I recently purchased a Case 1835b with Perkins Diesel engine. I did nearly a full fluids service of it (all filters and fluids, except the chain compartment oil). I've been running it for maybe 10hrs now and noticed occasionally it will loose all drive capability. I think perhaps it's due to hydraulic oil being low, as there is a leak I've not been able to identify where is coming from yet - it's somewhere underneath as it drips out of the hole where you access the oil drain and out of the front drain holes. However the bucket controls still work fine when this happens. Usually if I just let it idle for 15 seconds, or sometimes put the bucket down, it will start working again. I do have the service manual in PDF which I will send anyone a link to if they like. But I've not found any info on hydraulic fluid level checking. So I have a few questions: 1. I see no way to tell how much hydraulic fluid is in it, how can I tell? I'm trying to figure out how much I'm loosing. 2. Can someone confirm if being low on hydraulic fluid will cause the loss of drive? 3. Are there any access panels that would help me see underneath the thing to identify where the leak might be coming from, aside from the ones under the seat? Thanks!
Well I answered #3, the panel where the feet go comes out easily with 4 bolts. And I think I found the issue. One hydraulic line to the drive motor is damaged and there's a puddle of fluid under it. Need to confirm it's indeed leaking but that should be easy enough once I clean things up and try moving it around with the panel off.
Welcomre to HEF @KyferEz It not a good idea to run these without oil - high priority to make sure level is correct.
Thanks! Seems my level sight glass is a plug instead which is why I couldn't tell :/ have to replace that! I ran it some and didn't see any leaks but it was super nasty and hard to tell anything. So I spent a few hours and cleaned and pressure washed out the area around the drives. Wow it was nasty. Will lay down some pig mat tomorrow and run it to see if I can identify anything dripping.
Well still haven't identified the leak :/. Stripping it down more... Once I identify the leak I'll also go ahead and replace that one damaged line since I have it far enough apart it will be pretty easy and because it's quite damaged in 2 places, it will rupture eventually.
Finally found it. Took more cleaning. All in all I extracted about 3cubic feet of oily mud from the bottom of the unit. Pressure washed for hours and hours. Sure would have been nice if there was an access panel on the bottom to help with cleaning it out! One of the fittings on the line to the left motor was dripping. Also decided since I had it apart and the controls were a bit worn, and the holes in them were all egg shaped, to drill them out and make some brass bushings on the lathe for the drive arms and handles. Turned out pretty decent.
Annnnd that wasn't the only leak. After I pulled up the pig mats, found another from the parking brake. Looks like the boot is leaking quite a bit. Any idea where I can find one? Looks unavailable... If noone knows where I can find one maybe I can 3d print one using TPU filament.
While I'm thinking about it, why would the parking boot be leaking hydraulic oil? What's on the other side of the boot? Is it a oil bath or something?
Well another group helped me on that; it's the oil bath for the chain. The only way Hydraulic fluid is leaking into there is from a bad motor seal. That's what I was hoping was not the problem. Sigh guess I get to pull the hydraulic drive motor and rip into it. I paid too much for this machine to have these issues
You need to ascertain if the drive motor is actually leaking. I can't recall how high/low the park brake boot is situated on the chaincase OR if the chaincase has an oil level plug. But, if you remove the inspection covers, the oil level would just cover the chain at the lower part of the axle sprocket - sit between an inch or two of oil depth on level ground. Set the oil to correct level & run the machine for a while to see if the hyd oil level drops & is entering the chaincase. Those drive motors did have a habit of cracking the head of the motor. From memory, with the machine raised off the ground & the chaincase covers off ( & front cabin lower plate removed??) you could see the oil leaking from the front of the drivemotor, while operating the drive.
Don't rule out rain water as to the source of the high chain case oil level. Never did keep water out on my 4 1845C.
I don't store it where it will get rained on.
I propped it off the ground. After running a minute it started leaking out the chaincase and hydraulic level was down, so it's definitely the motor. Waiting on some AN12 male and female plugs to come in tomorrow and will get the motor out. I did pull off the cover and also one of the roller bearing pins is missing out of that bearing. Pretty sure I didn't loose it taking it off. Sigh... Anyone have a parts manual so I can identify the shaft seal and cover bearing part numbers?
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Motor seal kit is $619 and output seal is $44? That's crazy pricing! Surely that seal is a standard off the shelf part from some seal maker that only costs $6 or $7 direct from them. It sure looks standard enough... Guess I'll take the motor apart, measure the sealing surfaces, and try to find a substitute from someone like theoringstore website.
I have a paper manual and can get pictures of any sections you might need, seems like mine always has a weep in the belly pan no matter how many hoses I change.
Wait till you find out that the output shaft and bearing is a one piece unit and it’s 1100 bucks.
I have a 1830 Case . Mine had a lot of dirt and stuff in the belly i had to make a hoe to rake it out. I am the kind of guy that will try to fix or build parts for obsolete stuff . I have gotten a lot of use out of this machine and hope to get more but if i some how got rich a new skid steer would be one of the first things i would get.
I don't see what you are referring to. The output shaft isn't available, but was available separately. In any event if I had to spend $619 on a seal kit I'd just buy a motor for $1350 and save myself the hassle. I got the motor out, was a bit of a pain. Time to get it apart...
Before you get to much further, crack the plug for the chain case drain enough to see if oil or water is coming out.
It was a little water but mostly oil mixed with hydraulic fluid. And the shaft on the motor has some play around the seal, enough that I can see it squeeze fluid out around the seal.
If the shaft has play, more than likely the seal kit won’t work. The seal gets blown out because of the internal pressure it leaking to the nose seal.
It's maybe 20tho combined in both directions, but ya I figured I'd need to ensure internal bearings are good and determine why the play. I expect some play since there's the external bearing on the cap that holds the end of the shaft, so I'm not totally convinced that amount of play is bad, yet. However I am prepared if necessary that I'm going to be buying the new motor. I'll post my findings with pics. Haven't had chance to work on pulling motor apart yet :/ maybe tonight. I paid $9800 for this thing with smooth and toothed buckets, forks, and a custom inverted narrow trenching bucket. I wanted the attachments, but definitely overpaid due to the guy's lie. I'd have been happy if it wasn't for this; even if a hose was ruptured and leaking I'd have been happy. As it is I'm pretty mad and he won't respond. Bad people ruin everything for everyone; I've learned my lesson in the past to never trust anyone. I just didn't know know in this case (pardon the pun) that this thing had a possibility of this sort of hidden leak; I had checked everything else
Other than opening up the chain case, which goes a little beyond inspection of a machine for sale, you wouldn’t have known. The same thing was wrong with my skid and the previous owner said it had a small leak. There are 4” plugs for access to the wheel bearings and the chain case was so full, it was leaking out of them. Other than putting it up high on blocks, you could never get to those plugs.
So I sorta screwed up and didn't realize it until I had the hydraulic drive motor apart. In step 6 I put the bolts too far down and pulled the entire assembly out, so couldn't make alignment marks shown in step 7. Aside from that the parts all look great. The reassembly steps only show using your alignment marks; they don't explain how to determine proper alignment if you don't have the marks... Can someone help?
If it's aligned incorrectly, it'll simply run backward. I'll have to dig for sequencing the timing.
I found an after source for the seal. So ya supplier prices are an outrageous rip off. A quality output shaft seal is Part number U12-1.25-25B from aftermarket suppliers for under $8 and is good up to 5000PSI. That was the one I was a little worried about, now the rest should be easy, will post the part numbers when I have found them - mainly cause I hate companies overcharging that much and this is my way to combat it and help others hopefully.
Were you able to find the info? I've looked and looked and I can't figure out how the allignment matters though I'm sure it's because I don't understand something though.
I won't be around my manual for a few days but I can see if there's anything in it about that this week.
Not sure which motor that is....but, I took a guess. See page 10 in this PDF. https://char-lynn.net/assets/docs/103_S_Series_Eaton_Char_Lynn_Repair_Info.36154615.pdf
Thanks but not it. Here's an image of mine, (I need to clean it) and the tag says: TRW Ross gear div Code 114 84 Spec. MAE24053 A1 How big of a deal is this? Like if I get the thing off one tooth and it runs backwards, can I just put the hoses on backwards to make it go forward? If so then I can just put it together and reverse the hoses if it's going wrong direction, which will solve this for me, because the one hard line to the motor this unit had on this side was replaced with a hose. For further learning, I have the below, but the above question is the primary one I need answered so I can move forward. I read this: https://www.insanehydraulics.com/letstalk/gerotortip.html And after reading that, I came to realize that in my motor and the one pictured in above link, there are 7 lobes and 7 valleys in the georotator,. Also in my case there are 14 teeth on the shaft, and due to that, the 14 teeth align to either a lobe or a valley, alternating. In the link above, there are only 12 teeth, so it's not even distribution so a little more work has to be done to ensure correct alignment. Basically since this motor has 7 lobes and 14 teeth, then whatever I choose as tooth 1 is arbitrary and if it's aligned with a lobe valley, then motor turns one way, if it's aligned with a lobe peak, motor turns other way. Do I have all that correct?
For the remaining seals, some of them have been harder to find than others. Over all a lot of work finding good parts. The case seal has been the most difficult and I don't need it but I found something I think can work. All parts except bearing found at herculesus dot com. And even though I have to buy more than I need of multiple of these seals, I'm still only totaling under $70 for all of them and am buying enough to do both motors; I'm assuming I'll have to do the other motor eventually. There are a couple of orings I'm not worrying with, Part 24a in diagram. Those should be pretty standard and I expect I have them in the standard and metric variety pack kits I have if I need them. Diagrams referenced: https://www.messicks.com/catalogs/c...train/6-6-150-d127145-hydrostatic-drive-motor and Case IH 1835B - CASE UNI-LOADER SKID STEER LOADER (NORTH AMERICA)(07/82 - 12/87) Parts Diagrams Case IH Parts Catalog Lookup. Buy Case IH Parts Online & Save! www.messicks.com Name Mfg Number Aftermarket number(s) Output Shaft Cover Bearing 277062 MR16 BR162416 IKO SJ7194 RBC HJ162416 NCS1616 Output Shaft Seal N9703 U12-1.25-25B If you have shaft wear at sealing point, maybe try stacking 2 U12-1.25-SQB as they are half the height and one would seal in different area Output Shaft Shim N9516 573-218 ID 1.250 X OD 1.500 X Tall 0.050 55D HYTREL material Note mine was missing so this was approximated by measuring the remaining space between the seal and ring where the ring is part N6702 in diagram Part 18 on diagram Seal Ring N6709 39.47mm ID x 42.67mm OD x 1.65mm Thk or in inch is 1.55" ID x 1.68" OD x 0.065" Tall 580-029,SOR-75NBR-1.5x1/16-C/S(25),O-RINGS 1.5" ID x 1.675" OD x 0.66" Tall BUNA-N RUBBER material Case Seal rectangular Oring N9509 Measured: 4.32" ID x 4.55" OD x .02" Tall 109.7mm ID x 115.6mm OD x 5mm Tall 580-346 is a 580 Square O-Ring with an ID 4.125 X OD 4.500 X 0.203" Tall Note could not find exact match. This has ID too small, OD is close, but likely will be too thick once put on, however I'd hope the stretch thins it out enough. If not, then could try 580-345 which is ID 4.000" X OD 4.375" which will stretch more. Case Seal backup ring N8747 teflon Measured: 4.32" ID x 4.54" OD x 0.05" Tall 109.7mm ID x 115.3mm OD x 1.3mm Tall MBU-110X2.5X1.3 Back-Up Ring ID 110.00mm X OD 115.00mm X Height 1.30mm 95A DUROMETER
MAE book https://sanat-hydraulic.com/wp-content/uploads/2020/11/TRW_Ross.pdf
Thank you! I've looked through it and see no reference of timing. Reassembly steps 10 to 14 cover that section and aside from lining up the hole I showed in picture from the coupling shaft and drive link nothing is said about the rotor set spline mesh. Oh well I'll just reassemble it and see what happens.
Well I got it all back together yesterday. No leaks so far but the real test will be when I staring really working it. All the seals fit perfect except the case seal which was too thick. I could have rigged it up on the lathe and turned it down to correct thickness, but I inspected the original and it was in great shape so just reused it instead since I was in a time crunch to get it fixed so I could move it cause I needed to get my side by sides out of the shop to go have fun. I didn't mention it before but the output shaft was a bit chowedered up by a failed bearing in the cap. I welded it up and chucked it in my bench-top lathe and turned it down. Installed a new bearing on the cap. Fit perfect and runs nice and smooth The failed bearing would not come out using a slide hammer puller. I had to cut out the cage, cut the outer retainer ring, and use the dremel cutting disc to grind away the side wall of the bearing till it was weakened enough the slide hammer could make progress. After that the rest was easy. Didn't have a new outer retainer ring, but I am sure it will be fine without it, the bearing pressed in hard enough I'm not worried about it moving. I also needed a bushing for the shock absorber that mounts to the controls for the drive motor. Had a chunk of rubber, cut a sorta round bit out of it on my mini band saw, and lathed out a nice new replacement. In the pic is the rubber chunk, what's left from what I cut out, and the part I made. I have to say I'm a fortunate man, my wife is amazing. She encouraged me to go ahead and buy the lathe when I was fretting over the expense and whether or not I really needed it. It's been a great tool to have! Pics!
Good news I've worked it about 4hrs total and no leaks! It still however occasionally does the no drive thing... And fluid level is about 1/4 up the sight glass. Seems to only do this when it's good and hot after over 2hrs of constant work. Thoughts?
Crap I take it back, there are two more leaks... The sight glass was misleading as it is showing up to 1/4 on the glass when it's well below that cause fluid is getting caught in the edge of the glass :/ At least the motor shaft I resealed isn't leaking! One leak is a hose going to that same motor, at the connection, which is tight so it must either have some dirt or damage, dunno, I cleaned it before putting it on so I'm guessing probably damaged. The other leak appears to be the other motor either the back seal of the case or perhaps one of the seals for the cap in this pic. Guess I'm pulling that motor too and getting another new hose.
One leak was just damaged fitting on a hose, easy fix. The other motor feels like the gasket is partly blown out the back of it. But it's not a major leak so for now going to let it be so I can get some other projects done. Thanks everyone who helped!