I have had no luck searching here.I have a 2003 40xt with some issues.I have been online looking for a shop manual all day with no luck.I think my Hyd fluid is leaking into my chains on the left side.Can the drive motor do this?All I know is I have fluid coming out of the rubber plug in the floor pan>Anybody heard of this before?Any help would be great!
Welcome to the forum rpctsv! :usa Yes, a motor failure can do that. gggraham and goose are Case techs here on the forum, be patient, I'm sure one of them will spot your thread and respond to it.
yes that is a problem with 40XT - How many hrs are on your machine? The Case dealers here fix it by replacing the motor...expensive! There is normally a problem with the bearing at the output shaft of the motor - it looses preload & allows the seal carrier to move a little. The leak usually comes from an oring on o/d of the seal carrier. You will have to pull the motor from the machine & check it out.
The machine has just over 1,700 hrs on it.I sometimes operate an 1845C at work,we beat on it like a rented mule,and it keeps going!I just bought this 40XT a month ago figuring it would be a workhorse too.This machine seems to have alot more power than the 1845C.The chains and sprockets look new IMO,and the machine in general is clean clean.I bought this machine right so I have some room to fix it right.The big issue I need to solve first is where can I get a service manual?You would think theres a CD out there for a reasonable price. My kid has seen too many skid steer utube vids,my guess is this machine has seen some hard landings the last couple weeks that might of brought some of this drive motor leaking issues on.
The early 40XTs did have problems with the drive motors leaking into the chainbox due to the loss of bearing preload and then seal damage. The middle version of motors were better but would still lose pearing preload. Case has a shaft cartridge to repair the problem but most of the housings are damaged enough that putting the repair kit in is pointles. The latest motors are holding up good but are a little pricey. The best thing to do would be to replaced the motor with the newest motor. The bad side is you would be wise to replace both of them or the other one may fail soon. Its alot easier to pull the tandem pumps and replace both motors than to pull the tandem pumps twice or fight the motors without pulling the pumps especially the rear motor.
Lost my reply,***?Didn't post,oh well.Goose>where would be the best place for a service manual?I am a machinist by trade and feel I can fix most boo,boos.This machine will be used for light farm work and I have $9,500 bucks in it with the trailor.Do you think I should punt and look at a different machine?Back to the 1835C,is this newer machine incapable of being reliable?I would really like several years of trouble free service from this toy(50hrs or less per yr)!
The 40XT is a good machine with the newer drive motors. Steer along way away from the 1835Cs, Gas or diesel versions both. They are an older machine and have a 3 cylinder continental/teladyne engine was have numerous problem over time. The main failure in the 40XT drive motors is the spacer between the bearings on the output shaft that set the preload on the bearings were made out of soft material. The spacer hammers or wears against and then the preload on the bearings is lost and the shaft starts moving radially and knocks out the seals. The cartridge kit that is available has the hardened spacer but will only fit in the second generation motors. If you can get the numbers off of the tag on the endcap of the motor I can tell you what generation of motors you have.
Awesome!I will look tomorrow. I made a typo,our work skid is a 1845C not an 1835. Do I need to bite the bullit and buy a repair manual from Case?
Goose heres the serial numbers on the drives. Left side 1590081002 5202 7174 Right side 1590081002 0103 7055 These hydraulic motors are Char-Lynn which is an Eaton motor.I work in the PVC industry which uses these motors in various down stream pulling operations.Kind of freaked me out seeing them in my skid loader! My guess is these are all the old drives you speak of.We constantly sell rebuild kits for these types of hydraulic motors.I hope I can save theses motors to save some bucks! On the manual issue>you have some leads on repair manuals? On the drive motor issue>without a manual,it looks to me that you might be able to pull the drive motors out the front of this machine to trouble shoot the leaking issue? Any help would be awesome! Randy
You can pull the drive motors out the front, but you have to carve up the battery box to get them out the front. It is a royal pita to pull them out the front compared to pulling the pump group and pulling them out the top. You already will have the hose going to the motors unhooked to pull the motors, from there yoy only have a couple more hoses, 2 sets of linkage and mounting bolts for the pumps and it will make you cuss alot less. I do not have a sorse for a manual other than through Case. The do make the manuals on CD but they arent much cheaper than the book. Will run the numbers tomarrow and let you know tomorrow.
Hey Goose...better send you a reminder email to your work email...or you'll forget. LoL, I've done it a number of times. :Banghead
Sent one while I was replying but thanks for the reminder.
They do not offer the repair kit for the motors in your machine. Looks like new drive motors is the only for sure solution.
Well, that sucks big time.Being without a manual is there anything that will mess this thing up after I get the motor back in as far as bleeding the hydraulics? I know you say no kits but I have to try a rebuild.I have access to 4th axis mills and all kinds of bad ass toys to rebuild stuff like this.Like I said before,we have been rebuiling char-lynn style motors for our haul-offs for 20 years.Maybe this is something case said no too and not something that can't be done. What would the cost be for 2 new factory motors? You have been very helpfull,thank you,Randy One more thing,could you tell me what the upgraded motor part numbers are?
Ttt
The new drive motors list for $1050.00 each.Sorry forgot to bring the part number home . All of the older part numbers sub up to the new part # so you only have one choice.
Well, that ain't that bad. I've had to replace the Rexroth radial piston motors on a couple of T190 Bobcats, can't remember the dollar number but it seems they were over 2 bills, and you can only get them from Bobcat.
As soon as I can find a service manual I will get the motor out.I called my local Case dealer and found myself wondering if THEY have a manual!I'm sure skids are pretty much the same as a tractor and a good mechanic can just figure it out.All I need is an exploded view and some torque specs.Every manual I have found online is out of stock! Case has certainly done a good job of keeping their proprietary info out of the publics hands.I'm very frustrated at this point!On a better note,thanks for all the help guys!!!
You can view exploded component views at the online parts catalog. www.casece.com click on North American/English go to Parts and Service tab at the top scroll down and click Parts Catalog on the next page you have to click the Launch Parts Catalog link just above the video your there. just type in your model number.
This is sooooo frustrating,the web site keeps saying no matches found.Maybe its broke?I have model number,serial number.No matches found.Too funny,I can only get in if I type in a different model number.
Would this be the motor your working on?
I don't know,I have been looking for an exploded view before I pull it.The case web site is doing some weird stuff,I found my model and looked at some dia's,now it won't let me in.I will try to go into my history to pull back up the pages.
Hmmm, the diagram I just displayed came from the Case website. That's wierd. :beatsme
Here's a pic of the same motor I posted above assembled. Just now got it from the Case website.
The Case website is case sensitive,I was putting in 40 xt<40XT is right.I'm retarted,All I know is throwing 3grand at this thing is not an option.I have to fix it myself somehow someway.
This repair is not recommended by some professionals. But in the instance of a machine that will be only rarely used - this is what I've done to fix this problem in the past without costing a huge amount of $$. Remove the drive motor from machine ; do not fully strip the motor - you can remove the seal retainer from the front of the motor ; remove the seal & oring from the retainer ; refit the retainer & measure the amount of clearance between it & the circlip groove ; remove the retainer & build up the outer flange(next to circlip) with bronze & machine it off to according to your measurement. This will stop the shaft end float. You will have to buy a new seal & viton oring from a hydraulic supply company. These are not able to be purchased individually from Case - they only supply full kits. You could replace bearings (2 x tapered)..... but they are held on to the shaft with a huge type of circlip with rounded ends & no holes.... very difficult to deal with! The condition of the bearings will control how long this repair will last. Some I've repaired like this are still going after 18mths. As I said some people may not agree with this - but if you dont want to spend thousands & are only using the machine a few hrs here & there - it does work. If the bearings do start to fail down the track - it only allows oil to leak past the shaft seal again, it does not affect the hydostatic parts of the motor or pumps.
Awesome!!!!!!!!!This is what i've wanted to hear!I drained 11 gallons of oil out of the chain reservoir today,tomorrow the pump will be out.She was full!On a good note,the chains and sprockets look new,I can't believe how good they look!I guess the only way to get the chains off is by bringing the axles in?Not a single master link,I think i'm in virgin territory on this toy! Thanks to everybody so far!This is my first skid and i'm finding out there is a learning curve.
Motor is out and have taken a look.In pic 1 you can see how the bearing spacer is wearing unevenly,it is getting cocked to one side under load I presume.In pic 2 you can see where the shaft is wearing the top of the gasket causing the gusher of oil into the chain drive resevoir. Is this the spacer you spoke of Goose? I presume this spacer preloads the tapered bearings,if so I can deal with this.Maybe a little tungsten tig rod after a preheat and a grind job after I have determined the thickness. The clip is no problem we have a tool,the bearings look great as do the chains and sprockets!!!!!! The wasted gasket,this will be found,if I can't I will turn out some of the land and make it nominal ,not special metric crap? Over all this motor is still ****!A total pain in the ass to get out!!As I see it,the spacer is letting the shaft deflect enough to take the seal out.Not really to much to these things as I see it,I could never justify throwing it out for these fixable issues. OH,almost forgot,the seal journal looks great as does the I.D. of the pump housing.All have been measured and are within .005. I'll take some pics of the fix if anyone gives a ****.
Wow, that's pretty strong. Maybe I should ease out here and go view another thread.
Nooooooooo,didn't mean it that way.Just don't want to waste the band width with my pics,thats all.
I just aquired a Thomas 1700A. I downloaded the shop repair manual and the shop parts manual right from thier web-site... VERY nice! I looked at CASE but could only find the parts manual: https://webparts.pvassociates.net/cnh/webparts/main.php Good Luck!
I guess I don't have enough posts to edit yet, but if you follow the link above, you just have to type in "40XT" in the search bar...
I just bought a parts manual off ebay for 87 bucks saturday.I'ts easier for me to have it in hand,not just on my computer.Sadly,i have not located a service manual yet.I will have questions when it's time to go back together with bleeding hyd system and such.Right now my loader has more oil and dirt in the bottom than you could ever imagine. thanks for the input so far guys.
I'm about to buy a 40XT from pictures only. Is the VIN # adequate to find out the generation of the drive motor? The machine is an '03 with 700hrs and looks really clean. Even if the drive motor is doomed for failure, with only 700hrs, is it too late to install the Case cartridge kit? I'm hoping no, if it's not leaking yet. Also, anyone know what the little grey metal box is that's mounted on the floor between the operators feet?
I wouldn't worry about the drive motors they are repairable.I ended up replacing the wasted spacer with a bearing race.Had to turn out some meat out of the ID but no problems since.My machine is great and hits hard.Grey box?Huh?Is it your aux switch?I just have a rocker switch in the middle for my aux.Is it hinged?
The box is about 8" X 8" X 8". Maybe it's a cab heater. The machine has side windows and what appears to be hinges on the pillar for a door, however the machine is not advertized with cab heat. Guess I'll find out tomorrow when the dealer open's.
Sounds like someone added an aftermarket heater.
Pull the motor out and take the big snap ring out and pull the shaft and bearing assy, you will see the problem, the large spacer between the bearings has worn and allowed the bearings to move closer and destroyed the preload that keeps the shaft on center. A good hardened spacer made to the dimensions that will re-establish bearing preload should repair that motor. Parts to reseal it should be available. We in the business cannot do that as if it comes back it's our baby thats why others have told you to replace them, but they are well over $1000 the last I installed, but if I were an individual I'd consider a fix if I had the equipment and materials to do it.If you are success ful with one I'd do both while you've got the tandem pumps out Look and decide what you want to do. As others have said, turn and walk , no run, away from the 1835C either gas or diesel. If you decide to repair keep uis posted. Ps, when removing hoses and reinstalling you MUST be absolutely clean, One speck of sand in the closed loop system will cause thousands of dollars damage and that is no exaggeration. Once the dirt is in the closed loop it just continues to circulate creating more debris which just continues to circulate-------------etc till you have junk. clean the belly pans as good as you can before disassembly. Mel
Correct, it's an aftermarket heater. I don't think it works, that's just another thing to fix:Banghead. Thanks for the helpful easyfix tips Mel and all.
A bump to the top for this, does anyone have the cross reference for the drive motor to get it from a hydraulic shop? checked with Case here, and they charge that drive motor out at $2500. I am wondering if I can get a motor number so I can walk into Motion and see about them ordering it.
Try Loader Parts Source, they might be able to reference motor by application and not need motor number. http://www.loaderpartssource.com/
Hello rpctsv We are experiencing the same problem at the moment! Did you ended up buying the entire motor? We could really use you advise. Thanks so much, Pedro's Concrete
Need some more info on this fix anyone have any tips Need to see if this fix worked long term, would making a new preload spacer out of harder steel be advised? Any help appreciated
Yes I'm interested!! THANK YOU!!! This thread could help me with my 75XT...was this fix worth the effort or is the only real option to buy a new drive motor? We only use our machine 1 -2 times a week, though for 4-5 hours of pretty hard work when we do (mixing & lifting rammed earth).
We fixed the issue! I highly recommend removing your pump, disassembling and getting another pre load spacer machined out of hard steel! I machined a spacer in an hour, replaced seal, and reassembled our pump on our 40xt been working flawlessly! Dont waste money and a perfect pump just take a week of downtime and fix it right!
how to rreplace ntandum pump 60xt how to rreplace ntandum pump 60xt call me if you can jim 303-807-0084
Hey guys, any thoughts on the best place to buy the replacement drive motors on the 40xt?
What price did Case dealer give you?
About $3000 a piece Canadian. I can order somewhat cheaper from the U.S. but I only found Loaders Parts Source. Wanted to see some comparables and go from there
Came across this thread while doing research on the 40XT machines. Disappointed to find out about these drive motor issues in what otherwise seems to be a rock solid series. I looked into it more and from what I can tell the big number on your motors breaks down like this, "159" <this is the "product line identification number" and 159 means it is an Eaton "VIS 30" (valve in star) motor. "0081" <this is the "product identification number" and it designates various features of the motor such as output shaft style, mounting hole pattern, various thread styles and sizes ect ect. "002" this is the "engineering change code" and is the most mysterious number. I can find hardly any information about this number but apparently 002 is the old one and 005 is the updated. I'd be very interested to learn exactly what is different between the two.
I have the same motor and have been searching for the right seal kit. Found the Char Lynn seal kit for this motor and it appears to be the same code as the VIS 40. My repair man is not convinced these are the right ones and thinks CASE have an OEM seal kit which differs from the Char Lynn kit. He thinks CASE may have a different shaft or something. I am suspicious. He told me his advice was to run away from this job because these motors are nothing but trouble. The motors are in good order otherwise and the machine is only used on the farm. We suspect the shuttle valve blocked with rubber when a new hose was not cut and cleaned properly and the motor got hot which destroyed the seals. If I understand what you are saying, going with the Char Lynn seal kit using these numbers should provide the right seals. Any assistance would be appreciated. I am assuming part numbers for the US will be the same for Australia.
Welcome to HEF @OzXT40 Is this drive motor already dismantled? I would assume that if a new hose was fitted to this motor & was not properly cleaned - your problems may be great deal worse than just plugging up a valve. Your repair man is correct saying that these CNH motors have a different shaft. I have only used the OE seal kits in doing full reseal of the motors - pricey, I know....
Thanks for the prompt response. The motor was inspected on site but with the mechanic now. He assures me the rest of it is in very good order and we have pulled the other motor off and will do the seals on it as well if we can get the kits. The information posted by @jacobb is interesting. I would have thought even if Char Lynn did a special motor for CASE that it would identify the motor with these numbers for parts. We did some on site testing of the pump and it is fine and if we ever get the motor sorted, we will do some temperature testing at various points. Finding people to talk to in Australia with knowledge of an old motor such as this is difficult and we live more than two hours from any major town with hydraulic services. It only gets farm work but is an integral part of our bushfire protection plan. Our fire season starts soon and we had two fires last year so we have about a month to get it sorted. It is only an assumption about the dodgy new hose causing the problem. The rubber could have come from the motors own seals. It has 2700 hrs now and we would like to see it run another five years at least so we have time to sort out a replacement. This forum has been a great help over the years and I appreciate the quality of the advice.
@OzXT40 TIP - Thought I might just mention this for your repairer - a small ball bearing used as a shuttle often gets lost when these motors are repaired by guys who are not 100% familiar with them. If the ball doesn't go back in - the motor won't drive.
Thanks for this tip. I have spoken with CASE in Melbourne and he is confident the seal kit on the CASE customer parts list is the correct one. The external shaft on my motor has 28 teeth as per the parts list but I noted there is also the drive shaft so I am hoping that will not confuse things further. He said they would take the parts back if wrong and not used.The attached file is what I am basing everything on and will disregard the Char Lynn numbers for now.
You have no idea how pricey in this country. Looking at $250AUD but better than a new motor. I found two of them available at $3800 AUD each which is a bargain. Really appreciate your assistance. The mention you have only used OE kits gives me a bit more confidence.
So finally had the seals replaced and picked up the motors yesterday. I contacted CASE myself and they were prepared to take the seal kits back if not the right fit (and unused) but he was confident they would. Seems he was right and I have no idea why it was such a problem to the mechanic. In the end I just told him to order the parts or tell me if he did not want to do the job. Once fitted we will see if all is good. We have an infra-red thermometer and will check temps throughout once it is all warmed up.
Motors are back in and we have done a test without load on the wheels. All is good so far.
Apologies for bumping an old thread but I was wondering is this bearing pre load issue with all the early xt models or specific to the 40XT? I have a 95xt that had 2 extra gallons of oil in the chain case on both sides when I bought it. I put 15 hrs on it and checked again, doesn't seem to be filling up for me but can't imagine how else that oil got in there.