Does anyone use a wrist/power tilt on their excavator. I would like to get one with a pin grabber quick-coupler. I think that would be slick. I have heard that it limits your breakout force is there any truth to that? What does everybody think? would you have one? Do you have one?
Check out www.helac.com . They claim to be pretty strong. Might be kinda pricey though.
I got the literature on the helac powertilt. They look like a heck of a unit, it has all of the specs, requirements and all of that, I just have not been able to find a price for them.
Try this www.wagmann.com . Nothing speacial about this company as I found them with a search but their site says they sell them. No price lists but they do have contact info listed on the site.
I have been researching these for about 1 year. We will be buying one prolly next year. The best choice is helac. They have a tilting coupler that is also a hydraulic quick coupler. You need a 3rd valve in your pump to run 2 way hydraulics, plus a extra set of lines. Just the tilting coupler alone, you are looking aroud $12,000. Also, you don't want a tilting bucket, you want a tilting coupler so that you can change buckets.
We have aux. hyds. to the end of the stick. 12 grand is hard to justify for it, although it is an awesome attachment.
you need to see this attachment wrist and 360 degrees http://www.rototilt.cc/rototilt.html
I GOTTA HAVE A ROTOTILT......DANG...how SWEET!:thumbsup
I'd imagine that thing is pretty pricey to buy and repair.
I got a tilt-a-tac on my bobcat. Same concept. Different application. I can't run the stupid thing with out one now. :yup
We use wrist buckets on all our machines, from 45 tonne machines down, you can hurt the buckets, but guys seem to find ways to hurt digging buckets as well. We have close to 100 excavators now and most have weldco-beales brand wrists:bash
I see that rototilt on a local contractors machine they were filling inside a granite island in the center of the road. I almost went in the ditch when i saw the bucket turn sideways and dump gravel . Looks awesome to me. :thumbsup
Awesome attachments but too pricy for me.:crying Maybe Santa will bring me one, but I'm thinking I've been pretty naughty this year.:naughty
man that thing is sweet
The rototilt is more for light duty. I gotta call the sales rep at Helac someday to get a price quote. They make a standard duty for general cleanup and a heavy duty for trench, ripping, hammering, etc...
i know it is a killer attachment
Just curious, when you say aux. hydaulics, do you mean you have lines to run a hammer ?? If that is the case, you will also need another set of lines. To run a swinger attachment, you need 2 way hydraulics.
We dont have anything hooked up to the lines, but I think that they are 2 way hyds. They are supposed to be able to run a thumb, so that should run a swinger right?
My tilt is on the bucket, not on the connector. Mark Faulkner, the guy that built it for me said that a coupler tilt looses too much power unless your doing specialty work. Those roto set-ups are awesome! Mark said he can build one for my machine, but it's real $$$$$! A good operator can grade out loam and go right around a pole or object with out moveing the machine. Here's a link to a thread with a pic of the bucket, bottom of page. Here's Marks link. http://www.mcfaulkner.com/tilting_grading_bucket.asp
http://www.engcon.se/start.htm http://www.indexator.se/ http://www.smpparts.com/ http://www.sandcomaskin.se/eng/sandco_index.html http://www.maxbro.info/ http://www.steelwrist.com/home/ These are the manufacturers that I have found. I've only tried Engcon but it works very well.
Forget the rest.... Rototilt is the best! Hey Guys, Just noticed your Rototilt comments, and couldn't resist to chime in. The Rototilt is by far the most powerful and enduring option on your list. I've successfully sold the Rototilt in applications that any of those competitors would shutter to think of like piledriving, mining, rock drilling, with attachments like 5000# rammer hammers, ape robovibs, & tramac tunnelling heads. Average Rototilt capacity is 3 times that of the excavator, and you could literally hang the excavator from the Rototilt and not rip it apart! Rototilt works off any hammer plumbing, no need for expensive bi-directional circuitry, and has 6 times the holding/tilting torque of a powertilt. All the others on the list are cheap imitations fabricated in weld shops and filled with regular gear grease. The most notorious is engcon, who's founder, Stif Engstrom originally worked for Rototilt, then branched off with his own clone. The original Rototilt is manufactured by Indexator of a highly engineered worm gear in a casted housing filled with a liquid synthetic gear lube, having better longetivity, and loading characteristics, mostly due to less friction. If you compare wrists to cars.... Rototilt would be the Rolls Royce, engcon would be the hyundai, and helac is the geo.
Let's stick to the facts pls... Apparently DirtMan is trying to broadcast a message coming from Indexator, the Swedish manufacturer of Rototilt, about it's products beeing superior. Instead, let's look at some facts about the rototilt/tiltrotators on the market. Rototilt is a registered trademark of Indexator, this is why everybody else on Klutz list has to use another name: Tiltrotator or Steelwrist. The product however does the same job, endless rotation of the bucket and tilts 40 degrees (except Steelwrist 45 degrees). Many manufacturers have used oil for lubrication historically but has changed to grease. Why? when the oil has leaked out of the gearbox you have no lubriction at all. Even Indexator recommends re-filling the gearbox with grease once the oil is history. Practice always beats theory. Engcon has a welded gear housing with lower quality but casted gear housings are also used by others (Steelwrist even use casted steel). Indexator uses single acting tilt cylinders which are shorter but less stable and cannot withstand loads to the extent that the dual acting cylinders can (used by all others on the list). Indexator is just one option on this market, Engcon makes twice as many (approx 4000 in 2006) with a weaker product, Steelwrist is smaller but growing fast. In Scandinavia today almost all excavators between 3 and 30 tons are equipped with a tiltrotator/rototilt/steelwrist and more markets are moving in the same direction. When will it take-off in North America? It's a killer attachment for any machine, reducing cost and time, adding enormous flexibility but demanding more skilled operators. Conclusion: learn how to use it and start making money in no-time. Conclusion 2: Compare Indexator, Engcon and Steelwrist before buying one.
The Roto-tilts are the best out there, I've seen them in action while leveleing back fill material along walls, you can put the excavator anywhere and rotate the bucket so the back end doesn't hit the wall as you pull material away from it.
I got the helac on my Case cx50 and i love it.Has not broke yet and it's been on their more than 2 years.I work it pretty hard tilt it to the side and only use one tooth to pry out stumps, hot top and what ever else i have to do.. glen
Welcome to Heavy Equipment Forums TheDigger! :drinkup
Welcome to Heavy Equipment Forums glenhd! :drinkup
We have a JRB coupler with a tilt grading bucket on our 120 Deere. We bought it with about a 1000 hours and the machine should have never left the factory the way it is. With the long stick and coupler, the bucket can touch the cab. The weight has also taken a toll on the machine. Its a nice setup and worth having despite the weight. We dont use the grading bucket on the 120 much any more but we use the one on our Kubota KX121-3 constantly. Its worth every penny and does more work than the digging bucket.
Best of the Best Don't be confused by the clone makers, Digger is obviously working for Steelwrist, who sells what? 12... Indexator does not recommend filling with grease, until the Rototilt is very old, and grease is obviously not superior to oil. The truth behind the oil/grease debate is that the reason the clones use grease is because of inferior seals, sealing surfaces, and manufacturing practices, thus......resulting in less capacity, and shorter life. To say that any other tiltrotator is "Equal" or the same as the Rototilt, is just ignorant, and would only originate from a lessor competitor. As for the tilting, Indexator's primary cylinders are double-acting, and the highest quality in the industry...AND for those applications where it's important to have a compact envelope, Indexator also offers telescoping cylingers, which considerably shortens the overall package length. 45 vs 40? All I can say is, "why sacrifice capacity for 5 degrees"? Three words that all the clones should learn...Finite Element Analysis.
And judging by your post, I would bet that you are affiliated with Indexator. Would I be correct in that assumption? :cool2
I work for our local county highway authority. I bought our first Helac wrist back in the early 90's for the 1st hydraulic excavator we leased. The guys liked the hydraulic excavator and really liked the wrist. Makes ditching and finishing real easy and quick. In fact, a couple our operators can finish a lawn area without any handwork . Today we have a medium size CAT, a smaller Cat Excavator and a mini all with Helac wrists. (I can't remember the models now that I'm back in the Engineering Division , I'll have to check on Monday) Our "machine" before the 1st Cat was a 15 ton Linkbelt cable crane with bolted boom. Talk about bringing the boys out of the dark ages
We will keep our Weldco-Beales wrists, don't see these other brands standing up to the abuse they need to take. They look like anything over a 15 ton machine will rip them apart.:bash
Light Duty? NO WAY! The Rototilt is actually rated for about 3 times what the excavator can dish out. You could literally hang the excavator from the Rototilt without tearing it apart, for example, an RT60B model Rototilt is rated at 60 TONS static load, or 20 TONS dynamic load. There's not many other attachments with this capacity, including those that are just cut and weld fabrications. Go in the field and compare for yourself. In Sweden, you will find some working Rototilts that are nearly 20 years old! You WILL NOT find a Helac, WainRoy, etc., that's even close to that age. I have Rototilts working on mining heads, pile drivers, rock drills, and 5000 lb Rammer hammers, all which have been out working for years without failure. Can any of those other options make that claim? Bottom line, you don't have to "baby" your Rototilt. It's not just for light duty applications. It can take whatever the excavator can dish out.
Lots of salestalk here..... I work for an CATdealer in Sweden and judging by what we have to repair and fix when it comes to indexator and engcon it's in reality no difference, Steelwrist are just coming out on the market so I can't tell about them yet. if you ever get the opportunity to test a machine with a rototilt, tiltrotator or whatever it's called do it, it's not a waste of time.
Well the biggest Roto-tilt is only rated for a 24 tonne machine and has to many extra parts to damage, just like Allu buckets which in theory are a great invention, but are self destructing and require constant rebuilding. In our field of environmental cleanup and demolition the attachments are used to there extreme and most do not stand up, contrary to what sales and manufacturer reps say. So your bucket may be your pride and joy, but in the real world, to many features can be detrimental to durability. Even if they rate the attachment for three times the machine weight, our 45 tonners will keep the wrist buckets that they have. :bash
i think we need to start a new thread for those who wish to peddle their wares
Sorry guys, I missed what was going on in this thread. To those involved in the sales of wrists, at this site we allow dealers/manufacturers one post to explain who they are and their product. After that, you may answer questions raised by members. We DO NOT allow the arguing I'm seeing go on in this thread. If you are interested in promoting your product after your initial post, you must contact me about advertising here at HEF. I do not want our members to be subject to the bickering witnessed here.
Did the research Hej Per, When I was doing my research on this concept, I stopped in at PON. Is that where you work? What I noticed at PON CAT, and from talking to the mechanics there, is that they used engcon mostly on smaller equipment as it costs less, but for larger machines up to 30 tons, they used Indexator even though it costs more, it was more durable. PON had about 6 from Indexator, and 3 from engcon in stock. Not trying to make a sales pitch here boss.
Rototilt Hey all. Just want to comment on this tread beacuse i have run machines with rototilt for almost ten years and its an amazing tool. Doesnt matter what brand there is,but what you can do with it. You can dig around anything(cabels,roots,pipes you name it) level any surface on no time and save a lot of time doing so. If you get used to rototilts i dont think you will regret the investment.:cool2
Oslo obstacles Hej Rockbreaker, You are the expert on underground obstacles. During my research trips, I visited one jobsite in downtown Oslo, and there was pipes and cables running in every direction, at many different depths. I can't imagine even trying to tackle this job without a Rototilt. Do you know my friend, Erling Ånesland? He is the importer there in Norway... www.rototilt.no .
i'm going to unfold my table and start selling my snake oils.
Does anybody have a wrist? Hey dayexco...why be that way? There's no call for that kind of post! The title of this thread is asking for answers, so everyone is just discussing the possibilities. Do you have trouble understanding the question..."Does anybody have a wrist?"
Rotorilt Hey Dirtman! Yes i know Erling Ånesland and his daughter who is the boss now. And thanks for telling dayexo that... ointhead
well, the way i see it, you are promoting "one brand/manufacturer".....that being rototilt. maybe you aren't, you just own and use the product and really like them, but it appears you have a sales interest in this product. please accept my apologies if this is not the case. if you do, i think you should talk to the administrators and become a site sponsor.
Simply put Hey day, Yes I do have a local sales interest, but not globally, so my conversations with Canada, Sweden, Norway, etc. have no bearing. Again, I was just answering questions, and correcting the wrong statements. Can't have bad information out there. I am talking to Steve, but tell me....how does that affect you, so that you could act that way?
I will say that Dayexco's comment was out of line and am sure it won't happen again, as he apologised for it in his last post. Moving on from that.... How does one person's opinions of what equipment meets their needs affect you ? It shouldn't, unless you were using that information to modify your own fleet OR you were trying to make a sale, correct? From your previous posts it would seem you are trying to accomplish the latter of the two. It's clear that Dayexco has found a fleet of equipment and attachments that works for him, and by his previous posts it's clear he is not interested in your product, so why continue to try to sway him to buy your product? There is a difference between trying to put correct information out there and trying to make a sales pitch. Again, your previous posts seem to be the latter. Also, please refrain from posting links to any rototilt site until you and Steve have come to agreement on advertising.
DirtMan, thank you for finally admitting that you are the sales rep for Rototilt in the US. In my vocabulary the following quote from your earliers post is just sales talk, not "correcting the wrong statements": "To say that any other tiltrotator is "Equal" or the same as the Rototilt, is just ignorant, and would only originate from a lessor competitor." To talk about "clones" you need a commonly accepted original. This reminds me of the IBM PC, and I really don't think about my Dell as a clone... Since I like facts, here are a few more: IBM PC is dead Engcon made approx 5000 tiltrotators last year Indexator made approx 1500 (still claiming to be world leader) In the Nordic countries 90% of ALL excavators are equipped with a tiltrotator The interesting question (in my humble opinion) in this thread is: what are the obstacles to overcome before the tiltrotator is as common in North America as in Scandinavia? I have one for the top ten list: training the operators to really benefit from this great tool.
My add to your top ten list Digger: Getting the machine owners to understand that even if it cost them a bit,the investment will pay off just beacuse they can do much more with one machine. And sometimes that saves you some money in the long run
Totally agree. Another obstacle: If you can do more with one machine means that you probably need fewer machines, which potentially means less machines sold for the machine sales companies, so there is a somewhat weak incentive for them to push the tiltrotator concept.
wrists Hi Rockbreaker & Digger, there was an article in Earthmovers magazine a few months back all about what I call a rotating head, some call wrists, etc etc. I found it quite remarkable just how common they are in your part of the world ( Nordic countrys, Ye I know you invented it :notworthy) Amazing that you even have them on machines over 20t. The problem in the UK is we have a massive plant hire market and the clients / hirers cannot see the benefits of the head. Those that do, still wont pay the extra to have it on a machine. I have a good friend that has one for his rubber duck, but he very rarely manages to get more on the hire rate so refuses to use it. The pair of us have oscillating ditching buckets, but again it is a struggle to get extra for them. :Banghead The people in the UK using rotating heads are small / medium contractors who themselves have spotted the benefit directly in all the ways discussed in previous posts. I'm sure they will get to be more common here but it will take time I'm sure. Wish I could warrant havin one :cool2
what is probably dif in the US, is we're typically digging in new developments, wide open areas, we're "rock/n/roll" digging, the wrist o twist for most of the contractor's i've been around, me included.........isn't worth the expenditure. and you'd NEVER get the owner of a project to pay you more money just because your machine had one.
:iagree I will admit that it would have its advantages here and there, it would be nice to have tilt for digging ditches, but I don't dig enough ditches to justify a $20,000 investment. It would allow an excavator to do more, but it will not replace a dozer, or loader, or skidsteer, etc. On most of my jobs I have more than one pice of equipment there, so we can use each them for the parts of the job that they do best - thats why they build diffrent types of equipment. I can see some big disadvatages the rototiltator - like decreased breakout forces and you could not use as big of a bucket due to the extra weight. Again these things would not be an issue on all jobs, but I wouldn't want one on my machine when i'm loading trucks.
Well many machine owners in Norway said the same thing and now you see wrist on their machines too. And you must see the wrist as an investment that you can make money from not as an exspensive the contractor must pay you to have
Is it possible to get the owner of a project to cover your expenses on a GPS system? Rockbreaker put it very nice, a tiltrotator are a tool for you to earn more money. If you only could see what an experienced operator can do with such a tool. Imagine laying pipe in a trench. it superfast when you pack the pipe with crushed rock. Or finishing areas in development that are too small for a dozer. Earlier here in Scandinavia it was normal to just have one "rigid" bucket on an excavator, then we moved to quick-coupler and then had a tilt bucket and a normal bucket. Today a project supervisor or forman expect an excavator to show up with at least two buckets maybe three and an tiltrotator. If not you might be sendt back. Think possibilitys and investment, not expenses, this is the perfect tool for small businesses with maybe 1-5 excavators. I saw some where concerned it put extra weight on the end of the stick. Well the tiltrotator are also on the same type quick coupler as the buckets, so when you need to do heavy digging you just take it off and mount the bucket directly on the stick.
i just drove from south dakota, to florida, .....that trip took me thru nebraska, iowa, missouri, tennessee, alabama, and florida...not one roto/wristotwist on any machines i saw digging...i'm on my way back now, came thru alabama, louisiana, texas, oklahoma, staying tonight in kansas...not one roto/wristotwist...and i'm the type to stop and watch whenever i see any digging going on. apparently we in the US don't have a clue, or the value of the roto/wristotwist doesn't merit the expenditure for our type of digging.
Well maybe you could be the one breaking new ground for a change in how you use your equipment dayexco Give it five years and i think that you will see that the number of excavators with a wrist have grown. And you can be one of the first too see the opertunities with a money saving tool for your excavators,beacuse some one will do it i think. Would be sad loosing jobs beacuse the other firms can do it cheaper than you beacuse they have things(could be wrist or something else) that make them do the job faster than you. I would belive that any thing that made you flexibel and saved you time would be interesting in a money making wiev? It is much money i agree on that ,but if you think of the years it will last its not so bad after all.
Pipe line work with a wrist
I think I saw a vid of that on YouTube with that pipe handler, very wild.
again, those pictures are reflective are the types of projects you are involved in. on our sanitary work, you must have people in the excavation to grade the bedding material, lube the joint, and push the pipe together, and align it with a laser, and pack the bedding material under the haunches of the pipe. our inspectors here would never allow pipe to be laid in a situation such as shown in your pictures. they want the excavation dry, and a solid foundation for the pipe to rest on. i can't think of one particular occasion in the last 27 years i've been in business on my own, not counting the years prior to that when i worked for my father, where i would have used a unit like that to lay pipe. that said, i'm sure it's very handy for how you do things. i've got pics just like yours digging around cables, we do it all the time. the fastest/safest way to get dug around them is with a vacuum, which we haven't invested in yet, but looking for. i'm happy that the unit works for you so well, to me it would be an unjustifiable, expensive, encumbrance.
Our Power Tilt gives us 90 degrees and I love it for the type of stuff our machine does. On the job we are on now I couldn't put a price on the time it saves.
wrists Hi Brian, your machine without that powertilt would be like a pub without beer, a criminal waste of time :notworthy lol. Haven't had chance to check yet, but if you haven't updated the thread on your machine please do. Its a wicked piece of kit and I'm sure others are as intrested in your new venture as I am. Good luck :drinkup
I think that a wrist/swinger is dependent on the type of work you do. Day is right though, a contractor isn't going to give you an extra $20/hr to dig a basement just cuz you have a swinger. We have a helac swinger and we use it for digging swales, building detention basins and slope work. We don't use it often, but it is nice to have when you need it.
i'm looking at your picture, the position you have the bucket in to display the rototilt's dexterity, and i cannot think of one time in the last hundred or so miles or water and sewer main i've put in where i've needed to place my bucket in that position to complete my job. you've all done a fine job of convincing yourselves the purchase/need/use of it. in your niche markets where you're digging on extreme slopes, placing pipes in crappy subsoil conditions, they apparently merit their purchase. for the typical water/sewer contractor, you couldn't justify one.
Hi Rob, I didn't realize just how important the wrist is to our machine until I started this project. Its a contaminated site excavation were I am cleaning the material off of the bedrock. I have tilt but no rotation, when cashflow allows we will get that.... I wonder how one of those Rototilts designed for a regular hoe our size would stand up on the Spyder. That would be the ultimate test of the abuse it could withstand. The operator in the orange is not me (our machine though). It's Domenic Frei, a supervisor with Hazco. Before comming here he was a Spyder Hoe Operator in Switzerland and just loves operating them. I turned the contols over to him on Friday, got some incredible pictures and did some learning from an expert.
Now that's work only a Spyder can do!
Great pics Brian :drinkup Good to hear you are open for new products and i think most of the rototilts produced will take the abuse you can provide with that machine. And Mr Dayexco i hear what you are saying but i don`t think you understood me right. We have rocks and hard materials to dig in here too and that dont stop any owners of machines to not put a rototilt on the machine they use. Largest machine i have seen was a Cat 330 with one on. Most ove the contractors here doing water and suer lines have a rototilt on even when digging the ditch. My point is that none of them used it ten years ago and now you hardly see a machine without it,and maybe that will happen in the US some day too. But i understand you will not be first in line and for me that is not a problem:bash
my son saw this thread, emailed me and goes..."dad, why are you beating a dead horse"? we don't need one, don't want one, aren't buying one.....they need them, bought them, like them...each to their own...upon his advise, i'm hanging my whip back up on the wall.
Brain are you cleaning up the contaminated dirt off the slope and pileing it behind you as you work down the slope ,and the other excavator on the top side loading it out???? Or are you having to move the dirt more then once.How long will this job take you and do you have more work lined up? I could see where the other coupler in your case would be a plus at least for your machine and you. Glad to see your finally getting to work the machine.Also nice to have someone to run the machine and give you some pointers how to go about doing the job. Stay safe and good luck:usa
What makes me wonder how it would stand up is our machine puts out far more power then a regular machine in the same weight class. As well it uses the bucket (or whatever attachment is on it) to walk around the job. I'm sure you can imagine the stress that is put on it as I'm lowering myself down a steep slope. It weighs in at about 19,000 pounds. Some guys have tried adding attachments like thumbs made for a machine the same size and they destroy them in no time if the operator is not extemely careful with it. And to put one on strong enough to last adds way to much weight for when your working on the slopes. There is one that is designed for it that has the tilt, rotation and quick coupler all in one. It will be a big investment but for us it will be worth it. I start at the farthest point away from were the track hoe can reach and toss it out to were he can get at it. I often toss it 2 or three times. He then tosses it a couple more times up to were the trucks can be loaded. They booked us for a minimun of 10 days on this project, see how it goes. I have lots of interest but no solid comitments yet for after this job. Spring is fast aproaching though and I'm confident we will get busy. Domenic was only there the one day but it was a great day. I think I learned more from him in that day then I could have learned on my own in 6 months of trial and error.
I love stuff that lets you do more work but lets be honest most excavators don't have couplers or thumbs here, the extra cost would never be made back. For the guys like Day it is all about feet in the ground, they have it figured out and for them it doesn't help. It's cool but not everyone has a use for it.
heads/wrists Thanks for the update Brian, great pics. You were very lucky to be able to watch an experienced hand at work, I was told years ago, keep your eyes and ears open you can learn an awful lot. There was a bit about keeping your mouth shut as well but I've skirted around that bit as I never managed to master it Personally I wouldn't bust a gut to get a rotating head for your machine, I think you will be more than happy with where you can get with what you have and I understand you concerns over the stresses you will imposse when walking and climbing. I have always been a bit concerned about the vulnerability of the tilt rams on the ENGCON heads we see advertised a lot in UK. Dayexco, thank you for your input in this thread, I have found it very intresting and fully appreciate where you are coming from. Sounds like one smart son you got yourself. Mine is smart to, has no intrest in plant at all. Has an office job :bash :drinkup
Some real life examples of what you can do with the wrist I liked Brians pics so I tried to find a few pictures of what drivers typically do in the strange part of Europe called Scandinavia. Enjoy! Pict no 1: Kato 823 (23 ton Japaneese). With the wrist you don't have to move the excavator as much-> save time/cost Pict no 2: CAT 320. Surgical precision when doing ground work. BTW The driver is 60+ :yup Pict No 3: Volvo EW160B. Material handling with a pallet fork-> do more with one machine. As you can see it's not only the 5 ton machine that use a wrist, they ALL do up to 30 tons.
The more I think about it the more I think you may be right about the rotation Rob. The odd time I may use it probably wouldn't be worth packing the extra weight around when I'm not using it. The power tilt is probably plenty flexible enough in 99% of the places I will be. Cool pictures Digger. That's neat how you can put the bucket on backwards, our machine can do that too although I haven't yet. I'm sure that will come in handy in the future though. With our power tilt I really like that it's a seperate attachment in itself. That way it can be used with any attachment and not just the bucket. Looks like yours can be too?
On pict No1 the bucket is rotated, not put on backwards (you can do it but there's no point if you have endless rotation, right?). Yes, the wrist has a quick coupler on top, so you can put on any bucket or tool (like the pallet fork in pict 3) Also, when you need the full break out force you simply disconnect it and put a bucket on. Done in 30 sec, since you have a quick connector for the hydraulics. One difference compared to the powertilt is the tilting force which is probably 3x with the wrist. You can lift the machine with the tilt.
I should have had a closer look before I posted ointhead That's a really nice set up.
ditching in the south I work mostly along the beach and tidal rivers here in eastern nc. as well as several coe spoil islands .We also have a power/tilt attachment by power-tilt, it is a sweet unit with my 5' or 6' cleanout buckets along with standard/heavy/V buckets that i use with my daewoo 220 lc 3. This machine is very light in the back with the hyd thumb mounted and the ptilt installed along with a bucket, it has the quick coupler and adjustable flow valves installed to control speed during digging /fine gradeing. I have used several diff tilts/ never had the need for rotation, do to the differant buckets on hand. This machine has worked on 24' matts most of it's life with a V bucket and the power tilt off do to the extra weight, we only install it when ground is stable enough to not need matts/no slopes. The tilts and rotations are nice, but it's a cost that you have to justify, if you have several trackhoes in differant sizes, the tilt machine setup is always on the other job site when you need it or won't fit this machine.
Successful Entrepreneurs Hey gents, Here's a list of US Rototilt users who you can ask if it's worth the investment: Granite, Triangle Paving, Shaw, Lane, Zachry, Malphres, Soper Wheeler, Malcolm Drilling, City of LA (24 units), Ranger, Ryan, White, Jack Massie, American Piledring (18 units), ElPaso Water, Taylor Davis, Herzog Contracting (20 units), Frontier Kemper, Alcoa, Northfolk, DM&E Railraod, Northfolk Southern, CE Barker, City of Durham, Harris County, Yuma County, City of Richardson, Clallum County, City of Lawton, MD Landscaping, Watts Electric, Aldridge Electric, Georgetown Rail, B&B Stoneworks, J&J Railroad, ACME fence, Rocks Direct, CA Hull, TBH, PMR, Blue Iron, etc.etc. Anyone in this business should be able to recognize someone on this list....CALL THEM and ask if it's worth the investment. Don't take my word for it. These guys are not the most successful or most efficient at what they do for nothing.
:lmao:lmao:lmao If I need to phone someone who's not the most successful or most efficient at what they do to find out if its worth the investment then I'm already pretty sure of the answer Ye, ye, ye, I know I took it out of contex the media do it all the time :drinkup
Hi have a look at www.engcon.com . The noble art of digging!! Heavy duty
My experience from the Engcon is very good, Sweden has really tough ground conditions and also it is well tested due to climate. Manufactured for over 20 years.
let me guess tiltrotator... you've not read all of this thread? or if you have, you skimmed over the part where dirtman beat his particualr drum that hard that the fella got binned? i like internet wars, very good for making everyone look stupid tho dirtman was in a class of his own, traipsing here and there spreading the 'good' news of how his way was the only 'true' way... the use i could see for a tilting/rotating setup is in tight access work where you cannot satisfactorily position the machine effectively using a conventional setup.
Mouse I can see youre a Bobcat man, please visit the show Intermat if you can!, it's a new launch from Bobcat taking place... Very interessting. Bobcat Europe is integrating their new control-system for Tiltrotators in the joy sticks
ok so i deserved that i guess. you want me to drop everything and duck over to intermat in france in april for a launch of a product we probably wont see here for another 2 years at least? ok - so whom do i need to make the cheque out to?? hmmm, let me try a different tack tiltrotator - do you have any opinion on any subject apart from titlrotators?
Not cool dude We all cannot be rich like you. It's all I got and it does the job.:usa
Sorry, I messed up that last post. I was trying to quote 9420pullpan's "C..A..S..E" acronyms. Pretty funny though. But hey 9420pullpan, give some about $10,000 then I can sell my Case and get one like you whatever that is, probally a Cat. Send me the money I'd love to own a Cat as well.
If we could find one in the budget it'd already be here. Right now it's just on the drool list!
Well, first of all, I am not a salesman for any of these things! I am in the process of getting a 40k lb excavator and am excited to be getting a tiltrotator for it. I am trying to consider all my options, which are somewhat limited here in the USA. So far I'm leaning towards Engcon, mostly because of availablility and price. I am considering the Indexator too. As I understand it, the major difference between the two seems to be cast vs. welded housing, and oil vs. grease as lubrication, am I correct? Also, Indexator does not seem to have this "optional grabber", which boy does look handy. Can anyone give me some first-hand feedback from these optional grabbers? I'm also looking at a brand called HKS from Germany, which doesn't seem to be mentioned here in this thread at all, and of course the Engcon people tell me is not nearly as strong. Again, does anyone have any personal experience of these? What other major tiltrotators am I missing that are available in the US? Thanks! Joshua
Engcon has a new version out with casted housing, still grease lubricated. Both of them offers optional grabber, Indexators model is quickly detachable if you don´t need it. Might take half an hour to a full hour to demount it from the rotor body. If you are going for full proportional control of it Engcon has a slightly better valve in their MCV.
That new engcon does look even cooler, been reading about that. I don't necessarily want to wait for it's arrival, so it's looking like I'm leaning toward the EC20B with the proportional control system, gonna cost me about $25k without the grabber, and we'll see if I can get that, I sure would like to. The indexator is both more expensive, and there are no distributors in my entire country that I can find. No one has any experience with the HKS?
Can we get an update going on this thread. I'm looking for ways to improve my ditching profiles.
Hi Guys, If it's of any interest to you, we are in the process of developing our own tiltrotators. Our 8 ton prototype is complete (a few tweaks left to do) and then we should be into production. Here's a short preliminary demo video taken in our workshop: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EtO486iI5H4 Looking to retail at £6,900 non-proportional and £7,900 proportional, for the 8 ton version. Other sizes will follow after. We also supply aftermarket tiltrotator attachments at a fraction of the cost to the major manufacturers... Hugo Bucket Warehouse Ltd.