Hi All, Last October I picked up a 580SL and had low power issues. I changed the lift pump and per your recommendation changed the filters and fuel line. Hoe ran fine but didn't get much use until now. It runs strong for about an hour then it loses power. This happened the last time I used it two weeks ago and again today. I ran it today moving brush across a field to burn. Nothing challenging. I made maybe 7 trips using second gear to take brush to the burn and third gear on the return. On my last return I had to drop to first gear and I could barely crawl out of the field. I don't think it's the fuel, I'm running my other equipment from the same tank. When I replaced the fuel hose and the inline filter there was no sign of crud so probably not junk in the tank. Temperature gauge is DOA but it doesn't seem overly hot. What would change after an hour of use???
Sounds like biological contamination case.
I'm confused. Why would contamination take an hour then be good the next time for another hour? Also, my tractor and excavator have no issues whatsoever. Same fuel, same tank.
Sorry, I missed that you used it two weeks ago. For some reason I thought you haven’t ran since last October.
Biological is actually not problems with your storage tank so much. It’s when equipment sits for a long time, with tank half or almost empty. It doesn’t plug filters right away. Is there any chances pickup tube broken?
Tank breather plugged?
Is the fuel tank vent clean ? When the tractor is in limp mode slowly remove the fuel fill cap and listen for a noise made by air sucking into the tank. There is a banjo bolt on top of the fuel injection pump that could be partially blocked with crap.
Bacteria will stay somewhere close to the top of the fuel, until the fuel level will drop low enough so it will be getting sucked in to fuel pickup tube.
ALL GOOD SUGGESTIONS.!! 2 more to throw into the mix, How about a floater or rag in the tank.?? If you’re running 5 gallons at a time, that in itself will cause a problem.. Good luck & I hope u find it.
I like the sound of the breather. It makes sense and it's an easy fix. I am planning to use it tomorrow for a few hours. How does this sound: Run as normal When power drops off, remove the tank cap Tractor should run normally again. That work?
Does it smoke at all when the power is low?
No
Just loosen the fuel cap and see if it runs all day.
Well, I tried it today and it lost power after just a few minutes with the gas cap loose. It seems to be connected to load. When I climb s slope it will do okay then lose power. If I put it in neutral and rev it a bit I can get another 50 yards before losing power. After limping back I didn't have time to fool with it. Frustrating! this is what it acted like before I changed the lift pump.
Is your rpm dropping off when it is "low power" or just the speed. I had a issue on my loader when the fluid level was low in the transmission that it would get slower and slower when warm or going up hills. Added fluid and it fixed the problem. If your rpm is dropping then that seems more engine related.
RPM drop off, engine chugs and will stall if I don't put it in neutral. No sign of a tranny slip. Good thought tho.
Ok, in the interest of troubleshooting when you put it in neutral it revs up again? Have you played around with the throttle and shut off lever on your injection pump to verify they are operating at full travel/responding/not limiting fuel?
Hmm. Good point about shut off. But i think SL has FPT/Iveco engine which is CRD.
No i was wrong. Looks like its Case 4T-390 ( basically 4BT). There's some things I have been having on my customers Bosch VE Inj. pumps. but you will be required to buy some tools. Lets complete "simple checks" first.
Wonder how the unit would run off of a Large 5 gallon can strapped on well, sending fuel direct to transfer pump or before the first filter. Not sure about the exact piping off of the filters on your unit. If forcing 1-2 Psi of air into the tank makes it run better, or produces a leak then you can fix leak or start testing pressure available to pump. Tests first, then spend small money to start. Simon C
What is the serial number? is it JJG prefix?
I don't know much about diesels I don't know much about diesels. Where is the shut off lever on the pump and how does it work? As I recall, the throttle is cable operated - is the arm the cable attaches to the shut off lever? .
Yes - JJG0266871
What does that indicate?
P pump its "Emission certified " engine. How you get that out of P pump - is beyond me. Probably because of aneroid, which BTW another "monkey wrench" in to problem. I don't want to go on another goose chase. Is your primary filter translucent or metal?
Not sure what the primary filter is. There is a small inline filter before the lift pump. It's a metal can that I replaced 3 operating hours ago along with the lift pump. Then there is a single canister type filter with a drain on the bottom. That's also metal. I'm surprised to hear 'emissions' as I thought it was old enough not to care. Where can I find a serial number to production year reference?
Me too, but that because of anerod. That thing cuts fuel when boost pressure is low, so it wouldn't smoke black. They do not have that on other machines with VE32 injection pumps. Can we dot this: Case have fuel tanks that is pretty easy to look in to, just open the lid, shine flash light and visually inspect what is in it. I would suggest getting a translucent in-line filter ( don't throw the old one away), because you can see what's going on, even when the system starts sucking air. if it was me - I would cut spin-on filter and look what's is in it also. but I have tool for it. The problem is consistent with floating contamination in the fuel tank, doesn't look like aneroid/wastegate problem - but "never say "never""!
Years show 4/94 - 12/00, so it is not years - it's "edition" starts with JJG0258464 The non emission dates show 5/98-12/00
It necessary to know the serial number so that anyone trying to help you knows if you have an early production 580SL or the later 580SL series 2. There are many differences between them.
I'm skeptical of the fuel but don't want to overlook the obvious. Tomorrow I'll look in the tank, pull the spin on filter and if I can get a replacement I'll open it up. Boost pressure, hmmm... I have no idea if the turbo is working or not - is there a way to test boost? Also, can I disable the fuel cut out?
Yes , you can can check boost pressure. just need to adapt 0-30 psi gauge. Disabling aneroid, I'm pretty sure you can, but consult nice gentleman going by the handle Pumpguysc, he already have commented on this thread.
I looked at the tank today and the fuel looks good. Nothing floating, no problem that I can see. I'm kind of stuck.
U don’t want to disable the aneroid, that would give u less power..
This is becoming a learning experience. I have the Case service manual for the backhoe, the Case manual for the engine and a Cummins 4BT manual. None of them have any information on the injector pump beyond remove and replace. I've been searching the net an cannot find a service manual for an A type pump. Specifically PES4A95D320. Does anyone know where I can find a service manual??
Good luck with that.. U may have better luck searching for BOSCH “A” PUMP.
I know right? The pumps are everywhere - I can buy one off Amazon but the manual....I've been looking for hours and nothing.
I'm resurrecting this to give a shout out to thepumpguysc. Thanks to his help I've got my machine running good again. This forum is incredible. Thepumpguy has taken the time to trade messages with me for weeks. If anyone in SC needs anything done, he is definitely the man!
He's a good dood lol
Lol.. thank u both..
Would you mind sharing what was wrong with it?
hell, IDK.. he was turning the screws.. lol
Of course not. It seemed to be choking out under sustained load but it was unpredictable. I replaced the fuel pump overflow valve it it seemed to run a little better. The problem became much more consistent at that point and was only under heavy load (up hills in second gear). Next I changed the wastegate actuator. The problem became less severe but there was still a little lacking during my hill climb tests. I adjusted the aneroid until I got slight black smoke when the turbo spun up. That got me real close. One turn on the load stop screw with a minor throttle stop adjustment and she runs about as good as I'd expect. I can set the throttle to 2000rpm and go up a decent grade in 2nd with no trouble. The mechanical governor holds the speed almost like cruise control. I learned a lot and it was really, really helpful to lean on thepumpguy during. Thanks for asking.