Hey guys, I need some advice. I'm new to dozers and have bought a early 70s case 450. It's been a learning experience to say the least. The dozer runs good and I only have minor things to fix. Most of what I need to fix I have found out by searching the Internet for but I have some questions on some things that I've been getting conflicting info on. First up is hydraulic and trans fluid. I've read that the only fluid that should go in these machines is case TCH fluid. Unfortunately I have not been able to locate it anywhere. Is there a place to buy it? I don't have a case dealer near me at all. Would the napa hydraulic fluid that meets TCH requirements work? If not, do you have any suggestions? Another problem I can't find the answer for is my hydraulic tilt cylinder doesn't work. I know it's getting fluid as it leaks like crazy. Could rebuilding it with a seal kit be one of the reasons why it doesn't work or is there another fix that I'm not aware of? The cylinder doesnt look cracked or broke, it just leaks like a faucet. As I said, this whole thing is a learning experience so I'm not knowledgable on hydraulics. Also, is there a place online to buy parts from that you guys frequent? I need a seal kit for one of the lift cylinders (right side, seems to be common with case dozers) and have been getting different part numbers from different suppliers that I see online. The serial number is 28xxxx if that helps. Thanks for all your help guys. Any info is appreciated.
It sounds like time to rebuild all the cylinders. For the lift cylinders I usually take one apart, then take the parts and go to a hydraulic shop and try to find common seals, etc to match and rebuild both at the same time. There have been a few times on older stuff that they no longer use more common parts, in that case I'll take the pistons and remachine 'em to be able to use modern seals.
Well, I know I need to rebuild one lift cylinder and the tilt cylinder because they leak heavily. If I rebuild the tilt cylinder with new seals would could that be a reason on why it doesn't work? I guess I'm asking if a cylinder leaks heavily would that make it not work? As stated, I have no knowledge of hydraulics.
Evening, your tilt should work evening thou its leaking, not sure about that, does the engine "strain" a little when you actuate the tilt? If not there's something disconnected. I use TCH equivalent just do some research on the oils.
Thanks operator4100. The engine does not strain at all when tried. I'll have to look at the lever valve and see if I can see anything. What I've been finding is TCH oil is superseded by hy tran. I guess it I find oil that meets hy tran then I'm good? I was more worried about the trans oil because it is low and read that you shouldn't put anything but TCH in it.
If the seals on the piston are totally worn out/torn etc there could be enough leakage that the cylinder won't work under load and barely even move without any load on it. You mentioned that it "leaks like a faucet", does it do this when you're trying to move it either way?
It doesn't move at all. I've noticed it leaks from the shaft and the fittings. I've seen online a diagram and it looks like there is suppose to be orings on the fittings. I'm sure my orings on the fittings are gone and the shaft seals need to be replaced also. I figure I'll replace those seals and orings and if everything else looks good in the cylinder then ill throw it back together and see what happens. Worst case is I'm out the money on a seal kit but I'll gain by not leaking hydraulic fluid all over the place. To be honest I really haven't spent that much time on the dozer. I've been waiting on one of the master cylinders to show up (should be here tomorrow) and then I can get some more seat time. I noticed that the small amount of seat time I've been on it the tilt doesn't seem to work regardless of what I do with the lever.
Resealing the fittings and replacing the rod seals will probably stop the leakage, but it might not help the cylinder(s) operation. If a cylinder is bad enough it's leaking profusely around the shaft seal, it's not that much harder, time consuming or expensive to replace the piston seals. At worst, it's also quite possible the cylinder(s) may need to be honed as well.
Mobil 424 meets specs for Hy Trans. http://www.mobil.com/USA-English/Lubes/PDS/GLXXENCVLMOMobilfluid_424.aspx
Thanks for the suggestion and the link! Ok. I'll see if I can locate a complete seal kit for the cylinder. After all, if it's gonna be apart to fix the shaft seal then why not just reseal the whole thing. If It still doesn't work after that then that will point me in a different direction for the problem. Thanks for the help.
have any pics of the little jigger?
Got the seal kits for mine from a online site "little dozer"
I'll try to get some pics up. I've found seal kits online so I just need to measure my shaft to make sure it's the right seal kit. From my understanding the seals arent that hard to replace. Or so it looks from online tutorials. Currently I'm trying to track down some gauges. The hour meter, tranny temp, and tranny pressure guages all need replaced.
I was wondering where you are getting your seals from? I've found them on ebay but haven't bought any yet, just wondering. I've found the gauges at Coleman Equipment site not sure if they are aftermarket or not, they do have good parts diagrams, DW
For parts I have had great luck with RPM machinery. http://partstore.casece.com/us/casepartstore/parts-search.html#epc::model_find Even when trying to find obsolete parts these guys have been great help. If they cant get something they work with you until they help you find what you are looking for, whether it be new, used, or aftermarket. Good luck. Chris
I seen the seals on Coleman's website. I've also seen the seals on broketractor.com. Those two places seem to be the most popular as they always pop up during google searches.
Hey guys, I was just thinking, There's 3 or 4 different types of cylinders that was put on these dozers according to my parts book, some were stamped on the gland with the cyl. # , some have a split gland seal, some have a solid gland seal, so be careful before ordering! DW
Thanks for the info operator4100. I found this website and they say returns are no problem. http://www.reliableaftermarketpartsinc.com/servlet/the-Case-cln-Dozer-cln-Seal-Kits/Categories The good news is I got the tilt cylinder working! I still need to reseal it but it works and I'm happy. Got a chance to run it today. Other than the leaking cylinders I'm happy with the performance of it. Didn't have any problems with it at all. I was working next to my guest house so the blade was literally inches away from the siding. Kinda scary as I only have one master cylinder working right now so I tried to stay off the brakes as much as possible. New master cylinder should be here tomorrow or Monday. Beings how this is my first piece of equment I gotta say, what a time saver. The work I had to do today would have took me a good day with a shovel. The dozer only took 20 minutes. Unfortunately I had noticed more cracked and broken shoes than I thought I had. Anybody got a good source for shoes?
So I ended up welding up a couple of the shoes that were cracked pretty bad. I think they will hold just fine. The one shoe that is broke I haven't found a replacement yet. I'll just have to keep my eyes open for them. The master cylinder showed up the other day. Figured I'd put it on this morning. Unfortunately I'm gonna have to figure out something with the brake line as the new master cylinder came with a adapter fitting that isn't even close to the right size. So, off to the parts store I go.
So does anyone have a manual that can tell me how to check tranny fluid? Is it the same as a automatic tranny when you check the fluid in neutral while at operating temp? Ran the dozer today pulling stumps, pushing down trees, and grading. No problems at all but sometimes I can smell ATF fluid. Pushes just fine, torque converter is at 30 lbs, tranny at 200 lbs. Any ideas?
So does anybody know about case 450c dozers? I have a chance to pick up one for $2500. Has winch and is in decent shape.