I have a 1975 Case 580B that was running great when I parked it 6 months ago. I tried to start it yesterday with a fully charged battery and pored in fresh diesel fluid in tank. The tractor would not start. I bled fuel thru both fuel filters to make sure I did not have air in line and made sure that I am getting fuel to injector pump. I have a manual shut off cable and I checked to make sure it was in the run condition. I opened return line to tank on top of injector pump to make sure it was not plugged. Tractor still would not start. What am I not doing correct . The fuel is gravity fed thru 2 fuel filters to inlet of injection pump and I am getting fuel at pump but it is not going thru pump to injectors to start motor. I removed the 3 bolts and took off top of inj pump and shut off valve seems to be moving when I work shut off manual cable. It had fuel inside so I sucked fuel out that was in bowl and it did not refill on it's own.The fuel was real clean that was inside. Any advice on what to try next ? Thank's for your help.
Welcome to HEF, Texan. Did you clean the fuel filter that is in the injection pump ? #13.
Thank's Tinkerer , no I have not tried that yet. Do I just unscrew fuel inlet L and then unscrew # 11 and check filter. I did not know it had one there. Do I need to be careful so that nothing unexpectedly shoot out?
I removed inlet fuel line and checked filter #11. It was not stopped up but I sprayed it good with carb cleaner. I put it back together and tractor still would not start. It will try to start when I spray a little starting fluid. I leave return to tank line unhooked and no fuel come out. It seems like I am not getting fuel thru injection pump. I have fuel going to pump.
If you can have someone help you try wrapping a rag around an air hose blowgun and pressurize the fuel tank. Don't go crazy, 3 to 5 psi max !!! Loosen the nuts on the injector lines one at a time. At the injector. Fuel should come through.
I will try that tomorrow. Thank's for your help .
Yes, loosen the lines AT THE INJECTORS & crank the engine, just to see if its air bound. If u have fuel UP TO the injection pump & the metering valve is free & the return connector is off the pump.. & you don't have fuel spurting out of the loosened inj. lines.. THATS NOT GOOD. Just about only 2 things it could be>> Stuck pumping plungers inside the pump or the pump is seized/locked up.. Ok, try this> remove the fitting off of the fuel INLET.. fill the pump inlet up w/ fuel.. Crank the engine for a few revs & recheck the fuel level on the pump inlet.. Is the fuel still at the level u put it at?? or did it get sucked down?? IF it got sucked down, THATS GOOD.. that means the insides are turning & its not locked up & the pump is re-buildable.. IF the fuel is at the same level.. NOT SO GOOD.. Your looking at big bucks to be repaired.{seized head & rotor} Either way the pump has to come off.?? UNLESS the ether works.. I'd be happy to walk u thru removal..
I would like to double check 1 thing. When I removed the 3 screws on top and pulled off top cover I moved manual shut off cable off / run and I saw movement inside pump housing. How am I suppose to check metering valve the correct way and what to look for? One thing I noticed is when I had inlet line open I cranked tractor over and notice a little fuel squirting out of inlet side if this matter. Is there a neutral safety switch or something that will stop tractor from starting if tractor is in gear? I would like to double check everything. Thank's
There are two neutral start safety switches in the electrical system. Neither one of them have anything to do with the fuel system including the pump. They are designed to prevent the starter from operating when they are not in the neutral position. I do not comment much on pumps. I leave that to the professionals. Did you get all the O rings and gaskets in where they belong ?
This is what I tried. I removed inlet line and filled with fuel. It sucked level down. Pressured up tank and fuel blew out of return line to tank. Tractor sounded like it wanted to start. I guess I blew some fuel into cylinders. Removed top cover and sucked fuel out. Fuel still turned on at tank and have good flow of fuel to inlet of pump. Should bowel have filled up with diesel with fuel still turned on? thepumpguysc : What did you mean by UNLESS the ether works ?
I would think so. Have you tried giving it a sniff of starting fluid ? There are times just a sniff will get it going. You cannot blow fuel into the cylinders by pressurizing the tank. Only the injection pump can do that.
The fuel at the inlet squirted and/or went down, that's the good thing Thepumpguy was talking about. The next step is to loosen the injection lines at the fuel injector, and see if they squirt air bubbles or pure fuel. Once they squirt fuel, tighten them up and it should start. Are you getting a fog/mist out of the exhaust? or is it perfectly clear? that will tell you if you're getting fuel injected or not. If you're not getting fuel, then loosen the injector lines, if you're still getting nothing out of the injector lines, THEN, and only then, go back to the injection pump.
Sounds like a restriction in return.. ?
Return line was disconnected and the bowel did not fill up with fuel after cranking engine. Motor try to start when I spray ether . Nothing come out of exhaust unless I spray ether starting fluid. How to check metering block and shut off position?
Try this again, where's that fuel going if it's not filling up the injection pump? If it wanted to start then it was obviously getting some fuel. Unless you were using ether at that point?
I was using starting fluid . Cover was still off and bowl did not fill up with diesel and fuel valve is turned on and getting fuel from filter to inlet of pump. What is the flow of fuel from outlet of 2nd filter to inlet of injection pump to bowl first then pumped to injectors and what is not used in bowl returned to tank? Just trying to get a little knowledge of flow thru pump. Where is pump plungers and if they are stuck will fuel flow thru pump? Any thing I can try to pour in pump to get plungers unstuck like Sea Foam if they are stuck and how to check metering valve and shut off valve
The metering valve is the little gizmo that turns the fuel on & off.. Since u have the top cvr off.. work the shut off lever.. u see that 'leg" on the shut off cam moving?? THAT LEG is hitting the metering valve ARM.. & the arm should be moving back & forth w/ the shut off leg.. IF its not, the mv is stuck.. It can be freed up with a few well placed flicks of your finger.. or just reach in & grab the arm & push/pull it back & forth.. IT MUST BE FREE to move on its own.. I've never "tried" to pour anything inside a pump.. I know others have tho & it seemed to work.?? ATF will loosen things up.. The pumping plungers are deep inside the pump.. it has to come apart to get to them.. IF u read other sites.. theres a fella that says to blow compressed air in 1 of the outlets on the pump & slowly rotate the insides of the pump {pump off of engine}.. I guess he means to rotate the engine by hand.. a few rotations.. In theory it will work.. its just that, if they're stuck..they're stuck.. About 65% of the pumps I get have stuck pumping plungers & about 40% have to be removed w/ a hammer & brass punch.. I don't think "air" is gonna move them..
When I pour fuel in inlet of pump with filter and stem ( # 11,12,&13 in Tinkerer first diagram) fuel is sucked down when cranked and when I stop cranking air bubbles rise. When I left filter and stem out (#11,12,&13) and poured fuel into inlet and cranked level stayed the same. If pump need rebuilding , about how much will it cost?
I'll send u a prvt msg. & STOP F'n w/ the pump.!!! There was NOTHING in my instructions about removing anything..
I am having the same problem with my 580b getting plenty of fuel to the pump but it will not pump anything out i have took the top off to make sure that the stop plunger is free it seems to be moving feely and it is pumping fuel out of the return but nothing to the injector lines i have tried plowing compressed air into the tank will no help and have tried compress air in the injection line port while slowly roiling the motor still nothing. It has been sitting for 4 or 5 years i have drained all the fuel out and put new in and all new fuel filters. Any help would be appreciated
Nothing left to do except pulling the pump .. the pumping plungers are more than likely stuck.. It’s easier to get back on, if u time it before pulling it off.. Remove the side cover window.. Under the window is a stationary line.. there is also one that rotates.. Rotate the engine by hand until the two lines meet and stop.. that’s it..
how hard it is to rebuild the pump on thins it doesn't look to difficult
Hahaha.. I have no idea of your abilities w a wrench.. or your willing ness to buy some special tools..and a manual
i am assuming this pump works a lot like the p7100 i have hoped them up before and rebuilt accouple for friends
Welcome to HEF, Matthew !