, researchers in the pocket of big pharma! 1 example Monsanto paid ghost writers to write their study results! Info Freedom Act internal documents, emails etc. Weren't allowed to be introduced into evidence @ the recent Calif trial by the judge. Jury awarded $286million to plaintive and of course Bayer's Monsanto is fighting with appeals. Bayer AG purchase of Monsanto; Monsanto hide massive info from Bayer's board-investors before the merger deal was approved. Bayer-Monsanto set aside $287million to cover any litigation! Bayer AB, Monsanto chemical warfare experts! Bayer AG, convicted Nazi war criminal. Fritz ter Meer; after his release from prison 1950, he went to the UN, 'control the food and you control the people, LOL.UN 'that is a great idea'! With Internet, most all information is available for anyone seeking real facts. Using Google search, clean search history by typing https://myactivity.google.com/myactivity into search bar. With google's tracking if don't clear history you'll keep getting repeat results.
Actually the whole “Conventional Agriculture” dose it and biggest CO2 emitter is - tilling of the soil! Same thing is to blame for loosing 12 feet deep of fertile topsoil in 200 years! And you don’t have to listen to science to know that - just stand on the bridge over Missouri or Mississippi rivers, after rain in spring or fall time and look at what flowing to Gulf of Mexico! But EPA afraid to even look that way! On the other hand they “regulate” chainsaws and trimmers!
And now when weeds become more glyphosate resistant - they start to talk about return of “agent orange”!
Missouri River has always been Mud, Mark Twain noted, "Too Thick to Drink and too Thin to Walk on".
Yep! They was plowing soil back then!!!
This thread went from a air loss problem on a tractor to discussing soil and air pollution. Thread is over. Truck Shop
In life everything is intertwined!