Hey guys, thanks for taking the time to read my post. I am starting a Bobcat for hire business here in Pine Bush, NY and I am going to primarily focus on land clearing and general residential cleanup. With all the construction going on in this area, I would like to be the first guy in to clear, and the last guy out to provide the clean up before the house goes on the market. I will purchase a track loader (t140), with stump grinder attachment, root grapple, and a brushcat. My pricing will be based on the job.. Is there any advice anyone can offer me before i get underway?
Get a better machine more suited to landclearing. Bobcat is fine for clean up but not the best tool for landclearing.
thanks I know the t140 is not the best choice for land clearing but the 140 offers such versatility, I don't have much of a choice, can you offer an alternative? I should point out the plots of land here don not have huge trees mostly shrubs and brush.
IMO, the only way to clear is with a excavator.
It really all depends on terrain and the kind of clearing you are doing. Around here it is being done with either a fellerbuncher or chainsaw followed by a skidder, then brought to a whole tree chipper. excavators are great for stumping but I dont think there the best tool for the job either just becuase they can push the trees down. Becuase then you still need to move them to fire pit or to where ever your bringing them to get ride of.
Excavator with a thumb is the only way to go if you ask me. knock the trees down, rip them out, hop out and chop off the stump, then stack your logs and pile your brush. effortless and quick, clearing with a bobcat would make me cry. im sure after you add up the price for the machine and all the attachments you want you could get a decent 120 sized machine. IMO an excavator is the most versatile machine there is, with a good operator of course.
Just read that your clearing would be mostly shrubs and brush, so i guess the bobcat wouldnt be too bad.
Even for shrubs and brush I would get a larger mini ex with a thumb. It wouldn't tear up the ground so much if you didn't want it to. Faster and more efficient for get up and loading green waste as log as you don’t have a long haul to load a truck or trailer. Limit the # of attachment needed. You could haul it with a smaller trailer because you wouldn't have to haul so many attachments. You would have to limit your self to land clearing with no extra attachment you could dig footing, do trenching, some demo. And IMO skid steers are POS's to run all day every day.
Thanks Dozer! Appreciate the feedback, but I want the versatility a Bobcat offers as oppsed to an excavator. I think the ground will not be dug up so badly due to the Bobcat T190 has the tank treads just like an excavator. In additon, I will not be running the machine all day everyday, as this will be a part time venture for me. And as a part timer( i am a nyc firefighter), I need to be versatile as I dont know which type of job will come in. If I were in construction or major land clearing I would purchase an excavator. I really appreciate your input! My ears are always open and I am always learning.
Bobcat303, When you say clearing land,do you mean just getting rid of the vegitation(small trees,shrubs) on top of the ground via burn piles or trucked out,and leaving the root systems and stumps in the ground? Or,do you mean clearing the land of everything,and doing the leveling too? I see you mentioned a stump grinder and brushcat,so I'm thinking you may mean the first.Just opening up the area by:Chopping up and/or getting rid of the brush,grinding the stumps flush,and having stumps,roots,and topsoil removed later,where needed,by another contractor when they've decided where structures and drives will be.I would think you've the right equipment in mind for that type of work.(with no leveling involved)Are contractor's going to accept this as the limit of your work?I'd think they'de want stumps pulled out where needed straight away,and not have too go back after this stuff later. If you mean the second,I agree with the other guys.I think you'll be disappointed at how hard it'll be with the equipment you've in mind.Even some brush can have root systems that'll wear you skid steer out trying to get out of the ground,after enough time.Also,skid steers can dig,but they don't do great in ground that's been undisturbed for a long time.They work hard to get through large roots,and they can't persaude much of a stump to do anything.A 6" tree stump will be hell to get out of the ground with a skid steer.You may get the job done eventually with it,but it'll take alot of time,effort,and abuse of your equipment.A backhoe,or excavator(even small)could dig & pull the same stump out easily in minutes. It all depends on what you've got in mind.Would a backhoe attachment for you skid steer be something you'de consider?It may be impossible to use the skid steer without it,if you're going to go down into the ground after some of the stuff.But with it,you would have the ability too,when needed,albeit a pain to screw around mounting and dismounting attachments.It wouldn't be the mightiest backhoe around either,or have much reach,but it would make some things possible,that otherwise would be VERY difficult.If you're set on going the skid steer route,you may need this attachment just to get some of the jobs,if stump removal is mandatory.
Please understand that I'm just playing the devil's advocate with this... If I'm Joe Contractor, why should I use you to do this clearing with your Bobcat when my excavating contractor could do the same thing for me, and he's going to be there right after you leave anyway? (The reason I ask is that, in my experience, when a "clearing" contractor has been used, they're mainly tree guys. They cut down the trees and brush, and what they don't haul away, they run through a chipper. All of their work takes place above the dirt. Once they've gone, the excavating contractor comes in with a good sized dozer, track loader, or excavator, and strips and stacks the topsoil, removing the stumps and roots as part of the process. I'd hate to see you invest in a setup that's adapted specifically to work that you're not going to get...) (Now, on previwing the post, I see that Jeff has pretty much raised the same questions I did. It scares me to be thinking like Jeff...) :wink2
Where the idea would work out great,is if Bobcat303 was a part of a team(subbing to larger contractor),and he was responsible for just work that you'de use a skid-steer for normally. In that case he could fit in at many different levels of the job.Backfilling foundations,etc. It may require making a commitment to one general contracting co.(and being on call),but could be very benificial to him,in keeping his skid steer busy.And it would take away the necessity to have some of the attachments,advertising,doing bids,etc. This is what I do,and it's nice not being responsible for things that I'm not equipped to do.It does take away the feeling of "Being the Boss"and "Calling the shots"(and getting rich,most likely)when you're answering to someone else,BUT it's a good way to get started out,and learn about the biz,without jumping in head first.Plus it shields one from mistakes much more than being completely independant.The general will be keeping an eye on progress,and I'm SURE will steer things in the proper direction,if needed.They're also much more likely to be forgiving when mistakes happen.The home owners are the ones that can be absolutely ruthless with their lawyers,when things go south. Is this an idea you'de even entertain Bobcat303,ie not focusing yourself as a independant,but rather a O/O subcontractor to a general,with no specialization except that of operating your skid-steer?Is your schedule as a FF flexible enough to accomidate calls to show up to a jobsite whenever?The last one might be the tough part. It's been my experience that it always starts out sloooow,and then you get a few jobs,things pick up alittle,and wham,you're wanted all the time,you can't keep up,and you're turning down work.It's been like this whether it's trucking,hauling dirt,skid-steer,plowing,whatever.So the FF and contracting might be something that's hard too balance.And when you turn down offers too much,the calls dry up.This is the downside to subbing,and could make it infeasible in your situation. Good luck with your business,whatever you decide.
Jeff and Digger Thanks guys for all your great advice and devil's advocacy, I appreciate it, I really do. Like Jeff said, I could work for a contractor, lend an extra helping hand, if you will. Why should Joe Contractor dedicate his machines to jobs my track loader can do? His bigger machines could be doing bigger jobs! What if Joe Contractor has two job sites A and B....A needs the big guys, excavators, dozers, etc..while B is just getting started (or maybe just finished?)..just purchased and the plot of land is thick with brush and stumps and small trees. That is where I come in, do the work on jobsite B while the big boys are dedicated to jobsite A. Does that make any sense? How about the home owner that does not want his lawn torn up , but still has to have something done? My schedule as a FF is pretty flexible, I am sure I will have to turn down some jobs due to a conflict, but I have to remember which job puts food on the table and roof over my head, and will take care of me when I am 60 I make good money with the FDNY and will have a great pension when I am 43..so FF takes priority...but nontheless, if I can schedule a job for the days off...it'll be great to make some extra cash and have some fun playing with my toy. I will follow your advice and start out slooow. Take a few jobs that fit into my schedule, and hopefully, word of mouth will take it from there. If the calls dry up because I turn down to much, than that is a risk I am willing to take.
:thumbsup It sounds like you were already thinking of what I was trying to get at. If you can find your place in the whole mix of things that need to be done,I think there's lot's of oppertunities for work.
Thanks Jeff Jeff, That is just it, I gotta find my niche, and stick to it!
Now im confused.... are you looking at a 190? or a 140...you mention both. :spongebob Try out a T-250 or T-300 before you buy, with a grapple they would work wonders for clearing brush and trees up to 6-8" diameter.... I might buy a grapple soon, I have a bunch of land to clear on my property and some jobs coming up where it would be usefull.
X2 on a skid steer a grapple or a 4in1 are must haves.
i would recommend if you are starting out to rent the equipment. just yesterday i rented a mini ex to work in a marshy area my backhoe would get stuck in. after paying the rent for the ex i still made some money. 2 hours payed the rent the other 6 was mine. that is an ok deal. this would also allow you to use many diffrent size skid steers. the abilities do change with size. for land clearing i would definitly want something bigger than the 140. if you find that you are using them enough to justify the purchase go for it. if not you really aren't out that much. good luck
Coastal You are correct I did mention the T140 and T190, the first mention of t140 was a typo, it was supposed to be a T190 from the get-go. Thanks for paying attention to detail! :thumbsup
Capt Met Thanks for the advice, but I want to own the machine for my own property..as it looks like a disaster site. I agree with you that the T-140 is to small, and I meant to say I am purchasing a t190. While that is still small, yes, but it is big enough for the land here in the area, and anything bigger is out of my price range.
Bobcat, welcome to the site. You sound like you're in the same suituation as I am, a FF trying to make a living by doing excavation on the side. Although I've never owned a Bobcat or any type skid steer, their versitility is amazing and I have no doubt that with your contacts in the fire service you'll keep it busy. I started out bushhogging and grading roads with a Kubota and moved away from that into excavating as I found the demand. As long as you have a few contacts and are willing to work your way up the food chain, go for it. We all had to be bottom feeders at one point in our business taking whatever jobs trickled down until we build a customer base.:Banghead Good luck, stay safe.
Bobcat, I'm going to start off by saying that if you want to start the business, then by all means go for it! Better to have tried and failed than to have never tried. I'm in a similar situation as you (and so are a bunch of other guys on this site). I have a "good" full-time job, but I'd rather be out playing in the dirt...:drinkup. I'm only in my 2nd year. Last year I did a few jobs here and there, and rented everything I needed and had it delivered to the site. This year, I decided to buy a machine of my own, because there were some small jobs I had to pass on last year due to not having my own equipment (the job would not have paid the cost of the rental). Went out and bought a basic Bobcat S175, and a set of over-thee-tire tracks. Now, some things to think about. Just keep in mind that having a machine for use on your property is one thing, and using it for a business is another. First and foremost, you will need a commercial liability policy. Once you have that, you can go to work, but now you need a way to get your machine to the job. Time to buy a truck and trailer. With the truck and trailer comes commercial vehicle insurance, inspection, plates, repairs, etc. Just remember to look at the whole picture, and don't just get seduced by all those glossy photos in the sales brochures...:thumbsup
Electra Glide Thanks for the advice! Yes I am already incorporated and getting the commercial liabilty policy should not be a problem, but I am aware it is a cost as well as the commercial plates, and insurance. The government wants their piece of the action too. I just wanna play in the dirt.:Cowboy