What all brands of hydraulic oil do you all use? Anyone use the "Xtreme" brand that's at a lot of parts houses?
I use Shell Tellus 32 all season with a low pour point "Shell" mostly because I have a good dealer locally, and he is a client of my construction company
Is this the cheap Xtreme with the yellow bucket and green lid? The stuff I've seen is a 303 transmission hydraulic fluid, the "may be used where the following specifications are recommended" is a fancy way of saying this fluid doesn't meet any specification from the last half century. What machine and compartment are you thinking of using it for?
Yeah we have used Xtreme for years in just about everything . Farm tractors, dozers, excavator, crane. Seems like pretty good oil at a decent price www.tractorsupply.com/en/store/xtremereg;-tractor-hydraulic--transmission-fluid-5-gal Its made by Cross oil www.crossoil.com/lib/docs/pds/PDSUniversalHvyDutyTractorHydraulicFluidXtreme.pdf
Yes Delmer, yellow bucket with green lid. I think the hydraulic pump has gone bad on my cat d5 dozer. If I have to get a new pump, I think I might go to a different kind. I have two friends that have had hydraulic pumps go bad on two new holland tractors. We've had a couple mechanics blame it on the Xtreme oil. We have one parts house around here and the Xtreme is all we can get without driving an hour.
I drive the hour to get a better fluid, and that's what I'd do with any New Holland tractor or Cat dozer (one that at least claims to meet the specification your machine calls for). NO WAY I'd use this in anything newer than an H Farmall or 8n Ford, or as a flush. The bucket front says it meets J20A and J14, then the back says it "may be used" where newer specifications are recommended. The link lists "performance level" as if they're suggesting that it performs at the same level without actually meeting the specification? That's my take. I don't have the experience of TD25C, so feel free to tell me where I'm wrong.:stirthepot
So what brand or brands do you guys suggest a person use in a '95 cat dozer besides cat brand oil?
Any of the major brands like Shell, Mobil, Conoco, Texaco, etc, should do you fine. Doesn't have to be Cat branded oil
Have you had trouble with Xtreme hydraulic oil in the past Delmer ?
No, I'm just relating the specs it claims it meets and the other claims on the bucket. Also I'm assuming this is one product we're talking about because I only see one around here, but there could be a whole line of Xtreme oils. I can say that in cold weather it is noisier and causes more stuttering hydraulics on cold starts than the Mystic fluid that I can get around here for just a little bit more, that claims to meet more newer specs.
That's interesting Delmer. So you have used the Xtreme hydraulic oil in some equipment?
Changed the old oil in a long 510 with extreme a couple of months ago and the transmission is definetly noisier, even with the colder weather.
I am guilty of using that stuff, too. I do draw the line with using it in transmissions or any form of gear train. For my use, it is hydraulic systems only. Sent from my DROID RAZR using Tapatalk
Most of these problems "created" by changing the oil were already there. Worn bearings and gears can be covered up by Lucas or other honey fix. The detergents in the new oil can wash away varnish that are slowing worn parts in the hydraulic system from grinding themselves out. Seeing as most equipment gets a fluid change every decade its no surprise. For example, not really any different than changing the fluid in an auto trans at 150,000 and then it starts to shudder and on its way down hill
Very well put Mike, if the problems were not starting to show up alot of people would not be changing the oil, just one more job attitude.
Yes and no. Cheap oil can definitely cause issues. One quick way to tell you have cheap oil is look at the viscosity index (vi). Basically the viscosity grade only describes the viscosity at one specific temperature (unless it is sae multi-vis), but VI describes the change in viscosity with temp. Higher numbers indicate less change in viscosity with temperature, thinner oil when cold, thicker above 105f and higher refining costs. This is one area where full synthetics shine and why that is all I put in my car. This may sound similar to the pour point, but they often add pour point enhancers. So in regard to Mikes comment, cheaper oil might be giving your parts less cushion when hot and more stress when cold, and if it bad enough you might be getting cavitation (sounds like rocks going thru the pump, especially bad for piston pumps) There are also wet clutches and brakes to think about. Not all friction modifiers play well with all the different kinds of friction materials there are. This is one of the main drivers for companies like Deere to update their specs from j20c to j20d for example. I would never use an oil that doesn't meet the minimum spec of my machine because you could end up ruining all the clutches plus any collateral damage. And something a lot of people overlook is mixing oil, between brands or even within a brand! There are hundreds of different specific additives that can be used and some of them can cause a decrease in performance if mixed together. Unfortunately it is kind of a dirty secret in the oil world and they will rarely have any information on what is compatible. Not to mention that unless it is a glaring problem you probably wouldn't know about it. The best advise I can give is try to stick with one specific kind of oil to avoid this. And if you have to switch strongly consider the cost of a repair vs the cost of a system flush to get 99.5% of the old stuff out. ISZ
Delmer, not to hijack the thread, I need to flush the hydraulics on a Case 350. It is milky looking. I have the OEM fluid, but it is a little to pricey to use as a flush. You don't see any issue in using this or something like this to use as a one time flush. I was going to drain the tank, fill it with fluid and push it out of each of the dozer blade cylinders. Then drain all that I could, change the filter and fill with the good stuff, run it awhile, a few days, then drain tank, change filter and fill again with OEM fluid. Will this process work?
Yes, that's the way I do it. The pros will say you have to disconnect every hose and cylinder and blow them out, then use two people to run clean fluid through and flush the old out. You do want to try to get as much of the fluid out as possible, if you have the patience and another machine you could use compressed air to blow out the lines while you pull the blade to move the cylinder back and forth. If that's too much trouble, be sure the rods are retracted as far into the cylinders so they contain as little oil as possible. And you don't have to fill the tank, just add enough that the pump doesn't suck air, and flush it twice that way.
I bought the Xtreme hyd.oil in the yellow bucket once. I couldn't find anything on the bucket in regards to the viscosity. I emailed Cross Oil company and asked what the SAE rating of it was. Yes, I meant SAE not AW. I received an email from the company vice-president in Louisiana. He said it would be the equivalent of SAE 30. I live in Illinois, so that was the end of my use of it. Here is a link to a dealers website. Notice that at the bottom of the description for the oil in the yellow bucket it states ; "Use where mid-viscosity range hydraulic fluid is required. It is recommended for use in warmer climates. Consult owners manual for specification recommendations for individual " Here is a link to that dealers web site if you care to read it. http://www.cavalierhoseandfittings.com/page3.html
Gopher1; Double acting hydraulic cylinders need to have one hose off and one on so you can push all the contaminated oil out of the cylinder. Then take the hose that was off (and should be now full of clean oil) and attach it to the open fitting. Next remove the other hose and push the cylinder rod the opposite way and force the oil out of that side of the cylinder piston. You will never get the system clean unless that is done. If you are going to use OEM oil for the final fill I would recommend that you use it for the entire flush, Also keep the hydraulic tank full all the while you are doing the flushing operation.You will not lose a lot of clean oil if you watch carefully when the lines start to run clean oil out of them. I am not too keen on using any compressed air for flushing the system. There is a danger of damaging a pump if it is started up with air in it. Start the job with a clean hyd. filter and change it again when you are done.
Took my hydraulic pump off and took and had checked. Checked out good. The guy that checked it for me that owns a hydraulic shop said that I should run an oil with an AW-46 additive. Called the parts house and they can order it. They have a AW-40 in stock. Would there be much difference running the 40 vs the 46?
AW simply means "anti-wear" - most hydraulic oils have it. Is it for your D5..? If so price up a good brand SAE10W hydraulic oil, you may find it's cheaper. 40 or 46 oil is slightly heavier in viscosity than what's recommended, which would be an ISO AW32 or SAE10W - they are pretty much interchangeable as far as specification goes.